Shootout in Cabo??

[Laughing Angel]

Okay, I don't like hearing this...

 

 

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/n/a/2011/10/29/international/i170039D44.DTL&tsp=1

 

Hoping this is an isolated incident/anomaly. Anybody got any information?

[39august]

Why are you apologizing? This story was in our newspaper today. It immediately made me wonder about cruises to Cabo. I have always felt Cabo was very safe as it is primarily just a tourist site.

[Banditswife]

I too felt very safe in Cabo. Even if this is in wrong area of board, still interesting to cruisers.

[Laughing Angel]

I'm apologizing because I posted this on the wrong board (and because I am so anal retentive, it is tearing me up inside). :(

 

Most message boards with this set up allow the option to delete posts. Apparently, the administrators of Cruise Critic have turned off that option (C'mon admins--you mean I'm stuck with my stupid mistake forever??)

 

Back to the topic: I've always felt quite safe in Cabo. That's why this story surprised me. No additional information has been released since the initial AP news story yesterday, and that seems strange to me.

[lovevacadays]

I'm apologizing because I posted this on the wrong board (and because I am so anal retentive, it is tearing me up inside). :(

 

Most message boards with this set up allow the option to delete posts. Apparently, the administrators of Cruise Critic have turned off that option (C'mon admins--you mean I'm stuck with my stupid mistake forever??)

 

Back to the topic: I've always felt quite safe in Cabo. That's why this story surprised me. No additional information has been released since the initial AP news story yesterday, and that seems strange to me.

 

It is certainly sad to hear about this in Cabo as I sail there often. But, these things can happen anywhere. We had a shooting in Seal Beach, California a few weeks back at a beauty salon that killed 8 people. But, I can imagine that this happening in Cabo could potentially take it off cruise itineraries just as it happened in Mazatlan and Puerto Vallarta.

[lappy22]

This happened in a shopping center in the northern part of the city, not in the tourist area. Something that can happen just about anywhere.

[babies12]

It is certainly sad to hear about this in Cabo as I sail there often. But, these things can happen anywhere. We had a shooting in Seal Beach, California a few weeks back at a beauty salon that killed 8 people. But, I can imagine that this happening in Cabo could potentially take it off cruise itineraries just as it happened in Mazatlan and Puerto Vallarta.

 

Exactly! That shooting in Seal Beach was horrible, I guess I better not venture down there anymore as it's just not safe. Look, Cabo is just fine, and still safe, safer than most cities I live nearby. I just hope some people don't start running amuck screaming aloud the "sky is falling" because IT'S NOT! I plan on going there on a land based vacation next Spring!

[scdreamer]

I understand how scary this can sound to tourists, particularly cruise ship passengers, who tend to be more insulated than overland independent travelers, but I believe it's important to acknowledge that there are instances of gang (and other) violence in many places outside Mexico, and we don't seem to hear "I won't set foot in California/New York/etc."

 

Very little of the drug and gang violence in Mexico affects tourists, but blanket statements of fear ruin economies, and do affect the lives of many innocent families who are dependent on tourism, whether directly or indirectly.

 

I love Mexico and the Mexican people, and it makes me sad to know that tourists are avoiding ports there, and the country's mostly good and hardworking population is suffering. I also think it is important to remember the big picture: that most of the Mexican drug traffickers are catering to users who are NOT Mexican, but rather reside in the United States.

 

My husband and I regularly travel in Mexico, and we feel safer there than in many cities here in the United States. We spent three weeks traveling by car on the back roads of the Yucatan last spring, and had an amazing time. This coming March, we will be taking a two-and-a-half week trip to Mexico City and Oaxaca, and we are again looking forward to a wonderful experience.

 

While I love the cruising experience (have cruised Mexico, Europe, Alaska), it provides very little authentic interaction with the culture and people of other countries. Being afraid to "set foot" in another country based solely on a CNN article is a sad thing in my opinion. It would be like never visiting the United States because of crime reports and statistics from any big city.

 

Common sense, being self aware, and choosing where and when to be in various places is the key.

__________________

[big green]

I understand how scary this can sound to tourists, particularly cruise ship passengers, who tend to be more insulated than overland independent travelers, but I believe it's important to acknowledge that there are instances of gang (and other) violence in many places outside Mexico, and we don't seem to hear "I won't set foot in California/New York/etc."

