Can we avoid rafting?

I am starting to look at river cruises for the first time for 2017. We are in our 50's, active, and would prefer all-inclusive. We love good food, decent wine, and would like active excursions/bikes. We have been on 3 ocean cruises (liked Azamara) and must have a balcony/open-air.

River cruising sounds like a wonderful way to explore cities and I love to be on the water but my reading has led me to understand that most, if not all, of the river cruise ships will raft with other ships (at least sometimes). Rafting is NOT appealing to me; I do not love crowds. So, helpful Cruise Critic members, do you have ideas about how to lessen the chances of rafting? Time of year, particular routes, or cruise lines that may raft more or less? We are not wedded to any particular timing or even cruise route yet.

If it is not possible to avoid rafting (at least most of the cruise), I will explore barge cruising a bit more. Barge cruising sounds lovely but, of course, barges cannot explore larger cities or waterways and they only go a very short distance.

I would appreciate any input to help us find a river cruise that is as interesting and beautiful as any but maybe a bit off the beaten path...many thanks!

We did not raft at all on the Rhone (two cruises). I suspect the Duoro and Bordeaux would be the same.

 

We have rafted on the Rhine, Main, Danube and Moselle. We travel in off season 90% of the time.

I really don't think you can avoid rafting. We did raft on the Rhone a couple of times; we cruised in Nov/15.

 

I wouldn't really avoid the river cruise ships just due to rafting. Sure, it can limit the view which is why we book the steerage cabins. We are only in the cabin to sleep and shower.

 

As for the crowds, I can only assume that you mean more people in port with more ships in port. It's not like ocean cruising where you can have 8 -10,000 more people on cruise days. Each river ship only holds a maximum of 200 people. Even with six ships in port, that's only 1200 people.

On the Duoro all sailing is done in the daytime so you are guaranteed to be able to use your balcony in peace for all that. There are also many fewer ships on the Duoro, so I think rafting will be rare -- but again it would be only when you're off on an excursion or at night.

There are no crowds. We rafted once or twice land we never saw the pax of the other ship, we simply walked through their entry across to our entry.

We were rafted in Egypt, routinely. Of course with the collapse of tourism, most of the other boats were empty, so we simply walked through their lobbies. I can't imagine it would be much different if they were full, frankly.

 

The big disadvantage was that our balcony frequently faced another boat. So there wasn't much to see unless were moving out on the river. Unfortunately our side of the boat was the one that was always facing in.

Rafting is pretty much a crap shoot and no matter which company you sail with they have no control over where they will dock in any port on any river. That is up to the dock master who will assign incoming ships based often on their departure times. It's a function of the time of year and popularity of the itinerary....you're more likely to be rafted during the height of the tourist season and on the Rhine and Danube rivers. Although we were rafted in both Egypt and Russia. Got2Cruise is correct when he says you will not interact with the ship you are rafted to as most of the time they will be walking through your ship either across the lobby or sun deck. They will have no access to the rest of your ship, nor will you have access to theirs. The worst thing is that you will not be able to see out of your window or french balcony and you will want to keep the drapes closed when you're dressing. Keep in mind that you are usually off the ship during the day and the drapes are closed at night anyway so rafting isn't that awful. It's not like you're rafted 24/7 and never see daylight, and the traffic through your ship and/or theirs is usually when you're leaving and when you're returning.

 

You mention that you must have a balcony/open air. I do too as I tend to be claustrophobic. If that is why you require a balcony/open air, I can tell you from personal experience that rafting has not been a problem for me. Since you haven't done a river cruise before I am going to mention that on most cruise lines the balcony they talk about is french balcony, which is basically a sliding glass door with a railing you can lean out and over to take pictures or look at scenery but you cannot sit on it. As to the balcony being "real" or french...there are some cruise lines with real balconies you can sit on, but not most of them...you'll have to check carefully and be mindful when talking to TA or cruise company to ask if it's a balcony you can sit on if that's important to you.

