SHARE....one more time....

I think you haven't been following the Stone threads very carefully. Yes, I (and others) have been called several names because we don't want to eat in SHARE. Let's see, the "belching hogs in the trailer park" remark was one of my favorites. (The mods removed that one, I think.) So you can skip the lecture.

 

MY objection to the Stone trifecta is the removal of favorite items from the MDR Always Available menu in order to offer some odd-sounding Stone creations instead. Anyone is welcome to go to SHARE. Knock yourself out. You are also welcome to try the promised Curtis Stone Chef's Table (when it appears.) Two-thirds of the Curtis Stoning of Princess is off my radar, but I do get to complain when he starts robbing me of favorites in the MDR.

 

BTW, next time you're on a Stone-laden ship, you might want to eat at SHARE every night. Reports are that the place is next-to-empty and the waiters are up on deck trolling for customers. I guess this is their version of "change or die."

So what does the Anytime Dining Menu have to do with Share which is what the OP was reviewing? And speaking of following threads, there is not ship in the fleet that you can not order the "old stuff" on. Frankly I'm sure they would LOVE to serve you a 4 oz piece of farm raised frozen Salmon (they sell the same thing at the Dollar tree) as opposed to some of the other menu items. They also have plenty of "beef Medallions" as they are left overs from trimming the filet. You will notice there is no consistencey to the grain pattern. Both dishes can be delicious if made correctly which princess does, They are availbel however. Just not on the menu. But then neither is the rack of lamb or escargot which we have every cruise.

So what does the Anytime Dining Menu have to do with Share which is what the OP was reviewing? And speaking of following threads, there is not ship in the fleet that you can not order the "old stuff" on. Frankly I'm sure they would LOVE to serve you a 4 oz piece of farm raised frozen Salmon (they sell the same thing at the Dollar tree) as opposed to some of the other menu items. They also have plenty of "beef Medallions" as they are left overs from trimming the filet. You will notice there is no consistencey to the grain pattern. Both dishes can be delicious if made correctly which princess does, They are availbel however. Just not on the menu. But then neither is the rack of lamb or escargot which we have every cruise.

So would you like for me to go through the thread and show you what someone said to someone else and then received an answer from someone else who then commented on something about something else that was said by someone else? I guess you aren't familiar with forums and the way threads evolve. I was responding to a comment about another comment I had made about the price of SHARE, based on a comment made by someone else based on a comment made by someone else based on a comment made by someone else. But thanks for the sermon. I'm sure your check from Stone is in the mail.

This reminds me a little of Kai Sushi on the Diamond during our recent 12 NZ cruise. The Crown Grill space was taken away and given to Kai Sushi. Crown Grill is now a portion of Horzion Court at tables with tablecloths. The steakhouse ambiance is now gone. As we had early traditional dining we passed Kai Sushi many times while checking the sunset, and found Kai Sushi to be pretty much empty. A friend 'dropped in' during lunch one day and was surprised the sushi wasn't better than it was. Maybe during an Asia cruise it's busier, but I don't see how they've paid for the remodel. BTW, there is now an additional up charge if you want lobster in the Crown Grill.

I have read that Kai Sushi wasn't popular & probably passengers are unwilling to pay extra for shipboard sushi when they can get better & less expensive sushi at home.

I refreshed my memory by checking old Diamond deck plans to confirm that your description of the changes made before the Diamond was deployed to Asia are inaccurate.

The twins Diamond & Sapphire have never had a Crown Grill restaurant & only a Sterlings Steakhouse located in a separate aft section of the Horizon Court. The space being used for Kai Sushi was previously the very large & underutilized Internet Cafe which is now much smaller & is located in the atrium on deck 5.

Good point. In addition, there is no limit to the number of things you can get in CG for your $25. You can have steak AND lobster and three orders of mushrooms if you want. SHARE limits the number of items you can order, and the servings are small (reportedly) and you'll need to pay another $39 for a second helping. I am not a food snob who needs to brag about the hoity-toity restaurants I visit, but I have seen a few in my life, and the price tag has never been worth the hype.

While not listed on the menu in SHARE, there are specific prices if you would like to add something extra. I am almost certain I was quoted $12 to order an additional entree (because I planned two dinners in SHARE and there turned out to be three entrees that interested me.) It's almost a guess to say I remember addition sides were $8. I'll find out for sure next week.

