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Silver Wind Service???


BethIRC

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I have just returned from my first SS cruise for which I had been counting the days down. I don't know if my expectations had been set too high after all the awards SS seems to get year after year, but I must say disappointment was what I came back with. After sailing Sea Dream, RSSC, Windstar (and a few others which I need not bother mentioning) I would put SS service at the bottom of this list. Points that I noticed:

 

1. We were never addressed by name from Day 1 to Day 7.

2. Drink service everywhere required going to the bar and requesting a drink as opposed to staff asking for orders at your table or lounge chair. Staff would walk by our table or lounge area and totally ignore us. This was around the pool and lounge. Casino service was minimal to say the least - again we would go to the adjacent bar and order our drinks.

3. During dinner we would, more times than not, have to ask for more wine, the wine list, or to refill our water glasses.

4. We always had a table for 8 for dinner each evening. Our first night, 5 desserts were ordered, 3 were delivered after asking for them twice and the cheese tray was never brought. Every night, the coffee service was a joke at the end of a meal.

5. I asked for the cork or written name of a particular wine that was being served on 2 different evenings and neither time was it given to me. (meanwhile upon my return I discovered in my last Sea Dream cruise folder a paper with the wine label taped on where I had asked for the name!)

6. Staff (including officers) would walk by an area with dirty glasses, towels, etc. and not pick anything up that was obviously abandoned from previous passengers.

7. Sea Day was horrible if you wanted to sit outside anywhere. All the chaise lounges were occupied and deck chairs as well.

8. Our group of 8 left on Day 7 without being able to tell you one staff person's name which is a real clue. This is the first time I have ever not done any tipping for special service levels at the end of a no-tipping cruise.

 

 

My question - Is this typical for Silver Wind? I find it hard to believe that this is acceptable service for this level of cruise ship. I would appreciate any feedback as I am having a hard time writing Silver Sea off but would not want to ever duplicate our recent experience at any price.

 

Beth

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I was on the Silver Wind at the end of April and I had a completely different experience. The opposite, in fact. My SO and I were always addressed by name (by those that I would expect to know my name, anyway), and the staff went out of its way to obtain whatever we wanted, whenever we wanted.

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Hi Beth,

 

Sorry to hear of your dissapointment, particularly as I had such high hopes of getting you to some of my favourite Palma places and you'd been given expectations by me and others on these boards.

 

The fact that for your experience SS didn't stack up well to your experience of those other lines, and compared to what you expected, then your question as to whether this is typical or not - is an intersting question, but is only one of two questions. Is it typical but why did it happen?

 

I don't think it is typical of what has happened before. But whether it is typical of what might happen in the future - which seems to be what you are asking - I think should be answered by SS.

 

Why not ask them?

 

The executive who I guess would be most pleased to hear from you is:

 

Frank Sansone

Director, Guest Relations & Venetian Society

Silversea Cruises

Telephone (954) 468-3015

Fax (954) 762-3470

franks@silverseacruises.com

 

Franks appointment has been announced to customers and Venetian Society members in the latest newsletter.

 

Why not make contact and tell us how you got on?

 

If in the end - based on feedback from here and what Frank responds - you conclude that "one of the others" is better - then please let us know.

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I have sailed on the Cloud and am going on the Wind in Sept...but my experience on the Cloud was not like anything you had just the opposite as the OP stated,and as UK1 suggested I would contact SS and ask why as your experience just seems so out of place for a SS cruise no matter the ship.I am not one for posting reports,but I will post our experience on the Wind when we return.I do not anticipate a negative,and am sorry that you had one.

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My SO and I spent 50 days on the Wind from January thru mid April. We experienced not only top level service, but also staff that knew our names by day 2. Was it due to our length of stay? I can't answer that, but we had an incredible experience. On the side, the staff was overwhelmed on an 8 day leg from Buenas Aries to Rio. The clientele on that leg was made up of the "booze and cruise" crowd. People would reserve chairs at 7:00am and never show up until after lunch. At one point the hotel director told the pool staff to pick up everyone's towels, bags, etc, and deliver them to reception. This was a bit extreme, but it got the message across.

