Stop bringing non-service animals on ships

I am a dog lover, and until Monday we had 2 dogs ( we lost our Basset Monday morning ) but also think it's a huge problem. It's ridiculous how easily people can get a 'support animal' certification and then bring their animals everywhere. On a cruise, if I was at a table where someone had their dog with them I'd ask to be moved.

Sorry for your loss.

JC

On our last cruise there was a woman who carted around this little dog, carrying him in her purse, beach bag, or her husband's backpack, setting him on the chairs in the Lido, etc. Now I know that cruise lines can't ask what the dog is for, but being a nosy cruiser, I certainly could, as it didn't appear to me (yes, I realize, my untrained eyes) that this dog was for anything more than coming along for the ride. We were walking back to the ship when I came up behind the woman and said "Cute little dog, is she a service animal?" The lady replied (without seeing me) "I'm deaf, she alerts me to sounds." Really, I was behind her, and the dog was in her husband's backpack - sleeping. I said "How could she have alerted you - she's sleeping?" The woman's response was "I can feel her vibes." SCAM Total loss of respect for people like that who take advantage of a situation. Get yourself a pet/house sitter and go on a holiday. I'll get down off my soapbox now.

Smooth Sailing! :) :) :)

On our last cruise there was a woman who carted around this little dog, carrying him in her purse, beach bag, or her husband's backpack, setting him on the chairs in the Lido, etc. Now I know that cruise lines can't ask what the dog is for, but being a nosy cruiser, I certainly could, as it didn't appear to me (yes, I realize, my untrained eyes) that this dog was for anything more than coming along for the ride. We were walking back to the ship when I came up behind the woman and said "Cute little dog, is she a service animal?" The lady replied (without seeing me) "I'm deaf, she alerts me to sounds." Really, I was behind her, and the dog was in her husband's backpack - sleeping. I said "How could she have alerted you - she's sleeping?" The woman's response was "I can feel her vibes." SCAM Total loss of respect for people like that who take advantage of a situation. Get yourself a pet/house sitter and go on a holiday. I'll get down off my soapbox now.

 

 

 

Smooth Sailing! :) :) :)

She really needs to practice up on her own scam or come up with a better story. LOL

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I’m curious, do people try and go on excursions with these questionable support animals. I would think some countries would have regulations about bringing them in.

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You don’t have a handle on service animals.

 

Not all are trained from birth.

Not all are dealing with human issues where lying at the foot of the human is useful.

Not all are big.

Not all are owned by people who can carry them or deal with leashes.

Little dogs can get very tired walking all day with their humans.

A carrying device doesn’t mean they aren’t service dogs.

Small animals get cold.

Many people dress their smaller dogs to keep them from being cold.

The choice to dress a smaller dog in something cute doesn’t negate the good the dog might be doing.

 

And service animals don’t even have to be trained in obedience.

 

If we ran across a shivery yippy applehead chihuahua that could sense my husband’s blood sugar changes, we’d find it clothes to stay warm, keep it close to DH (which might involve carrying it or having it in a wheeled conveyance, and be happy about it.

 

If my son’s one febrile seizure had actually been a seizure disorder and we had found some crazy little dog that could sense an oncoming seizure and alert him so he could stay safe, we wouldn’t care one bit how YOU might react to it.

And you don't quite understand the law either. While I agree that not all service dogs are trained from birth, and not all are trained in obedience (since some can't afford this, this is one reason there is no certification or registration requirements), you fail to mention that if a dog behaves in the manner that is outlined in RCI's rules, the business has the legal right to ask the owner and the service animal to leave the premises, without any fear of legal actions for the removal.

Also, regardless of what you feel is best for the small service dog (and I know they can exist, and do good service), in regards to how "tired" the dog gets, the law requires the dog to be either on the floor or in the owner's arms. Period. If the service dog cannot keep up with the owner, then the owner needs to change their lifestyle to match their chosen service dog.

Cruise lines are afraid that the passenger with the dog is some disabled and/or mental health rights advocate who is setting them up for a lawsuit.

I don’t travel with my dogs but it really wouldn’t bother me to see someone with there dog that someone thought they needed. Just be thankful that you’re not in a place in your life where you don’t feel the need. Of course this desire you have to figure out which dog is needed and what dog is getting over on the system might be another problem you have all to itself

The point is, many seem to be taking advantage of the current policies to take their dogs just because they want to. Not that they have any NEED to do so.

