Rhine water levels 2018 and similar topics

TashiChino,

that means you spent close to a 1000 kilometres riding on a bus rather than sailing on your intended boat. I was surprised the cruise company even offered such an alternative plan, but then I realised that due to post-cruise stay and flights people might prefer to that rather than interrupt the trip right there near Passau. I hope you were able to at least enjoy the ports and towns you saw along the way to some extent and hope that all future conversation with Scenic will be to your satisfaction.

What news reports said last night and this morning does not make me feel confident about the situation changing for the better very soon, I am afraid. "There is no widespread prolonged rain in sight" was one comment. The current river levels: Maxau 362cm, Kaub 75cm, 67cm.

notamermaid

TashiChino I hope you won't mind posting the compensation once Scenic lets you know.

 

We are booked for next year and I have read the River Cruise Guarantee. It obviously has different compensation levels depending on deck and cabin choice. I can't work out whether the amounts referred to in the guarantee are per cabin or per person. Hopefully per person, or everyone would still be very out of pocket.

I am completely bamboozled by the River Guarantee now. For the 5 days/4 nights off the boat we have been offered 1 days interruption which comes to $300 pp in our cabin, on the Diamond Deck. I believe people in more expensive cabins will receive marginally more.

Notamermaid, that was the catch for most people. We were told that if we elected to leave the cruise we would be taken to the nearest airport and flown home which would disrupt those with future travel plans. At this point Scenic do not appear to be attempting to nurture future relationships and build a customer base.

TashiChino

We are also on the Diamond Deck on Scenic Jewel boarding Sept 3 from Basel. I called Scenic yesterday voicing my concern, but still being 2 weeks out I didn’t expect that they would be able to tell me about our particular voyage, but wanted to get some idea as to what they are doing for the passengers that are presently travelling that have interruptions to their planned cruise. While the Scenic rep was very sympathetic and did say that there was another department that would handle these situations she certainly made it sound much better than 300.00 pp compensation. I’m so sorry for your huge disappointment and lack of satisfaction from Scenic for a cruise that was nothing like what you had booked.

Notamermaid: Thank you so much for all the insider information! Don't worry, I for one do not plan to try self-navigating the river based on your info! For a "non-math" person, you've given lots of info!

Histiomom: If you're still monitoring this, how did the rest of your journey go? We are on the Amsterdam - Basel on the Viking Kara, scheduled to depart Amsterdam on Sunday, August 26th.

Everyone else: Although I plan to be out and about exploring everywhere we go, and getting some relaxation time in, I will try to provide a quick post here and there to give some updates on the conditions we encounter, and what Viking does to address them. Departing Thursday, August 23rd for two advance days in Amsterdam - still excited about the trip!

cruising denise,

welcome to cruisecritic. Perhaps you have seen or read them, but I recommend the stickies at the top of the page for some great info by our host jazzbeau. Thank you for your kind words. I was imagining somebody approaching the captain saying "I read on cruisecritic...", I hope nobody gets annoyed with me.

But by all means, if you hear about navigation on the Rhine or the draft of your ship empty or full or both, please do tell us, anyone. It is always enjoyable to hear interesting details from onboard the ship.

It would be great to hear from histiomom and the Crystal cruisers again, see how they have fared on their cruises.

Good that you are keeping your spirits up. Looking forward to hearing from you. Have a great cruise.

notamermaid

Edit: forgot the figures: Maxau 364cm, Kaub 71cm, Koblenz 72cm.

 

notamermaid

I probabky missed something earlier, but what do those numbers mean?

cruising denise

Look forward to your updates when you get a chance. Have a wonderful time on your vacation.

We were due to be sailing with Emerald on Sunday, Amsterdam to Frankfurt but they cancelled the trip on Wednesday due to the low water levels. We had received notification from them last Saturday advising of the concern regarding levels and that they had changed the boat and would update us further on Wednesday which they did. We are disappointed as this would have been our first river cruise. We were offered a full refund or a future cruise certificate with 5% off our next booking. We decided to go for the full refund. Fortunately we were able to cancel our Heathrow hotel at no cost to us and we had no pre or post cruise tours booked.

We were due to be sailing with Emerald on Sunday, Amsterdam to Frankfurt but they cancelled the trip on Wednesday due to the low water levels. We had received notification from them last Saturday advising of the concern regarding levels and that they had changed the boat and would update us further on Wednesday which they did. We are disappointed as this would have been our first river cruise. We were offered a full refund or a future cruise certificate with 5% off our next booking. We decided to go for the full refund. Fortunately we were able to cancel our Heathrow hotel at no cost to us and we had no pre or post cruise tours booked.

