It's Called Hygiene

Interestingly, in reading several of the Koningsdam reviews, there were many passengers from prior sailings who complained bitterly about having to be served in the Lido buffet. They complained that they believed this was HAL's methodology of "food rationing" to control costs. They also complained that not being able to serve yourself created longer lines, which is understandable.

On a recent 28 day Princess cruise, their buffet had self service. Although it was posted to use new plates if returning to the buffet, I repeatedly saw people come back to the buffet with their dirty plates scooping food with a serving spoon and putting it in contact with their dirty plate. Perhaps they believed they were being environmentally friendly by not using an additional plate. Additionally, I also observed on many occasions people getting some food on their hands while at the buffet and licking their fingers and then subsequently picking up serving spoons. Also, some returned cookies, rolls, or other items from their dirty plates back to the serving plates, perhaps believing that they did not want the food to go to waste. Regardless, some people have little or no concept of hygiene. Not surprisingly, many people on the cruise, including myself got sick. One of the things that my wife and I recalled about our prior HAL cruises ( Noordam, Nieuw Amsterdam) was that HAL served food in the buffet, preventing improper hygiene, and disease transmission.

I'm not a germaphobe, but I don't want to consume other people's germs along with my buffet food and I don't want to get sick, particularly on vacation.

We have decided not to cruise lines that do not serve you in the buffet. We appreciate HAL taking an interest in the health of their passengers by providing additional staff to serve in the buffet . Thank you HAL.

Perhaps others can see this as a positive rather than negative.

Stay healthy my friends:)

It's true that some people have poor hygiene practices and some people have very little regard for others. Any time that you are around large numbers of people you take your chances. Like you, I also believe that the best strategy is to try and reduce the risks associated with large crowds. Being served at the buffet on a cruise ship is one way to reduce those risks. (Now if we can only get passengers to stop handing their plates back over the line and stop eating off their plates while stood in the line, two pet peeves of mine).

Hygiene may be the reason they serve you in the buffet, but for us, it was just another reason we probably won’t be cruising HAL again, at least in the Caribbean. There never seemed to be a consistent starting place for the line in the buffet and the direction changed constantly. I prefer the ability to go to the various stations and get what I want, then go to the next station. We ended up standing in a long line of people who didn’t seem to know what they wanted just to get to the next station. To each his own, but I prefer to wash my hands and serve myself at the buffet.

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The problem is, loads of people do not wash their hands before entering the buffet and as mentioned they lick their fingers and then touch the handles of the spoons, tongs, etc. In 2016 we tried NCL Breakaway for a change. First day in the buffet and older "gentleman" was grabbing pieces of lasagna out of the serving dish with his bare hands and eating it right there! I immediately alerted the server who took it away to dispose of. A lady sitting at a table close by thanked me for helping to eliminate the potential of spreading disease. The "gentleman" offender told me to mind my own f...... business! I had to hold back my DH from causing a scene.

So, yes, I much prefer HALs way of doing things now. We won't do the buffet thing again, if people are allowed to serve themselves or have access to the serving dishes with their hands. How many people do stick their hands in the food and no one is there to catch them in the act? Sorry, but I just can't go there anymore.

We love the fact that HAL serves in the buffet line. Over the years we have seen too many examples of bad hygiene in buffet lines that made us cringe! People pawing through bread or pastries to find the "perfect" one. Licking fingers and then picking up the serving utensil. And who knows if that same person is one of the horrible people who leave the washroom without washing their hands! :eek:

Food rationing? Seriously? Are they hearing themselves? hahahaha

I agree that a lot of behavior I have seen in buffets make me cringe. I am becoming more "germ aware" the older I get. However, you cannot control the general population, and not everyone behaves at a buffet the way they should. It's unfortunate that good hygiene and manners are lacking in some folks. The suggestion that HAL serve the food is a good one to avoid these situations where folks are behaving badly. It doesn't bother me if I need to return to the buffet several times to get the selections I want, nor does it bother me to be served by staff. I have seen people in the past heap their plates so high that I thought the food would spill onto the floor. It's kind of ridiculous. There is plenty for everyone. But some people are rude and selfish and act like its the last time they will see food for a month. Incredible.

