Is "class" cruising coming back

Solo, cheapo traveler here. I have very mixed feelings about you Haven people (smile) On one hand, I appreciate the fact that you are willing to pay $7000-10,000 for a room for a week and book that room 2 years in advance because that exact room is that important to you. That allows me to pay $359 for my inside sail away room for the same departure. Are you getting 20-30 times more the experience than I? I don't think so- you might. As someone mentioned upthread earlier, I buy a spa pass. I spend the week in the thermal suite and find my bliss. That makes me a bad revenue passenger- I don't go to the casino or shop in the stores or go to the art auctions- I just float there in the bubble tub and smile. I listen to Haven folks here discuss how much to tip the butler and how disappointed/angry/upset they were that they were not properly recognized by a bartender for being a Haven guest and that they were not given priority seating to (fill in the blank). To someone like me, that complaint sounds self indulgent and snotty, but to the person who paid 30 times my fare, they likely felt justified.

 

Different perspectives.

 

As far as paying double, etc- I sailed solo on MSC years ago with no problems. Now there are a number of people with stories about how they can't book on that line as a solo or the solo trip is that much more expensive. Guess what? Same on Carnival and Royal Caribbean. The easiest, most sane way is to simply approach a solo booking as the cost of the cabin for the trip rather than per person. After all, you buy the hotel room and the car- you don't pay by the bed or the seat. NCL offers some amazing deals to solos and downright steals fi you can go last minute. I did a cruise on the Pearl for $50 a day. You can't eat for $50 a day on vacation, much less a room and transportation.

As someone who can afford the Haven and is very much the target market for it (fly first and business class, eat Michelin restaurants etc)... I agree with you. You don't get value in the Haven that justifies the price. Especially on NCL. A regular cabin is perfecrly nice and we thought the specialty dining was much better than Haven restaurant. The Haven bar is arguably the worst bar on the ship, too. Enclosed, tiny in a lobby next to concierge.. Whoopie. I'd buy a spa pass and specialty dining with a regular room. It's pretty much what we do now.

Some people just eat up the feeling of being exclusive and will pay top dollar for it. Sit at the crappy bar because they know other cruisers can't.

It's really a testament to how good cruising is. They just can't offer enough with suites to make it worth it. It offers basically nothing that memorably enhances our experience. So we save $5k and sail regular cabins.

Using the word "class" the way the OP does suggests a social caste rather than the financial transaction of purchasing an optional higher level of luxury for non-essential travel.

It's not as though anyone *has* to travel on a cruise as a means to a needed destination. The cruise ship is as important as the ports and is the actual "destination" for many. So, for me, while I can't rationalize flying first class because the airline flight is only the means to get to my chosen destination, I CAN accept spending more than the basic rate for what matters to me after the plane ride.

But again, it's about the money I'm willing to spend to go above the basic yet still damn grand level (which we should also remember is beyond the means of many).

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I know about the "double cost" for solo travelers (same price as if two people sailed).

 

But what is this about "triple"?

 

Also, the so-called "sale price" is THE "price". No one ever pays the "brochure price" (which makes that advertising, to us anyway, either absurd or seriously misrepresenting the "real" price).

 

Is it different outside the USA (I assume from your post)?

 

GC

I have paid "brochure price" for all my cruises.

I know about the "double cost" for solo travelers (same price as if two people sailed).

 

But what is this about "triple"?

 

Also, the so-called "sale price" is THE "price". No one ever pays the "brochure price" (which makes that advertising, to us anyway, either absurd or seriously misrepresenting the "real" price).

 

Is it different outside the USA (I assume from your post)?

 

GC

GC, the cruiseline was Cunard NYC to London. Sale price was under $900 pp double occupancy. Quote for 1 passenger was $2790.

"I bet if an NCL ship ever sinks the people on the lower decks will be locked below like on the Titanic. I heard a rumor the Haven has their own dedicated lifeboat with better rations stored on board and an emergency butler.

Funny you mention that because while not in the Haven as Dawn does not have one, I am in an Owners Suite and heard that I could tip my Butler $50, hand them my key cards, and he would "attend" the life boat drill for us, so we would not have to associate with the "rabble". We will be escorted to our own private lifeboat in the case of evacuation anyway so why actually attend the life boat drill??:rolleyes::rolleyes::');p

Excellent example!! And I couldn't agree with you more. When I started teaching I made less than that!! and I sailed in on OV cabin bc it was commiserate with what I could afford for my hard work. Fast forward many years later to my current standing as a school principal...I still travel commiserate with what I can afford.

