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Scenic Amsterdam to Budapest


Dolebludger
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Host Jazzbeau,

 

If you read posts above on this thread, you will see that other seasoned cruisers believe that the word "concierge" when combined with the word "laundry" means that it is included in the fare, in "cruise language". If it does not mean this, what does it mean? does it mean only that a "butler" picks up and delivers the laundry -- rather than this being done by a room steward as on mass market cruises? And if that's all it means, why did anybody think it was something worth the advertising space.

 

I did read all the posts, and my opinion stands [as my opinion :)]. Who can explain the mind of any ad writers? They clearly take daily doses of puffery pills. ;)

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Quite true, sir. the wording is subject to differing interpretations as to its application to all cabins and suites. And that is the problem.

 

But as to the Royal Suite we have reserved, I think I have just found the answer. I refer to page 7 of the 2016 Scenic brochure concerning Royal and Panoramic suites, Under the heading of "Exclusive additional indulgences" the language includes "For the duration of your cruise enjoy COMPLIMENTARY laundry and pressing." (EMPHASIS ADDED).

 

So, in our particular case, this issue should be concluded (it had better be). Yet, I do retain concern for other cruisers in other accommodations misunderstanding what is really intended to be offered because of the "puffery".

 

Now, we move on to the bigger problem of how to get to the ship in business class, without having to drag our luggage around at intermediate stops. I know "air to Europe" (whatever that means) is included in the fare, but it is economy class. We are senior citizens with a few disabilities. For us, economy class would be torture, as is retrieving and re-checking bags at overcrowded and understaffed airports. But our TA is helping us with this, and hopefully a solution will be found in a day or two.

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Can I suggest Air Miles for those expensive Business Class seats! Knock on wood we have not been disappointed yet. If you look outside the box those seats are available. This Sept we flew KLM curtesy of our Alaska Airlines miles. Total cost $5 each way per ticket $20. (We did have to shorten our pre trip by one day to score these seats).

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Thanks for the suggestion, but we used up most of them on our 2015 Scenic cruise. And as far as the "free air to Europe" deal Scenic is offering, it has been our experience that airline miles cannot be used to upgrade a ticket supplied by a cruise line. If I am wrong, please correct me. But, in any event, we don't seem to have sufficient airline miles or AmEx miles left to upgrade two round trip flights to Europe and back from economy to business.

 

I was not expecting business class airline tickets for us for this 2016 cruise to be cheap -- especially if we confined the airlines to those who would transfer our luggage all the way to and back. But I confess that the $30K United charges just blew me away! You see, to fly out of here in Durango, CO, we are a bit limited. We can fly United to Denver to catch another flight if we are flying to the east. Or we can fly American to Dallas for a connection. (If we are flying west, we can take American to Phoenix, but that is not an issue here) To go east, once in Denver or Dallas, we need a connection on an airline that will transfer our luggage from the flight from Durango. So, it is complicated. I realize that this is not a "river cruise" problem, but an airline problem -- but the two are sort of connected, right?

 

Well, we have a good TA on the problem, and it is hoped that he will solve it for us. And I wish we had some United or AmEx miles left. But given the price United (and its partners) is showing now, even airline or AmEx miles wouldn't bring the cost into reasonable territory.

Edited by Dolebludger
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How about shipping your bags (Luggage Free or similar) and seeing what Scenic can do on Business seats from a Texas or other easily accessed Gateway. Sometimes the cruise companies can give you good less expensive options and sometimes not. I know my DH hates traveling even in Business and when I run out of tricks I will be in trouble ;)

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Good advice, and we are checking into all of these options. And I will report right here what we find. Sometimes people don't realize that some of us who like to cruise live in rather remote areas. Maybe we chose to live here for the same reason we like to cruise? I recall less than 20 years ago when all airlines (except Southwest) would transfer luggage to any other airline. Unfortunately, it is not that way today. And in the same time frame, I remember when flying economy was doable. Now, the airlines have reduced the seat and legroom, unregulated.

