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Tom,

 

We really enjoyed your review of the Lirica. We like the way you are very straight forward with your remarks. Your stateroon having a glass door was interesting, as our stateroom had only the shower curtain. Too bad you missed the incredible restaurant on the top of the hill in Puerto Limon. We will remember the red snapper & plantains meal for a long time. We noticed that the Lirica did not stop at Key West, but Nassau, and also went to Ocho Rios instead of Montego Bay. Did the lack of stopping at Key West cause you a problem?

 

icon_smile.gificon_cool.gificon_biggrin.gif

 

Happy Cruising, Buil, http://cruiseclues.com

Sitmar, RCCL, Costa, HAL, Princess, Royal Cruise Line, Celebrity, Renaissance, Disney, MSC Lirica

"We cannot change the direction of the wind... but we can adjust our sails"

 

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Tom, great review. I would only wonder how you got an enclosed shower stall in Room 8122. We were in Room 8037 & got one of the curtains that cling to you when wet. (smile) Other than that I agreed with your review. We had mediocre service at our dining table, but we saw some better waiters at other tables. So I wouldn't condemn the ship for one or two waiters. Our room steward(s) were great, and the bar servers were great, too.

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Thanks Tom....I sailed Sitmar and Homelines..so I am hoping for a reincarnation when this line evolves. I will book for the fall of 2005 as soon as the books open up. In the meantime I really want to experience the Monterey next summer if the line decides to keep her...I heard rumor they might sell he off. I love Italian wait staff in the dining room...so I hope they do not change crew like Costa did...the old cost was great inj my book. Then I do not look for everything American in my european lines.....thats why I sail on the them....like the old Stella Solaris, the Odysseus, the Deutchsland ...now theres a mix.

By the way..the pictures were great...can't wait to see how the Opera will be outfitted and if the stack on the Armonia will be rebuilt to match her new step sisters......I hope.

Thanks again

Tom

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Tom, You are showing your age (smile). I remember Sitmar well, and my daughter, who is now in her 20s, fondly remembers her first cruise on the Fairwind when she was only 5! The Italian crew on Sitmar, really went out of their way to make all the passengers feel like VIPs. I also hope that MSC can achieve that caliber of service (not to mention Sitmar's great Italian cuisine) but I think they must first decide whether they want to be a mediocre budget line, a typical mass market line, or something special. At this point the vote is still out!

 

Hank

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Well I see one change I do not like.

The white stack with the MSC logo was stunning...reminded me of the daVinci in her last years. If MSC wants to be a reincarnation of Home Lines or Sitmar, then go with a pale yellow stack...this new dark blue is so NCL......it looks bad.......

MSC....go back to white!

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  • 3 weeks later...

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Capt. Tom wrote:

If MSC wants to be a reincarnation of Home Lines or Sitmar, then go with a pale yellow stack...this new dark blue is so NCL......it looks bad.......MSC....go back to white]<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

 

Why should MSC Cruises be a reincarnation of some other line?

 

They changed their logo and colours so that they could differentiate the container line (which has a buff stack and old logo) with the cruise arm of the business. It is also because it is in line with their re-branding to suit the new markets envisaged when the newbuilds (2 at Chantiers d’Atlantique with a 3rd option and another 2 possibly from Fincantieri) come online. MSC Cruises will not be limiting its cruises to the Med or the Caribbean they will eventually be a world player and are now setting the foundations.

 

Capt. Tom can you send me an e-mail? Check my profile.

 

Cheers

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Hi Hornblower...will look to write off line.

My comment on reincarnation was based on what the new North American head of operations Mr Sasso was quoted on the Travel publication called Travel Trade. He said...."think of the new MSC as Homelines or Sitmar."

I took that as either a comparison for those that were familiar with those lines.....or what they want to become. Both had great following in the states.

As for the stack....I thought the white was stunning. How much the blue color will stand out at night remains to be seen. Me I am a stack man, then a bow, then a stern...when I study a ships design.

I am facinated with all the information you have ......we will have to correspond! icon_biggrin.gif

 

By the way...will be on the Paul Gauguin in September...wish it was Australia...love it down under.

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Capt. Tom, I apologize, I didn't read that article and went back to read it. I guess Rick Sasso can make that comparison, it probably will be the best analogy he can make.

 

As for the look of the MSC vessels, have a look at this image I rendered:

 

Ad_1349_2.jpg

 

Let me know what you think.