But I never did order extra food. Thought I would need to when I saw the small size of the Beef Cheek Pie entree. But really.... the food is rich and filling. I would not suggest ordering seconds until you've finished your first meal. Chances are that you won't want seconds.

I also hope what I read here is true, that the Coral Princess Sabatini's conversion to SHARE was postponed. I really LIKE Sabatini's and look forward to a few evenings there on my April 2016 15-day canal full transit. I frowned when I read the unfair comment referring to Sabatini's as a d*mp.

I do agree in general with "the need for an occasional change." Yet there are certain staples that always should remain. And that was the principle upon which the MDR menus were formed: changing items every night, so it's something different, yet offering "comfort foods," "staples," or "traditions" -whatever term you'd like to use, for those always available items, so that everyone can find something they like.

But wait: Some of those "always available" items are gone, replaced by new Curtis Stone items. So of course people will be upset. Conceptually it was a mistake to replace that section of the menu with new items.

BETTER, I think, would have been to feature ONE different Curtis Stone menu item each night as part of the rotating menu. Now it's talked up by the waitstaff (hopefully.) And featuring one different item each night allows greater exposure, and perhaps the opportunity to encourage diners to give SHARE a try.

FURTHERMORE, the Point-of-Sale terminals which the waitstaff use to enter diners' selections could be put to work to tally the popularity of these new items.

Yes, change is important. But replacing a food outlet (Sabatini's to SHARE) is an EXPENSIVE proposition and capital investment. If the new concept doesn't float (pardon the pun) then we, as paying passengers, pay for it in the end with ANOTHER replacement.

Princess may need to consider a more cost-effective means to provide passengers with change.

 

Princess may need to consider a more cost-effective means to provide passengers with change.

I agree. What Princess has been doing the last couple of years is springing some big change on people and then backtracking when it doesn't go over so well. They do things backwards. Before finding out if people want something, they give it to them and then scramble to control the damage after the fact. There have been several examples of this, not just the SHARE thing. I have little faith in the judgment of current management.

The problem with that "bad management" is the PC has increased consecutively their market share, market loyalty ie members of their captains circle and position platinum elite and so forth, income and number of days cruising by those members. And they have done so at a much higher rate than the industry average of 5.5% They have NOT had to re brand/reinvent themselves with water slides, ice skating rinks etc.

The culinary changes have also proven successful in drawing a younger and new base of passengers. Even if a specialty venue is "half empty" each diner represents additional income that they would not have if they ate in the MDR. It comes at a very low cost. The reason they change those venues is because of declining interest in the old venues. Specialty diners also represenent additional income because they carefully pair beverages. which are very profitable. Beyond the 39.00 cover charge they spend mightily on wine aperitifs and such. Average spending by the cruise line for food per passenger and crew is approximately 8.90/day. The average specialty diner spends $59.00 per day above the basic fare. and overall 115.00/day MORE per the average cruise passenger. These folks want a broader experience and pay for it.

Its better than 90% of basic fares (at all levels) to break even on a cruise. So even a few "specialty diners" make a huge difference to the line. In fact the more of them there are the better the experience for all passengers as they main consideration in the "bad managers" office concerns themselves with margins not gross (as does any well managed business. Of course these bad decisions are what's allowing several billions over the next few years in new ships

The culinary changes have also proven successful in drawing a younger and new base of passengers.

If you say so.

The culinary changes have also proven successful in drawing a younger and new base of passengers.

 

Really? SHARE was only announced last August. The Curtis Stone menu items in the MDR only debuted on Golden maybe three months ago. The first ships with SHARE restaurant only sailed in December. Are you sure this concept "proven successful in drawing a younger and new base of passengers"? In less than two months?

The passengers now sailing on Ruby and Emerald probably booked well before the restaurants were open or before any reviews were available. You think this "younger and new base of passengers" heard about SHARE and immediately booked a cruise just to experience SHARE?

I will admit the SHARE concept was geared to appeal to a younger demographic. I'm just not sure that was successful. Management may also have been attracted to the higher price point as well. Just doesn't seem to be working.

