Are my sums wrong (tipping)

I had to dine out twice in one day a year or so ago and the tips for that day came out to $9.50 per person (not sure what that is in pounds) and we weren't eating in any upscale establishments. It's not the crew's fault that you booked a 30 day cruise but you should consider the tips to be part of your costs.

I have to disagree that you should consider tips to be part of your cost. You say its not the crews fault that the OP booked a 30 day cruise but on the other hand its not the OP's fault the company (presumably, as no one knows for sure) don't pay their staff a proper living wage.

OP you earn your money, you should be the only one to decide how you spend it!

This will never be sorted out until the cruise companies include tipping in the headline price and while ever tips are discretionary some will pay and some won't. C'est la vie!

I have to disagree that you should consider tips to be part of your cost. You say its not the crews fault that the OP booked a 30 day cruise but on the other hand its not the OP's fault the company (presumably, as no one knows for sure) don't pay their staff a proper living wage.

OP you earn your money, you should be the only one to decide how you spend it!

This will never be sorted out until the cruise companies include tipping in the headline price and while ever tips are discretionary some will pay and some won't. C'est la vie!

It is what it is and wait staff and other people that work for tips, whether they work for the cruise company or a hotel or a restaurant are all paid substandard wages with the expectation that the remainder of their income comes from tips (here in the US anyway). I would not dine out at a restaurant if I couldn't pay for the meal and a tip nor would I book a cruise if I could not pay for the cruise fare and the recommended tips.

We are not talking about something that the OP has to have to sustain his or her life, we are talking about a luxury. If one can't pay for a luxury than maybe one shouldn't be spending money on luxuries in the first place.

out of curiosity I wondered how many cabins a steward would look after.

 

 

 

Google says it was between 20-35

 

 

 

So just for an example lets say, 28, now if we tip £10.23 per person, and lets say 2 person per room, that's £20.46 per cabin per day, therefore:

 

 

 

28 x 20.46 = £572.88 per day

 

14 x 3572.88 = 8,020.32 for a 14 day cruise

 

 

 

Does a steward really earn that much?

You have you numbers wrong. The room steward and MDR waiter get 25% each from the daily charge. The rest is divided among a number of other staff.

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The average steward only has 15 to 20 cabins max. If they have more then an assistant steward is assigned.

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It is what it is and wait staff and other people that work for tips, whether they work for the cruise company or a hotel or a restaurant are all paid substandard wages with the expectation that the remainder of their income comes from tips (here in the US anyway). I would not dine out at a restaurant if I couldn't pay for the meal and a tip nor would I book a cruise if I could not pay for the cruise fare and the recommended tips.

 

We are not talking about something that the OP has to have to sustain his or her life, we are talking about a luxury. If one can't pay for a luxury than maybe one shouldn't be spending money on luxuries in the first place.

The US tipping culture is different from the UK. Staff in our restaurants have to be paid a legal minimum salary. I can dine out and not have to tip the waiter or waitress.

These discussions will go on and on and on until cruise companies include tips in the price.

I am paying for my 'luxury' at the price the cruise company ask me to pay. I have earned the money to pay for it and so have the right to choose whether or not I pay the discretionary gratuities.

Sorry, we'll have to agree to differ on this subject!

Here is the breakdown from the RCI website:

 

The automatic gratuity is $13.50 USD, or $16.50 USD for suite guests, applied to each guest's SeaPass® account on a daily basis. Here's how it is shared between your onboard service team:

Standard Staterooms:

$6.35 - Dining Services

$3.45 - Stateroom Attendant

$3.70 - Other Hotel Services

 

So, using 28 staterooms on a 7 day cruise, the Stateroom Attendant and his assistant would share $3.45 x 28 x 7 = $676.20.

 

As I understand it, this comprises the majority of their salary, since the cruise line is not required by law to pay tipped employees the normal minimum wage.

X2 for two people per cabin.

The US tipping culture is different from the UK. Staff in our restaurants have to be paid a legal minimum salary. I can dine out and not have to tip the waiter or waitress.

 

These discussions will go on and on and on until cruise companies include tips in the price.

 

I am paying for my 'luxury' at the price the cruise company ask me to pay. I have earned the money to pay for it and so have the right to choose whether or not I pay the discretionary gratuities.

 

Sorry, we'll have to agree to differ on this subject!

I agree that the two cultures are different, but I've always lived by the motto "when in Rome" and have done my best to learn and live by the cultural norms of the country I am visiting as much as possible (the ship being the "country" in this particular case). I do understand where you are coming from, but taking your dissatisfaction out on the hard working crew is a poor way to make your point since this has little impact on the company. If you really wanted to make your point you would cancel your cruise and tell the company exactly why you are cancelling.

We pay the expected amount and on every cruise so far have tipped extra. We have had some awesome stewards and waiters. Then there's been that outstanding bartender ;) who has been taken care of cause he took care of us. These people work hard and long hours for their money, it's not a 40-hour week job.

