Why aren't there more cruiseships that use sails?

And why aren't there any big ones afloat at all? It seems to be a niche market, using small ships (<400 pax) with the high fares that come with small ships.

Would it technically be possible to create a ship the size of MS Rotterdam (1400 pax, 600 crew) that uses sails as its main method of propulsion?

And why aren't there any big ones afloat at all? It seems to be a niche market, using small ships (<400 pax) with the high fares that come with small ships.

 

Would it technically be possible to create a ship the size of MS Rotterdam (1400 pax, 600 crew) that uses sails as its main method of propulsion?

Why not ask a ship building expert?

It's probably because most cruisers want the amenities found in the mass market ships. Large (ish) cabins. Multiple dining rooms and bars. A variety of entertain!sent options day and night. Swimming pools and hot tubs. And the ability to enjoy these most of these without being crammed in close quarters with the other guests and crew. Their stability at sea, and speed could also be a factor. I'm a very poor sailor when on board a sailboat, spending most of my time hanging over the rail.

Technically, I suppose it would be possible to build a huge sailing ship. But I would think it would wallow like a pig, and it's speed would be pretty slow if it depended primarily on sails.

Maybe relying primarily on wind for propulsion would not be efficient and certainly not predictable or reliable for maintaining ports of call schedules. I would think it would also require quite a bit of sail to move a large ship effectively.

The ships would also still be heavily reliant on diesel electric generators to provide electricity for all other ship's operations. Cruise ships currently rely on this method of power to drive the ship's electric motors as well. Not sure of the net benefit or practicality of sail as a replacement, or even a supplement, to propel even a small or mid size cruise ship.

Technically, almost anything is possible. Cost wise, and profitability is another thing.

Wind Surf, one of the largest sailing cruise ships these days is 14,000 gt and requires 26,000 sq. ft. of sails to push it along. To get a ship the size of the Rotterdam (61,000 gt, or 4 times the size), would require at least 4 times the sail area, perhaps more, or over a 100,000 sq. ft. Also, placing sails on top of a cruise ship that size would create a very unstable vessel, since the driving force would be up high, creating a tipping moment. Wind Surf has 8 decks, total, while Rotterdam has 10 pax decks plus at least 3 crew decks.

Probably the same reasons we no longer fly to Europe in DC-3s !

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Think of the complaints about the flappy sail noise...:rolleyes:

My guess would be that it's to do with the surface area needed increasing by more than the surface area of the ship.

If the Rotterdam is four times the size of the Windstar, which means four times the volume, it is about 1.6 times higher, wider, and deeper. But assuming it needs four times the sails to drive it, that means sails (being only in 2 dimensions) twice as high and twice as wide. Hence, centre of gravity rises.

And why aren't there any big ones afloat at all? It seems to be a niche market, using small ships (<400 pax) with the high fares that come with small ships.

 

Same reason they don't have rowboat cruise ships.

Because someone invented engines.

Duh.

Ships with sails have lots of limitations. Consider a typical Windstar ship carrying about 150 souls with a maximum speed of 11 knots. Now translate to your typical 7 day cruise out of Ft Lauderdale. They would not be able to get to many ports in a week (at top speed which would mean using the engines). And some folks would be disappointed about the lack of amenities onboard (due to the size of the ship and weight limitations,

Hank

Because ships with few passengers cannot make the money they need to do the upkeep, pay taxes and fees, etc...to make a profit. The entire point of a BUSINESS is PROFIT. If you own a business, you must make MORE than the expenses or there is NO REASON to do it.

Simple economics.

And why aren't there any big ones afloat at all? It seems to be a niche market, using small ships (<400 pax) with the high fares that come with small ships.

 

 

 

Would it technically be possible to create a ship the size of MS Rotterdam (1400 pax, 600 crew) that uses sails as its main method of propulsion?

Ever been on a sailboat? Sailing vessels cannot head directly upwind without tacking over and over. Sails are a nice idea but terribly inefficient when your intention is to get from A to B in a direct line.

Think of the complaints about the flappy sail noise...:rolleyes:

There would only be flapping on a tack or attempt to sail too close to directly upwind. Any downwind jibes on a vessel that large would require exceptional seamanship built on many years of true sailing experience.

While I totally understand why the overwhelming majority of cruisers prefer the "non sailing" ships......for some there is a wonderful rhythm to the motion of a sailboat....

It is not the place for people who need constant entertainment and shows and large buffets. But for those looking for serenity....sailing ships may be worth a try sometime.

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Larger crew would be needed to handle the sails and associated rigging.

