Zou Bisou Bisou

I declare I know the facts.:)

Well good. Now we know where you stand. In your mind you know the facts. In reality, you don't. Now we can all just move along.

The car dealship where I take my car to be serviced has the same problem. The dealership does their own survey, where they encourage the customer to be totally honest. The dealership wants to know what went right/wrong so they can use that info to make business decisions.

 

The car manufacturer also wants me to complete a survey. The service desk dude, said fill it out if you want to and make whatever comments, but please get give scores of 10 across the board. If they get even one "9" on one question, out of 100 surveys the manufacturer's reps beat them up. There is manditory training that they have to attend (which the dealership has to pay for, so it ups their cost of doing business, which of course ends up impacting their prices). Management has to submit plans and show evidence of progress. There are special programs that they will not have access to unless they are 100%.

 

This is similar to RCCI's process. RCCI doesn't really care about using the survey information to figure out what is working and what is not. They want all 10s to report to JD Powers and other "customer satisfaction" programs. They want all 10s because the bosses' bosses' bosses' bosses' bonus is dependent upon all 10s (kind of like when that multi million dollar football coach runs up the score against some team in the last game of the season because he'll get an extra 100,000 dollars if the points for percentage is over 60% or something). The scores are not expected to be "real" they are being used for a completely different purpose.

 

More and more RCCI's policies are coming up short. And while my waiter or room steward may deserve all 10s for working hard and smiling at my dumb jokes or whatever -- RCCI's management deserves lower scores. We just booked a cruise - non-RCCI -- so that is my scorecard to RCCI.

You don't really know this for a fact. Are you just making this up?

OK. Let's try this one more time. Someone is totally missing the point.

 

We are NOT talking about service so there is nothing to be subjective about.

 

We are talking about facts. And the facts of how the CRUISE LINE determines the value of the SURVEY vs. how a passenger THINKS the survey is interpreted. If a passenger misinterprets the way the survey is seen by the cruise line (as a lot here are--viz "An 8 or a 9 is a very good score") and the cruise line says, "no, a 10 is the score we want and that's what we want our crew to deliver" it doesn't mean 2 hoots what YOU (the passenger) thinks. The cruise line determines what they want a good score to be, not you.

 

I realize that this is somewhat akin to the way people have been taught for years (e.g., 10 exceptional, 9 excellent, 8 very good, etc.) and the application of it (only a 10 is satisfactory, e.g.) is ridiculous, but that is not the point. It is the way that it is, just like the store being open whether or you want it to be different or not.

But actually, we are not necessarily talking about FACTS. You and others are talking about what SOME employees have told you and about experiences YOU have had with surveys done in other businesses.

These are not facts. You can declare all you want that giving a 9 on a Royal Caribbean survey is the same as giving a Zero. But then that is just you declaring that. It is not necessarily FACT.

I and others here don't just take as fact something someone says because someone told them or they heard this or whatever. For all we know the bigger scam might be that begging for 10's gets them 10's and so some of them do just that, they beg.

You don't know the facts and I don't know the facts about exactly how these surveys are used. If you want to declare you know the facts, go ahead.

We were on Jewel in August.

Jewel has not switched to the new Chops menu and is still priced at $30 for Chops instead of $35.

We ate in the Main Dining Room twice. Service was fine. Not great, but fine. I brought a drink in with me as bar service is pretty slow in the MDR.

Read.

Oh the car business or whatever? Not taking the time to go back over old posts. This is getting tedious.

What I've learned from this thread is the surveys are a sham so anyone who participates in them is being had. Tip your servers very well and skip the survey.

BTW, it was a joke, I know you didn't work in the cruise business. Sheesh!

Could be. Only have 20 years in the business and 600 cruise days to rely on. Please, please train me!!

20 years in the cruise business, I'm surprised you don't have more days at sea than 600. Bwaaaaaaahahaha!

That's exactly what everyone here is telling you. Since you have clearly stated that you have "more money than you can spend in a lifetime", please step out of your bubble and stop functioning under the misapprehension that the company will "better their business" based on you giving the waiter a 9 vs. a 10. All you're doing is hurting the employees - so yes, please, don't fill out any surveys; you might cost someone their job for something they had no control over.