 

I don't like crowds very much either but let me share two experiences I had on river cruises in Egypt and Russia. On the Nile we woke up in the morning and discovered we were rafted. After breakfast I opened the drapes and sat in front of the window when my "next door neighbor" opened her drapes. We exchanged smiles and then both of us opened our sliding doors and started talking. They were from England and heading in the opposite direction from us. Before you know it we were sharing tea (hers) and cookies(mine) and exchanging info about what we each had seen and done. In Russia when we wound up rafted we did the same thing only this time we didn't speak their language and they didn't speak ours and after a few awkward attempts discovered we both spoke French and shared a bottle of wine! Both of these were delightful encounters that I am very glad we had.

Edited February 29, 2016 by Hydrokitty

Mekong river: we rafted only once, never saw the passengers of the other ships.

Thank you all so much for the helpful 'insider' information!

I do know that most of the balconies are not 'real' balconies, which is fine. We just love to have a private place to talk, read, and enjoy the views with fresh air. We also sleep with the window open - always (even in Iceland). So the privacy we would lose with rafting is important to me. Of course, the trade-off is enjoying some iconic European cities from the water.

Special thanks to HydroKitty for the lovely stories of new friends across the balconies - these unpredictable and wonderful things are one of the reasons we travel and will keep in mind when fretting about rafting and other imperfections!

I will look into the Duoro or Rhone, maybe in late September 2017.

I do know that most of the balconies are not 'real' balconies, which is fine. We just love to have a private place to talk, read, and enjoy the views with fresh air. We also sleep with the window open - always (even in Iceland). So the privacy we would lose with rafting is important to me. Of course, the .

 

AMA's newer ships (which is most of the fleet) have real balconies. We have had these several times and really enjoy them.

 

Sleeping with the door open may not be practical if your itinerary has a lot of locks. It will be noisy and I would not want to have those lock walls right there (these are for the most part very tight spaces) when I was sleeping. I would find it disruptive.

AMA's newer ships (which is most of the fleet) have real balconies. We have had these several times and really enjoy them.

 

Sleeping with the door open may not be practical if your itinerary has a lot of locks. It will be noisy and I would not want to have those lock walls right there (these are for the most part very tight spaces) when I was sleeping. I would find it disruptive.

 

 

I agree about the locks. The locks are not really mentioned that much here on CC. We were amazed how tight a fit it was going through the locks. There is maybe six inches between the ship and the wall.

...We were amazed how tight a fit it was going through the locks. There is maybe six inches between the ship and the wall.

Most riverboats are specifically designed for the absolute maximum size (width, length, height) they can be, and still fit into the locks and under the bridges in the area they are designed for. I have been on barges (in this case considerably smaller than most river boats) in France with less than an inch clearance on each side in the lock. Last year passing through Lyon the captain had to move the water ballast while passing (very slowly) under a bridge to get first the bow and then the stern under with maybe a centimeter of clearance. I was on the fore deck watching this maneuver in wonder - I think we were the last boat for several days under that bridge as the water was rising.

On my Uniworld Danube River cruise last November, we never rafted once, probably because it was the off season. As has been pointed out already, river boats carry a max of 200 passengers in most cases, so there are no crowds.

 

Roz

AMA's newer ships (which is most of the fleet) have real balconies. We have had these several times and really enjoy them.

 

Sleeping with the door open may not be practical if your itinerary has a lot of locks. It will be noisy and I would not want to have those lock walls right there (these are for the most part very tight spaces) when I was sleeping. I would find it disruptive.

 

There have also been reports of nasty little surprises (bugs) from sleeping with the balcony slider open. Cruise ships don't have screens!

There have also been reports of nasty little surprises (bugs) from sleeping with the balcony slider open. Cruise ships don't have screens!

 

Especially in Egypt where we couldn't even sit on our balcony most of the time because of the bugs.

 

Really good point about the locks and you'd not want to have the drapes open while sleeping either because the light is like a searchlight!!!

We were rafted in Egypt, routinely. Of course with the collapse of tourism, most of the other boats were empty, so we simply walked through their lobbies. I can't imagine it would be much different if they were full, frankly.

 

The big disadvantage was that our balcony frequently faced another boat. So there wasn't much to see unless were moving out on the river. Unfortunately our side of the boat was the one that was always facing in.

 

Wendy, were you on the starboard or port side? We are booked starboard. Of course, docking can vary between trips.

