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Formula280SS

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About Formula280SS

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    New England
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    MSC-NCL-RCCL-DCL
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    Eastern and Southern Caribbean

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  1. Yep, now a second re-infection can lead to heart failure from the medications side-effects damage to the heart. NEWS FEBRUARY 17, 2020 Chinese doctors: Coronavirus can reinfect people, and the second infection can lead to heart failure. Possibly worse than the Chinese government is letting on. https://www.theblaze.com/news/chinese-doctors-coronavirus-can-reinfect-people-and-the-second-infection-can-lead-to-heart-failure AARON COLEN Doctors in China say patients who recover from coronavirus can be reinfected — and if that happens, they become significantly more likely to suffer fatal heart attacks due to the nature of the virus and the effect of the medicine used to treat it, according to the Taiwan News. The information comes from doctors working in the Hubei province of China, where the virus originated, who spoke under the condition of anonymity out of fear of retribution from the Chinese government, which has attempted to suppress information about the virus outbreak and punish those who leak info. "It's highly possible to get infected a second time," a doctor told the Taiwan News. "A few people recovered from the first time by their own immune system, but the meds they use are damaging their heart tissue, and when they get it the second time, the antibody doesn't help but makes it worse, and they die a sudden death from heart failure." Additionally, the true scope of the infections still may not be known, due to some complicating variables. Chinese doctors have had issues with false negatives from the coronavirus tests, with cases in which X-rays reveal significant lung infections for people who tested negative for coronavirus multiple times. That may be part of the reason China abruptly decided last week to change the way it counted cases of the virus. At first, only confirmed positive cases were counted. Now, China is counting people who are diagnosed by way of symptoms, even if they have not tested positive. The change caused a sudden spike in the number of both cases of the virus, and resulting deaths. A doctor also told Taiwan News that the virus can be present in a person without symptoms for up to 24 days, and that the virus has "outsmarted all of us." If true, many people could be both unknowingly infected, and potentially infecting others, creating huge problems for public health officials desperately attempting to stop the spread. As of Monday, there are more than 70,000 cases of coronavirus in China, with the death toll nearing 1,800 people.
  2. Yep, agreed. An expert booted off the Diamond Princess says Japan’s coronavirus control is “completely chaotic” https://qz.com/1804615/japanese-expert-on-chaotic-coronavirus-infection-control-on-diamond-princess/ February 19, 2020 Mary Hui By Mary Hui Kentaro Iwata, an infectious diseases expert at Kobe University, was brought onto the Diamond Princess yesterday, a day before the Japanese government began allowing passengers to disembark from the quarantined cruise ship. What he saw shocked him. “The cruise ship was completely inadequate in terms of the infection control,” Iwata said in a YouTube video he uploaded yesterday. “There was no distinction between the green zone, which is free of infection, and the red zone, which is potentially contaminated by the virus.” He had boarded the ship as a member of the disaster medical assistance team, after having been denied permission to enter in his own capacity as an infection control expert, he said. The ship has been docked off the port city of Yokohama since Feb. 3, with 3,700 people onboard. A man who disembarked in Hong Kong on Jan. 25 was found to have Covid-19, prompting the quarantine. The ship is operated by Princess Cruises, part of the Carnival Corporation, one of the world’s largest cruise companies. As the number of people infected on the vessel steadily crept up, experts began questioning Japan’s strategy of continuing to enforce the quarantine on thousands of people in an enclosed space. While passengers were confined to their cabins, crew members shared living and working spaces and had minimal protective gear when interacting with passengers. As of yesterday, 542 people have been confirmed infected with coronavirus, or roughly 15% of everyone onboard. Passengers who tested negative for Covid-19 and who have been asymptomatic began disembarking this morning, though people who tested negative but shared a room with an infected person will be kept aboard for additional quarantine. Iwata said in the video that in his two decades of dealing with infectious diseases, including the 2003 SARS outbreak in China and the more recent Ebola outbreak in Africa, he “never had fear of getting infection myself.” But on the Diamond Princess, he said, “I was so scared. I was so scared of getting Covid-19 because there’s no way to tell where the virus is. No green zone, no red zone, everywhere could have the virus.” He added that “there was was nobody in charge of infection prevention as a professional, the bureaucrats were in charge of everything.” In his day spent aboard the ship, Iwata said he observed numerous lapses in infection control measures. Crew members, some of whom were wearing full protective gear and others who weren’t, were walking around the vessel, potentially cross-contaminating different