You have some info confused and some is variable by person and cruise line. First, is it just one steward? Very difficult for one steward to cover 28 cabins...that is more likely for two steward teams, like Holland America uses. I think for one steward, 16-18 would be a more realistic number. Some cruise lines assign number of cabins by type- for example, as suites are larger, the stewards will be assigned fewer. They might be assigned more of smaller cabins.

 

Second, tipping is rarely mandatory...a number of people don't tip at all.

 

Third, your amount of money is typically spread over many staff- dining room as well as room stewards, not just room stewards. The cruise lines I am familiar with it is about $5 per day, per person in a cabin, for the room steward team, out of a standard 12.5 USD per person, per day tip..

 

So, no, the cabin stewards don't make anywhere near that much for their very hard work.

Oh my gosh...are there really people who don't tip at all???

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On RCL we do the prepaid gratuity when we book the cruise. On board i find the one or two interesting pubs (usually top deck pool and one other). I give USD cash tips for the server at random times that takes care of me. When it is crowded they seem to see me there and my favorite brew is handed to me through the crowd:o

We get envelops from our cabin staff and leave some USD cash if thet have been attentive and do towel puppets each day:cool:

The MDR staff hand out these envelopes if you eat there frequently.

Cash in any amount is always appreciated and you do not have to feel guilty if it is enough or not . Something is better than nothing and I am sure the staff meets enough people with alligator arms and deep pockets.

The staff I have encountered to date on RCL work hard so I tip what I consider fair.

The cruise lines need to be more honest about the fact that the 'tips' are really a salary for the staff, and perhaps set a slightly lower amount (say $10), but make it part of the fare. That would probably even out for those who just either don't get it or don't care and skimp out usually. I think it would improve service and improve the actual tips for the staff. The problem is they all need to agree to do it.

As an American, I would be too embarrassed to admit to taking a 30 day cruise and not paying the full tip. As a Brit (I have dual citizenship), I can see why someone would think it's ridiculous to be expected to spend that much when the staff are already getting paid. Americans can't grasp the concept of companies charging more for their products to give staff a realistic wage and Brits can't grasp the concept of paying staff so little and expecting passengers to 'tip' the difference.

As I have said. It's a tax problem for the crew. Tips aren't usually taxable in their home countries. In Canada servers have to pay tax on tips. Salary in the crews home country are taxed at a fairly high rate. I've heard the cruise will have to go up about $50 per person per day.

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As I have said. It's a tax problem for the crew. Tips aren't usually taxable in their home countries. In Canada servers have to pay tax on tips. Salary in the crews home country are taxed at a fairly high rate. I've heard the cruise will have to go up about $50 per person per day.

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I thought it was because they pay a set portion (percentage) of the wages to the hiring agency. So, they contract for x amount of money to be paid to the hiring agency IF it is their wage they must pay that portion. BUT they get to keep all of their tips because they aren't "wages".

 

That is why they only get "paid" $250 a month (or whatever the going rate is). That is what they pay back to the agency and the rest is free money, so to speak.

They get paid a rate similar to their type of job in their home country. Also onboard doctors are paid what they would get at home. All the crew is in a similar type of salary issue.

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Oh my gosh...are there really people who don't tip at all???

 

Yes there are. It makes some people feel good when they tip and other people feel good when they don't.

Does a steward really earn that much?

No. Pay the recommended amount and content yourself with knowing that the ship told the steward to expect X amount and the steward accepted that job with the expectation of X amount.

Does it matter? Is it our business how much the steward earns?

 

 

No. Pay the recommended amount and content yourself with knowing that the ship told the steward to expect X amount and the steward accepted that job with the expectation of X amount.

Exactly. I don't get this urge to know how much your server gets paid on a cruise. Do you ask when you go to Burger King, Olive Garden or any other restaurant. No? I know at my favorite restaurant that the waiters make more then I do but I still tip them 15% to 25% for the pleasure of waiting on me.

I also don't ask at my doctor's office, clothing stores or anywhere else for that matter. It is simply none of my business.

I'm sailing on 5/29th on NCL. I pre-paid the gratuities which were $13.50/day = $54. BUT how much does NCL keep and NOT hand over to the workers? Keep as an 'Admin. Fee' or whatever they want to call it. Why do I suspect NCL of this? Look at their excursion prices! And now they charge a fee for room service. I always hand additional cash tips to those I get amazing service from. It is certainly not all of the what ... 20+ people that help me, advise me, answer questions or I come in contact with on the cruise.

I'm sailing on 5/29th on NCL. I pre-paid the gratuities which were $13.50/day = $54. BUT how much does NCL keep and NOT hand over to the workers? Keep as an 'Admin. Fee' or whatever they want to call it. Why do I suspect NCL of this? Look at their excursion prices! And now they charge a fee for room service. I always hand additional cash tips to those I get amazing service from. It is certainly not all of the what ... 20+ people that help me, advise me, answer questions or I come in contact with on the cruise.

