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Rhine, Danube Water Levels - Are Cruise Lines Sharing Info?


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We're concerned about the impact of the low levels on the Rhine and the Danube on Xmas markets cruises and so hope those of you out on cruises will keep us posted about how it's going. In the meantime, here's a story on what's happening that was launched yesterday on Cruise Critic: http://www.cruisecritic.co.uk/news/news.cfm?ID=4665

 

Carolyn

 

Carolyn Spencer Brown

Editor in Chief

Cruise Critic

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We just returned from the Nov 12 sailing of Viking Prestige on the Danube. We sailed from Nuremberg to Regensburg and were then informed that due to the low water level, we would get off the ship the next morning and onto a bus. We travelled to Passau on bus and had our scheduled tour and then lunch at a restaurant and then back on the bus for Melk. In Melk we got on the Viking Legend to continue our journey. We had to disembark again in Vienna for transfer to Budapest, where we were put into a hotel for the last night. We had lunch at Cafe Gerbaud and dinner at the hotel - Corinthia Grand and then breakfast at the hotel also before most folks caught their return flights.

 

The Viking Legend folks were also bussed and put on Prestige.

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Carolyn,

 

I´m booked on a short trip out of Passau in mid December with a German cruise line. So far we haven´t got any information. But I´d say it´s too early anyway.

 

River levels can change pretty quickly (and not just in Europe, I´ve made this experience in the US several times). So it doesn´t make any sense to inform passengers - let´s say - a week ahead of the cruise that there might be any problems on an upcoming cruise.

 

I´ve been on the MS Mozart (back then it was still Deilmann). We had to face a spring flood and got stuck in Vienna after 23 hours (roundtrip out of Passau). Everything else was by bus even the transfer back to Passau. After a one night hotel stay (BTW also the Corinthia Grand) we returned to Vienna and got more or less hourly updates by the Captain. He checked the water levels and told us the bridge clearance. He was willing to go back to Passau but finally had to make the decision to stay.

 

Actually there is no major rain in our forecast neither in the area feeding the Danube river nor in the area feeding the Rhine river. Two days of rain can chance pretty much.

 

Christmas Markets in Southern Germany (especially Bavaria) do start tomorrow evening.

 

steamboats

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So it doesn´t make any sense to inform passengers - let´s say - a week ahead of the cruise that there might be any problems on an upcoming cruise.

 

I have to respectfully disagree. When as a customer, I have spent many thousands of dollars, when the prognosis is not good, when we're two weeks away from the event, you can't sit there just hoping all will be well.

 

This potential problem has been known for weeks, at least. You have to assume that the responsible cruise lines have put together contingency plans for a worst case scenario. I would like to know what those plans are, even acknowledging that the fine print in the contract and the limits in our travel insurance will be of no benefit.

 

It would be simply wonderful if there are torrential rainstorms in the next two weeks to make all these concerns moot. But clearly, that's not going to happen.

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We are booked on Avalon Panorama and departing on Christmas Eve. We are not up for a bus tour and are hoping that water levels improve, even more so for the people that live there and depend on the river.

 

I would not expect the river cruise companies to make early announcements as they will continue to hope that rain will come and voyages go as scheduled.

 

We are just back from a superb cruise with AmaWaterways and I spoke with the Captain about the water levels as we observed several empty ships docked in Koblenz when we were there. He said that's things can change in just a couple of days and that there is no way to really predict what may happen by the time of the market cruises, except for those set to go within the next week.

 

I am going to make back up hotel reservations for our trip, as we will choose the option to cancel and get a refund if our cruise turns into a bus tour. I would much rather be on our own than moving about every day to meet the back up plans of the cruise line. I expect we will be offered the option to cancel and get a refund and our air is non refundable.

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Thanks, Steamboats. I so appreciate your posts on this forum -- rain (lack of) or not, you've got lots of great input. Keep us posted, will you?

 

Carolyn

 

Carolyn,

 

I´m booked on a short trip out of Passau in mid December with a German cruise line. So far we haven´t got any information. But I´d say it´s too early anyway.

 

River levels can change pretty quickly (and not just in Europe, I´ve made this experience in the US several times). So it doesn´t make any sense to inform passengers - let´s say - a week ahead of the cruise that there might be any problems on an upcoming cruise.

 

I´ve been on the MS Mozart (back then it was still Deilmann). We had to face a spring flood and got stuck in Vienna after 23 hours (roundtrip out of Passau). Everything else was by bus even the transfer back to Passau. After a one night hotel stay (BTW also the Corinthia Grand) we returned to Vienna and got more or less hourly updates by the Captain. He checked the water levels and told us the bridge clearance. He was willing to go back to Passau but finally had to make the decision to stay.