Sorry, I'm not buying it. You go ahead and put all 10's on the survey. Meaningless. I will skip the survey and enjoy my cruise and very generously tip the many great people I have met on my almost 30 cruises with Royal Caribbean. Many of those staff members have been on multiple cruises I have been on. They seek me out when they find out I am on board. I seek them out if I find out they are on board. Cruising is a small world if you do it enough. I am a-ok with the way I am with the staff. You go fill out your survey.

Stepped away from this thread for a while (too frustrating reading some of the posts) and I am amazed at some who still don't get it.

 

They are trying to take their perceptions (an 8 is great, a 9 is excellent service, e.g.) and try to make it fit in the reality of the situation. Even when those in a similar rating driven business (the auto business but also the mortgage business and even the Air Force) patiently explain the program, they fall on deaf ears "cuz that's just the way I think!" Just because you wish it to be different just doesn't make it so. This does NOT mean that if you get-substandard service you should respond with a 10. What it DOES mean is that if you get flawless service and you rate an 8 or 9, because that is what your standards are, you are hurting the employee. It is quite definitely NOT a compliment in the current system (rightly or wrongly).

 

It is like arriving at a retail store at 8 AM and finding it closed and getting miffed because you THINK they should open at 8 when they don't open until 9. You are trying to push your assumptions on a situation that simply does not exist.

Maybe you are the one who doesn't get it.

What you choose to believe is your own business, but understand that the overwhelming majority of customer-service surveys are counted by the company as either "perfect" or zero", and that companies often make decisions on the continuation of employment, raises, and promotions at least in part based off these surveys.

 

I used to work for a mortgage loan bank(customer service side), and we had surveys that were given out to customers. There were 3 categories, and we had to get a 5/5 in all three categories for the survey to count for us. Anything less than that counted against us. Two 4's and a 5? Same as three 0's. And, yes, people were fired, promoted, and given raises partly based off these surveys.

 

As I said, you can believe what you wish but it is not only possible but likely that these surveys are "all-or-nothing" surveys.

Then I am glad I don't fill out surveys anymore. If it is counted as a zero because I didn't complete the survey then so be it. I will not take part in this type of sham. I think most customers think these surveys are there to gauge our opinions to help them better their business. If you are telling me that giving an employee all 9's on a survey is like giving them all 0's then it is not a survey but a sham. And I for one do not participate in known shams.

If people would ignore these surveys maybe they would go away!

I am so sorry!! Since my post was malarky, I obviously wrote it in the middle of a stupor. Please direct me to where I said they would be fired or demoted, dang if I can't find it now. I guess the part where I said they would be punished slipped into cyberspace since you read it since I can't find it anywhere now!

 

You can believe whatever you want. Like I said, you may wish or think it to be different, but sorry, you are wrong.

 

Have had more than "some employees" tell us this. After over 600 nights on cruise ships we MAY have had some conversations with staff about how things are run (including HDs). Perhaps we were able to get along with them well enough that they open up and are straight with us, but maybe you know more.

 

The surveys DO affect some of their time off (more for better scores). The surveys DO affect their dining room assignments (closer to the galley for better scores). The surveys DO affect Employee of the Month awards (although not the only parameter).

 

Besides cruising experience, I spent nearly 20 years running large car dealerships where virtually the same standards applied. Once again, I will repeat that I would like it changed, but you are living in delusion if you think a "9" is as good as a "10". It isn't.

Umm of course a 9 isn't a 10. Who ever said that? I am so glad you know this TRUTH as an absolute because more than some employees "told" you.

I outlined in red one sentence/statement in your post that I labeled as Malarky. I did not label your post Malarky. Please re-read.

You say not getting a 10 affects getting table assignments and time off. Not getting a good table or getting less time off because one received all 9's instead of all 10's is a form of punishment, is it not?

You said in your other posts that a rating of less than 10 "damages" an employee. I am sorry I inferred that that damage might mean demotion, or eventual firing or punishment. Come to think of it I would rather be demoted, fired or punished rather than be "Damaged".