BTW, there is now an additional up charge if you want lobster in the Crown Grill.

Somehow I missed this part of your post...the Sterling Steakhouse on the Diamond does not have lobster on it's menu. Paying an upcharge when wanting lobster which is not on the menu isn't a surprise to me.

http://www.princess.com/downloads/pdf/Onboard_Experience/SterlingSteakhouse-Sample-2014.pdf

On ships with the Crown Grill the lobster tails have never had an additional fee & we have the filet mignon & lobster tails every time. Several years ago you could get a whole lobster for an additional fee ($9?) but never for lobster tails.

The Bayou Café only located on the Coral & Island does add a $5 fee for an 8 oz lobster tail to the $20 cost for dinner.

http://www.princess.com/downloads/pdf/Onboard_Experience/BayouCafeMenu-Sample-2014.pdf

Not just share, there has been lots of changes. The reviews from folks who have actually eaten there are strongly positive (you do understand CC has little effect on anything beyond a few laughs and rolled eyes to the Cruise Line Staffs - this thread is a great example lots of piling on and opinions but little actual experience although those who have partaken are generally happy with their experience or at worst neutral)

What does matter is click counts and time per visit on the web site as well as few other measurable outcomes and bookings resulting from the time on the websites. That is one of the reasons the site is constantly changing. It needs to be measurable or it is only a brochure.

I think Curtis Stone wants us to spell it "SHARE." Since it has been such a rousing success and has attracted thousands of new, young passengers to sail on the Ruby and the Emerald, it's only a matter of time, then, before every ship in the fleet will have its very own SHARE restaurant where it will be nigh on impossible to get a reservation since the place is already packed to the rafters every night with all those thousands of new, young passengers Princess has already attracted. Why they might even expand it to the Coral!

Oh, wait...

(Where do I sign up for the Curtis Stone Cheerleading Squad? I could use a little extra income. Or does it pay in free endive foam?)

I guess I need to say something here. We just got off of the Emerald Princess on the 6th after doing a B2B cruise. We decided to try SHARE with me kicking and screaming. Menu did not look good to me. But hubby convinced me to try. I am a very plain and picky eater from the midwest. And no fish or seafood. But, they managed to find something I liked. For an appetizer, I had the little gems. And after trying some, I actually liked some of them. For my main course, I had the Twice Cooked Duck. First time I've tried it. Wonderful! And for a side, I had the potatoes gratin. An excellent combination for a picky eater. Then shared my husbands desserts. I left feeling very full. Just wanted to say, maybe some people should give it a chance. I know it's pricey, but defiantly a good experience.

Not just share, there has been lots of changes. The reviews from folks who have actually eaten there are strongly positive (you do understand CC has little effect on anything beyond a few laughs and rolled eyes to the Cruise Line Staffs - this thread is a great example lots of piling on and opinions but little actual experience although those who have partaken are generally happy with their experience or at worst neutral)

 

What does matter is click counts and time per visit on the web site as well as few other measurable outcomes and bookings resulting from the time on the websites. That is one of the reasons the site is constantly changing. It needs to be measurable or it is only a brochure.

Wow, first you're an expert on restaurant profit margins and now you're an expert on websites. I'm sure Princess is kicking themselves they don't have you on staff, to mansplain their business to them.

this thread is a great example lots of piling on and opinions but little actual experience although those who have partaken are generally happy with their experience or at worst neutral)

I imagine that this is a form of self-selection. There are those who look at the SHARE concept and menu and understand that this is an establishment that they will probably be happy with. Consequently, they're are positive to neutral reviews. Others can also look at the menu and know they would not find it acceptable. Consequently, they do not go to SHARE just to have an unsatisfactory experience and there is no review.

I do not believe one has to actually dine at SHARE to have an opinion. I can tell you, for example, that I would not like SHARE just from reading about the concept and reading the menu. I am not attracted to SHARING. I'm not attracted to duck. I'm not attracted to endive foam. I see no reason to pay $39 PP to confirm that this is not the kind of restaurant I would enjoy.

Wow, first you're an expert on restaurant profit margins and now you're an expert on websites. I'm sure Princess is kicking themselves they don't have you on staff, to mansplain their business to them.