 

Cheers

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<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Hornblower:

Let me know what you think.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Well, I'm not Tom, but I don't think it looks bad at all. Personally I think I prefer the white though (white funnel included).

 

As nice as a blue hull looks, white can be beautiful too; and it seems there is a fixation on blue hulls lately.

 

Doug Newman

Cruise Critic Message Boards Host

e-mail: shiploverny AT yahoo DOT com

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Doug what do you mean by "...and it seems there is a fixation on blue hulls lately."

 

Maybe there's more of a fixation with hull art at the moment, NCL, etc. Anyway... what do you think MSC should do without changing the new logo and dark funnel?

 

Cheers

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Stripes stripes stipes!

I think a hull stripe is beautiful...something that was common years ago to break up all the white.

As for the blue hull rendering...yuk. Its so Holland America! But very creative on your part.

I want the white hull and the old MSC black stripe on the hull, or they could use a green stipe like the old Italian line ie Raffelo.

As far as other hull art...nasty in my opinion. Ships should be graceful, sleek and clean in their appearance. At the rate NCL is going it won't be long before we see ship art like the Constitution had at one time with the sun on the hull and the suns raise radiating all over the ship up to the funnels...not nice.

I was looking at the pictures of the Opera as she left the yard.....not a bad looking ship although the stern is not to my taste....I like stepped sterns myself. The new logo.....to busy...still prefer the clean simple old logo.

Will I sail the new Opera...you bet.

By the way..I read the Mistral maybe lengthened and balconies added by Alstrom...I wonder if that would get MSC interested....if so I hope the satck gets redone.

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<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Hornblower:

Doug what do you mean by "...and it seems there is a fixation on blue hulls lately."<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I meant among ship enthusiasts... Everyone proposes a blue hull for anything and everything. I like blue hulls, but white can be nice too.

 

Personally I don't think the blue would fit MSC's image. Italian ships have been white for 40+ years.

 

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Anyway... what do you think MSC should do without changing the new logo and dark funnel?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I agree with Tom. A thin blue stripe, a la Home Lines, would look lovely. (Actually Sitmar ships had one too for a time.)

 

Speaking of hull art, that was actually a Sitmar invention from 1988 or so. It looked awful.

 

Doug Newman

Cruise Critic Message Boards Host

e-mail: shiploverny AT yahoo DOT com

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<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Capt. Tom wrote:

Stripes stripes stipes!

I think a hull stripe is beautiful...something that was common years ago to break up all the white. As for the blue hull rendering...yuk. Its so Holland America! But very creative on your part.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

 

I agree. A dark blue stripe would be nice. The dark hull does suit ocean liners more than cruise ships, especially due to where cruise ships sail, in warm and hot climates.

 

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Host Doug wrote:

Personally I don't think the blue would fit MSC's image. Italian ships have been white for 40+ years.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

 

I believe so too.

 

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Capt. Tom wrote:

By the way..I read the Mistral maybe lengthened and balconies added by Alstom...I wonder if that would get MSC interested....if so I hope the stack gets redone.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

 

Sure, it will add value to MISTRAL and make her more palatable. MSC has said in the past that they were not interested in MISTRAL, however it is possible they have struck a deal with Alstom (Chantiers d’Atlantique) prompting the work. Stretched and improved she’ll offer better economies of scale. Now, we don’t know whether MSC will purchase or charter her. Where will MSC deploy her? Are the bets on Scandinavia?

 

As for the stack, I haven’t seen any good images of MSC ARMONIA (ex-EUROPEAN VISION) that show her funnel and if there have been any design changes. Have to wait and see.

 

* EUROPEAN STARS is up for auction in July. MSC will definitely be the number one bidder.

 

Cheers

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<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Hornblower:

A dark blue stripe would be nice.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Yes... Same thing that I said when I saw the first images of COSTA EUROPA. Nice, but she would look that much better if they reinstated the stripe she had as HOMERIC.

 

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>MSC has said in the past that they were not interested in MISTRAL<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I believe that at some point they said that they would be interested, but only at the right price... I guess the price she sold for recently was not the right price.

 

My guess is that Alstom don't have anyone specific lined up to buy/charter her; if they go through with the stretching plan it will be to make her more attractive to potential buyers/charterers.