Sorry to hear about your service, try SS again.

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My SO and I spent 50 days on the Wind from January thru mid April. We experienced not only top level service, but also staff that knew our names by day 2. Was it due to our length of stay? I can't answer that, but we had an incredible experience. On the side, the staff was overwhelmed on an 8 day leg from Buenas Aries to Rio. The clientele on that leg was made up of the "booze and cruise" crowd. People would reserve chairs at 7:00am and never show up until after lunch. At one point the hotel director told the pool staff to pick up everyone's towels, bags, etc, and deliver them to reception. This was a bit extreme, but it got the message across.

Sorry to hear about your service, try SS again.

 

I think you hit the nail on the head re the 8 day pax,and hooray for the hotel director.When the staff is overwhelmed by a group it makes it hard for everyone,and it is certainly not fair for the staff as I know how hard they do work.I must say also,there are those that cruise that complain about every little thing and I do mean every little thing so it all has to be taken with a grain of salt.If someone has a legit compalint I think SS bends over backwards,and even for those that aren't I may add.I have found some that have cruised on the mega ships that switch to the smaller cruise lines are not sure what they have gotten into and therefore are ill at ease and complain the loudest.Sort of like those that go to Bermuda and expect Nassau.I think SS offers a very fine product and if changes in this product are made from time to time it is a busniess and changes have to occur whether to everyone's way of thinking or not.I know SS charges higher fares,but I have always felt we have gooten what we paid for and I would do it again and again.I would like to think that SS will be given a second chance.Didn't mean to ramble..sorry.

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Thank you all for your responses and I will take some of your advice. I have already started my draft of my experience to be sent to SS. Thanks UK for the contact information to send it to.

 

We are not megaship cruisers as you can see by the ships I listed. One of the couples with us had been on a Princess cruise in the spring and their service was better, but they did not like the ship size so they won't go on Princess again.

 

I manage a private golf course community and believe me, service has always been something that we continually work to improve. We also have those members that can't be pleased no matter what level you deliver. I would like to think that after all these years I have not become one of them! I do find it difficult when I am "off-duty" to not continue to look at how others do it and see how we stack up. After most trips, I am wanting to hand pick several staff members to put in my suitcase to bring home. I have even offered a food and beverage manager a consulting position at our club if he ever comes stateside and wants a side job! I only complained twice during the trip and they handled the complaints in a satisfactory fashion.

 

So, with all your comments, I am now feeling better and have decided that this must have been an "off" cruise for us and SS. I know this can happen in any organization. Maybe a key player was on vacation this trip. Anyway, I also know that they can't get better unless they are told so I now need to get the letter into the right hands at SS.

 

I will keep you posted.

 

Thanks,

Beth

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Beth, good luck with your letter. I'd emphasise all the points in your letter - just as you did in your last post. You sound thoughtful and well balanced.

 

However, as you well know from your own experience, quality is also about consistency and I can assure you the last excuse will be that someone important wasn't there.

 

As you well know, a well balanced, unemotive letter with all negative superlatives removed after the first draft - should be constructively received.

 

Do let us all know how it progresses.

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On the side, the staff was overwhelmed on an 8 day leg from Buenas Aries to Rio. The clientele on that leg was made up of the "booze and cruise" crowd. People would reserve chairs at 7:00am and never show up until after lunch.

 

 

In this connection, I was distressed yesterday to hear on a popular local radio station(while seated in my dentist's chair!!) an advertisement for a group tour to South America, including a cruise on SS. The announced package tour price (including air, land tours, and cruise) was astonishingly low. There is no question that the ship was SS. It was described in some detail and named. I had a very unhappy on a RSSC cruise with a group ruining the atmosphere. Though I have encountered very large family groups (that had their own reserved minibusses for tours), I have never encourted such package tour groups on SS. It is discouraging that SS is taking this route.

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My husband and I just returned from our second cruise with SS. The first on the Whisper last Dec (the famous one in another string) which we thoroughly enjoyed as our first... then last month on the Cloud in the Med. It was superior in many ways and convinced us that travel with SS is our new found passion. We are scheduled next to do the transatlantic in Oct.

