contactless payment cards?

In Canada our credit cards have PIN numbers, where we have to enter a 4 number PIN number to complete a transaction.

 

Is this the same as a contactless payment card?

 

Will I be able to use my credit card on the bus if I run out of money on my Oyster card?

No - that's "chip and pin".

 

"Contactless" cards work just by close proximity to a reader - no PIN or any other authorisation required. A contactless card usually has a little symbol showing four curved lines on the opposite end to the chip.

 

In Canada our credit cards have PIN numbers, where we have to enter a 4 number PIN number to complete a transaction.

 

Is this the same as a contactless payment card?

 

Will I be able to use my credit card on the bus if I run out of money on my Oyster card?

 

Most Canadian Credit cards and debit cards now have the contactless pay option. You just touch the card to the terminal and your primary account is automatically charged.

No - that's "chip and pin".

 

"Contactless" cards work just by close proximity to a reader - no PIN or any other authorisation required. A contactless card usually has a little symbol showing four curved lines on the opposite end to the chip.

 

 

Most Canadian cards now come with the tap and pay option. The individual cards have to activated for this. All my cards have this feature active. The only draw back is that you should use and RFI proof wallet to block access to the card. Crooks can read these cards in your wallet or purse.

 

Will I be able to use my credit card on the bus if I run out of money on my Oyster card?

 

Contactless is accepted on London Buses, you simply "Touch In" with the contactless credit card instead of your Oyster Card. It should be noted that a London bus journey will be £1.50 irrespective of whether you travel one stop or twenty stops. The difference with Oyster Card/Contactless Credit Card is that Oysters have a daily charge cap but credit cards do not. Whether your credit card company do a foreign exchange transaction charge per use is another thing to think about but as a safety net you do not intend to generally use could negate the problem with short term use until you top up the Oyster.

 

Regards John

I use a protective RFID sleeve on my cards no special wallet required

I got a pack at the TV showcase store or you can find them in luggage stores or online

I got a RFID wallet because all my cars including driver license are problematic.

I have them for my credit cards and my passport, picked them up at CAA.

Crooks can read these cards in your wallet or purse.

 

And even if they could, which is extremely doubtful, what are they going to do with the information.

 

To use the contactless information they would need a merchant account with a card company, and as soon as the fraud reports roll in they get shut down.

 

Meanwhile the bank has a responsibility to refund you for any fraudulent transactions on your card.

 

If you want to steal money from credit cards there are many easier ways.

And even if they could, which is extremely doubtful, what are they going to do with the information.

 

To use the contactless information they would need a merchant account with a card company, and as soon as the fraud reports roll in they get shut down.

 

Meanwhile the bank has a responsibility to refund you for any fraudulent transactions on your card.

 

 

Yes they can read the RF chip quite easily. With the data off the chip they can easily duplicate for online purchases or produce matching card. Bank cards carry all your banking and credit card info.

Yes they can read the RF chip quite easily. With the data off the chip they can easily duplicate for online purchases or produce matching card. Bank cards carry all your banking and credit card info.

 

The CVV isn't in the RF data so you can't use it for online purchases (unless the retailer is reckless and wants to swallow any losses), and anyway the bank is still liable for any fraud.

Most Canadian cards now come with the tap and pay option. The individual cards have to activated for this. All my cards have this feature active. The only draw back is that you should use and RFI proof wallet to block access to the card. Crooks can read these cards in your wallet or purse.

 

I have often read about this as a theoretical possibility; I don't read much about people who lost money this way.

Contactless is accepted on London Buses, you simply "Touch In" with the contactless credit card instead of your Oyster Card. It should be noted that a London bus journey will be £1.50 irrespective of whether you travel one stop or twenty stops.

It's also worth noting that now that the Hopper is fully implemented, you can change buses/trams as many times as you like within one hour from the original touch-in for one £1.50 fare.

 

The difference with Oyster Card/Contactless Credit Card is that Oysters have a daily charge cap but credit cards do not.