 

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Where will MSC deploy her? Are the bets on Scandinavia?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Would be nice to see a better MSC ship (than RHAPSODY) in Scandinavia. Looking into Scandinavia for Summer 2005 (this trip has been put off at least three times already) and it would be nice to have MSC as a choice.

 

Doug Newman

Cruise Critic Message Boards Host

e-mail: shiploverny AT yahoo DOT com

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<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Doug wrote:

I believe that at some point they said that they would be interested, but only at the right price...<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

 

MSC Cruises CEO Pierfrancesco Vago actually said this about a week before the auction, but as you said the price was not right, however I have the feeling that something is going on between MSC and Alstom regarding the stretching and the improvements on MISTRAL. On the day MSC OPERA was delivered at St. Nazaire, Gianluigi Aponte stated that MSC had other projects it was working on to increase their capacity in the short term. Could this mean apart from purchasing EUROPEAN STARS in July they may also charter/purchase a stretched MISTRAL?

 

***********************************************

 

Cheers

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I hope MSC builds something special and puts it down under....that way I can go back to Australia and also do a cruise as well.

Me...I still want to sail the old Pacific sky with a bunch of Aussies...the nicest people I have met at sea.

Yet before that happens I wnat to sauk the old Monterey.

Do you know where she is deployed in late Fall? I see her schedule through October....in the MEd, but where does she go after that.....I am guessing the Canary Islands...but maybe she heads to South America? I am looking for a late November early December 2005 cruise... and this would be a special thing to do if her scedule fit.

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<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Capt. Tom wrote:

I hope MSC builds something special and puts it down under....that way I can go back to Australia and also do a cruise as well.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

 

Well, not sure whether MSC will send one of the future newbuilds down under unless it is on a world tour in 2008/9, but I do think one of the older vessels, RHAPSODY or MELODY, or maybe one of the vessels bought at auction may end up here at some stage, maybe to test the market.

 

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Me...I still want to sail the old Pacific sky with a bunch of Aussies...the nicest people I have met at sea.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

 

Never been on the Pacific Sky, so I cannot make a comment on her, but I do agree Aussies are good sorts to be around with.

 

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Yet before that happens I wnat to sauk the old Monterey.

Do you know where she is deployed in late Fall? I see her schedule through October....in the MEd, but where does she go after that.....I am guessing the Canary Islands...but maybe she heads to South America? I am looking for a late November early December 2005 cruise... and this would be a special thing to do if her scedule fit.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

 

I’m not sure if Monterey will make it to 2005. She’ll probably be sold sometime at the end of 2004.

 

***********************************************************

 

Cheers

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Capt. Tom, I noticed on the MSC Cruises website that Monterey is scheduled for a last cruise on September 9th., a 12 day cruise:

 

Genoa, Barcelona, Casablanca, Arrecife, Santa Cruz de Tenerife, Funchal, Malaga, Almeria, Genoa.

 

It is possible she'll be sold at the end of September. There’s also a rumour she could end up with Spanish travel operator Pulmantour on charter. Who knows.

 

Cheers

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Thanks for the information on the Monterey, Sir Hornblower.

Come September I will be in your hemisphere....sailing on the Paul Gauguin out of Papeete.

hey...why don't you book and we can talk ship stuff till we turn blue in the face......in between the swimming, sailing, snorkling, parasailing, jet skiing, dining, attacking the bar by the pool, sunning, lets see, what did I leave out.....sight seeing.....and yes a few hours of nap time icon_biggrin.gif

 

PS...do you know of any web sites that might have interior shots of the new Opera..I want to see how she differes from the Lirica.

Respectfully

Tom

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Capt. Tom, unfortunately I'm anchored down with a nine-month old daughter and a wife who is just over two months pregnant, so I won't be able to do any cruise for a while.

 

As for images of OPERA's interiors I think there are a few around, but here's a good website to start with:

 

Navires Croisieres - MSC Opera interior photos

 

***********************************************

 

Cheers

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<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Hornblower:

I have the feeling that something is going on between MSC and Alstom regarding the stretching and the improvements on MISTRAL.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Of course as far as I know the whole stretching business is still a rumor.

 

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Capt. Tom:

Me...I still want to sail the old Pacific sky with a bunch of Aussies...<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

A friend of mine said that the most fun he ever had on a cruise was on PACIFIC SKY (he is not Australian).

 

A while back there were rumors of a big refit for her to bring her "up to the standard of PACIFIC SUN (ex JUBILEE)". IMHO it would probably be more like "down to the standard" but that's besides the point.