parts of the ship, he said. Iwata said he also saw people eating lunch with their medical gloves on, and handling their smartphones while wearing their protective suits, “so it was completely chaotic.” Even something as simple as a printed informed consent form to authorize tests for coronavirus is a potential source for transmission, Iwata said. “That paper was going back and forth, back and forth” between the room with the infection and elsewhere, he said, describing how his suggestion to switch to verbal informed consent was neglected. He was later ordered off the ship by someone from the ship’s quarantine office, he said. He has isolated himself in a separate room to avoid infecting his family. In a series of tweets (link in Japanese), vice minister of health Gaku Hashimoto, who was on board the ship, said Iwata couldn’t give him a clear answer as to why he was on board and so was politely asked to leave the vessel. Hashimoto added that he’ll report the incident back to the health ministry to understand how this was able to happen. Addressing Iwata’s comments, an official from the ministry of health and labor told Japanese newspaper Asahi Shimbun (link in Japanese) that it was a “misconception” that amateurs rather than specialists are working on board the ship to prevent infections. Correction: An earlier version of this story misstated that people who tested positive but shared a room with an infected person will be quarantined. It should be those who tested negative.
  3. Experts ponder why cruise ship quarantine failed in Japan https://www.concordmonitor.com/Experts-ponder-why-cruise-ship-quarantine-failed-in-Japan-32771658 By MARIA CHENG and MARI YAMAGUCHI Associated Press Published: 2/18/2020 3:01:09 PM As an extraordinary two-week quarantine of a cruise ship ends Wednesday in Japan, many scientists say it was a failed experiment: The ship seemed to serve as an incubator for the new virus from China instead of an isolation facility meant to prevent the worsening of an outbreak. Since the virus was identified late last year in central China, it has sickened tens of thousands of people and killed more than 1,800. As of Tuesday, 542 cases of the virus, known as COVID-19, have been identified among the 3,711 quarantined passengers and crew, making the ship the site of the most infections outside of China. The Diamond Princess cruise ship is also the only place where health officials have seen the disease spread easily among people beyond China. The question now is: Why? The Japanese government has repeatedly defended the effectiveness of the quarantine. But some experts suggest it may have been less than rigorous. In a possible sign of lax quarantine protocols, three Japanese health officials who helped in the quarantine checks on the ship were also infected. “There are sometimes environments in which disease can spread in a more efficient way,” said Dr. Michael Ryan, executive director of the World Health Organization’s health emergencies program. Ryan said cruise ships in particular were known to occasionally accelerate spread. “It’s an unfortunate event occurring on the ship and we trust that the authorities in Japan and the governments who are taking back people will be able to follow up those individuals in the appropriate way,” he said. Japan’s health minister, Katsunobu Kato, told reporters Tuesday that all passengers who remained on the cruise ship have had samples taken and that those who tested negative would start getting off the vessel beginning Wednesday, when their required 14-day quarantine is scheduled to end. “They all want to go home as early as possible, and we hope to assist them so that everyone can get home smoothly,” Kato said. The process is expected to take until Friday because of the large number of people involved. “Obviously the quarantine hasn’t worked, and this ship has now become a source of infection,” said Dr. Nathalie MacDermott, an outbreak expert at King’s College London. She said the exact mechanism of the virus’ spread was unknown. Although scientists believe the disease is spread mostly by droplets – when people cough or sneeze – it’s possible there are other ways of transmission. “We need to understand how the quarantine measures on board were implemented, what the air filtration on board is like, how the cabins are connected and how waste products are disposed of,” MacDermott said. “There could also be another mode of transmission we’re not familiar with,” she said, noting the possibility of environmental spread and the importance of “deep-cleaning” the entire ship to prevent people from touching contaminated surfaces. During the 2002-2003 outbreak of SARS, a related virus, more than 300 people were infected through a defective sewage system in a Hong Kong housing estate. MacDermott said it was possible there was a similar issue aboard the Diamond Princess. “There’s no reason this (quarantine) should not have worked if it had been done properly,” she said. Cruise ships have sometimes been struck by outbreaks of diseases like norovirus, which can spread quickly in the close quarters of a boat and among elderly passengers with weaker immune systems. But MacDermott said it would be highly unusual for an entire boat to be quarantined. “They might quarantine the people affected in their rooms until they’re 48 hours clear of symptoms, but certainly not all passengers,” she said. Some passengers on the Diamond Princess described the ship as a “floating prison” but were allowed to walk on the decks every day while wearing a mask and were told to keep their distance from others. “I suspect people were not as isolated from other people as we would have thought,” said Dr. Paul Hunter, a professor