I know, right? I'm so impressed my toes tingle. LOL.

Wow, first you're an expert on restaurant profit margins and now you're an expert on websites. I'm sure Princess is kicking themselves they don't have you on staff, to mansplain their business to them.

Although my field is business metrics, a first year business school student, would see what's happening. My job was to give my clients the tools to measure their business plans. I'm retired these days and no longer consult to the cruise industry.

We went past SHARE last night at 7 PM. The place was virtually empty. If this was a land based restaurant I would be placing discount coupons in the newspapers to drum up business. :p

If that's anything of a typical night I'ed be worried if it were my business.

The problem with that "bad management" is the PC has increased consecutively their market share, market loyalty ie members of their captains circle and position platinum elite and so forth, income and number of days cruising by those members. And they have done so at a much higher rate than the industry average of 5.5% They have NOT had to re brand/reinvent themselves with water slides, ice skating rinks etc.

 

The culinary changes have also proven successful in drawing a younger and new base of passengers. Even if a specialty venue is "half empty" each diner represents additional income that they would not have if they ate in the MDR. It comes at a very low cost. The reason they change those venues is because of declining interest in the old venues. Specialty diners also represenent additional income because they carefully pair beverages. which are very profitable. Beyond the 39.00 cover charge they spend mightily on wine aperitifs and such. Average spending by the cruise line for food per passenger and crew is approximately 8.90/day. The average specialty diner spends $59.00 per day above the basic fare. and overall 115.00/day MORE per the average cruise passenger. These folks want a broader experience and pay for it.

 

Its better than 90% of basic fares (at all levels) to break even on a cruise. So even a few "specialty diners" make a huge difference to the line. In fact the more of them there are the better the experience for all passengers as they main consideration in the "bad managers" office concerns themselves with margins not gross (as does any well managed business. Of course these bad decisions are what's allowing several billions over the next few years in new ships

Although my field is business metrics, a first year business school student, would see what's happening. My job was to give my clients the tools to measure their business plans. I'm retired these days and no longer consult to the cruise industry.

You did raise a great point about "daily spend" that took a few minutes before I could agree with you. I misread your comments about pairing beverages. I first I thought you meant that the Celebrity Chef menus were developed, pairing and suggesting beverages. I actually read what I wanted to think, based upon my experiences in SHARE: I always purchase a bottle of wine with dinner, and the wine list specially developed for SHARE is... OUTRAGEOUSLY PRICED! No, I don't look for a $24 or $32 bottle of wine (on land maybe, but I know there's a higher markup on board), and yes I was able to find a bottle I liked and a price I'd pay $48 the first night and the second night I relented and paid for an $85 bottle.

Actually, on the wine list subject, I went through my papers from my January cruise, remembering that I asked for and was given the red wine list (it's a card like the SHARE menu) Here's the prices for bottles of red wine: 85, 59, 129, 36, 35, 52, 120, 48, 170, 79, 240, 96, 220, 220, 235, 480. Those are U.S. Dollar prices and I've double checked: there are not any typos.

(I just did a quick search on the Penfolds Grange wine and it may be reasonably priced at $480 from what I saw; I am not a wine connoisseur)

THEN ... I realized I made your point for you... when I think what I do spend. You stated the average spend for a specialty diner is $59 per day, compared to $8.90 for others. Gosh, that's pretty easy to do even eating in the MDR. Ordering a bottle of wine in the $30's or $40's price range and just having a few Campari & Soda's which I do, and I'm at your mark. Then add my usual once a cruise perfume purchase and most likely a purchase in the gift shop --both of those enticed by my 10% Elite Discount-- and I guess I'm certainly the demographic you mention.

Wow: $8.90 really is low because that's the price of ordering one soft drink and one cocktail daily. But then I think of all the posts I've read on here about people finding ways to STEAL their non-refundable OBC's to take home as cash... and others who go to great lengths to smuggle liquor on board so they don't have to pay the price of a drink... and I realized just how sad the revenue equation may be.