As you were a teacher and are a school principal, I hope that you intended to use "commensurate" and that "commiserate" was an auto-correct error. Though I will happily commiserate with you about being a working stiff;)

Using the word "class" the way the OP does suggests a social caste rather than the financial transaction of purchasing an optional higher level of luxury for non-essential travel.

I disagree with your interpretation. In the heyday of cruise liners, ships often had three or even four "classes" of travel. They were distinguished by price, not social status. A butcher made good could sail in first class if he had the funds. An earl who lost everything in the stock market crash would sail in third class if he couldn't afford a more expensive ticket.

While first class cabins would be larger and have better furnishings, and first class passengers would have better food, the true distinguishing feature of "classed" sailing was that passengers in different classes were completely segregated from each other on the ship. Separate dining rooms, separate lounges, separate promenades, outdoor spaces and pools (when available). Third class passengers weren't allowed into first class areas, and first class passengers weren't supposed to go into third class areas.

I have been wondering if class cruising is coming back? That is are we as a society going back to first class, second class, and steerage. With the increase in perks for suites, haven, restricted areas becoming the norm are we that far away from separate dinning, pool area etc.

My interpretation of OP's concern is that our society is becoming so unequal that we are returning to de jure segregation (on financial wherewithal, not social class) rather just de facto segregation.

and first class passengers weren't supposed to go into third class areas.

On NCL many "third class" passengers don't want the "first class", Haven, passengers to book VIBE so that still exists!

Of course, there are different classes on cruising. It was sort of demanded by the customer base. It goes back awhile with airlines, then demand for ala carte cable packages. People do not want to pay for things they don't use. Also at the same time, there is a segment of the customer base that also wants upscale amenities, minimal kids running around making lots of noise. If people are willing to pay more for more exclusive accommodations then so be it.

As a historian and one who has studied the ship experience of millions of immigrants, I see more similarities than differences on this subject.

If you were a first class passenger on a steamship in 1906 (or a modern cruiser in the Haven), you would have of course had better food, service, and cabins.

Also, first-class passengers were kept segregated from steerage class folks at all times. Today, segregation can sometimes be accomplished if you wish to stay exclusively in the Haven, eat at Haven restaurants, etc. The comparison falls apart today in areas like the casino, gift shops, and bars/lounges.

Haven people who wish to use the MDR or main pool can hang out with all the other passengers. Haven folks can also walk all the cabin hallways. In 1906, the first class passengers were banned from "touring" steerage areas. It seems that steerage class folks were more of a spectacle for the first class passengers, and condescending airs must have been heavy as the first class passengers walked through observing the wretched masses. I guess even the rich became bored on their two-week journey.

For passengers in 1906, the ships' doctor and crew would have processed first and second class passengers on the ship before they reached port in the USA (usually Ellis Island), and those passengers could immediately walk off the ship to the city or train station.

The steerage passengers had to go through Ellis Island for an interview and medical inspection. The worst part was the doctors using a button hook to look under the eyelid to check for contagious eye diseases. The doctor sanitized the hook by wiping it on his uniform. If that eye disease was found, the passenger would be sent back at the expense of the shipping company. The US government didn't want LPC's "likely public charges" to enter the USA. The first and second class passengers weren't subjected to that procedure.

Disembarkation today is made easier and accomplished by Haven folks who receive help from a porter. They can often go directly to the customer's officers and not wait in line. Also, for excursions, the Haven/suite people have special lines giving them priority in tendering.

There are subtle distinctions in classifying people today. Of course, anyone can purchase a Haven cabin, but the wealthy passengers have ways to discern who is of a "higher class."

I've been in the Haven with a butler, Haven dining and pool, etc., but have no problems with sailing in an inside cabin. I'm more comfortable in steerage with the masses.

As you were a teacher and are a school principal, I hope that you intended to use "commensurate" and that "commiserate" was an auto-correct error. Though I will happily commiserate with you about being a working stiff;)

Ahh, gosh...good catch. Darn auto correct :D:D Does it help to know that I was a math teacher?;p

Nope. Has nothing to do with your social class. It's all about dollars and your choice!

 

Something for everybody.

 

It seems this question gets asked every now and again by folks who either do not want to pay or can't afford but begrudge those that can and do.