 

Her decor now is rather dull (especially compared with the original Sitmar-era decor) but I hope they don't do anything cheap and nasty...

 

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>I am looking for a late November early December 2005 cruise... and this would be a special thing to do if her scedule fit.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

If you want to try MONTEREY I'd do it as soon as possible. She is for sale and with the seemingly ever-more-rapid expansion of MSC I don't see a place for her in their fleet for much longer. For that matter I don't see much of a place for her elsewhere either, to be honest.

 

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Hornblower:

I do think one of the older vessels, RHAPSODY or MELODY, or maybe one of the vessels bought at auction may end up here at some stage, maybe to test the market.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

It will be interesting to see how long the older ships stay in the MSC fleet. I (finally) managed to get my hands on a 2004 brochure and noticed that MONTEREY, RHAPSODY, and MELODY are now being called "The Classic Fleet"... Shades of Festival ("Discovery" and "Premium") and Royal Olympic ("White World of Epirotiki"/"Blue World of Sun Line" and later the older ships being called the "Tradition Fleet") here, with an obvious attempt to differentiate the newer ships from the older ones.

 

I'm still not clear on how exactly Rick Sasso's new North American subsidiary in Florida will affect MSC globally but it has crossed my mind that perhaps LIRICA, OPERA, and the other "new" ships will get whatever enhancements come of it while the "Classic Fleet" does not?

 

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Hornblower:

There’s also a rumour she could end up with Spanish travel operator Pulmantour on charter.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Hmm... That's a new one. You must be connected to a different rumor mill than the one I use icon_wink.gif .

 

Actually, it was rumored that MISTRAL had been bought by Pullmantur, or that Alstom was chartering her to Pullmantur, or that one way or another they had gotten her. I think this was actually reported in Lloyd's List (or was it Fairplay?) right after the auction. It also is apparently a rumor circulating in Spain right now (or so I'm told by a Spanish friend). Obviously they didn't buy her but that's not to say that they couldn't be chartering her.

 

If the Pullmantur/MISTRAL rumor is true, they are expanding at a rate that should make even Aponte jealous though it is worth noting that they have lost R FIVE (marketed as BLUE DREAM). R SIX, previously marketed as BLUE STAR, will now be marketed as BLUE DREAM instead. And there are even slight differences between them!

 

Of course the Pullmantur/MONTEREY business could be true as well but that one strikes me as less credible, to be honest. Why they would want her is beyond me. In the meantime I'm waiting to see how the atrociously-named HOLIDAY DREAM turns out. She is getting a big refit and I just hope they don't ruin her by doing something cheap and tacky (Didn't I say that once already in this post, about another 1980s ship icon_wink.gif ?).

 

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Capt. Tom:

we can talk ship stuff till we turn blue in the face...<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

You're talking about talking about ships until you're blue in the face and you haven't invited me icon_wink.gif ? (No matter, I can't go to Tahiti in September anyway!)

 

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>do you know of any web sites that might have interior shots of the new Opera..<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I have not seen any real photos. Yet. MSC's very fancy new web site is still not fully functional so I'm not holding my breath for photos there... If I do see any anyplace I'll be sure to post here.

 

Doug Newman

Cruise Critic Message Boards Host

e-mail: shiploverny AT yahoo DOT com

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One 9 months, another on the way.........wow!

That is wonderful!!!!!! The wife is going to need a holiday after all that!

Congrads DAD.

As for your posts..thanks for the photos of the Opera....I thought it interesting the general color of the interior avoided the cool colors of the Lirica and went to the pinks, puples etc. Maybe the next build will go in another direction. Either way I like waht I see.....much more pleasant than Costa's new builds ala Farcus......still want to know what kind of drugs he uses......and he says his designs are along the lines of those found in the Normandie......bad drugs,,,,,really bad drugs.

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Yes talk ships till blue in the face...what else would you do out on deck with a beverage in hand......

Well Hornblower can't go in Sept and it seems that I slighted you...yet you say you can't go in September either....well I am booked on the Star Clipper sailing Dec 5th......why not come along. Its a completely different experience than a big mass market ship.....not much to do at night but sit back and talk ship shi_.

So tell you spouse you are Clipper bound and book already..... during the cruise we can discuss a group sailing on MSC in the summer or fall of 2005 if they are in fact going to keep a ship in the Caribbean all year.

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