This has been alleged for most all cruise lines, with absolutely no proof, many times. So, what NCL charges for their excursions (similar to other cruise lines, I am sure) is not proof in any way that they are stiffing their employees.

NCL has cut cruise fares to try to take a bigger share of the market. The NCL "nickel and diming" that is commonly complained about on Cruise Critic is an attempt to create an "a la carte" product, and making up for lost revenue in the cruise fare side. But that IS NOT evidence they are stealing from their employees.

High employee turnover would be a FAR, FAR better indicator of issues than excursion costs.

Facts, not innuendos, please. And I am not a NCL defender...I have not sailed on them, and what I have heard, they are not my kind of cruise line. But I am not going to smear them without pretty solid evidence.

So NCL 'stiff' it's clients/customers, but they don't 'stiff' their employees? Why? Because they are so up front and above board? Our Med. cruise had EXORBITANT excursion fees. But traveling to so many countries, we had NO idea how to get a tour NOT through NCL. The quality and what was provided on the tours in no way came close to what was promised by NCL. For example: Tuscany winery tour with 'authentic tuscan lunch'. $220/Per Person. Tuscan lunch was platters of deli meats, olives and cheese. Then HUGE bowls of pasta gone cold with a drizzle of sauce that had dried onto the cork screw pasta. Really? I can make this at home. This is only 1 example of their over priced and low quality excursions.

There is no way to find out if they do stiff their employees. The greatest indicator of future behavior is past behavior.

So NCL 'stiff' it's clients/customers, but they don't 'stiff' their employees? Why? Because they are so up front and above board? Our Med. cruise had EXORBITANT excursion fees. But traveling to so many countries, we had NO idea how to get a tour NOT through NCL. The quality and what was provided on the tours in no way came close to what was promised by NCL. For example: Tuscany winery tour with 'authentic tuscan lunch'. $220/Per Person. Tuscan lunch was platters of deli meats, olives and cheese. Then HUGE bowls of pasta gone cold with a drizzle of sauce that had dried onto the cork screw pasta. Really? I can make this at home. This is only 1 example of their over priced and low quality excursions.

There is no way to find out if they do stiff their employees. The greatest indicator of future behavior is past behavior.

That is a fairly common Italian lunch. Italians don't cook pasta like they do in North America. You got a cold pasta salad for lunch. No different that what is served on the ship.

If they stiffed there staff , the staff after a while won't work for them.

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That is a fairly common Italian lunch. Italians don't cook pasta like they do in North America. You got a cold pasta salad for lunch. No different that what is served on the ship.

If they stiffed there staff , the staff after a while won't work for them.

 

 

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Thank you, I appreciate your comments and thoughts, But sadly, no. It was a hot pasta that has red tomato sauce drizzled on it. SO little sauce that it barely covered the corkscrew pasta. It was a hot pasta that sat and sat and gone cold.

On the cruise we just got off our room steward had 15 rooms to service. He was pretty busy I don't think he could have managed more than that timewise.

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So NCL 'stiff' it's clients/customers, but they don't 'stiff' their employees? Why? Because they are so up front and above board? Our Med. cruise had EXORBITANT excursion fees. But traveling to so many countries, we had NO idea how to get a tour NOT through NCL. The quality and what was provided on the tours in no way came close to what was promised by NCL. For example: Tuscany winery tour with 'authentic tuscan lunch'. $220/Per Person. Tuscan lunch was platters of deli meats, olives and cheese. Then HUGE bowls of pasta gone cold with a drizzle of sauce that had dried onto the cork screw pasta. Really? I can make this at home. This is only 1 example of their over priced and low quality excursions.

There is no way to find out if they do stiff their employees. The greatest indicator of future behavior is past behavior.

I hardly think it is NCL's fault that you are not tech savvy enough to go on the internet (or CC for that matter) and look up things to do in each port, check out preferred guides and tours for each port. You chose not to do this - or have anyone else do it for you - so you can hardly complain that it is anyone's but your own fault you didn't research excursions in advance. Even before I found CC I still knew how to find shore excursions or "things to do" in ports. It is really hard. Go to Google, type in shore excursions and the port name. Viola!

So NCL 'stiff' it's clients/customers, but they don't 'stiff' their employees? Why? Because they are so up front and above board? Our Med. cruise had EXORBITANT excursion fees. But traveling to so many countries, we had NO idea how to get a tour NOT through NCL. The quality and what was provided on the tours in no way came close to what was promised by NCL. For example: Tuscany winery tour with 'authentic tuscan lunch'. $220/Per Person. Tuscan lunch was platters of deli meats, olives and cheese. Then HUGE bowls of pasta gone cold with a drizzle of sauce that had dried onto the cork screw pasta. Really? I can make this at home. This is only 1 example of their over priced and low quality excursions.

There is no way to find out if they do stiff their employees. The greatest indicator of future behavior is past behavior.

Once you've paid the service charges it isn't really your concern what happens to the money, but the crew has to be paid something and that amount comes from the customers one way or another. That NCL overcharged you for a third party excursion that they have no control over has nothing to do with the service charges.