 

I cruise suites and Haven. I am middle class. Just, at my age, have made good financial choices. The Haven is full of people like me.

 

The super high class is on Regent, Crystal, Silversea, etc. or on their own or leased yacht.

 

 

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Best explanation I’ve heard.

Not sure why it matters to some if others pay more to get a better vacation experience. You see it all the time in the hotel industry. You can pay for Motel 6, in a dicey neighborhood. Or, you can stay at the Four Seasons, in a great part of the city with a much higher level of service and luxury.

The ONLY Haven Cabins I’ve ever seen that go for the $7K-$10K often thrown out as pricing are on the newest NCL ship and for much bigger Haven Cabins (like Garden Villas).

I’ve NEVER spent more than about $4K for my Haven Suites. While not on the latest ships, I spent around $3K for an Aft Suite (complete with Butler, Concierge, SDP, UBP, internet, etc) on the GEM several months ago.

Has nothing to do with the Caste System. You want an inside GTY cabin with no perks, you can get one....cheap!

If you want more than that, it costs more.

That’s true of ALL the mainstream lines.

I have been wondering if class cruising is coming back? That is are we as a society going back to first class, second class, and steerage. With the increase in perks for suites, haven, restricted areas becoming the norm are we that far away from separate dinning, pool area etc.

Not sure of my feelings on this, just wondering what others are thinking

:) I don’t think so.

They let ME hang out with the captain. :cool:

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Best explanation I’ve heard.

 

 

 

Not sure why it matters to some if others pay more to get a better vacation experience. You see it all the time in the hotel industry. You can pay for Motel 6, in a dicey neighborhood. Or, you can stay at the Four Seasons, in a great part of the city with a much higher level of service and luxury.

 

 

 

The ONLY Haven Cabins I’ve ever seen that go for the $7K-$10K often thrown out as pricing are on the newest NCL ship and for much bigger Haven Cabins (like Garden Villas).

 

 

 

I’ve NEVER spent more than about $4K for my Haven Suites. While not on the latest ships, I spent around $3K for an Aft Suite (complete with Butler, Concierge, SDP, UBP, internet, etc) on the GEM several months ago.

 

 

 

Has nothing to do with the Caste System. You want an inside GTY cabin with no perks, you can get one....cheap!

 

 

 

If you want more than that, it costs more.

 

 

 

That’s true of ALL the mainstream lines.

I agree. Reminds me of this...

I remember my mother and I cruised on (my favorite) NCL Sun 14 nights in an aft penthouse.

We met 2 college aged girls who booked last minute in an inside cabin for 10% of the cost of what we had paid. They explained it was cheaper to cruise from Santiago to Buenos Aires than fly. They had the free time and 2 weeks of meals and entertainment were a bonus. Their only extra cost was the DSC which was less than they would have spent on eating at home.

So? Both of us had trips that delighted us. Very different costs and experiences but worthwhile.

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I think folks bringing these issues to the forum are more worried about cost than class.

I was first attracted to NCL because of the anytime dining and the non formal atmosphere aka you do not have to wear a suit or slacks to dinner.

Now when NCL started adding in perks at little to no extra cost like drink and dining packages it attracted a lot of folks on here who turned into NCL fan boys. Well now everything has caught up. Fares are above or the same as Celebrity and Royal. Given the Choice between the 3 at the same cost will even the playing field ( the days of cheap Haven access are over.) So the former standard balcony cruiser is going back to being what they were no Suite.

NCL seems to want a certain client that will pay extra for everything they do not want a ship full of folks that only participate in included food and festivities.

As for me I will go with the best bang for the buck I like to cruise at least twice a year. I am not going to go just to go either.I have to have certain things when cruising.

I always get the drink package and reserve some special dining. with at least a balcony. If I could not afford this I would find something else to do on vacation.

A lot of the frugal or people that can not afford NCL new price model went on to MSC to get what they used to get at a better price maybe you should look into that.

 

The ONLY Haven Cabins I’ve ever seen that go for the $7K-$10K often thrown out as pricing are on the newest NCL ship and for much bigger Haven Cabins (like Garden Villas).

 

I’ve NEVER spent more than about $4K for my Haven Suites. While not on the latest ships, I spent around $3K for an Aft Suite (complete with Butler, Concierge, SDP, UBP, internet, etc) on the GEM several months ago.