Maybe you could be a little clearer about how someone is "Damaging" an employee if they give them a 9 rather than a 10. And here I thought a 9 meant Excellent service...silly me.

On one of our cruises on Explorer we had a waiter who was doing an excellent job. But on night while we were eating he walks up to the table and begins his pitch about the surveys. This then continued every night afterwards. I remember after one of the diatribes looking at my brother and saying that if he mentions this subject just one more time he can kiss a good rating goodbye. It started to go beyond annoying to making me angry.

I agree.

I mentioned in an earlier post that being pestered to do the survey and give a good rating "cheapened" the experience. Apparently that was a bad word choice for one particular poster. If a staff member pesters, annoys or bothers his client he is NOT giving good service.

Unfortunately, there is a very specific reality here. And that is, if the employee does not get a 10 across the board, it will be counted against them.

 

You may WISH it to be different, or THINK it should be different, but that is just the way it is. Those of you who never give the top score for anything, you are hurting the employee, plain and simple. Just because it is your usual practice does not mean it meshes with the reality of the situation. Just because you insist on beyond stellar performance to give the top rating, does not mean that it benefits the employee. The exact opposite is true: it damages them.

 

There are a lot of things that would be better in a perfect world, and maybe this is one of them, but you need to understand the world you are "living" in, and to run counter to that does nothing for you and damage to others.

 

Want it changed, and I do? Make your feelings known to upper management in the home office, not on the ship. In the comments section of any survey, make your feelings known. Don't make your feelings known by penalizing an employee, even inadvertently.

I think this is Malarky! I do not believe an employee will be fired, demoted or otherwise chastised for not getting a ten. That is ridiculous! Where is the proof of this? If I give an employee straight 9's across the board for good service they will be punished? I don't think so.

Maybe some employees tell you this but that doesn't make it true. You think Royal spends all the money on doing these surveys so they can justify firing and punishing their employees? Come on...if you really believe that then why why would you give such a Company your business?

Wow, which is it? Worked your whole life, or stay at home mom?? Nice to see you have so much compassion for the third world employees on your cruise ship - as long as your "experience isnt' cheapened". Let them eat cake or take their 8-9 rating!!! As somone with " more than I ever dreamed of or could spend in a lifetime", I'm sure it's easy to pontificate how you're not going to give anyone a "10" unless they "deserve" it...........

 

I really have no doubt you treat the cruise employees well and tip them well. But you're comments here are a different story.

My dearest bouhunter,

So you have put me in my place. I am a non compassionate, elitist pontificator.

Thank you for that since you know me so well.

Getting to your comments, yes I have worked all my life, unless of course you know better than me that we stay at home Moms have a life of leisure.

If you think stay at home Moms don't work than I will guess you are a Man or a woman who never had children. No Mother would ever think such a thing.

Or maybe you think it is only work if it is outside the home and you get paid for it?

My comments are a different story? But of course your comments to me were so nice.

If I am forced to give a ten on all questions on a survey regarding my experiences on a cruise ship and with it's staff then the survey has no meaning which is why I said I usually don't complete surveys. But what does it matter what I think or say, you know much better than I what I am really all about now don't you? Pontificator indeed!

While it is annoying, it is so obvious most of you have never worked at a job where your pay and employment were reliant upon a survey.

 

The reason they do their spiel is because if they get an 8 or a 9 you may think that is still great but their boss thinks it is terrible. If it isn't a 10 it might as well be a 0. It is unfair but these employees are just trying to keep their job. Punishing them for this is beyond unfair. It is petty.

Sorry, but I worked from age 11 on. Nothing was ever handed to me. Had a loving family and great education (because that was important to America in the 1960's to early 70's). I did not come from money but am nearing 60 and have more than I ever dreamed of or could spend in a lifetime. I was able to be a stay at home Mom from the birth of my first child.

If I were to give an employee an 8 or 9 instead of a ten and their boss thinks it is terrible, that is the problem of their boss. That is why I don't like these surveys and usually do not answer them. They mean nothing...except maybe a reason to give employers to underpay their workers. And most employers underpay their workers these days. Sad but true.

Sorry, but I for one am terribly sick of those surveys and employees who are compelled to ask you to fill them out and give you a good rating.