 

We, like Jeff and many others here, are very willing to pay the extra to get a superior experience. And by no stretch of the imagination are we wealthy...but know what we want and are willing to prioritize and pay for it. But at the same time, I recognize there needs to be change and adjustments in order for them to maintain a viable operation. We are quite flexible, but we want that "superior' experience. And we will in turn be VERY loyal customers.

 

RE this marketing campaign. After reading this last post, I started to get a little worried. Reason being, I saw on my Costco (for those who do not have...like Sams Club) coupon mailing.... they are marketing SS cruises. That is a whole different market I would imagine. Those who are marketing experts might give us some insight here. Maybe I am overreacting.

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You are not over-reacting.

 

SS are unable to balance the books. Instead of retaining the qaulity and price they have decided to reduce the price and quality to try and fill the ships - and get closer to break-even.

 

You will lose the product you like and others will gain a different product to the one that you currently know for that they can afford.

 

The two last posts are more evidence of where they are pursuing their new markets.

 

Why don't you write to the e-mail address and express your view?

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RE this marketing campaign. After reading this last post, I started to get a little worried. Reason being, I saw on my Costco (for those who do not have...like Sams Club) coupon mailing.... they are marketing SS cruises. That is a whole different market I would imagine. Those who are marketing experts might give us some insight here. Maybe I am overreacting.

 

This is remarkable. As I see it, at least two issues are involved.

 

First, the extension of handsome discounts to new passengers while (possibly -- I am not certain of this) denying those discounts to loyal passengers who are committed to SS and have booked well in advance.

 

Second, and to my mind even more important, the demographics of the passengers. As those of us who spend a good deal of time on the pool deck know, it takes only a few loudly obnoxious people to destroy the quiet and relaxing ambience. A recent SS cruise was graced by three couples, travelling together. Two had cruised before -- on one line, Carnival. They were attracted to SS by some heavily discounted fare. How do I know? Because they talked very, very loudly and were pleased to share their wisdom about cruising/discounts with anyone who cared to listen (and many who did not!).

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Observer, and others

 

Your experience matches mine exactly. And your view about the discounts is identical to my own.

 

I urge you to e-mail Frank Sansone and tell him exactly what you posted.

 

This issue is so important I suggest you copy his boss who is CEO of SS

 

Albert Peters

 

albertp@silverseas.com

 

This feedback is essential to SS and if sensible they'd welcome it. If they don't know then, customers are really doing them a favour by telling them. I told Frank exactly what you have said two days ago about the discounts to new customers being unavailable to Venetian members and how some of those customers impact the cruise adversely and the potential effect on existing customers - but he didn't believe me!

 

On my last cruise - the bunch that constantly whined on about their discounts were also Carnival customers. They drunk champagne at every breakfast had two main courses side by side for each meal and were very loud and frankly embarrasingly greedy. They took over the pool and played games so people couldn't swim and wherever they were people moved away. I was unlucky to have some of them in front of me on the return flight - and would you believe they complained all the way through and demanded to talk to the captain - which caused some amusement.

 

Many customers were upset that the ambience of their cruise was being ruined by a relatively small number of people who had exceptionally lower rates than they as loyal customer had paid. Who is going to book a year in advance when you can be a "rate tart"?

 

Please, please, please - let's not start the debate again about the fairness or equity and / or wisdom of offering special discounts to non customers that are not available to loyal customers, as all we'll be doing is simply repeating the previous thread and we'll all get bored!

 

The more people that tell Albert and Frank of the more chance of them listnening.

 

ps The announcement of the discounts to travel agents for NEW CUSTOMERS only says in it's instructions to TA's:

 

Offer may be used for closed mailings but MAY NOT BE ADVERTISED PUBLICLY

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The fact is, there are only four main boutique ship lines. Crystal has large ships, pre-assigned sittings and all "exclusive" pricing. RSSC is not intending to move up-market either. Seabourn has only 600 berths in all (so even IF it is "better", it won't make much of a difference in market share). So Silversea needs a slightly wider clientele, and even if it does move slightly down-market, the "upper" passengers will still have nowhere else to go (not cruise or charter your own), so they are quite "safe" and therefore wise (to balance their books and stay in business) in doing what they are doing. Perhaps to cater to the "upper" passengers, they have introduced "butler service" to the top suites. Perhaps down the road, these suites can get specially ordered food (course by course in the privacy of their suites and therefore not upset the majority of the other passengers). The butlers (specially trained) may in time learn to fill all the special needs of those passengers able and willing to pay a substantial premium! That scenario, in the long run, may make good business sense.