We wanted to cruise in the Mediterranean on the Epic last summer but thought that almost $9000 for a Haven courtyard suite was too much so we cruised on MSC Meraviglia instead.

I think folks bringing these issues to the forum are more worried about cost than class.

I was first attracted to NCL because of the anytime dining and the non formal atmosphere aka you do not have to wear a suit or slacks to dinner.

 

Now when NCL started adding in perks at little to no extra cost like drink and dining packages it attracted a lot of folks on here who turned into NCL fan boys. Well now everything has caught up. Fares are above or the same as Celebrity and Royal. Given the Choice between the 3 at the same cost will even the playing field ( the days of cheap Haven access are over.) So the former standard balcony cruiser is going back to being what they were no Suite.

 

NCL seems to want a certain client that will pay extra for everything they do not want a ship full of folks that only participate in included food and festivities.

 

As for me I will go with the best bang for the buck I like to cruise at least twice a year. I am not going to go just to go either.I have to have certain things when cruising.

I always get the drink package and reserve some special dining. with at least a balcony. If I could not afford this I would find something else to do on vacation.

 

A lot of the frugal or people that can not afford NCL new price model went on to MSC to get what they used to get at a better price maybe you should look into that.

I'd have to agree.

I'm a recent 1st time NCL cruiser. I actually preferred the "traditional" style of cruising, but agree that "freestyle" can be nice when you don't want to plan or pack much. NCL's rep for value also had me intrigued. We can afford Haven. We just vehemently are opposed to paying that much as it's not in our personal value "sweet spot". Spoiled by other past cruise lines.

Just cruised too late with NCL. It's fully into the airline "extra fees" mode now. Too many cutbacks. Value WITH luxury was what attracted me to cruising in the first place. NCL used to be one of the top value lines, if not THE top value line. But by the time I actually got around to sailing, it's not anymore. I'll have to do some calculations, but just from base fare, I paid about as much for this past NCL cruise as I did on my last Disney cruise. Other than a newer ship, which isn't that big a deal as Disney maintains their ships really well and the Bliss has some design missteps, NCL can NOT compete with Disney overall in terms of a cruising experience.

Don't get me wrong. I liked my NCL cruise. I'm still gonna consider NCL. It's just that I'm only going to look at their ultra discounted fares. I'm quite sure that once I add up all the "extras" I ended up paying for, it cost me more to go on the Bliss than it did on the Disney cruise. It's definitely not a class thing. If anything, modern mass market cruising is the great equalizer. Like a previous poster said, real first class types sail on the smaller premium lines or on private yachts.

We wanted to cruise in the Mediterranean on the Epic last summer but thought that almost $9000 for a Haven courtyard suite was too much so we cruised on MSC Meraviglia instead.

Not sure what’s going on in EU. That’s 2X+ the price we pay to sail North America!

I agree that this is way more about cost than "class". We are working class, and our last cruise prior to the one we just took was 3 years ago. Since then, we'd been on exactly 2 short vacations with our daughter (3-4 nights). While planning our most recent cruise, we decided to get a suite as we enjoy the space, the "extras", etc. We are not "upper class" at home, nor do we pretend to be on the cruise. It's simply our preference and we are willing to pay that premium to have that experience.

Having said that, we've only ever cruised on the Dawn (no Haven) so I don't have experience with the "ship within a ship" concept that Haven seems to offer. If I cruised on a Haven ship, I could see us choosing a suite that wasn't in the Haven "area".

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Not sure what’s going on in EU. That’s 2X+ the price we pay to sail North America!

It was not that expensive a few years ago.

I just hate it that some folks have more money than me. I think someone should pass a law making success illegal. I don't think we should all be the same but no one should have more than me. I also hate all those folks that are younger and better looking.

I just hate it that some folks have more money than me. I think someone should pass a law making success illegal. I don't think we should all be the same but no one should have more than me. I also hate all those folks that are younger and better looking.

I just hate it that some folks have more money than me. I think someone should pass a law making success illegal. I don't think we should all be the same but no one should have more than me. .

No need to pass any law. Just vote socialists in the next election and all of the above will become a reality.

I think that the class system is coming back. I prefer sailing on cruise lines now where outside of your cabin everyone is the same.

No need to pass any law. Just vote socialists in the next election and all of the above will become a reality.

Socialism is only working that way in countries where the people aren't voting or where they only can vote on the socialists!