 

Actually there is no major rain in our forecast neither in the area feeding the Danube river nor in the area feeding the Rhine river. Two days of rain can chance pretty much.

 

Christmas Markets in Southern Germany (especially Bavaria) do start tomorrow evening.

 

steamboats

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Thanks, Caviargal! Heartening news, re how quickly things can change! Can you keep us posted about how it works out for you?

 

Carolyn

 

We are booked on Avalon Panorama and departing on Christmas Eve. We are not up for a bus tour and are hoping that water levels improve, even more so for the people that live there and depend on the river.

 

I would not expect the river cruise companies to make early announcements as they will continue to hope that rain will come and voyages go as scheduled.

 

We are just back from a superb cruise with AmaWaterways and I spoke with the Captain about the water levels as we observed several empty ships docked in Koblenz when we were there. He said that's things can change in just a couple of days and that there is no way to really predict what may happen by the time of the market cruises, except for those set to go within the next week.

 

I am going to make back up hotel reservations for our trip, as we will choose the option to cancel and get a refund if our cruise turns into a bus tour. I would much rather be on our own than moving about every day to meet the back up plans of the cruise line. I expect we will be offered the option to cancel and get a refund and our air is non refundable.

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Thanks, Steamboats. I so appreciate your posts on this forum -- rain (lack of) or not, you've got lots of great input. Keep us posted, will you?

 

Carolyn

 

Thanks, Carolyn, sure I will!

 

Paulmj,

 

No cruise company is happy to put you on busses for a certain stretch of the trip. It costs them a lot of money so they are trying to keep you on the ship as long as possible and avoid extra costs for busses and hotels.

 

And of course they want happy passengers and are aware that you paid a lot for the cruise. Anyway they are not responsible for the weather and they have to do the best out of it.

 

If you get an information two weeks ahead of your cruise that there can be a problem with the water levels. What are you going to do? No trip insurance will cover a cancellation. Unless the cruise company decides to cancel your trip you still "have" to go if you don´t want to lose your money.

 

IMHO a good communication is very important. I´ve experienced both good and bad communication. Usually good communication is helping to make the passengers feel better and make the best out of it. Bad communication usually leads to complaints. But as I´ve stated before the situation on the rivers is depending on the weather and it can change extremly quickly. Therefore it doesn´t make much sense to worry passengers by notes two weeks ahead that there might be a problem in case it doesn´t rain... But a good communication should start right by the point you are beginning your trip and meet up with the ship (or the tour guide / CD in your pre cruise hotel).

 

River cruising has a risk and that´s the weather. On these boards you can get the needed information ahead of time and prior to booking your cruise. With booking you sort of accept this risk.

 

You can also get short time information about the current situation prior to your cruise on here. Then you are prepared that your cruise might face problems and you can make the best out of it!

 

steamboats

 

PS: Just to make clear: I´m "in the same boat". I have a short trip booked for mid December and it´s a present for my Mom´s birthday so I want it to be a special one for her (as it´s her first river cruise). I won´t be happy either if the cruise is going to be shortened. But it´s still a bit less than three weeks and lots of things can happen. Sure I´m monitoring the weather reports and forecasts too.

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It's true we can't do anything about the weather, but Steamboats you've provided a nugget of information the I would never have thought of: namely, the draft (if that's the right term) of the ship may be significant. With new larger ships, and more amenities on board, this may become more of an issue and it's ironic that the lines are turning to their older ships for rescue.

 

Just something else to consider as we plan ahead.

 

Best wishes to all those cruising in the near future and we hope it all works out for you.

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Carolyn and Steamboats,

Thanks for all the up to date info. Right now AMA is posting the trips from Nurnberg will go as scheduled. We leave Wed. for Budapest for time on our own before meeting up with the cruise. Origanally, the boat would go ahead on the 2nd day to the cruise and we would join it an hour west. We'll just see that new port earlier. Not a big fan of bus trips, but it will give us an opportunity to see some small towns that we might not from the boat.

DH checked the draft of our boat it is 1 meter. Hopefully, this will enable us to make the rest of the trip safely.

Steamboats, hope your gift to your Mother goes as planned.

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Hi all,

 

We are currently sailing on the Amalegro from Nuremburg to Regensburg.

All is fine at this end. No one on the ship really wants to talk about it and most of the people on board have no idea the rivers are low. I guess ignorance is bliss.

Anyway I finally spoke at length with our cruise director and she said they were not sure they would have made it to Nuremburg from their last cruise. It is a day-by-day thing. She did say the captain is sure until at least Monday which will put us to Linz, and that they would be very happy if we made it to Vienna. Although it has not been said, Budapest looks to be out of the question. They either may bus from Vienna or get to within an hour or so out of Budapest. We shall see. No rain in the forecast but it has been foggy every day so far.

