Deceptive Advertising by Royal Carribean

While I think we scared the OP off with the arguing,

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Did we scare him off or is it because we saw through his attempt to deceive us on his half baked story and thread title?

You don't have to spend even $0.01 to get off at any port. You can get off the ship in Miami, and if you don't decide to spend a cent there, you can spend the entire day however you want before you board again for your next stop at no cost. My point is that Miami has a lot more going for it as a port-of-call than a crappy cruise line owned "island."

That's pretty disingenuous. The only way you wouldn't spend a penny in Miami is to not get off the ship. At least in Coco Cay you can actually get off the ship for a nice beach day without spending any money. Transportation alone in Miami will cost you. Coco Cay has never been my favorite but it has pretty nice beaches.

Well, Royal certainly has no reason to change if their loyal customers don't insist on it. I do appreciate the civil debate.

Your words -"Carnival gave us generously."We are not debating CCL... I have always seen CCL do the right thing. We are talking about RCI... not doing the right thing/not having to do the right thing... depending on the side.

I find it interesting that you have stated "We are not debating CCL" in response to ucfalli post.

All this post does is show how people are ill equipped to handle changes/ things life throws at them. How to figure out new solutions or how to make the best of a situation.

 

For Pete’s sake. My carnival European honeymoon cruise was cancelled something like 2 months beforehand. I pulled up my big girl pants and researched an alternative cruise with the refunded credit and discount carnival gave us generously. Had an amazing Alaskan cruise instead. I’ve also had a Western Caribbean cruise changed with whole new ports to eastern and had a great time. Found out at the dock due a hurricane.

You yourself have mentioned CCL twice in this thread: #54 and #174. In #93 you even provided a link to Carnival's Itinerary Change Policy.

Also you have not said this to other posters that have mentioned CCL.

IMHO if you can mention CCL then ucfalli can.

Take your proof of deposit, a copy of the contract you agreed to, go shopping for a lawyer. But don't waste too much time. The instant you made a deposit, you agreed to all the terms in the contract.

We beat you lol, we've booked 7 cruises that should stop at cococay and have NEVER been [emoji39] it's on one of ours for next year and maybe the dock will be finished by then lol.

 

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Where do you end up going if not to Coco Cay. We have one booked for April next year that leaves out of Miami. Obviously they wouldn't be using Miami as a replacement.

I find it interesting that you have stated "We are not debating CCL" in response to ucfalli post.

 

 

You yourself have mentioned CCL twice in this thread: #54 and #174. In #93 you even provided a link to Carnival's Itinerary Change Policy.

Also you have not said this to other posters that have mentioned CCL.

IMHO if you can mention CCL then ucfalli can.

No offense here.. but I did not say she/he could not mention it. I said we were not debating that they did the right thing... she stated in her post that they did the right thing... which based on the posts you mentioned, thanks for doing that research, would indicate that I agree that CCL does the right thing. She compared "putting her big girl pants on" when CCL did the right thing... not hard to do when you are treated like a valuable customer.

Probably been answered but if his fiance wanted the Bahamas, did he do his research and see they were only there for a few hours? I would have done a land vacation if it mattered so much. Very odd.

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As it stands I have not once said RCI cannot legally do what they are doing, I said it is wrong.

 

However I do have a question.. keep in mind I am NOT an attorney, so this is just that.. a question. If the cruise line accepted any reservations for the old itinerary, during a period of time where they knew they had to change, but had yet made the announcement, wouldn't this technically fall under some sort of fraud, and invalidate the contract for those individuals that booked during that period of time when RCI knew?

Not sure about your first sentence, perhaps is a generic comment. The post you quoted was in response to someone else, and was not directed at you.

It would not invalidate the contract. That is not the way it works. This is in every contract or purchase terms you'll ever see (at least I would be shocked not to see it). This is in the cruise ticket:

15. SEVERABILITY:Any provision of this Agreement that is determined in any jurisdiction to be unenforceable for any reason shall be deemed severed from this Agreement in that jurisdiction only and all remaining provisions shall remain in full force andeffect.

Fraud is a good question. You might be able to prove fraud, but it would not be easy or likely. In order to prove fraud, you would need intent. Basically, that Royal lied on purpose, the lie was told for the purpose of misleading people, and that people are injured by the lie. You still first need to overcome the argument that the contract tells cruisers up front, that there is no guarantee of ports, and they can change at any time for any reason. That will not likely go your way. If you got past that, then the intent argument would kick in.