 

I know that neither this thread nor this forum is meant to discuss airline problems. But I do feel that all "lux" cruise lines should have included laundry for all on cruises over ten days (to bring this back on topic). And I feel that if they don't, it should be made clear in their promotional material. The reason is luggage limitations and fees on airlines (which we have to use to get to the cruise) and the luggage transfer problem between airlines, and the crowded, under staffed, and lack of porterage services at airports.

 

Now, why did we reserve another cruise on Scenic after just getting off one last month? Well, here is the good story. First time I was ever able to wear my good jeans to dinner on a cruise (a western slope Colorado formal wear). First time I ever encountered a cruise director who actually provided valuable information, instead of telling corny jokes or advertising for port businesses. Best "shore excursions" I have experienced. Breakfast and lunch via buffet -- but they need to be because there are so many land tours you don't have time for a sit-down. Best fellow guests because they are mainly Australian -- and Aussies are just like western slope Coloradans only they live elsewhere. Best entertainment, because it was educational. Best cultural experiences. Best way to see the interior of Europe.

 

This is getting boring, I know, but I didn't want sound overly critical of Scenic due to misleading ads. Viking advertises itself as "all-inclusive". Believe me, they aren't. I saw some TV ads for Carnival that said "it is just like an all-inclusive land resort that goes from place ti place" No way. I contacted the Federal Trade Commission on that one. The ads were gone. I don't know if I had anything to do with it or not. I just think consumers should be informed accurately of what they are buying before they buy it.

 

But for a European river cruise, we'll go Scenic -- if we can get there without a second mortgage!

 

And I am somewhat like your DH. I hate long flights -- even in business or first. So my DW has taken on the responsibility of booking us not only business or better class, but also booking us some stops along the way. I'm sure she and the TA will take care of this mess. For what United is charging now for this trip, I can charter something!

Edited by Dolebludger
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Have you looked at the ships descriptions towards the end of the brochure it lists what is included for each cabin on each deck so it may be a tad clearer. I must admit the new Scenic website is a pain and I feel a retrograde step to the previous website. In answer to the differences in the Russian cruise to the rest of Europe it is the Russian regulations no cruise company can own a vessel they are all leased and non of them can have unlimited alcohol. I hope you get your air challenges sorted in the past I have had the luggage transfer or non transfer problems several times whilst catching up with my other half on his world jounts luckily now both retired and it's now acceptable to travel in more comfortable wear rather than heels and a suit. CA

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For us, economy class would be torture, as is retrieving and re-checking bags at overcrowded and understaffed airports. But our TA is helping us with this, and hopefully a solution will be found in a day or two.

 

I hope your TA has explained that it is not really very difficult to have your bags booked through to your final destination as most airlines of any size have 'interline' agreements between them for the transfer of bags in transit.

 

So you should not find that the baggage issue is much of an impediment.

 

Finding low cost business class fares on the other-hand is not so easy...

Edited by Mark_T
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Canal,

 

Thank you for explaining the situation with the Russian Scenic cruises. We are not booked on one of those, nor do we plan to do so. It is just that reading the review of others that took one of those gave me a bit of pause. Apparently, they were not sufficiently advised about Scenic not really being "all-inclusive" on that itinerary. It is apparent that getting accurate information about the details of a Scenic cruise is a problem for more people than just us. We too are both retired and now living in the Rocky Mountains, where we wear jeans and coats in winter and shorts and short sleeve shirts in the summer. And we don't really "dress up" for anything. Some organization had an event here last spring which was "semi formal" and men had to wear a tie. Nobody showed up!

 

Mark,

 

I think our TA will get the air sorted out, but it is a bit weird. On all legs except for Durango to Denver, we will be on Icelandic Airlines. From Durango to Denver, United is our only choice. Icelandic is not a "code share airline" with United. But our TA thinks he can work it out to get our luggage shipped direct from Durango to Zurich (where the cruise embarks), and then back from Amsterdam (where the cruise disembarks) to Durango. Let's wish him luck! Claiming luggage in Denver and taking it to another terminal and rechecking it (and doing the security thing again) is a major pain in Denver. But if he can make this work the price is reasonable and we will take advantage of the opportunity to stay a few nights in Iceland. We don't know anybody who has ever been there, and we think it would be nice to see the place.