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Here we go again......this you all can bank on..as long as SS is deeply discounting cruises either in ads,Costco,on-line, etc.it is going to draw a different crowd of people who would never have spent the money otherwise to cruise on SS plain and simple.We have cruised on another smaller line that did the exact same thing(they are no longer in business,but not because of that though),and the pax changed the cruises in a way that I never would have sailed with them again,and many other's as well.We were not snobs,but enjoyed a quiet cruise with no shows,open seating,no putting towels out at 7AM,and not loud and obnxious behavior.I see this coming to SS's,and I hate to say it.Just maybe though the small ships and no shows and small casino's will deter some from sailing often at least I hope so.I will wait and see what happens with our upcoming cruise,and I will hope for the best as I am really looking forward to this one.This will be interesting to see how it plays out a year from now.

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The voyage we had been on last December was a 50% discounter. None of the passengers were "loud" or impolite. None ran around or did anything unbecoming. Behaviour is not NECESSARILY determined by how much one pays. There are many ordinary folks who are nice and gentle, and not ALL high paying people are necessarily better behaved. As long as most customers understand that these are small ships and gentle manners are required, then those who do board will likely abide by the rules. Nomatter how Silversea discounts, it will still be expensive compared to the mass market lines, and those who do come aboard likely already know something about it, and so far, (other than someone "stealing" some cabin supplies), nobody has mentioned any bad behaviour on this board as yet. Am I right?

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Nomatter how Silversea discounts, it will still be expensive compared to the mass market lines, and those who do come aboard likely already know something about it, and so far, (other than someone "stealing" some cabin supplies), nobody has mentioned any bad behaviour on this board as yet. Am I right?

 

Well, I did see one well-coiffed older lady in a ball gown and jewelry who was staggering in the corridor one night (and not because of the ship's motion, either).

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The voyage we had been on last December was a 50% discounter. None of the passengers were "loud" or impolite. None ran around or did anything unbecoming. Behaviour is not NECESSARILY determined by how much one pays. There are many ordinary folks who are nice and gentle, and not ALL high paying people are necessarily better behaved. As long as most customers understand that these are small ships and gentle manners are required, then those who do board will likely abide by the rules. Nomatter how Silversea discounts, it will still be expensive compared to the mass market lines, and those who do come aboard likely already know something about it, and so far, (other than someone "stealing" some cabin supplies), nobody has mentioned any bad behaviour on this board as yet. Am I right?

 

I don't know why some people always ends up twisting this into some sort of class or snob issue. It wasn't last time and it's not now. It is a statement by several of what they have seen and what is clear to them.

 

No one is getting at you and your discount. I remember very well enjoying your anticipation of your cruise and all of the questions you asked - and no one begrudges you your discount. I'm sure you were well behaved!

 

However, specifically several people have complained about people who have made it clear that they were only there because of this discount and effectively spoilt the ambiance for others. All you say IS true of YOUR cruise, but it doesn't negate other peoples experience since then when the heavy first-timer exclusive discounting has increased, and other peoples experience on their cruises wasn't the same as you had on yours. I can tell you with confidence that TA's have been receiving vociferous and increased complaints from SS's most loyal customers - so these comments here are not isolated. My t/a told me today of one customer of SS with more than 700 days who has complained to SS, received no reply and has resolutely made her next booking with Seabourn.

 

Those that were well behaved - even with the special discounts would I'm sure have knitted in and gone unnoticed.

 

I wish I understood why some peoples' hackles rise when people talk about this what is (for some) the unacceptable downside to SS's policy of heavy first-timer exclusive discounts.