Hygiene may be the reason they serve you in the buffet, but for us, it was just another reason we probably won’t be cruising HAL again, at least in the Caribbean. There never seemed to be a consistent starting place for the line in the buffet and the direction changed constantly. I prefer the ability to go to the various stations and get what I want, then go to the next station. We ended up standing in a long line of people who didn’t seem to know what they wanted just to get to the next station. To each his own, but I prefer to wash my hands and serve myself at the buffet.

 

 

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Do you wash your hands after you serve yourself? After you have used the tongs? Many people don't! I've seen people sneeze into their hands and pick up a ladle or tong right after it. Thanks but no thanks! Much rather the Crew member serve it for me!

Also, on some of the other Lines you Cruise with Self-serve Salad Bar some of those people take forever in deciding what they want to add onto their lettuce. Not sure how you think this is saving time anymore than the person at the Salad Station on HAL where someone is trying to decide what they want to add onto the Salad!

This is one of my problems with Pre-Made Sandwiches. I've seen people cough and sneeze into their hands and pick up a sandwich and squeeze the bread at the opening of the bag and put it back and take another one. I would much rather wait in a line for a Sandwich made by a Crew Member and know my food wasn't being touched by someone else!

Hygiene hasn't gotten bad everywhere -- not just on ships.

We do not go to any restaurant that has a buffet at home.

We appreciate the crew serving us. It may take a little longer to get your food, but in the end it is a better practice.

Hygiene may be the reason they serve you in the buffet, but for us, it was just another reason we probably won’t be cruising HAL again, at least in the Caribbean. There never seemed to be a consistent starting place for the line in the buffet and the direction changed constantly. I prefer the ability to go to the various stations and get what I want, then go to the next station. We ended up standing in a long line of people who didn’t seem to know what they wanted just to get to the next station. To each his own, but I prefer to wash my hands and serve myself at the buffet.

 

 

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Most HAL ships are going to Lido Marketplace in drydocks. No start and finish points-just go to the station you prefer. Has really helped with backups on our cruises with the new concept.

Waits were much shorter. Once people got used to the layout was great. The only line I stood in was the Asian station-always very popular.

Really appreciate the crew serving. HAL has ended the 48 hour code orange at the beginning of each cruise. No more people sampling food with their own spoon causing everyone to wait while crew replaced the food.

Quick question - as I forget! Can we go to the MDR for lunch? Or is the Lido and Pinnacle Grill the only options?

We will be on the Veendam in May. Thanks.

Quick question - as I forget! Can we go to the MDR for lunch? Or is the Lido and Pinnacle Grill the only options?

We will be on the Veendam in May. Thanks.

MDR is usually open for lunch on sea days.

Last two cruises I believe PG was only open on sea days at lunch

They don't seem to push the hand sanitizer as much any more.

Allan

Most HAL ships are going to Lido Marketplace in drydocks. No start and finish points-just go to the station you prefer. Has really helped with backups on our cruises with the new concept.

 

Waits were much shorter. Once people got used to the layout was great. The only line I stood in was the Asian station-always very popular.

We were on the Rotterdam, which recently had a dry dock update. There were no separate stand-alone stations as we have seen on other lines. There were 2 lines on either side of the Lido with different sections, but there was basically one line for the main offerings.

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It's true that some people have poor hygiene practices and some people have very little regard for others. Any time that you are around large numbers of people you take your chances. Like you, I also believe that the best strategy is to try and reduce the risks associated with large crowds. Being served at the buffet on a cruise ship is one way to reduce those risks. (Now if we can only get passengers to stop handing their plates back over the line and stop eating off their plates while stood in the line, two pet peeves of mine).

I agree that a lot of behavior I have seen in buffets make me cringe. I am becoming more "germ aware" the older I get. However, you cannot control the general population, and not everyone behaves at a buffet the way they should. It's unfortunate that good hygiene and manners are lacking in some folks. The suggestion that HAL serve the food is a good one to avoid these situations where folks are behaving badly. It doesn't bother me if I need to return to the buffet several times to get the selections I want, nor does it bother me to be served by staff. I have seen people in the past heap their plates so high that I thought the food would spill onto the floor. It's kind of ridiculous. There is plenty for everyone. But some people are rude and selfish and act like its the last time they will see food for a month. Incredible.