 

All,

 

Sorry to seem like such a "sissy" about what some consider "little things" like laundry and avoiding airline coach travel. But again, we are retired folks who have moved to a resort town where there is always a good time to be had. So if anything about a trip looks like it might be a "pain", we'd just rather stay home during that time, and chose from one of the many other trip opportunities that always seem to present themselves with no "pain".

 

I will post again when we get all the concerns about this cruise sorted out fully.

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Icelandic is not a "code share airline" with United. But our TA thinks he can work it out to get our luggage shipped direct from Durango to Zurich

 

Glad your TA is on the case, but it is not a matter of 'code shares' that is to do with one airline putting their flight number on another airlines metal.

 

You need an interline agreement to get luggage checked through to your destination in Europe.

 

I suspect you are talking about Icelandair and they do have an interline agreement with United.

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You should by all means go to Iceland! Great place. We've been a few times and love it. Iceland air allows (encourages) stopovers on transatlantic flights.

 

Just be aware that their "Business" class is NOT the same as what you are used to on some of the major carriers. They do NOT have lie-flat seats. They fly 757s with Saga-class seats more akin to domestic First Class. The seats are nice, wide leather seats, 2x2 configuration, but it's a recliner and the seat pitch is probably not more than 40" so it's not like business seats in United, etc with a 60"+ pitch.

 

Though it's fine for us coming from the East Coast, 5h30 from JFK or BOS, it might be less desirable for you flying from Denver.

 

**

 

Definitely, there is a difference between interline agreements for luggage, and codeshares. However, this difference can sometimes result in baggage fees, or can result in avoiding fees, so just be aware.

 

Example: we're Delta elite so we don't have to pay fees on DL or other Sky Team. A few years ago, we flew ALB-ATL-HNL on DL, then changed to Island Air for a final hop to Lanai. Totally separate tickets. Even though Island Air would have charged us a luggage fee, we didn't have to pay because the DL agent in ALB interlined our bags from DL to Island Air, and we don't pay on DL. BTW Island air is a bunch of puddle jumpers that AFAIK is not in a codeshare alliance with anyone, except maybe Hawaiian... And we didn't have to touch our bags again until they arrived in Lanai.

 

Now, coming home we flew Hawaiian Airlines from Maui to HNL, then flew the return portion of our DL ticket HNL-ATL-ALB. Again, we were able to have the HA agent in Maui interline our bags onto the DL flights so we checked them in Maui and didn't have to touch them again until ALB. BUT: HA charges a luggage fee. Even though DL wouldn't have charged us as elites, we still had to pay HA a few bucks per bag to take them from Maui to HNL because we have no status with HA.

 

So what I found is that (1) interlining is fairly easy and works; (2) the first airline (the one you're checking in with) seems to determine whether you'll pay a baggage fee.

 

Now, I suspect interlining baggage is easier when it's between two codeshare partners, like we've done flying home from Rome through CDG. I had to split up a ticket because we got the JFK-CDG for miles, then bought a separate AF ticket from FCO-CDG. The agent in FCO was able to check the bag to its final destination relatively easily. And, no baggage fee because of DL elite status.

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Mark,

 

I think I may be referring to Icelandair, I know the airline involved is owned by the government of Iceland and it it the only airline there. This matter has been rather convoluted so I probably called it by the wrong name. I'll find out the solution to the whole mess from my TA in the next day or two, and I thank you for the information that this airline does have a code share or luggage transfer agreement with United. That would solve the whole problem. The only info I was able to get on the internet about United's affiliates did not include any airline with "Iceland" in its name. But dealing with airlines here in the US is a real pain, as I'm sure you know.In any event, the airline from Iceland would cost us about $2500 pp rt from Denver instead of $15000 pp if booking a United flight. The only downside is the airline from Iceland does not have the fully reclining seats that United would have. But the upside is that our TA says we could stay over a day or to in Iceland. If this all works out, we'll take it.

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... and I thank you for the information that this airline does have a code share or luggage transfer agreement with United. That would solve the whole problem. The only info I was able to get on the internet about United's affiliates did not include any airline with "Iceland" in its name.

 

I understand how complicated it can be, I travel a lot on business so I use a few tools not general used by those with less need, and it does help when searching on the net to know the words the airlines use for different things.