On our last cruise there was a woman who carted around this little dog, carrying him in her purse, beach bag, or her husband's backpack, setting him on the chairs in the Lido, etc. Now I know that cruise lines can't ask what the dog is for, but being a nosy cruiser, I certainly could, as it didn't appear to me (yes, I realize, my untrained eyes) that this dog was for anything more than coming along for the ride. We were walking back to the ship when I came up behind the woman and said "Cute little dog, is she a service animal?" The lady replied (without seeing me) "I'm deaf, she alerts me to sounds." Really, I was behind her, and the dog was in her husband's backpack - sleeping. I said "How could she have alerted you - she's sleeping?" The woman's response was "I can feel her vibes." SCAM Total loss of respect for people like that who take advantage of a situation. Get yourself a pet/house sitter and go on a holiday. I'll get down off my soapbox now.

Smooth Sailing! :) :) :)

Not only alerts her, but actually signs what you are saying????????

REALLY??

If the "cute little dog " is really a service dog, and is cold when in the MDR, then put a doggie coat/ jacket on it and don't dress it up like a ballerina or a clown, etc.. It makes the "service dog" claim seem a little questionable (IMO).

Great idea, make it more expensive to bring their pets than to board them in a kennel. There are a couple of these people who take their pets into eating areas, sit them on their laps and feed them from the table. Those people should be banned from cruising for life, they do not know how to behave in the company of HUMANS.

I adore my dog which is why I pay for him to spend our vacation at a fabulous doggy daycare/boarding facility that he's been going to since he was 7 months old. He's 10 now and loves his vacation as much as we do. The last thing I want to do on vacation is to be getting up early to walk my dog or stressing him out by making him fly on an airplane. He gets a nice car ride to his favorite place to play and we budget the extra money as part of our vacation. I love my dog but I don't expect everyone else to! It's not only a sanitary issue but it could be a safety issue as well if a dog were to nip or bite a person or another dog. A true service animal should be welcome but these people who are bringing their pets everywhere need to stop. The "emotional support" scam is ridiculous and needs to be better regulated and enforced.

Hmm. They can't discriminate against a person with a service animal.

 

Royal should simply add a $250 cleaning deposit to all guests, refundable after the trip. Tie that to a guest conduct and responsibility policy. If a pet does its business outside of provided areas you forfeit the cleaning deposit and if it continues to happen you could be put off the ship. For a genuine service animal that is trained to use provided relief areas this will not be any issue. But for the self-entitled who let their dogs crap anywhere and make the crew clean up, they'll forfeit their $250. May make them think again about bringing a pet onboard when they have no genuine need.

Maybe they should also have to pay "cruise fare" just like we have to do.

Maybe they should also have to pay "cruise fare" just like we have to do.

That is illegal.

Disney started letting dog pets stay on property for an extra fee and I think in a few years, cruise ships may do the same. It started getting out of hand at Disney and they just ended up allocating some hotels, parts of the hotel for dogs and started charging a fee.

Except since there is no extra fee for a service dog, there is an increase in people lying and bringing Poopsy for free. Stepping in dog pooh has now become common at the pet dog permitted resorts.

Seen at my local Costco this morning. More places need to do this AND enforce it.

There is still the issue of fake vs legitimate service animal permits however.

Well, I'd like to share three experiences to show the world is not all like where we live. One took place in a "hip" bookstore in Rehoboth Beach, DE. I was in browsing and saw that they had a small cafe area for coffee, tea, baked goods. At one table was a woman with her mid-size dog. I went to the manager at the register and told her I was pretty sure animals were not allowed in indoor food areas in Delaware. She gave me an, "Aw, we don't mind." On cue, the cute little doggie peed all over the floor. I asked the manager if they mind having to clean up since the owner made no effort to do so.

 

The second took place at the local Harris Teeter. There was a guy who would come in with his smallish Shepherd. No way it was a service dog. He went over to the sample area where cheese cubes were available. He grabbed a few and proceeded to feed them to the dog who licked his fingers. He then went back and grabbed a few more with his hand to feed the dog. Yummy.

 

A third happens regularly in stores that have shopping carts. People placing their dog in the cart. Now, there will always be that "dogs are cleaner than humans" lame defense. But you know what, I've never seen a human sitting in a cart with his anus (not cleaned after use) uncovered against the bottom of a shopping cart. A cart the next shopper may be placing produce.