Their case is: We don't guarantee ports ever. We make every reasonable effort to notify passengers about changes, but we can't be expected to know the future with 100% certainty. Even if we make a change based on our best knowledge, there is nothing to say we won't change back. We are not required to tell passengers about changes in advance, so we'll stop doing that. Another problem, legally, it doesn't happen that often. I doubt you could proven a pattern of deceit.

The biggest problem you are going to face is not the contract, it is getting a lawyer to take the case. This is $800. From what I can tell, Royal already offered more restitution than is required. The contract in question is well challenged and holds up. The language is very clear.

I get the moral question of is this fair, but there really isn't a legal issue. If someone does go to an attorney, be careful what they are going to charge you. They are likely doing it for the fees.

Not sure about your first sentence, perhaps is a generic comment. The post you quoted was in response to someone else, and was not directed at you.

 

It would not invalidate the contract. That is not the way it works. This is in every contract or purchase terms you'll ever see (at least I would be shocked not to see it). This is in the cruise ticket:

 

15. SEVERABILITY:Any provision of this Agreement that is determined in any jurisdiction to be unenforceable for any reason shall be deemed severed from this Agreement in that jurisdiction only and all remaining provisions shall remain in full force andeffect.

 

Fraud is a good question. You might be able to prove fraud, but it would not be easy or likely. In order to prove fraud, you would need intent. Basically, that Royal lied on purpose, the lie was told for the purpose of misleading people, and that people are injured by the lie. You still first need to overcome the argument that the contract tells cruisers up front, that there is no guarantee of ports, and they can change at any time for any reason. That will not likely go your way. If you got past that, then the intent argument would kick in.

 

Their case is: We don't guarantee ports ever. We make every reasonable effort to notify passengers about changes, but we can't be expected to know the future with 100% certainty. Even if we make a change based on our best knowledge, there is nothing to say we won't change back. We are not required to tell passengers about changes in advance, so we'll stop doing that. Another problem, legally, it doesn't happen that often. I doubt you could proven a pattern of deceit.

 

The biggest problem you are going to face is not the contract, it is getting a lawyer to take the case. This is $800. From what I can tell, Royal already offered more restitution than is required. The contract in question is well challenged and holds up. The language is very clear.

 

I get the moral question of is this fair, but there really isn't a legal issue. If someone does go to an attorney, be careful what they are going to charge you. They are likely doing it for the fees.

Sorry the first part was just a clarification that I was on the side that it was not fair.

The second part was really just a curiosity question. Nothing more. I'm was not booked on this cruise. Thanks for answering.

Sorry the first part was just a clarification that I was on the side that it was not fair.

 

The second part was really just a curiosity question. Nothing more. I'm was not booked on this cruise. Thanks for answering.

No worries. Hope it answered your question.

Where do you end up going if not to Coco Cay. We have one booked for April next year that leaves out of Miami. Obviously they wouldn't be using Miami as a replacement.

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Okay, my family was impacted in the exact same way. My wife surprised me with a nice balcony room for the four of us (11&13 year old kids included) on the Vision.

I was very excited. A little cautious about having kids on a small ship with three sea days, but stopping at Coco was a huge plus.

A nice beach day in which we would still be eating and drinking on the cruise's dime. Getting the same experience the next day at Nassau would cost hundreds.

Then the change arrived. Miami is a point of departure, not a destination. Can't just walk off the boat and enjoy the city. All the places worth visiting are a decent Uber drive away. And I'm not sure taking kids to South Beach would be very wise.

So after thinking about it the day in Miami would probably be a third sea day in a row. The small ship would have my kids highly bored by that time and bored kids can wreck a vacation. We had already paid a $1000 deposit and ALL of that would be forfeited if we cancelled. So after learning that I had entered the pissed stage.

However, unlike the original poster, I had an ace up my sleeve. My wife is an attorney and it took her two calls to find someone with a clue. We traded a balcony for four on the Vision for two joining Promenade rooms on the Liberty AND got a Fare reduction, an additional discount, and all transfer fees waved.

So I got a happy ending. If the original poster is reading this maybe you can get the same change. It changed the departure port from New Orleans to Galveston and pushed the departure day back one day. I'm still a little pissed at RC over this. Changing ports when things happen at the last minute and out of their control is one thing, changing an advertised feature because you won't pay enough to get the work done on time is another.

Also, first post! I had been lurking and learning for a while, but I finally registered once I had something to add.

Okay, my family was impacted in the exact same way. My wife surprised me with a nice balcony room for the four of us (11&13 year old kids included) on the Vision.

I was very excited. A little cautious about having kids on a small ship with three sea days, but stopping at Coco was a huge plus.

A nice beach day in which we would still be eating and drinking on the cruise's dime. Getting the same experience the next day at Nassau would cost hundreds.