When I know more I will report it.

On a good note the cruise so far has been great. Had a super time in Nuremburg yesterday. Be back to you soon.

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No one on the ship really wants to talk about it and most of the people on board have no idea the rivers are low. I guess ignorance is bliss.

Ignorance is not a bliss when they're not prepared for the eventuality.

 

In our Viking trip, the passengers were not told of the low water issue until the night before they need to be bused. And even as we got bussed to Passau, they didn't say anything about the Vienna to Budapest stretch, until a german speaking passenger overheard a conversation between 2 crew members!

 

When the news got out they witheld information, there's a near mutiny within the passengers. One guy pretty much lost it! The atmosphere on the second half of the trip was more frigid than the air temperature!

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Thanks, SusanB1, my fingers (both hands) are crossed for you and everyone else who's on an Xmas river cruise this week!

 

Carolyn

 

Hi all,

 

We are currently sailing on the Amalegro from Nuremburg to Regensburg.

All is fine at this end. No one on the ship really wants to talk about it and most of the people on board have no idea the rivers are low. I guess ignorance is bliss.

Anyway I finally spoke at length with our cruise director and she said they were not sure they would have made it to Nuremburg from their last cruise. It is a day-by-day thing. She did say the captain is sure until at least Monday which will put us to Linz, and that they would be very happy if we made it to Vienna. Although it has not been said, Budapest looks to be out of the question. They either may bus from Vienna or get to within an hour or so out of Budapest. We shall see. No rain in the forecast but it has been foggy every day so far.

When I know more I will report it.

On a good note the cruise so far has been great. Had a super time in Nuremburg yesterday. Be back to you soon.

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Thanks, SusanB1, my fingers (both hands) are crossed for you and everyone else who's on an Xmas river cruise this week!

Carolyn

 

Carolyn, I think this is a lovely gesture you're making, a great spin on things, but I'm really not sure how meaningful it is. What can possibly happen in the next 30 days where...I hope, I hope...something wonderful and unanticipated will happen?

 

I for one have ten thousand bucks invested in this disaster, and judging from the reports of at_nyc there is a major riverboat cruise line that hasn't the foggiest idea what to do, has completely forgotten about customer service, is keeping everything sotto voce so as to not disturb the inmates, and we're to be sitting around here with our fingers crossed??

 

For what?

 

I want someone to say to me you have our insurance, we can't deliver the product you bargained for, and if you want out, goodbye and good luck. If you want to keep fingers crossed for something, do it for that.

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SusanB1, thanks for the update. We board someplace when you get off someplace. This will be our 15th river cruise and the first with ANY kind of water level problems. We leave on 30 Nov to meet friends in Budapest. They leave 29Nov and face the strike at London airports. Guess we'll hve a few good stories to tell. There is rain in the forecast beginning on 2 Dec. Hopefully that will get the Amalegro going back toward Nurnberg. If we have heard nothing by noon Monday, we'll call AMA. Need to know where to meet the group. I do believe this is a day to day happening. Again, thanks for the updates. Pat

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I for one have ten thousand bucks invested in this disaster, and judging from the reports of at_nyc there is a major riverboat cruise line that hasn't the foggiest idea what to do, has completely forgotten about customer service, is keeping everything sotto voce so as to not disturb the inmates, and we're to be sitting around here with our fingers crossed??

 

Paulmj - I doubt that any of the river cruise lines "don't have the foggiest idea what to do", I'm sure that all of them have a contingency plan in place depending on when / if / where the rivers become unsailable. However, since this does appear to be a day to day situation I would imagine it's difficult to tell the guests exactly what is going to take place 3, 4, 7 days down the road when the situation can change overnight. Imagine how disappointing it would be if the cruise line called you today to tell you that you MIGHT have problems in two weeks, you cancel and stay home only to find out everything was fine and the sailing went without a hitch? If that happened to me I'd be more upset at having missed the entire trip than at just having some changes made, but that's just me. I have no doubt that the reputable cruise lines will stay on top of the issue and make announcements as soon as they have a better idea of what the situation will be down the road (river). Best of luck for your trip, I hope that it works out.

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susanb1,

 

Thanks for reporting back!!

 

at_nyc,

 

That´s what I´d call bad communication! Tell the passengers as soon as they have boarded that the ship might not be able to go where it is supposed to go. Explain the situation and the fact that´s a day by day decision. Tell them as soon as you know about how far you can go and where to stop, change ships or change to bus. Telling you that you will receive a letter (whenever) with information about compensation is real bad communication!