 

Just knowing you need to look for 'interline' rather than 'codeshare' helps a lot for example.

 

I hope it all works out for you though, and do take the opportunity to have a quick look at Iceland on the way through :)

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jpalbny,

 

Thanks for the information. We will have to originate our flights with United in Durango going over, and with Icelandair in Amsterdam going home. Can you give me a "ballpark figure" as to what the luggage transfer fees might be in this case? (If there are any HIGH fees, I would expect they would be from United. And if they are too high, I'll charter us to Denver. United is hated here in Durango. They have a virtual "stranglehold" on us. There are letters to the editor in our local paper urging our local airport to ban them! But if they did, how would we get out of here when we want do do so? And how would the tourists that are a great support of our economy get here? We are about to vote on a property tax increase to upgrade our airport to attract other airlines and other routes into here. First property tax increase I will have ever voted for.)

 

Sorry for the digression in topic here. I do agree that, given the fact that Iclandair does not penalize, but encourages stop overs in Iceland, we should take full advantage of that. Our TA has connections with a firm that has helicopter tours there and will be trying to arrange such for us. And we are happy to hear from one who has been there that it is a great place to visit. If you have read my post above, you'll know that we are aware that the seating in business on Icelandair is not the customary "lay flat" seating customary for business international flights. Thus our interest in a few days in Iceland. And since you've been to Iceland, perhaps you could recommend some things we should see and do there?

 

Thanks in advance.:):):)

Edited by Dolebludger
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Mark,

 

Thanks so much for the info. If you read my post directly above, you'll see that going out of Denver and back by Icelandair will save us about $25K! That will make this cruise possible, and we certainly will want to spend some time in Iceland, especially if (as another member has said) Icenaldair does not penalize the traveler for a few days stopover there. And if you know of any places we should visit there, please post and let us know. All I really know about Iceland is that (supposedly) the Vikings gave it that name to discourage other nations from going there -- and that indeed it is not the ice covered place that the name suggests. I know that there are actually places of naturally beauty there -- but I just don't know exactly where.

 

Thanks in advance:):):)

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United absolutely will Interline your bags without any hassle at all. Has nothing to do with Code Share. As for baggage fees those would just be normal fees and the $25 - $40 per bag ones you normally pay. Nothing more :)

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Dolebludger, I don't want to drag this thread any further off topic by talking about Iceland, even though I'd dearly love to! There is a monster thread on the ports of call --> Europe --> Northern Europe section all about Iceland, started by someone who lives in Reykjavik. Over 500 posts but I didn't read them all! Wonder if there are some good answers there? I bet if you read the thread and post, you'll have some luck.

 

Here is a link to the thread. I will try to remember to check back there in a few days to see if you have posted questions, and I'll post a response if I can help.

Edited by jpalbny
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Mark,

 

Thanks so much for the info. If you read my post directly above, you'll see that going out of Denver and back by Icelandair will save us about $25K! That will make this cruise possible, and we certainly will want to spend some time in Iceland, especially if (as another member has said) Icenaldair does not penalize the traveler for a few days stopover there. And if you know of any places we should visit there, please post and let us know. All I really know about Iceland is that (supposedly) the Vikings gave it that name to discourage other nations from going there -- and that indeed it is not the ice covered place that the name suggests. I know that there are actually places of naturally beauty there -- but I just don't know exactly where.

 

Thanks in advance:):):)

 

I too have flown Icelandair and stayed 4 nights....As for the airline, it was very comfortable (we flew economy out of NY because it was only a 5 hour flight) It's not Lufthansa, but it was certainly better than Delta (IMHO). Another airline you might look into for less expensive business class is Air Canada. You would have to fly from Denver to nearest Canadian city and transfer to an International flight, but I was VERY impressed with them both for economy (Toronto to NY) and business (Toronto to Vancouver).