They do this in stores, restaurants, travel industry, everywhere.

When you have had a wonderful time on a cruise, the last thing you want to hear is please answer the survey and give me a good rating. Just cheapens the whole experience.

We tip well for good service. We do the automatic tips and drink package. So tips are covered when we step on board. But we keep going.... tipping waiters, bar waiters, dealers in the casinos....and anyone else for that above and beyond (which we usually receive).

So PLEASE Royal Caribbean don't encourage this behavior. Cheapons my experience.

That is good to hear such a great report. We are looking forward to sailing on her in 3 weeks.

 

I do have one question for you that you may or may not know the answer to. Do you know if Chops has made the switch to the new menu on Jewel?:confused:

Chops has not switched to the new menu or price on Jewel as of several weeks ago.

I was thinking the same thing. Growing up I would have been happy going anywhere regardless of weather.

Did your parents dislike children as much as you do?

Just raise the minimum age to cruise to at least five :)

And lower the maximum age to 40. That is about how much sense your post makes. We all know you don't like kids (even though you gave birth). Give it a rest.

I got my survey in my email within 2 hours of disembarking the Jewel in San Juan 3+ weeks ago. I actually took the time to reply especially because of the smoke in the casino.

That casino is too small to handle all the smokers who can no longer smoke on their balconies or any other bars. I am looking forward to the no smoking in the casinos on Royal Caribbean which is sure to come within the next year or so, following in the footsteps of Celebrity.

Nothing against smokers per se, but the rest of us should be allowed to donate our money to the casino without that crap. Most of the smokers were at the bar and not gambling. The whole place was so smokey it was hard to believe. Get it together Royal....most people don't smoke anymore but we still drink and gamble.

Each of us must choose how we spend our own personal funds.

 

Some will buy one brand of car, some will buy a different brand which is more expensive.

 

Some will live in one kind of residence, some will live in a more expensive residence.

 

Some will book an interior cabin, some will book the Royal Suite.

 

You have a choice about how you spend your money.

 

Spend it on cruise fare for your offspring or don't.

 

But stop whining.

Ouch. A little harsh. But here is my two cents, the third person fare is USUALLY much lower but in March as a previous poster complained of it is Spring Break. Choose off season with your little one and the third person rate will be lower.

That said, we paid for 2 -3, now 4 -5 cabins for our immediate family. Two to a cabin. As our adult children married and our grandchildren came along we book more cabins and just pony up. Choose the vacation that fits your budget. We do all inclusive and land vacations. Cruises, in the end tend to be a pretty good bang for the buck.

That's for sure!!! I was even reading some posts on here somewhere that they were getting any kind of drink that they wanted, not just those on the DL/CL drink menu:rolleyes:

Absolutely true! Getting high end like Grey Goose Vodka, Hendrick's Gin and the like in the bars rather than the CL. Also, the drinks added to the sea pass lasted 1/2 longer than the Concierge Lounge was open. This was on our Jewel cruise 3 weeks ago.

The best perk in the lounge is the company of other Diamond Cruisers. I"m hopeing to make Diamond Plus first quarter next year and meet even more nice people!!

While I am Diamond Plus, I have to admit some of the nicest people I meet on board are new cruisers or those repeat cruisers much further down on the food chain. Just saying...

You say the second formal night was day 5, which is Aruba. We don't sail from Aruba until 11pm, why would they make that a formal night?

So, the airline does not give you or his kids high tier status, but treats you well when you travel with your husband, the highest tier member. Well, cruiseline could do that, too. Celebrity allows cabinmates of Elites to attend the cocktail parties, even if the cabinmate personally lacks Captain's Club status. If Royal Caribbean did something similar (allowing cabinmates to share C&A perks), it would solve your husband/wife lounge issue you cite (unless they did not share a cabin for their own reasons). Wouldn't that be a better parellel to your airline example?

Yes, and I would be ok with that. I think it was crazy of Royal Caribbean to give everyone in the family the same status as the highest tiered member of that family. I don't think people even expected that but that is what they did and still do.

Sorry, I'll rephrase that. I try not to question one's frustrations.

Oh, but the questioning....now that's what it is all about!