of medicine at the University of East Anglia in England. He said the continued spread of the virus could be due to compliance problems. “It’s difficult to enforce a quarantine in a ship environment and I’m absolutely sure there were some passengers who think they’re not going to let anyone tell them what they can and cannot do,” he said. He suggested that if the passengers had been quarantined on land, having more space might have allowed for better infection control procedures. But he acknowledged that attempting to quarantine more than 3,700 people was logistically challenging. Hunter said it was “a huge disappointment” that the quarantine hadn’t curbed the spread of the virus and that it was unfortunate some passengers returning to their home countries would now face a second period of isolation. “Given how the virus has continued to spread, we have to presume everyone leaving the ship is potentially infected, and therefore they have to go through another two-week quarantine period,” he said. “Not to do so would be reckless.” Japanese health officials say a 14-day quarantine on the ship is adequate, noting that all but one of more than 500 Japanese returnees from the epicenter of the virus in China who initially tested negative were found to be virus-free at the end of their 14-day quarantine. Those officials also defended precautions taken on the ship. About 1,000 crew members were told to wear surgical masks, wash their hands, use disinfectant sprays and stop operations at restaurants, bars and other entertainment areas after Feb. 5, when the first group of 10 infections was reported and the start of the 14-day quarantine was announced. Passengers were instructed to stay in their cabins and not walk around or contact other passengers. Those in windowless cabins could go out on the deck for about an hour each day. The quarantine was largely for passengers because crew members kept sharing double rooms and continued to serve guests by delivering food, letters, towels and amenities, and entering passenger cabins for cleaning. Crew members also ate in groups in a crew mess hall. “Unlike passengers, crew members share their rooms, they share food, and that’s why some of them are infected even after the quarantine started,” said Shigeru Omi, a former regional director for the World Health Organization. Omi said quarantine is one of the measures considered effective early on. But the virus has already made its way into local communities across Japan, where untraceable cases have been popping up, he said. At this stage, “the spreading of the virus will be inevitable, and that’s why quarantine is out of the question,” Omi said. He said the focus now should shift from border control to preventing the spread in local communities. Other scientists said that passengers should have been removed from the ship from the beginning. “Boats are notorious places for being incubators for viruses,” said Arthur Caplan, a professor of bioethics at the New York University School of Medicine. “It’s only morally justified to keep people on the boat if there are no other options.” Caplan said that a second quarantine was warranted, but that officials had done a poor job of explaining what would happen if their original plan failed. “It’s never good to lose your civil liberties and your rights of movement, but two more weeks of quarantine is not an undue burden if you’re trying to protect spread of a disease,” he said.
  4. NEWS FEBRUARY 18, 2020 NEWS FEBRUARY 18, 2020 'The quarantine process failed': Over 500 have tested positive for Coronavirus onboard the Diamond Princess cruise ship https://www.theblaze.com/news/over-500-tested-positive-coronavirus-onboard-cruise-ship 'Something went awry' PHIL SHIVER Some are questioning the effectiveness of the quarantine process after an additional 88 passengers onboard the Diamond Princess cruise ship docked in Yokohama, Japan, tested positive for Coronavirus Tuesday. At the time of this writing, 542 of the 3,711 passengers and crew had tested positive for the infection. The newly reported total makes the ship the site of the most infections outside of China, USA Today reported. The 14-day quarantine is scheduled to end on Wednesday, however, hundreds of American passengers aleady departed the ship on Sunday through an evacuation process facilitated by the U.S. Department of State. During the evacuation, it was discovered that 14 U.S. passengers had come down with the virus, despite testing negative only a few days prior. The infected passengers "were moved in the most expeditious and safe manner to a specialized containment area on the evacuation aircraft," a joint statement from the State Department and the Department of Health and Human Services read. And upon landing, they will restart the 14-day quarantine period. Dr. Anthony Fauci, director of the National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases at the National Institutes of Health, told USA Today that while the initial decision to quarantine wasn't unreasonable, something had gone "awry." "The quarantine process failed," Fauci said. "I'd like to sugarcoat it and try to be diplomatic about it, but it failed. People were getting infected on that ship. Something went awry in the process of the quarantining on that ship. I don't know what it was, but a lot of people got infected on that ship." News of more infections on the Diamond Princess cruise ship come amid reports that Coronavirus can reinfect people, and that the second infection could be more dangerous — potentially leading to heart failure. Furthermore, speculation is on the rise regarding the virus' outbreak in China, with many believing that the country is lying about its death toll.