 

As for what to do in Iceland, it is truly a scenic wonderland. I would recommend staying at an Icelandair hotel (we were at SAS Saga and it was wonderful) and taking tours to see the glaciers, Vik, waterfalls, geysers and Thingvillir NP. Also not to be missed (just for the experience) is the Blue Lagoon, which you can arrange to visit on your way to the airport. Only downside to Icelandair (I don't really consider it a downside but some might) no matter where your flight originates or where it ends, it MUST stop in Iceland!! You may or may not have to change planes, but you do have to stop....apparently them's the rules!!! Daughter flew to Reykjavik this summer and went from Iceland to Brussels. Coming home she flew from Brussels to Iceland to Newark to KC!!! She flew business on the home flight and said it was very comfortable with good food and drink.

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And, for what it is worth, we are planning to go the Icelandair route by flying United to Denver and catching Iceland air. We understand that these airlines are transferring luggage -- at least for now. The only catch is we have to catch a 7:20 flight from Iceland to Zurich, which means a much earlier morning than I like -- especially on vacation. But we will get some private tours in Iceland as we'll stay two nights pre-cruise there. Everybody says it is not to be missed -- even if almost nobody goes there.

 

What a mess! If these airlines don't get their act together, this may well be my last trip of this distance.

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  • 3 months later...
As a matter of fact, we have booked on Scenic for August 15, 2016, and are working out air now, We have booked a larger room called a "Royal Suite" (though I doubt it will be a true suite). And our TA has been adequately assured that laundry WILL be included with that suite. I still feel the Scenic web page was misleading concerning included laundry, and still recommend that anybody booking Scenic get this matter clarified as to their intended cabin at time of booking. But overall, the cruise was so good and enjoyable that it would not be in our best interests to "cross them off our list" over the laundry issue.

 

As we are up in years, we are doing our long distance travel while we still (barely) can, and saving shorter, domestic trips for later. Even now, long airline flights in coach are just impossible for us. Mainly, I think, because airlines have been shrinking the passenger space in coach out of sheer greed. (As you my be able to tell, we are no fans of airlines!) Even first/business class on 10 hour flights is getting grueling. But the onboard experience is so good that we'll try it one more time.

I totally agree with your assessment of flying today especially overseas. We are 83 and 84 years old, live near Phoenix, Arizona and always fly to Boston for a few days to visit family before heading across the Atlantic which breaks up the trip somewhat. We are sailing Sept 5 Budapest to Amsterdam on the Scenic Amber. We chose to pick our own flights so we can be assured of aisle seating (we try to sit across the aisle from each other to get the illusion of more space) and shortest overall travel time. In this case 10 hours to Budapest and 8 hours non-stop from Amsterdam. Are you booking your flights through Scenic?

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We are not booking through Scenic. All they offer on their program is coach. As we have become older, we just won't take coach on long trips. Would rather stay home.(the ever shrinking coach seats have some to do with that too.) We booked all international legs first class on Icelander, and in fact will spend a couple of days there on the way over. Much less expensive. While lacking "lay flat seats" it at least has decent space in its regular first seats. And we can do a 45 minute flight from our home in Durango, and get on Icelander from there. Of course, I can't comment with accuracy on Icelander until late next summer when I have experienced it.

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I've been shopping flights from Medford OR to Zurich and from Amsterdam back to Medford. I didn't look at exactly your dates but business class on the route came to about $10K for two passengers. From Durango should be no worse. This price was on United.

 

I wonder if your TA gave you a price for first class.

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We are not booking through Scenic. All they offer on their program is coach. As we have become older, we just won't take coach on long trips. Would rather stay home.(the ever shrinking coach seats have some to do with that too.) We booked all international legs first class on Icelander, and in fact will spend a couple of days there on the way over. Much less expensive. While lacking "lay flat seats" it at least has decent space in its regular first seats. And we can do a 45 minute flight from our home in Durango, and get on Icelander from there. Of course, I can't comment with accuracy on Icelander until late next summer when I have experienced it.

 

Hey There Dolebludger, this is Lone StarCruisinCouple, Where in Durango do you live as we are looking at a home at The Glacier Club but have property over in Pagosa Springs and have a realtor going today to look at and give us a report on that is already built. We go to Carver Brothers when we come up to ski and coming up later this year to do some looking and talking with some builders.

Lone Star

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jeb,

 

Yes, when we checked United Denver to Switzerland, the fare was over $6K per, first class. Much cheaper in Icelander -- yes for first class. But Icelander has its first class only like a domestic first. No 180 degree reclining seats.

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