BUT ... I will say that I stand by my previous post that the capital outlay for the SHARE concept may not have been the most efficient way to attract the desired demographics. I can see where it would be difficult to answer the question: "just exactly WHAT attracted the target passenger to cruise with Princess?" Because the whole experience includes so many facets: level of service throughout, decor of the line's ships, stateroom accommodations & appointments, entertainment, food in the MDR and buffets, beverage outlets, and specialty dining outlets. And at the end of the day, as you pointed out, the measure of a specialty restaurant's success is in covers.

"The reason they change those venues is because of declining interest in the old venues."

I'm sure Crown Grill remains because of its cover count. I don't see those metrics, but they are obviously good, when the restaurant is always packed even as guests are being seated after 9pm. Whereas SHARE, I bet, has not yet realized cover counts anywhere near that level.

Lastly, somewhere here you mentioned the diminished impact CC has upon staff at corporate cruise line offices, as you noted "eyes rolling." I can tell you first hand that you are absolutely CORRECT! I have direct contact with a manager at Carnival Corp who related the same. There's a great deal of silly comments on CC: just look at some written in this thread, especially those of your attackers.

I guess I need to say something here. We just got off of the Emerald Princess on the 6th after doing a B2B cruise. We decided to try SHARE with me kicking and screaming. Menu did not look good to me. But hubby convinced me to try. I am a very plain and picky eater from the midwest. And no fish or seafood. But, they managed to find something I liked. For an appetizer, I had the little gems. And after trying some, I actually liked some of them. For my main course, I had the Twice Cooked Duck. First time I've tried it. Wonderful! And for a side, I had the potatoes gratin. An excellent combination for a picky eater. Then shared my husbands desserts. I left feeling very full. Just wanted to say, maybe some people should give it a chance. I know it's pricey, but defiantly a good experience.

Jules59- I'm glad you relented and gave it a try. You mentioned that you're a plain and picky eater, which "plain" does NOT describe ANY of the SHARE entrees or appetizers. I'm the opposite, open and willing to try new dishes. But even after enjoying the Shrimp Salad appetizer, I was not sold on the whole SHARE concept. I will admit, however, that when I tasted the duck... my eyes lit up... and I told myself: "don't fight this; it's really good."

As an experimental eater, buffet lines are a great place to try something you're not sure you're going to like. I would have never ordered frog legs from a menu, but I did TRY just one when I found it on a buffet years ago. If after a bite or two I hadn't liked it, then I could push the small portion I had taken aside and concentrate on something else. They were good.

But even with the buffet benefit... when I saw "Octopus Balls" on Ruby Princess a few years back (which referred to the shape, like meatballs: NOT like... Rocky Mountain oysters) I just HAD TO PASS. NO WAY was I even trying it. Or that time at an extensive upscale Chinese Buffet, when I stared in ABSOLUTE HORROR, telling myself "NO, NO, NO!! It can't be," afraid to look at the placard describing the dish to confirm that it really was CHICKEN FEET, which it was...and I did pass on that dish.

I would say the same about Beef Cheek Pie: on a buffet I would have passed. So it defies logic that I would have ordered that as my Main in SHARE. But I trusted my server. And how delicious the duck was on my first visit gave me confidence that it would also be as good. And yes, it was tasty.

I'd much prefer to read more comments from passengers like yourself that have actually eaten in the restaurant. Again, I'm glad you did like it, but had you reported back that you really did not enjoy your meal and what you didn't like, I would have appreciated reading what you honestly had to say.

There's more value, in my mind, to reading about other passenger experiences rather than the spending time reading the "noise" created by posters who have never been and never plan to go.

______________________________________________________

EPILOGUE: With respect to the Octopus Balls, the next day, as I was enjoying a glass of wine in Vines, having buried in the back of my mind the seafood item on the buffet, it wasn't until I was chewing that one round item from my tapas plate that I realized "yes, this is definitely one of those octopus balls." I gave a polite "no, thank you" when the second plate of tapas was offered.

BTW, there is now an additional up charge if you want lobster in the Crown Grill.

Apparently this is not fleet wide. We ate in Crown Grill 3x on the Emerald 2 weeks ago and were never charged extra for lobster. Also, Crown Grill was full every night, SHARE was empty every time we went by.

Berni

Apparently this is not fleet wide. We ate in Crown Grill 3x on the Emerald 2 weeks ago and were never charged extra for lobster. Also, Crown Grill was full every night, SHARE was empty every time we went by.