... 'nuff said!! Thanks. (y)(y)(y)

I'm going to go in the opposite direction here, and say that I have never been REALLY worried about this when eating in the HAL Lido. Most of the things I select to eat are actually where they make-it-to-order for you anyhow (such as the pasta-bar). If I were really disgusted by the potential germs in the Lido, then I'd gladly eat my meals in the dining room.

But more then that, I am a traveller and an adventurer (as are many of you) and eat in countries where they would not be able to get a restaurant license in the States or Canada. Street food in the back alleys of Vietnam -- sign me up! It was fantastic. I did not get sick on a route traveling through very poor areas of Thailand-Cambodia-Vietnam despite eating local street food AND in the Lido (self-service and all)! ;)

I'm not dismissing that germs exist and some people do not wash their hands as frequently as I do, or have the courtesy you'd (hope to) expect -- like covering your mouth/nose when sneezing and then washing your hands again (or to sneeze into your sleeve, like the kids in school now learn). But I take far more risks then eating at the buffet. I kiss my family and friends, the French kiss everyone :*, yet we still seem to survive it. I will not be a germaphobe or avoid the Lido. And if they did require servers to handle all the Lido crowds, we certainly would be paying for it. Do you realize how many full-time people would need to be hired? Wouldn't it just be easier to not eat in the Lido if it really disgusts you to have a buffet that is self-serve?

Buffets are very enjoyable for a lot of folks (as I'm sure you have all witnessed, and are sometimes disgusted by), and people do like choosing exactly which croissant, how big a scoop of mashed potatoes, grabbing more of one type of vegetable in a dish etc. I don't have the patience to wait in yet another line either, certainly they would have to extend the meal times to get us all in and out?

Enjoy your cruise and stay healthy in spite of it all!

Stand at any self-serve buffet line and you'll see things you can never unsee. :eek:

It does take longer when they serve you, but with the new Lido Market arrangement and better signage at stations, it isn't too bad. My only real complaint is finding the starting point at each station. For example, the salad station has two starting points, one at each side (marked by tiny signs). That's fine when there are two servers, but when there's only one, where do you stand? The server seems to take people in random order, even serving someone who walks right up to the middle and starts ordering while others are waiting.

I've been on a few HAL cruises where there was a mild noro outbreak. I swear, two people vomit and a HAL ship goes code red. The captain makes frequent update announcements saying "in an abundance of caution." A friend was on Something of the Seas when they had a raging noro outbreak. She said the ship was like a ghost town, with so many people too sick to leave their cabins. The cruise ended a day early so that the ship could have a deep cleaning. My friend thought the ship didn't act on the noro quickly enough when the outbreak started.

I like that HAL doesn't wait until half the ship is sick. They're careful to begin with, especially now that most buffet items are served. And I've been impressed with how quickly they can change practices to step up their anti-noro measures.

My only real complaint is finding the starting point at each station. For example, the salad station has two starting points, one at each side (marked by tiny signs). That's fine when there are two servers, but when there's only one, where do you stand? The server seems to take people in random order, even serving someone who walks right up to the middle and starts ordering while others are waiting.

I agree, it is difficult to navigate the rules of the buffet line. This past cruise there was a line stopped at the bread pudding station (which is self-service), a gap, and then a line for ice cream (where there is a server). I went to the line for ice cream and then the bread-pudding-sloth seemed annoyed that I was now ahead of him for the ice cream. You just can't win!

There is still one place on some HAL ships that has self service. It's the Taco bar outside the Dive-In ordering window. There are containers of all kinds of food, tortillas, taco shells and the goodies that go in them. It's all self-serve. But I have sat at a nearby table and watched a person grab the spoon for the sour cream, load a few dollops on her plate, then proceed to lick the spoon and put it back in the tub of sour cream. We called attention of this to the Dive-In persons and they replaced it immediately. The person who did this couldn't understand what the problem was and was amused by the whole incident.