Payment with a contactless card has the same daily capping as Oyster. In addition, if you pay with contactless, then there is an additional cap that is applied to all your spend in any calendar week (Monday-Sunday). So in some circumstances, you are capped at a lower amount using contactless than you would be using Oyster.

 

However, as a confirmed Oyster user, I have to really hammer the card for six or days to get over the weekly cap, so I tend to regard that as a bit of a gimmick.

 

Whether your credit card company do a foreign exchange transaction charge per use is another thing to think about but as a safety net you do not intend to generally use could negate the problem with short term use until you top up the Oyster.

A foreign visitor is likely to have to pay a forex charge whichever route they use to paying the GBP cost of travel on TfL. It'll either be the credit/debit card's forex charge for the purchases, or it'll be a money changer's commission for changing cash, or it'll be the bank's forex charge for withdrawing cash from an ATM. So much of this ends up being swings and roundabouts.

I have often read about this as a theoretical possibility; I don't read much about people who lost money this way.

Ditto for passports: if anyone wanted to have the information from your passport, they'd be better off stealing your passport because the RFID information is useless without the physical passport, and once they've got that, the RFID information gives them no further information.

 

But there are undoubtedly a lot of people making good money out of unsubstantiated scare stories.

I 'think' that TfL charge the contactless trips as one charge per day so the forex fees issue is lessened for overseas users.

 

Personally, I have my pay-as-you-go Oyster so I do not do this contactless thing (but I'm a bit of a Luddite in such things).

 

Also, if your journey on the tube is delayed by (I think) 30 minutes then you can reclaim the fare - not many people know that.

The CVV isn't in the RF data so you can't use it for online purchases (unless the retailer is reckless and wants to swallow any losses), and anyway the bank is still liable for any fraud.

 

Well, yes, the card owner gets reimbursed--but the bank and/or the store that's out the money for the products then raises prices on all of us.

 

I'd rather try to prevent fraud in the first place.

I 'think' that TfL charge the contactless trips as one charge per day so the forex fees issue is lessened for overseas users.

 

Personally, I have my pay-as-you-go Oyster so I do not do this contactless thing (but I'm a bit of a Luddite in such things).

 

Also, if your journey on the tube is delayed by (I think) 30 minutes then you can reclaim the fare - not many people know that.

The forex fee is usually a percentage, so it doesn't really matter whether it's a daily charge of £6.00 or a periodic top-up charge of (say) £40.00 (if for example topping-up a pre-pay Oyster).

 

There are several reasons that I keep using my Oyster rather than moving to contactless. One is only having to deal with a periodic charge to my credit card instead of a daily one, but on a more practical basis, the readers read Oysters much faster than they read contactless cards, which makes it faster to pass through the gates or walk past a standalone reader. (Phone payments are typically even slower than contactless; I wish TfL had never gone down the road of pandering to the phone addicts.)

 

The Service Delay Refund actually kicks in at 15 minutes. However, I have discovered that you actually have to be on board for 15 extra minutes or more. In theory, the SDR does not pay if the trains are only slightly delayed but are consequently so packed that it is impossible to board any of them for more than 15 minutes. Fortunately, I've never had to have the argument since the day that I discovered this (when TfL gave me the SDR anyway).

The forex fee is usually a percentage, so it doesn't really matter whether it's a daily charge of £6.00 or a periodic top-up charge of (say) £40.00 (if for example topping-up a pre-pay Oyster).

 

There are several reasons that I keep using my Oyster rather than moving to contactless. One is only having to deal with a periodic charge to my credit card instead of a daily one, but on a more practical basis, the readers read Oysters much faster than they read contactless cards, which makes it faster to pass through the gates or walk past a standalone reader. (Phone payments are typically even slower than contactless; I wish TfL had never gone down the road of pandering to the phone addicts.)

 

After reading here and on the London Sightseeing thread, I think I'm just going to pickup a couple of Oyster cards at Heathrow.