Berni

'bconley351' (odd that your quote says 'shredie' who didn't post that comment) posted several incorrect things including calling the Sterling Steakhouse on the Diamond the Crown Grill. They also claimed that Kai Sushi took the Crown Grill's location forcing the CG to a section of the HC. That's also wrong as Kai Sushi took the space previously used by the Internet Cafe which is now in the atrium.

Somehow I missed this part of your post...the Sterling Steakhouse on the Diamond does not have lobster on it's menu. Paying an upcharge when wanting lobster which is not on the menu isn't a surprise to me.

 

http://www.princess.com/downloads/pdf/Onboard_Experience/SterlingSteakhouse-Sample-2014.pdf

 

On ships with the Crown Grill the lobster tails have never had an additional fee & we have the filet mignon & lobster tails every time. Several years ago you could get a whole lobster for an additional fee ($9?) but never for lobster tails.

 

The Bayou Café only located on the Coral & Island does add a $5 fee for an 8 oz lobster tail to the $20 cost for dinner.

 

http://www.princess.com/downloads/pdf/Onboard_Experience/BayouCafeMenu-Sample-2014.pdf

'bconley351' (odd that your quote says 'shredie' who didn't post that comment)

I get blamed for everything. :p

You know, maybe we need a thread just for the SHARE cheerleaders and apologists. They certainly get their respective panties in a wad whenever someone says something critical about His Stoneness. (That Fan Club must have some great perks!)

I get blamed for everything. :p

 

You know, maybe we need a thread just for the SHARE cheerleaders and apologists. They certainly get their respective panties in a wad whenever someone says something critical about His Stoneness. (That Fan Club must have some great perks!)

Not this time! :p It's a mistake by 'bconley351' when quoting one of your posts they cut off the end of your post's "quote" portion and thus it incorrectly appeared to be from you. :(

I'm in the 'hope Princess knows what they're doing' camp but I'm skeptical that SHARE is a good idea. Like others have posted, I do not need to pay $39/pp. to confirm that I do not like the menu nor the ambiance of SHARE. I'm all for improving Princess to attract new & particularly younger passengers. However even when I was young 'trendy' food wasn't necessary to draw me to Princess & I think many younger people still feel the same way today.

I don't know if Princess completely understands their passengers desires & what made them so successful. To me something 'new' is not always the same thing as something 'better'. Things like SHARE & the Salty Dog (in Explorers & changing a venue that some passengers enjoyed to use for dancing) makes me wonder about the direction they're taking in the past couple of years. :confused:

It's a cruise so no "panties in a wad" (nor boxer/briefs for guys ;)) for me and I am grateful to be able to enjoy each cruise!!! :D

 

BTW, next time you're on a Stone-laden ship, you might want to eat at SHARE every night. QReports are that the place is next-to-empty and the waiters are up on deck trolling for customers. I guess this is their version of "change or die."[/ka

 

 

This reminds me a little of Kai Sushi on the Diamond during our recent 12 NZ cruise. The Crown Grill space was taken away and given to Kai Sushi. Crown Grill is now a portion of Horzion Court at tables with tablecloths. The steakhouse ambiance is now gone. As we had early traditional dining we passed Kai Sushi many times while checking the sunset, and found Kai Sushi to be pretty much empty. A friend 'dropped in' during lunch one day and was surprised the sushi wasn't better than it was. Maybe during an Asia cruise it's busier, but I don't see how they've paid for the remodel. BTW, there is now an additional up charge if you want lobster in the Crown Grill.

I think you meant to say Salty Dog in Wheelhouse Bar. So far, only the "bigger girls" (not the BIG girls) have it. Let's hope it stays that way.

I agree with Astro Flyer and totally don't understand how the execs on Princess think. Granted, Sabitini's has seen a decrease in utilization over the past few years but I personally think this could have been over come by a change in menu.

Princess has a HUGE return passenger base who as the more they cruise, they actually send less & less money on board the ship.

I am glad to hear that some of the planned changes from Sabitini's to Share have been scraped for now.

We have the 1st night specialty restaurant suite perk on our next couple of cruises so I think we will go back to Sabitini's at least once. My Mom can't eat the amt of food in the Crown Grill.