Then the change arrived. Miami is a point of departure, not a destination. Can't just walk off the boat and enjoy the city. All the places worth visiting are a decent Uber drive away. And I'm not sure taking kids to South Beach would be very wise.

So after thinking about it the day in Miami would probably be a third sea day in a row. The small ship would have my kids highly bored by that time and bored kids can wreck a vacation. We had already paid a $1000 deposit and ALL of that would be forfeited if we cancelled. So after learning that I had entered the pissed stage.

However, unlike the original poster, I had an ace up my sleeve. My wife is an attorney and it took her two calls to find someone with a clue. We traded a balcony for four on the Vision for two joining Promenade rooms on the Liberty AND got a Fare reduction, an additional discount, and all transfer fees waved.

So I got a happy ending. If the original poster is reading this maybe you can get the same change. It changed the departure port from New Orleans to Galveston and pushed the departure day back one day. I'm still a little pissed at RC over this. Changing ports when things happen at the last minute and out of their control is one thing, changing an advertised feature because you won't pay enough to get the work done on time is another.

 

Also, first post! I had been lurking and learning for a while, but I finally registered once I had something to add.

This post just proves what many already know. The cruise lines will say nothing can or will be done when dealing with low level customer servcie workers. But when someone who has true knowledge of the laws and what is allowed Royal will very quickly change the position they take. The reason they channge this foir you was they know, that you could have got a 100% refund going through the credit card dispute/ legal route.

Happy it worked out for you but Roayl and other lines know most people do not have the knowledge or will not spend Several hundred dollars on a lawyer to recover $1000 dollars.

This post just proves what many already know. The cruise lines will say nothing can or will be done when dealing with low level customer servcie workers. But when someone who has true knowledge of the laws and what is allowed Royal will very quickly change the position they take. The reason they channge this foir you was they know, that you could have got a 100% refund going through the credit card dispute/ legal route.

 

Happy it worked out for you but Roayl and other lines know most people do not have the knowledge or will not spend Several hundred dollars on a lawyer to recover $1000 dollars.

I once disputed a cruise for 3 with my credit card and didn’t have to pay for the cruise. It was supposed to go to Bermuda and instead we went to Canada.

Is there an update on that CAS?

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Where do you end up going if not to Coco Cay. We have one booked for April next year that leaves out of Miami. Obviously they wouldn't be using Miami as a replacement.

The multiple times I missed Coco Cay(in 25yrs) twice went to Nassau, Key West once, extra day at sea once, another we went to Labadee but that was on a 7 nite Eastern Carib. cruise. Most these were due to Hurricanes...

My wife and I booked the Visions of the Sea for a Jan 2019 cruise to the Bahamas. Specifical to see the highly advertised Coco Cay by RC. We paid for the whole trip and then a month later RC substituted Miami for our beach day at Coco Cay. We tried to change dates and they refused. The RC agents kept telling us about the great day we would have in Miami. I didn't pay for a cruise to Miami. I feel like it is false advertising and deceptive too. I have been on cruises where they can't stop somewhere due to weather of other problems but we are 4 months away from this cruise and they change itineraries after the boat is almost full. We cancelled the cuise and they are keeping $800 dollars. They say they will give us back $300 on our next booking. That will never happen! And I hear they cancelled on several other boats. Some smart lawyer is going to look at deceptive trade practises and get a class action suit going on this one. Someone at Royal Carribean was aware of the changes to Coco Cay. I hope RC feels the same pain my wife and I are feeling. This was supose to be our honeymoom cruise.

According to the contract, Royal can do that.

I understand that there are things beyond the cruise line's control that cause itinerary changes. This is different though. they are changing itineraries to facilitate their construction project. Consequently, the right thing to do would be to offer full refunds to everyone who wishes to cancel. The minimum would be to offer credits for other Royal sailings without penalty.

Your cruise is going to the Bahamas. Where do you think Nassau is? You want to see the real Bahamas, it's not a Coco Cay, which is a private beach island in the Bahamas. Nassau is the real Bahamas.

Coco provides all of the usual 'day at beach' excursion benefits at no fee. Purchased drink packages are also honored on the island. It doesn't offer an actual culture to experience though.

I will also point out that there are no similar excursion options available at Miami. Most Miami excursions are in-transit offerings which don't apply. Since the time in port is limited (I think the ship leaves Miami at 4) there is risk getting off the boat (and going through customs), getting a cab, and then finding an equivalent beach experience. Not cheap, that's for sure.

RC could have solved this issue by just going to a different island in the Bahamas.