Eek. So sad for you. I wonder if this season is a bellwether event that will get the EU to fund increased dredging operations.

I probabky missed something earlier, but what do those numbers mean?

Those towns have gauging stations that measure the Rhine River water levels. There are more but those are good for showing the changes and are representative of what effect it has on cruising. Kaub is in the Middle Rhine valley where the navigation channel is at its shallowest. The figures are the gauges not the actual depth of the river or navigation channel.

I will address that crucial difference in the next few days.

notamermaid

I got this email today, for our cruise that leaves technically Monday (we stay in Amsterdam Sunday and sleep on the boat.)

Thank you for choosing Gate 1 Travel for your upcoming river cruise on the Rhine. We look forward to welcome you onboard the Monarch Queen for an exciting sailing.

Today we were advised about low water levels on the Rhine River. This summer has been much drier than in recent years and, as a result, water levels have been lower than normal for this time of the year.

In order to avoid any navigational issues with the ship as it leaves Amsterdam, on Monday, when you disembark the ship for your city tour of Amsterdam, the Queen will depart the city and will meet you in Utrecht, where you will embark and continue on your cruise towards Germany.

You will not miss any of the excursions or activities in your itinerary.

Hello this is for Notamermaid or anyone else who may have info,we are on Scenic departing Oct 3rd. On the Rhine Moselle cruise,departing from Basel. Ending in Amsterdam which part of our cruise if nothing changes will be interrupted or diverted ?

Thanks to everyone who contributes

I posted earlier in the week.....Avalon Tranquility II, departed Amsterdam Aug 10th....arriving Basel tomorrow.

We only had two hiccups.....departing by bus to Cologne to catch up on time....ship delayed the previous night due to low levels and slower speed.

The other glitch but handled very well. Ship travelled upriver past Heidelberg to Mannheim while passengers travelled to Heidelberg to do tours then travelled to Mannheim to revised the ship.

Avalon worked very quickly to adjust accordingly to what ever happened.

Very impressed with Avalon......I had been fearing a bus trip.

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TashiChino, that is a terrible offer. From my reading of the river cruise guarantee, you should be compensated for each day.

This is a cut and paste from the first page of their guarantee:

"Depending on the level of Your Scenic Tour, You will be paid up to a maximum of $1,000 for each full 24 hour period from the start of the delay or cancellation up to a maximum of $7,000 (or seven (7) consecutive 24 hour periods) or the originally scheduled end date of Your Scenic Tour, whichever is the lesser."

This clearly states that the payment is for each 24 hour period up to 7 days.

And the following is a cut and paste from the Terms and Conditions:

Amounts payable if You have been offered to terminate Your cruise and You decide to leave the ship: Deck Max Limit per day, amount payableJewel $400Sapphire $500Diamond $600Junior & Royal Suites $800Amounts payable if You have been offered to terminate Your cruise and You decide to remain on theship or if the incident is not likely to be protracted:Deck Max Limit per day, amount payableJewel $200Sapphire $250Diamond $300Junior & Royal Suites $400

Your $300 is correct for Diamond Deck but it definitely states per day.

These documents apparently apply to Australian residents. Are you from Australia? If not, I suppose that there may be different rules, but it would be totally unfair if it was much different to this.

Hopefully we will shortly be hearing from you stating that Scenic have been a little more generous.

TashiChino, that is a terrible offer. From my reading of the river cruise guarantee, you should be compensated for each day.

 

This is a cut and paste from the first page of their guarantee:

 

"Depending on the level of Your Scenic Tour, You will be paid up to a maximum of $1,000 for each full 24 hour period from the start of the delay or cancellation up to a maximum of $7,000 (or seven (7) consecutive 24 hour periods) or the originally scheduled end date of Your Scenic Tour, whichever is the lesser."

This clearly states that the payment is for each 24 hour period up to 7 days.

And the following is a cut and paste from the Terms and Conditions:

Amounts payable if You have been offered to terminate Your cruise and You decide to leave the ship: Deck Max Limit per day, amount payableJewel $400Sapphire $500Diamond $600Junior & Royal Suites $800Amounts payable if You have been offered to terminate Your cruise and You decide to remain on theship or if the incident is not likely to be protracted:Deck Max Limit per day, amount payableJewel $200Sapphire $250Diamond $300Junior & Royal Suites $400

 

Your $300 is correct for Diamond Deck but it definitely states per day.

 

These documents apparently apply to Australian residents. Are you from Australia? If not, I suppose that there may be different rules, but it would be totally unfair if it was much different to this.