  5. And then there are those who chose to stay on the ship in Japan. US cruise ship passenger under coronavirus quarantine refuses to evacuate Diamond Princess https://www.foxnews.com/media/us-cruise-ship-passenger-under-coronavirus-quarantine-refuses-to-evacuate-diamond-princess Matthew Smith explains why he turned down the opportunity to return to the U.S. on a State Department-chartered flight from Yokohama, Japan. Matthew Smith, one of the nearly 400 Americans quarantined aboard the Diamond Princess cruise ship for two weeks amid an outbreak of the coronavirus aboard, said on “America’s Newsroom” on Monday that he and his wife are glad they decided not to evacuate and fly back home with the group because some of those Americans tested positive for the virus shortly before boarding the planes. The U.S. State Department sent two chartered planes to Japan Sunday night to evacuate the Americans who remained quarantined aboard the cruise ship, which has docked at Yokohama, a port city southwest of Tokyo. Passengers and crew have been subjected to a 14-day quarantine, which was due to end Wednesday. On Monday, Japan confirmed 99 more cases of people infected by the new virus on the quarantined ship, bringing the total to 454, according to the Health Ministry, which has been carrying out tests on passengers and crew members on the ship. The virus emerged in China late last year, and outside of the country, the ship has had the largest number of cases. The ministry said it now has tested 1,723 people on the Diamond Princess, which had a total of about 3,700 passengers and crew members. Host Ed Henry noted on Monday that 14 American passengers aboard the cruise ship quarantined in Japan tested positive for the coronavirus before they boarded the U.S. State Department chartered flights back to the U.S. The State Department made the announcement on Sunday, citing tests given before the Americans boarded the planes. Speaking via Skype, Smith, who refused to get on those planes, told Henry on Monday, “We didn't believe the conditions were safe to break the Japanese quarantine and put us all together in those conditions and, in fact, now having learned that they put 14 infected persons on the planes, we're all the more glad that we remained.” Smith, an American lawyer, said he and his wife are “both well.” “We have no symptoms of the virus, no cough, no fever and we're feeling fine,” he said. He added that they both have been tested for the coronavirus. “We haven't received results yet, but we have no reason to expect we're infected,” he said. When asked about the conditions on the ship, Smith said, “Princess has done a wonderful job of providing the conditions for a quarantine.” “We’ve been in our cabin for two weeks, but we are fed three meals a day and additional food beyond that, provided fresh linens and towels upon request, so the condition inside the cabin is really no different than it was during the cruise, it’s just there’s no option to get outside the cabin.” Coronavirus cases burgeoning in China is 'biggest problem': Dr. Marc SiegelVideo When Henry asked Smith how they are passing the time, he said, “Frankly, boredom is the least of our problems because from within a few days of the quarantine beginning, I reactivated my dormant Twitter account and my days are filled with communicating with friends and talking to journalists all over the world. “So we've been anything but bored during this time of the quarantine,” he continued. The quarantined passengers who were earlier found to be sick with the virus have been hospitalized in Japan. Australia, Canada, Hong Kong and Italy are planning similar flights for their citizens.