I do know that most of the balconies are not 'real' balconies, which is fine. We just love to have a private place to talk, read, and enjoy the views with fresh air. We also sleep with the window open - always (even in Iceland). So the privacy we would lose with rafting is important to me. Of course, the trade-off is enjoying some iconic European cities from the water.

 

We're doing Viking on the Rhine, next August. We booked a Veranda room - not the suite (they have those too). It's a small (by ocean cruise standards) outside space with 2 chairs and a small table. They do the French balcony rooms with the window and the railing on one side and the Veranda rooms on the other. This is splurge and spoil ourselves trip, so that's why we chose it.

 

I knew about the rafting and it doesn't really bother me. Might meet some interesting people that way!

I have been on 5 river cruises with Uniworld at different times of the year maybe rafted 4 or 5 times out of all the stops. The most was a Tulip and Windmill cruise in the Netherlands and Belgium (twice I think).

 

Second seating

There have also been reports of nasty little surprises (bugs) from sleeping with the balcony slider open. Cruise ships don't have screens!

 

Yes, and pretty smelly and ugly! Opened our drapes one time to find we were in the lock then opened the slider. Couldn't get that thing closed fast enough! We did raft while crusing from Amsterdam to Budapest but it did not bother us a bit. It was fun to see the other ships lobbies too.

It was fun to see the other ships lobbies too.

 

We enjoyed that too - esp since everyone was decorated for Christmas - all so nice and so different!

We did not raft at all on the Rhone (two cruises). I suspect the Duoro and Bordeaux would be the same.

 

We have rafted on the Rhine, Main, Danube and Moselle. We travel in off season 90% of the time.

 

We never rated on my last cruise in November (Main Danube Canal, Rhine and Moselle). We rafted three times on the lower Danube (from Romania to Hungary).

 

It is not really a big deal. You are rarely on the boat during the daytime when rafting would be a issue blocking your view. During nice weather you would be in town our out on deck. If bad weather probably won't be able to see much anyway.

 

JMHO and YMMV

 

JC

...We did raft while crusing from Amsterdam to Budapest but it did not bother us a bit. It was fun to see the other ships lobbies too.

Doesn't bother me much, as I am usually out rather than in my room. Many of the boats have the same (or close) height above water at the lobby, and it is a pretty easy stroll (while gawking [speaking for myself:rolleyes:]) through other ships. BUT when you have to climb two floors to the sundeck, down a sloping gangway to the next sundeck, etc. etc. it is a bother, especially if you have mobility issues. There is a reason to do some trips sooner, rather than wait until they will be too difficult.:(

 

Thom

"There is a reason to do some trips sooner, rather than wait until they will be too difficult." - Amen to that, brother. Whenever I hear my co-workers say they would like to travel some place when they retire, my response is always do it now. None of us what's tomorrow has in store for us. I've seen so many people in my office building retire and then within a year either die or develop a serious illness that severely limits what they can do.

 

Roz

We rafted on the Douro a couple of times. On that river (1) there is no night sailing and (2) the ports in the towns are fairly small and depending upon the number of boats on the river that week rafting may be necessary. One night, we didn't stay in the town advertised but downstream a few klicks in a different town because the dock was already full. Better deal actually.

 

Same in Porto, actually the boats dock across the river from Porto, the docking area is only so large and depending upon schedules rafting may be necessary. We were rafted with another boat most all the time in Porto. It was empty with only the crew onboard but it blocked our views from the cabins and dining room.

"There is a reason to do some trips sooner, rather than wait until they will be too difficult." - Amen to that, brother. Whenever I hear my co-workers say they would like to travel some place when they retire, my response is always do it now. None of us what's tomorrow has in store for us. I've seen so many people in my office building retire and then within a year either die or develop a serious illness that severely limits what they can do.

 

Roz

 

Right on! I keep telling people to do the trips where you need good legs: Greece, Russia, Africa, Egypt first... you can see the Louvre in a wheel chair but you have to climb that hill to see the Parthenon!!! I was fine when we retired and we did those trips first and I am so glad because after a couple of accidents I now have walking and balance issues and I could never do them now. Hasn't stopped me from traveling but it has caused me to change my itineraries!

Edited March 3, 2016 by Hydrokitty