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Even with 50% discount SS is still quite expensive for many people compared to what one can get on mass market lines. Hopefully this will discourage drug store crowd taking over Silversea ships.

 

The SS competitors have parent companies with deep pocket. Seabourn has Carnival or is it RCC? to help them out at least a while. Crystal is owned by Japan's biggest shipping company who can afford to keep Crystal floating at loss for a long long time if necessary. Radisson is owned by the Carlson, a major travel agency and tour operator, though I don't know how deep their pocket is. As far as I know, Silversea is the only independent among the top four. From what I hear, Sea Dream and Oceana are getting into this luxuary market segment. So our beloved Silversea got a real problem. I hope they can solve it in a way acceptable to loyal past customers.

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I hate to say that I don't understand why a cruise line would want to "punish" the loyal following by offering them less than a new cruiser discount. It makes absolutely no sense to me. Why not offer a Venetian Society discount on certain cruises to the new cruisers. That would make them feel "special" while not taking the discount away from past passengers. I truly hope some of the Silversea exec's read these boards.

 

Host Dan

 

BTW Seabourn is owned by Carnival

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I agree with Host Dan, and his suggestion is a very good one.

 

It seems preposterous to specifically deny Venetians the same level of discount that new passengers receive. In many cases (not all), the discount does not result in a subsequent booking, as the fares are higher than mass market lines. Concomitantly, the disparate treatment to the loyal existing customer base potentially results in a loss of revenue when the existing customer who perceives that his/her loyalty is not valued moves, for example, to Seabourn.

 

For a business such as SS, which relies on repeat customer patronage to survive, this seems a bit suicidal from a business standpoint.

 

Denyse

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Observer, and others

 

Your experience matches mine exactly. And your view about the discounts is identical to my own.

 

I urge you to e-mail Frank Sansone and tell him exactly what you posted.

 

This issue is so important I suggest you copy his boss who is CEO of SS

 

Albert Peters

 

albertp@silverseas.com

 

This feedback is essential to SS and if sensible they'd welcome it.

 

Several months ago, I sent two letters to SS. They were detailed and temperate. If only because I have spent many weeks on SS, I thought I might fare better than others have reported. I thought I might receive a response. I heard nothing. In my experience, writing to SS is like talking in a vacuum.

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E-mail exactly what you said here to Albert Peter and Frank Sansone. Only after you have done that, can you know whether the problem is systemic or not.

 

Let us know the result.

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I hate to say that I don't understand why a cruise line would want to "punish" the loyal following by offering them less than a new cruiser discount. It makes absolutely no sense to me. Why not offer a Venetian Society discount on certain cruises to the new cruisers. That would make them feel "special" while not taking the discount away from past passengers. I truly hope some of the Silversea exec's read these boards.

 

Host Dan

 

BTW Seabourn is owned by Carnival

 

I promise you Dan, I have discussed this at a senior level and they say they do not believe it is wrong and that it will not harm their business at all. When I asked them if that confidence were the case why they did it so secretly and furtively, they could not construct an answer.

 

I explained that I felt that there was an unwritten contract between SS and it's loyal customers. That is, in return for customers booking early, they will not be penalised if there is a price adjustment in the future. SS rely on these early bookings for their cash flow and planning. The new-customer exlcusive discount breaches that unwritten agreement and enrages customers. This will force SS into the same situation that banks, credit card companies, and mobile phone companies found themselves in the uk when they tried the approach of reserving best rates to attract non-customers. They killed customer loyalty. Banks and building societies had spent literally hundreds of years building loyalty into their business model, which one generation of stupid management killed for good and will never be able to reconstruct. I promise you that it is the single biggest act of industry-wide suicide ever undertaken. Now everyone in the Uk is a bank tart and has no loyalty. This has radically reduced bank margin, has killed "customer service". SS will kill their own early bookings and have already started to chip away at the loyal base. But they seem curiously blind to this logic. The only explantion is panic. Panic makes you blind to clear logic.

 

There is in fact only one solution. That is customers taking trouble to tell them that they know about these practices and that they find them unacceptable and that unless the price is matched then "goodbye".

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