 

steamboats

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Well said, trvlgirl99!!!! We all have a lot of time and money invested in our trips. All cruises, river and ocean, depend on the weather. Ports are missed or time in port changed. This is part of traveling. Have missed more ports on ocean cruises than on river ones.

 

Sheila, thanks for the good thoughts. Think we are going to try to get to the Cafe Kor in Budapest on our nite on our own. Will let you know. Pat

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Good luck to everyone, and I hope the cruises don't become too much of an adventure.

 

Besides a new-found interest in ships' drafts, I'm reconsidering cruise insurance that covers cancellation for "any reason".

 

I look forward to the reports of our experienced cruisers. I'm sure they'll make the best of it.

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Paulmj - I doubt that any of the river cruise lines "don't have the foggiest idea what to do", I'm sure that all of them have a contingency plan in place depending on when / if / where the rivers become unsailable..

The "contingency plan" was to bus people around! If I want to do a bus trip, I can do that for a lot less.

 

More over, some people have health issues which prevents them from sitting on buses for hours on end. They suffered miserably due to the switch. If you do a search as I just did, you'll find one of their competitors offered their passengers the option to re-book on a later date. Viking could have done the same but choose not to.

 

In fact, as we leave with only 2 out of 6 days itenery as originally planned, another group of poor souls are being herded on board for the same diasppointment. That's after 400 others suffer the same the week before us! Add to the 400 the week before us, there're now 1200 Viking passengers being misled into a bus trip for the price of luxury cruise!

 

Imagine how disappointing it would be if the cruise line called you today to tell you that you MIGHT have problems in two weeks, you cancel and stay home only to find out everything was fine and the sailing went without a hitch? .

Not as disappointed as throwing 6 grand on a bait and switch bus trip!

 

I have no doubt that the reputable cruise lines will stay on top of the issue and make announcements as soon as they have a better idea of what the situation will be down the road (river).

Your trust are misplaced.

 

There's no rain in the forecast. They knew that all along. The previous week's cruise wasn't able to get into Budapest. Yet, that's not communicated to us at all. In fact, we found out 1 day before they decided to tell us, only because a passenger overheard a conversation between 2 crew members (crews mostly speak German, majority passenger speaks English, but some of us are bi-lingual ;))

 

If some one choose to take the risk, it's up to the individual to decide. Not have Viking took the decision out of our hands.

 

Had Viking communicated to me the previous week's cruise was not able to get into Budapest (the main attraction for me), and there's no substantial rain in the forecast, I would have re-scheduled for a later date. Viking decided to take that option out of my hand, they must bear responsibility for their decision without my consent, AND the failure to ultimately deliver.

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at_nyc,

 

That´s what I´d call bad communication! Tell the passengers as soon as they have boarded that the ship might not be able to go where it is supposed to go. Explain the situation and the fact that´s a day by day decision. Tell them as soon as you know about how far you can go and where to stop, change ships or change to bus. Telling you that you will receive a letter (whenever) with information about compensation is real bad communication!

 

steamboats

I respectfully disagree.

 

It's more than bad communication. It's deliberate decision to be non-communicative for a known situation that would prevent them from performing their agreed service we purchased.

 

Given the previous week's cruises (both directions) were not able to complete fully, and no forecast of substantial rain, they have an obligation to inform the passenger of such a high potential of interruption. It's up to the passengers to decide if they'll choose to cancel or not. That's what trip insurance are for, after all.

 

As a matter of fact, if Viking is run by professionals, they would have had taken out business interruption insurance against low (and high) water, and pass those payments to the passengers! Instead, we had to pay for Viking's poor business management. Or, they're pocketing the proceed of their weather insurance and put their passengers down a one way street to their compatitors. :rolleyes:

 

I did a bit of digging abouth the "compensation" being offered in the past water-related cruises. It's a partial credit towards booking within a year! I'm sicken by such "offer". First, they rob me my vacation. Then they ask me to pay again to give them another chance...to make another booboo! (1 of the couple on our boat was re-deeming their "credit" from previous interrupted cruise! :eek:)

 

I will not travel with them again, given the pultry "credit" they're offering. That also frees me to look into the option of taking them to small claim court. It won't cover all of the cost due to the limit of small claim court. But it'll cover just enough to make up for the part of cruise not delivered.

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wow i can feel the disappointment and anger in many posts around this subject. we have done 3 river cruises and so far have been fortunate enough not to have our cruise disrupted.

it sounds particularly bad this year because of water levels. lets hope the cruise lines can assist passengers re better information and compensation if indicated.

 

http://www.cruiselawnews.com/ this website offers lots of info for cruise consumers about rights and remedies. might be worth a read.

 

better disclosure around the possibility of a bus trip instead of the cruise, although that can be difficult because of weather conditions etc.

 

our cruises were with avalon and we felt well looked after.

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