 

Thanks for all the help.

The forex fee is usually a percentage, so it doesn't really matter whether it's a daily charge of £6.00 or a periodic top-up charge of (say) £40.00 (if for example topping-up a pre-pay Oyster).

 

There are several reasons that I keep using my Oyster rather than moving to contactless. One is only having to deal with a periodic charge to my credit card instead of a daily one, but on a more practical basis, the readers read Oysters much faster than they read contactless cards, which makes it faster to pass through the gates or walk past a standalone reader. (Phone payments are typically even slower than contactless; I wish TfL had never gone down the road of pandering to the phone addicts.)

 

The Service Delay Refund actually kicks in at 15 minutes. However, I have discovered that you actually have to be on board for 15 extra minutes or more. In theory, the SDR does not pay if the trains are only slightly delayed but are consequently so packed that it is impossible to board any of them for more than 15 minutes. Fortunately, I've never had to have the argument since the day that I discovered this (when TfL gave me the SDR anyway).

 

I agree with why you should stick with the Oyster card (also I do not like having to get my wallet out to retrieve a payment card in a crowded tube station).

 

I'm not sure about the having to be on board rule though (I guess you have to have tapped in to enter the system maybe?). I thought they looked at time in and time out compared to the expected journey time. For instance, I froze my butt off on Finchley Road station platform for 30 minutes during the snowy spell - the refund came through within 48 hours.

Well, yes, the card owner gets reimbursed--but the bank and/or the store that's out the money for the products then raises prices on all of us.

 

I'd rather try to prevent fraud in the first place.

The bank won't lose because there have been no recorded incidents where card details have been stolen and misused in this manner.

 

If you wanted to stop card fraud then you would withdraw all the magnetic strip cards with only a signature and replace them with chip and PIN, but American banks have been surprisingly reluctant.

 

The only people making money out of the theoretical RF fraud are the people selling the fancy wallets.

I agree with why you should stick with the Oyster card (also I do not like having to get my wallet out to retrieve a payment card in a crowded tube station).

 

Yeah if I'm going to lose something I'd rather it not be a credit card. And if oyster is faster win-win

I'm not sure about the having to be on board rule though (I guess you have to have tapped in to enter the system maybe?). I thought they looked at time in and time out compared to the expected journey time. For instance, I froze my butt off on Finchley Road station platform for 30 minutes during the snowy spell - the refund came through within 48 hours.

True - I suppose that what they meant was that if the trains are actually running more-or-less normally but are too busy to board, you're not supposed to get a SDR. It makes sense, because they have no way of checking whether you're telling the truth then. On the other hand, if weather means that the trains are not running properly, then they can check that whether not you were actually on board a train at the time.

 

I got my SDR anyway on that occasion!

 

My sympathy for the getting frozen during the delay. There but for the grace of God - fortunately, when I was stuck for 45 minutes on one of the cold days I managed to get myself trapped on board a DLR train rather than on a platform.

And if oyster is faster win-win

I'd better not oversell this.

 

Oyster - read time typically about 30 milliseconds. Contactless - usually (by observation) between 10 and 20 times that duration.

 

This difference is enough to annoy me because it can mean the difference between having to break my stride when walking through a gate or past a reader, and not having to do so. But I suspect that an occasional user probably won't notice that.

 

It's the phone reading that is another 10 times that duration, or a perhaps a hundred times longer than the read of an Oyster. Everyone notices that.

I'd better not oversell this.

 

Oyster - read time typically about 30 milliseconds. Contactless - usually (by observation) between 10 and 20 times that duration.

 

 

I knew what you meant, thanks.

Where do you top up the Oyster card?

 

Can you use cash to top up the Oyster card?

 

I have an Oyster Card left over from a past trip, I want to make sure I have enough on it before I use it on the bus.. Where and how do I check the balance?

 

 

We will be staying at the Premier Inn Waterloo.