 

There a places dogs and other pets don't belong. It's time for all of us who rightfully object to raise a noticeable, vociferous objection in the presence of owner offenders.

And the American with Disabilities Act that gives service animals access to public places SPECIFICALLY forbids them from riding in grocery carts but the businesses are afraid to challenge them .. It is all four paws on the ground and harnessed or leashed or you can wear the dog on your chest.

This is a huge hot button for me. I work in a Four Diamond Resort and the amount of dogs we are seeing is obnoxious! I am also the parent of a child who is eligible for a service animal if I had a spare $20,000.00 lying around! I believe they should have to be licensed and I (as a manager in a business) should be aloud to ask for said license. It is not my business what service the dog provides but I should be a loud to see a license. Last week there was a yappy dog lounged out on one of our lobby couches. I assure you a service dog would not be lounging on furniture while out in public!

Actually you may certainly ask "Is that a service animal?" and "what task it is trained to perform?". If they answer, "keeps me calm". it may be an emotional support animal but does not meet the criteria as a service animal.

Actually, I'm pretty sure you are not allowed to leave an animal alone in a cabin. I think they are allowed off in some ports, but you can't get off the ship and leave the animal behind.

You can not leave the animal alone in the cabin ever. When I was on a cruise with a dozen or so folks with seeing eye dogs, the dogs were left in the care of the entertainment staff while folks went on shore. They had people with them that were going to stay with the dogs but the crew volunteered. I talked to one person who said that they had concerns about their very valuable partners being exposed to other animals and potentially ending up being quarantined on return to the US so there was no way they were taking the dogs on shore.

I don’t have a service dog, I don’t have an emotional support dog, heck, I don’t have a dog. Or cat. Or any animal. I have allergies and I lived upstairs from two not-allowed-at-the-apt-complex dogs who were “service dogs”.

 

During that time I became quite knowledgeable of the ADA, and I learned a ton about what service dogs do and how they act.

 

We ended up moving bc the management wasn’t willing to do what they were legally allowed to do.

 

 

 

 

 

 

All you’ve seen are the larger breed dogs. Why don’t you talk to people about the real smaller breed service dogs that are out there? They exist. They have a purpose. They don’t always wear vests. You might learn interesting things about how service dogs don’t all wear vests and aren’t all labs.

 

 

 

 

Not true at all. Except for the kudos part.

 

 

 

 

You don’t have a handle on service animals.

 

Not all are trained from birth.

Not all are dealing with human issues where lying at the foot of the human is useful.

Not all are big.

Not all are owned by people who can carry them or deal with leashes.

Little dogs can get very tired walking all day with their humans.

A carrying device doesn’t mean they aren’t service dogs.

Small animals get cold.

Many people dress their smaller dogs to keep them from being cold.

The choice to dress a smaller dog in something cute doesn’t negate the good the dog might be doing.

 

As for the whole emasculated man thing. That’s either anti man or anti woman and I’m not sure which. Might be both. Men are perfectly allowed to have small dogs and it doesn’t make them less of a man to carry them or to put cute clothing on the animal. Didn’t make my father MORE of a man to have Malamutes, either.

 

And service animals don’t even have to be trained in obedience.

 

If we ran across a shivery yippy applehead chihuahua that could sense my husband’s blood sugar changes, we’d find it clothes to stay warm, keep it close to DH (which might involve carrying it or having it in a wheeled conveyance, and be happy about it.

 

If my son’s one febrile seizure had actually been a seizure disorder and we had found some crazy little dog that could sense an oncoming seizure and alert him so he could stay safe, we wouldn’t care one bit how YOU might react to it.

 

 

 

 

Yep.

 

 

 

 

I’m glad that the dog was warm in that cold MDR.

 

There is no national service dog license or registry.

 

I’m fine with that. I don’t want to make the lives of people with disabilities harder or more expensive. Just my own philosophy.

"Service" dogs that are disruptive aren't service dogs. Diabetic alert dogs are frequently worn in a chest harness so they can detect breath changes. However, they don't spontanously develop this skill. Diabetic alert dogs have a high failure rate, must be retrained every couple of years and some endocrinologists will not recommend them since some patients stop monitoring and expect the dog to do the work.

Businesses legally can ask 2 things: You have a disability that requires a service animal? and what specific task has this animal been trained to perform foy you?

As to the Emotional Support Animals ... the ADA was rewritten a couple of years ago and no longer offers any legal standing to ESA. Their legal protection only applies to aviation (thanks to the Air Carrier Access Act) and to housing.