While I totally understand why the overwhelming majority of cruisers prefer the "non sailing" ships......for some there is a wonderful rhythm to the motion of a sailboat....

 

It is not the place for people who need constant entertainment and shows and large buffets. But for those looking for serenity....sailing ships may be worth a try sometime.

 

 

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Not unlike the big mistake that many mass market cruisers make in thinking that premium/luxury lines are "more expensive" (which is not always the case when you compare "net daily rate" for all that is included [e.g., airfare] vs "a la carte" [pay for bottled water?!?]), many cruisers do not consider yacht charters.

For example, a crewed charter for 8 people on a 60 foot sailing CAT, including food/booze/etc can bottom line at about the same per person cost as a balcony cabin on a higher end mass market cruise line.

Do some research and find a well respected worldwide charter yacht broker like Ed Hamilton Co.

Technically, almost anything is possible. Cost wise, and profitability is another thing.

 

Wind Surf, one of the largest sailing cruise ships these days is 14,000 gt and requires 26,000 sq. ft. of sails to push it along. To get a ship the size of the Rotterdam (61,000 gt, or 4 times the size), would require at least 4 times the sail area, perhaps more, or over a 100,000 sq. ft. Also, placing sails on top of a cruise ship that size would create a very unstable vessel, since the driving force would be up high, creating a tipping moment. Wind Surf has 8 decks, total, while Rotterdam has 10 pax decks plus at least 3 crew decks.

And if the masts were on the top deck, the ship would encounter air draft problems at some ports. QM2's designer often complains about the ship needing a squat funnel due to her having to squeeze under the Verrazzano Narrows Bridge into New York harbor.

Because it's 2016 and not 1816. ;)

Sailboats lean to much!

.

The very last thing we want to do on our vacation is to crowd onto a giant Vegas like playground with mediocre food, long lines, crammed in and fighting for a chaise lounge with 4000 people we don't know.

Tried it a couple of times and would not be cruising if we hadn't found the smaller quieter sailboats that Windstar sails. And yes, we do this in 2016. It's not for everyone, but neither is mass market cruising.

Check out the Vasa ship in Stockholm!

Complaints about rough seas would fade to insignificance when compared to complaints about the ship leaning and tacking and jibing.

A seven day cruise could become a cruise of somewhere between about 5 and 15 days depending on conditions (and I think that would be the biggest killer of all.)

They'd need way more crew.

The sails would need to be MASSIVE.

The number of ports they'd have trouble fitting under bridges would increase about 1000 fold when you add a 100 foot mast to current height.

Is that enough reasons?

The modern sailing yachts have motorized sails, operated from the bridge, so they don't need excessive crew members.

The Windstar ships don't "lean" much when under sail.

You're right about them being more slow, although all have engines and use them when sailing conditions aren't right. We've done four or five transatlantics and have found them to be much more stable than the top heavy giant cruise ships.

The masts are an issue in certain ports. We've had to wait both to get in to Lisbon and to exit the Pacific side of the Panama Canal.

Also I'm not sure why everyone is assuming if there were More ships with sails that they would have to be ships with thousands of oassengers.

The modern sailing yachts have motorized sails, operated from the bridge, so they don't need excessive crew members.

 

The Windstar ships don't "lean" much when under sail.

 

You're right about them being more slow, although all have engines and use them when sailing conditions aren't right. We've done four or five transatlantics and have found them to be much more stable than the top heavy giant cruise ships.

 

The masts are an issue in certain ports. We've had to wait both to get in to Lisbon and to exit the Pacific side of the Panama Canal.

 

Also I'm not sure why everyone is assuming if there were More ships with sails that they would have to be ships with thousands of oassengers.

Um, probably because of the question asked by the OP:

Would it technically be possible to create a ship the size of MS Rotterdam (1400 pax, 600 crew) that uses sails as its main method of propulsion?

The modern sailing yachts have motorized sails, operated from the bridge, so they don't need excessive crew members.

 

 

 

The Windstar ships don't "lean" much when under sail.

 

 

 

You're right about them being more slow, although all have engines and use them when sailing conditions aren't right. We've done four or five transatlantics and have found them to be much more stable than the top heavy giant cruise ships.

 

 

 

The masts are an issue in certain ports. We've had to wait both to get in to Lisbon and to exit the Pacific side of the Panama Canal.

 

 

 

Also I'm not sure why everyone is assuming if there were More ships with sails that they would have to be ships with thousands of oassengers.

Sorry to be picky but, it's "heel," not "lean" and Windstar's vessels are ships, not yachts.