 

Hopefully we will shortly be hearing from you stating that Scenic have been a little more generous.

Thanks djh1959, we are Australian, and those Australians we have been in contact with who elected to join the buses have also only been offered one day also. We are all feeling very let down by this. We have heard from someone from another country that they have received an offer of 5 days so are seeking clarification from Scenic in the hope there has been an error against us. We would hate to see others lose their 5 days though.

Whilst this all occurred on day 7 of our 15 day cruise, those who elected to leave have only been offered 6 days.

TashiChino, I am sure (or maybe I hope!) that there has been a mistake. I have read the Terms and Conditions repeatedly, and called Scenic and they assure me that the payments are per day.

There is a maximum of 7 days though, but one is quite ridiculous.

Luckily we aren't cruising until next October, but I don't think I will be enjoying the planning for this holiday as I now know that there is so much to worry about. It is a shame, because from Australia it is such a long journey and such an expensive holiday.

We were originally planning to do Amsterdam to Budapest, but it was worry about ending up on buses that made us change to a one week Amsterdam to Basel. We do still plan on travelling to Vienna and Budapest, but we will do that by train. We are now going to make contigency plans to do Amsterdam to Basel by train as well so that if everything goes belly up we will at least be able to enjoy our holiday and we can then come home and deal with Scenic if that happens.

Unfortunately I have a bladder condition whereby I need the toilet at least every hour, so a bus trip can't possibly work for me. Luckily we have travelled to Europe every year for the last 7 or 8 years so are very familiar with the excellent train system.

I must say I am now quite sorry to have forked out $1000 each in deposits which are of course non-refundable.

djh1959 I understand your concern and hesitation. I have no previous experience with the European rivers but hopefully others here could advise you what they are generally like in October, or perhaps somewhere you can access data to river heights and seeif if there is a correlation between July/August and the October of each year. Small peace of mind for you but the buses did have a toilet but I understand still uncomfortable.

Hello this is for Notamermaid or anyone else who may have info,we are on Scenic departing Oct 3rd. On the Rhine Moselle cruise,departing from Basel. Ending in Amsterdam which part of our cruise if nothing changes will be interrupted or diverted ?

Thanks to everyone who contributes

Hello caskale,

you will be fine on the Moselle, problems could arise from after Iffezheim going downstream, that place is the last lock on the Rhine seen from Basel. After that all the way to Koblenz could be slowed down traffic with delays depending on traffic, the worst stretch or even several might not be navigable. That is entirely up to captain and Scenic to decide, i.e. the authorities do not close the river. From just after Koblenz you should be fine with slight delays possible and rearranged docking places in Cologne possible. In the Netherlands interruptions at locks are possible but I have no details about river levels other than the info from past cruisers.

Current levels: Maxau 371cm, Kaub 73cm, Koblenz 63cm.

notamermaid

Hello caskale,

 

you will be fine on the Moselle, problems could arise from after Iffezheim going downstream, that place is the last lock on the Rhine seen from Basel. After that all the way to Koblenz could be slowed down traffic with delays depending on traffic, the worst stretch or even several might not be navigable. That is entirely up to captain and Scenic to decide, i.e. the authorities do not close the river. From just after Koblenz you should be fine with slight delays possible and rearranged docking places in Cologne possible. In the Netherlands interruptions at locks are possible but I have no details about river levels other than the info from past cruisers.

 

Current levels: Maxau 371cm, Kaub 73cm, Koblenz 63cm.

 

notamermaid

Hello notamermaid. thank you for this info hopefully by October things willl have improved

Cheers

TashiChino, I am sure (or maybe I hope!) that there has been a mistake. I have read the Terms and Conditions repeatedly, and called Scenic and they assure me that the payments are per day.

 

 

 

There is a maximum of 7 days though, but one is quite ridiculous.

 

 

 

Luckily we aren't cruising until next October, but I don't think I will be enjoying the planning for this holiday as I now know that there is so much to worry about. It is a shame, because from Australia it is such a long journey and such an expensive holiday.

 

 

 

We were originally planning to do Amsterdam to Budapest, but it was worry about ending up on buses that made us change to a one week Amsterdam to Basel. We do still plan on travelling to Vienna and Budapest, but we will do that by train. We are now going to make contigency plans to do Amsterdam to Basel by train as well so that if everything goes belly up we will at least be able to enjoy our holiday and we can then come home and deal with Scenic if that happens.

 

 

 

Unfortunately I have a bladder condition whereby I need the toilet at least every hour, so a bus trip can't possibly work for me. Luckily we have travelled to Europe every year for the last 7 or 8 years so are very familiar with the excellent train system.