The older style by-the-slice self-serve pizza in the Lido (before NY Pizza was added) is another area of problems. I waited to grab a few slices and a person in front of me was pulling pepperoni slices off of the pizzas, with her fingers, and adding the extras to her slice on her plate. I guess we are in a #me-first world, and some people are absolute slobs. They eat in public restaurants like they eat at home, and get annoyed to even hostile if you call them on their actions. I'm all for the few minutes delay caused by HAL servers doing the serving. I never had a problem asking for an extra slice of meat or a 2nd scoop of mashed, the HAL servers are happy to get what you want. A few minutes delay in the Lido is far better than 4 days stuck in the bathroom with an intestinal bug.

So, yes, I much prefer HALs way of doing things now. We won't do the buffet thing again, if people are allowed to serve themselves or have access to the serving dishes with their hands. How many people do stick their hands in the food and no one is there to catch them in the act? Sorry, but I just can't go there anymore.

So much agree with this. Thanks HAL! :)

There is still one place on some HAL ships that has self service. It's the Taco bar outside the Dive-In ordering window. There are containers of all kinds of food, tortillas, taco shells and the goodies that go in them. It's all self-serve. But I have sat at a nearby table and watched a person grab the spoon for the sour cream, load a few dollops on her plate, then proceed to lick the spoon and put it back in the tub of sour cream. We called attention of this to the Dive-In persons and they replaced it immediately. The person who did this couldn't understand what the problem was and was amused by the whole incident.

The older style by-the-slice self-serve pizza in the Lido (before NY Pizza was added) is another area of problems. I waited to grab a few slices and a person in front of me was pulling pepperoni slices off of the pizzas, with her fingers, and adding the extras to her slice on her plate. I guess we are in a #me-first world, and some people are absolute slobs. They eat in public restaurants like they eat at home, and get annoyed to even hostile if you call them on their actions. I'm all for the few minutes delay caused by HAL servers doing the serving. I never had a problem asking for an extra slice of meat or a 2nd scoop of mashed, the HAL servers are happy to get what you want. A few minutes delay in the Lido is far better than 4 days stuck in the bathroom with an intestinal bug.

Good Lord, it is disgusting what you see sometimes when among the general public. If I witnessed those two "examples" of behavior I would have been horrified, as I am sure you were. You did the right thing by notifying the staff. It's unbelievable what people will do, and the nightmare of all this is that they don't feel they are doing anything wrong. My mother raised me to be clean and neat, and to have proper manners and hygiene. I don't know if it is a lack of upbringing....maybe they were dragged up instead of raised up, as they say, or if it is just a general rule of disregard for rules of any kind, or having no regard for others, or just being self-centered. I don't know. I have seen some bad behaviors in the buffet, but the sour cream spoon licking and pepperoni pilfering are new ones to me. I never cease to be amazed by people's experiences! I just hope some folks out there see themselves in your post and just make it stop....for the benefit of all of us!

I found it quite interesting that aboard NCL ships, there are crew members at every entrance to the Garden Cafe (Lido) with spray bottles of hand sanitizer. You can not pass without having your hands sprayed. Its the same concept when you board the ship. There are sanitizer stations all over the ship. Just a observation on the topic of hygiene;)

I will be the first to admit that I was leery of the wait with the new Lido Market. I found service quick on both the Westerdam and the Rotterdam.

No long lines, no biggie at all. Now, maybe I chose the right time to go but it was pretty well organized IMO.

I think the longest I waited at the salad bar (which was very popular) was 7 minutes on a busy day.

Much faster than when they used to have the 48 hour code "orange" for the first 2 days on board. JMO though.

They don't seem to push the hand sanitizer as much any more.

Allan

Hand sanitizers have not proven very effective and may be counter-productive since many assume they have some sort of magical power. Washing hands remains the best since this option is the readily available option. Check the CDC website for more specific information about the use of hand sanitizers as a precaution against travel sickness. When they are helpful and when they are not.