And, yes, there's a ton of abuse ... and businesses are so afraid of a lawsuit they won't say anthing.

Pretty shameful of those businesses and the pretenders they protect

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Emotional support dogs are specifically excluded from the ADA. See attached.

https://www.ada.gov/service_animals_2010.htm

"Service animals are defined as dogs that are individually trained to do work or perform tasks for people with disabilities. Examples of such work or tasks include guiding people who are blind, alerting people who are deaf, pulling a wheelchair, alerting and protecting a person who is having a seizure, reminding a person with mental illness to take prescribed medications, calming a person with Post Traumatic Stress Disorder (PTSD) during an anxiety attack, or performing other duties. Service animals are working animals, not pets. The work or task a dog has been trained to provide must be directly related to the person’s disability. Dogs whose sole function is to provide comfort or emotional support do not qualify as service animals under the ADA."

Service dogs must have been actually trained for a specific purpose. they must be fully under the control of the passenger, whether by leash or by voice/hand signal control; if they aren't under control, they can be put out. (Over the side? ;)) And the organisation is not required to provide food for the dog, so it could be made a cruise line rule that service dogs are not to be fed in the dining room.

It would be illegal to charge fees for the dog or deposits over and above what humans without dogs are charged.

Incidentally, I don't agree with the ADA rule that stops the cruise line questioning what the service dog is for. All of those examples of valid needs for a service dog are serious enough that the cruise line ought to be told in advance. For passenger safety (of all passengers), they have to know who is blind or deaf, or in a wheelchair; and anyone who is likely to have fits, seizures, or other sudden immobilising conditions, ought to let the medical centre know in advance. So the "discrimination" aspect that stops the ship's officers asking what the dog is for, is bogus. If it's a real service dog, its owner ought to be registered with the medical centre or purser anyway.

They have this sign at my Costco too. I asked Bill who is the usual door greeter if it has helped and he just pointed to a scraggly dog on a long leash walking around Costco and said "NOPE". Bill says they clean up pee often enough that Costco made the signs, but it hasn't made a difference. People love their dogs, I don't get the need to take your pet shopping, I am not talking about service dogs....just the pets.

Seen at my local Costco this morning. More places need to do this AND enforce it.

There is still the issue of fake vs legitimate service animal permits however.

I'm curious, I know some countries will not allow you to have your pet until it has spent a certain amount of time in quarantine and if, as has been said, you cannot leave the dog in the cabin alone, how are these dogs allowed off the ship in a port with these restrictions? Anyone know? Cheng?

For what it's worth, I also agree with the original post. It's gotten out of hand. We were on a DCL cruise and the people in the next cabin had a small dog. Not sure it could be a service animal since one time you would see her carrying the dog around and another time it was him you would see with the dog and they were not always together. Seemed quite odd to us at the time.

I'm curious, I know some countries will not allow you to have your pet until it has spent a certain amount of time in quarantine and if, as has been said, you cannot leave the dog in the cabin alone, how are these dogs allowed off the ship in a port with these restrictions? Anyone know? Cheng?

 

For what it's worth, I also agree with the original post. It's gotten out of hand. We were on a DCL cruise and the people in the next cabin had a small dog. Not sure it could be a service animal since one time you would see her carrying the dog around and another time it was him you would see with the dog and they were not always together. Seemed quite odd to us at the time.

For most of the Caribbean countries, if a dog has an International Vet Certificate, and a micro-chip, the dog is allowed in the country. The service dog owner needs to get a clearance from each country prior to boarding. It is quite an ordeal.

I am a dog lover, and until Monday we had 2 dogs ( we lost our Basset Monday morning ) but also think it's a huge problem. It's ridiculous how easily people can get a 'support animal' certification and then bring their animals everywhere. On a cruise, if I was at a table where someone had their dog with them I'd ask to be moved.

I wouldn't move because I am not the problem. This actually happened in a restaurant when a large family came in and sat near me. They had a pack of kids who were screaming and running from one end of the restaurant to the other. Parents did nothing to corral them. I complained to the manager and he offered to move me to another table. I asked, "Why ? Am I causing a problem"? All I wanted was a quiet dinner with my wife. The manager didn't honor my request and I never went back to his restaurant.

A restaurant is not a playground and a cruise is not a dog pound. I have absolutely nothing against necessary, trained and legitimate service animals.