 

 

 

I must say I am now quite sorry to have forked out $1000 each in deposits which are of course non-refundable.

Scenic tour buses do have toilets on board, although they’re not very spacious.

We’re booked on the October, 2019 cruise Amsterdam to Basel on Scenic. I hope next year is wetter than this year(but not too wet of course).

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TashiChino, that is a terrible offer. From my reading of the river cruise guarantee, you should be compensated for each day.

 

This is a cut and paste from the first page of their guarantee:

 

"Depending on the level of Your Scenic Tour, You will be paid up to a maximum of $1,000 for each full 24 hour period from the start of the delay or cancellation up to a maximum of $7,000 (or seven (7) consecutive 24 hour periods) or the originally scheduled end date of Your Scenic Tour, whichever is the lesser."

This clearly states that the payment is for each 24 hour period up to 7 days.

And the following is a cut and paste from the Terms and Conditions:

Amounts payable if You have been offered to terminate Your cruise and You decide to leave the ship: Deck Max Limit per day, amount payableJewel $400Sapphire $500Diamond $600Junior & Royal Suites $800Amounts payable if You have been offered to terminate Your cruise and You decide to remain on theship or if the incident is not likely to be protracted:Deck Max Limit per day, amount payableJewel $200Sapphire $250Diamond $300Junior & Royal Suites $400

 

Your $300 is correct for Diamond Deck but it definitely states per day.

 

These documents apparently apply to Australian residents. Are you from Australia? If not, I suppose that there may be different rules, but it would be totally unfair if it was much different to this.

 

Hopefully we will shortly be hearing from you stating that Scenic have been a little more generous.

If you notice in the language the payments you quote are MAX amounts that they might pay not guaranteed or Minimum amounts. Also it appears that if the tour converts to a bus trip, it seems that they are only offering for the days where no excursions are taking place.

So clearly the $300 offering is in line with their guarantee since it is less then the MAX amount stated.

Clearly the guarantee as written is pretty useless since there is no specific minimum amount.

Notamermaid, thank you for all your wonderful information...what a wealth of knowledge. We (2 couples) are sailing Viking Basel-Amsterdam in late November. My questions have to do with water levels & weather -- high or low? Cold & snowy or Cold & raining?

If you notice in

 

 

RDC1 That was our concern. Although we are wondering which day they hae decided we missed out on activities. Obviously you are better off electing to leave the cruise, or stay on the moored boat where you get the all inclusive but no activities. If you took the default option of bus and hotel but chose not to go on the daily excursion you were responsible for your own meals at your own cost. All lunches and some dinners we were provided with off the boat were a single selection and barely edible - photos were sent to Scenic Australia while we were still on tour as evidence.

If you notice in

 

 

RDC1 That was our concern. Although we are wondering which day they hae decided we missed out on activities. Obviously you are better off electing to leave the cruise, or stay on the moored boat where you get the all inclusive but no activities. If you took the default option of bus and hotel but chose not to go on the daily excursion you were responsible for your own meals at your own cost. All lunches and some dinners we were provided with off the boat were a single selection and barely edible - photos were sent to Scenic Australia while we were still on tour as evidence.

 

I would certainly ask them their reasoning for the amount and see if you can leverage it.

 

I must admit that if I was on a river cruise and things started to go wrong and the line offered a refund for the remaining days, I would take it and make my own little train trip out of it. Especially if they are not willing to specify compensation for each of the options.

jeb_bud. We may very well be on the same trip - we are leaving (hopefully) on 14th October, Amsterdam to Basel on the Pearl at this stage.

You are right that the Scenic buses have toilets but there are still a couple of problems. Generally you are told not to use them except in an emergency. In my case there would be a lot of emergencies and it does get a little bit embarrassing. The comfort of the toilets wouldn't be an issue, having travelled a lot in Asia with this condition, believe me I have seen some horrendous toilets. It is more the embarrassment that bothers me.

The other issue is that from reading some Facebook posts, because there are so many issues on the rivers at the minute, there are not always enough Scenic buses to go around and so quite often people are put on other buses with no toilets. That would be totally impossible for me to do.

RDC1, you are also right that they are maximums and they don't provide any minimums which is fairly poor. My husband and I have already decided that if we have a similar situation, we will elect to leave the trip and use trains. We already have plans involving other people in Amsterdam pre-cruise and elsewhere in Europe after it, so total cancellation won't be happening.

I must admit that at this point, I am seriously regretting the non-refundable $2000 AUD that we have paid but it's too late for that now.