  6. Wow, these passengers can't get a break. USA sent planes to return 300+ passengers to US (base) and 14 "tested positive" on arrival. Now, passengers quarantined another 14 days at US base. That is awful. 14 passengers on US charter flights evacuating quarantined cruise ship test positive for coronavirus https://www.wmur.com/article/trading-one-quarantine-period-for-another-americans-who-were-isolated-on-cruise-ship-land-in-us/30960666 5:55 AM EST Feb 17, 2020 Associated Press FAIRFIELD, Calif. — Two charter flights carrying cruise ship passengers from Japan landed at military bases in California and Texas overnight, starting the clock on a quarantine period to ensure passengers don't have the new virus that's been spreading in Asia. A plane carrying American passengers touched down at Travis Air Force Base in Northern California just before 11:30 p.m. Sunday, local time. A second flight arrived at Lackland Air Force Base in Texas around 2 1/2 hours later, early Monday. Japan's Defense Minister Taro Kono had tweeted earlier that Japanese troops helped transport 340 U.S. passengers on 14 buses from Yokohama port to Tokyo's Haneda airport. About 380 Americans were on the cruise ship. The U.S. said it arranged the evacuation because people on the Diamond Princess were at a high risk of exposure to the virus. For the departing Americans, the evacuation cuts short a 14-day quarantine that began aboard the cruise ship Feb. 5. The State Department announced later that 14 of the evacuees received confirmation they had the virus but were allowed to board the flight because they did not have symptoms. They were being isolated separately from other passengers on the flight, the U.S. State and Health and Human Services said in a joint statement. Dr. Anthony Fauci, director of the National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases at the National Institutes of Health, said Sunday that an infected person who shows minimal symptoms could still pass the virus to someone else. After arriving in the U.S., all of the passengers must go through another 14 days of quarantine at the military facilities — meaning they will have been under quarantine for a total of nearly four weeks. Australia, Canada, Hong Kong and Italy were planning similar flights of passengers. Other governments, including Canada and Hong Kong, also will require the passengers to undergo a second 14-day quarantine. Japan on Monday announced another 99 infections on the Diamond Princess, raising the ship's total number of cases to 454. Overall, Japan has 419 confirmed cases of the virus, including one death. The United States has confirmed 15 cases within the country. Separately, one U.S. citizen died in China. Americans Cheryl and Paul Molesky, a couple from Syracuse, New York, opted to trade one coronavirus quarantine for another, leaving the cruise ship to fly back to the U.S. Cheryl Molesky said the rising number of patients on the ship factored into the decision. "We are glad to be going home," Cheryl Molesky earlier told NHK TV in Japan. "It's just a little bit disappointing that we'll have to go through quarantine again, and we will probably not be as comfortable as the Diamond Princess, possibly." She sent The Associated Press a video of her and her husband boarding the plane with other Americans. "Well, we're exhausted, but we're on the plane and that's a good feeling. Pretty miserable wearing these masks though, and everybody had to go to the bathroom on the bus," she said. Some American passengers said they would pass up the opportunity to fly to the United States because of the additional quarantine. There also was worry about being on a long flight with other passengers who may be infected or in an incubation period. One of the Americans, Matthew Smith, said in a tweet Sunday that he saw a passenger with no face mask talking at close quarters with another passenger. He said he and his wife scurried away. "If there are secondary infections on board, this is why," he said. "And you wanted me to get on a bus with her?" He said the American health officials who visited their room was apparently surprised that the couple had decided to stay, and wished them luck. "Thanks, but we're fine," Smith said he told them.
  7. Not sure if already posted. https://www.foxnews.com/travel/coronavirus-causes-four-countries-to-reject-cruise-ship-stranded-at-sea By David Aaro | Fox News 3 Hours Ago Cruise ship stranded at sea amid coronavirus fears, denied help by 4 countries he MS Westerdam cruise ship has been stuck at sea for nearly two weeks and will remain without a port after Thailand became the latest nation to block its entry amid possible fears of the coronavirus on Tuesday. A spokesperson for the Holland America cruise line previously told Fox News the ship planned to dock at Laem Chabang on Feb. 13, but now it appears that won't be happening. Thailand's Public Health Minister Anutin Charnvirakul announced on Facebook Tuesday that he refused permission to dock. Some of the MS Westerdam's roughly 2,257 passengers have pleaded online about their situation to no avail. The ship has been denied entry in Thailand, Guam, the Philippines, and Japan since the ship left Hong Kong on Feb. 1 Definitely stressful.we have been at sea 14 days as of this Friday. We have no passengers sick in any way. Westerdam is a ship of primarily US, Australian, British cruisers with no contact with mainland China other than to land in Hong Kong and go straight to our ship. #westerdam," one user wrote. Steve Muth, from Onsted Mich., told AZ Central they had been just floating around the ocean. "We've been denied, essentially, every port, every country since leaving Hong Kong," he said. The news comes as Carnival's Diamond Princess has seen over 130 of its 3,700 passengers infected with the virus -- which has killed over 1,000 people and infected over 40,000 globally. They remain in quarantine in the port of Yokohama. Fox News reported that Japanese Prime Minister Shinzo Abe suspected some of the passengers of the MS Westerdam have been infected, a reason for their denial at the port of Yokohama. Holland America said there is no reason to believe there are any cases of coronavirus on the vessel, which they also confirmed is not under quarantine. The cruise line said that all passengers will receive a 100 percent refund for the trip and a 100 credit to their next cruise. Passengers have been given complimentary phone and internet access.
  8. We'll, after hearing about this and reading the pertinent Cruise Critic threads (the "best place" to getting breaking news re: cruise ships; even if speculative), we certainly agree with you. We only hope that our concerns end up for naught; however, the risk to one of the most populated major urban areas in the world, we would assume that a reasonably prudent person (official) who take a step back and question the decision to allow disembarking. So now, as the 24-48 hours pass, we wait to see "if there is a risk that evolves" with such identified passengers or the rest of the 5,000+ other passengers and crew members. If so, the proverbial 'cat would be out the bag. Another thought, from my wife, with Port Canaveral next up and Orlando (Walt Disney World, Universal Studios, Sea World and the like), if they are willing to take the "risk" based on the current information, and information that unfolds (if any, and WE HOPE NOT) in the coming days before arrival. If 'they are wrong (even if <1% or even a fraction thereof) applied against the population of greater NYC/NJ, then the population and 'vacationers in Orlando, what a tragic risk calculation error. We hope we are totally wrong.
  9. Don't have time currently, but will address other issues re: CC ratings by CL and ship. RE: the proffer that it wasn't about "all ships" (versus the defense that it was only about ratings on CC); a reasonably prudent person (and then everyone else) will see only the title (which has no such 'scope limitation). As an aside, for those down-thumbing MSC, not a problem for us. We'll $ail it over and over and over. Meraviglia? Yep.
  10. Thanks for the reply, we simply disagree. These, for me, is where there is a RED LINE that make it 'a joke IMO compared to so many other ships on so many other cruise lines. 13. Ovation of the seas 12. Quantum of the seas 11. Princess Majestic 10. MSC Meriviglia
  11. Thank you. "THAT" was the point. "I doubt that is true." RE: the OP.
  12. Owned by Granite Media. 'The like all generate their revenues from advertising which is based on...hits measured and session time. Further, using CC 'sourced data from forums fails to discount for one obvious shortfall in measurement of ship ratings from CC; the sample data is likely not representative of the population. For example, take a cruise on Meraviglia with X,000 passengers on a certain date then look up reviews or posts on CC re: that cruise. Take that # and divide by X,000 total passengers. Further, make a 'leap to the assumption that those that didn't rate negatively were therefore 'happy. Just saying. Also we don't agree with the list at all; looks like the objective was MSC ships. IMO.
  13. Does anyone really know who/what Far & Wide is/are; their history and who owns them and what "it is they sell?"
  14. I agree. Yes, it is disappointing. We visited Ocean Cay the first two weeks of December; one visit was light wind the second was not. The only places on the island beaches protected from the wind were those protected by higher land and dunes. The waves crashing in on the Lighthouse walkway also would start to wash out splash over people on the walkway and on the outer side of the seating area at the Lighthouse. When Meraviglia left, she wasn't fooling around (speed wise) from our perception. That CHANNEL is narrow (believe it was excavated, not sure) and there appears to be little room for error. Again, sorry for the disappointment to the OP.
  15. Strong #2; they didn't have a North America itinerary customer base and, in starting in 2017, with the announcement of the six ships in two classes, plus the private island, they heavily discounted to "build a customer base." This was from a MSC sales management/executive on our Seaside sailing in 2018. Also, for us, the itinerary means little as these new mega ships are all in the Caribbean from FL and hit the same ports over and over; we go 'for the ship (newness) and 'the experience (Yacht Club, and we do the Haven when priced appropriately; as was our last 21N LA-NY via Panama Canal) and to get nice warm weather and sun.
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