 

Very little of the drug and gang violence in Mexico affects tourists, but blanket statements of fear ruin economies, and do affect the lives of many innocent families who are dependent on tourism, whether directly or indirectly.

 

I love Mexico and the Mexican people, and it makes me sad to know that tourists are avoiding ports there, and the country's mostly good and hardworking population is suffering. I also think it is important to remember the big picture: that most of the Mexican drug traffickers are catering to users who are NOT Mexican, but rather reside in the United States.

 

My husband and I regularly travel in Mexico, and we feel safer there than in many cities here in the United States. We spent three weeks traveling by car on the back roads of the Yucatan last spring, and had an amazing time. This coming March, we will be taking a two-and-a-half week trip to Mexico City and Oaxaca, and we are again looking forward to a wonderful experience.

 

While I love the cruising experience (have cruised Mexico, Europe, Alaska), it provides very little authentic interaction with the culture and people of other countries. Being afraid to "set foot" in another country based solely on a CNN article is a sad thing in my opinion. It would be like never visiting the United States because of crime reports and statistics from any big city.

 

Common sense, being self aware, and choosing where and when to be in various places is the key.

__________________

 

 

Totally disagree with you and we live next to the border in San diego--violence from Mexico has spilled over into San Diego--there are plenty of other places to see and travel to---and I have been to Mexico many, many times--but now the environment there calls for myself to not to travel to Mexico period.

 

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[riffatsea]

Here in California we have had shootings at:

schools,McDonalds,hairdressers,freeway overpass, and on the local streets.

In Arizona there was a shooting a few months ago outside of a grocery store!

Does that mean that all tourists should avoid Arizona and California?? I think not!!

BTW I believe folks in Arizona can carry concealed weapons on the street. This did not protect anyone during the supermarket shooting!

[CWcruisers]

Totally disagree with you and we live next to the border in San diego--violence from Mexico has spilled over into San Diego--there are plenty of other places to see and travel to---and I have been to Mexico many, many times--but now the environment there calls for myself to not to travel to Mexico period.

 

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If American's would stop buying drugs and supplying guns, it would help alot.

 

Do you realize that what will happen is that all cruise lines will leave the West Coast. Is this really what you want? Royal Caribbean and NCL have already left.

 

Why boycott an entire country for the behavior of a few? And why loose the future potential income for both sides of the border when the last of the cruise ships leave us for good because people are not using common sense and listening to the overhyped media.

[Laughing Angel]

I would still feel safe in Cabo San Lucas. While it is the most "americanized" of all the stops on the Mexican Riviera, it's a beautiful port of call with many friendly people and lots to see and do.

 

As was stated earlier, this sort of thing could happen anywhere. Unfortunately, it's just a symptom of the times we live in.

[lovevacadays]

Totally disagree with you and we live next to the border in San diego--violence from Mexico has spilled over into San Diego--there are plenty of other places to see and travel to---and I have been to Mexico many, many times--but now the environment there calls for myself to not to travel to Mexico period.

 

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Yep, as reported most of the major drug violence is in border towns in Mexico (San Diego borders Mexico) and not in the tourist areas such as Cabo San Lucas and Puerto Vallarta.

 

I lived in San Diego for 5 years and there was definitely areas in San Diego County I wouldn't venture to at night or sometimes even during the day.

[Nikki Lisette]

My family plans on staying on the ship in Ensenada. Last time

we did the Bufadora trip in a jaloopy bus and I had my doubts

I'd make it home safely. LOL.

 

What's Christmas like in Ensenada?

[lovevacadays]

My family plans on staying on the ship in Ensenada. Last time

we did the Bufadora trip in a jaloopy bus and I had my doubts

I'd make it home safely. LOL.

 

What's Christmas like in Ensenada?

 

Hi, Not sure what Christmas is like there. If you do want a little time off the ship just take a taxi or if there's a shuttle to the main part of town which is one long street of shops and restaurants. I've been there a few times and felt perfectly safe.

[CWcruisers]

What's Christmas like in Ensenada?

 

 

The Mexican's celebrate Christmas just as we do.

 

In Cabo, they even celebrate the 4th of July due to the large number of tourists and gringos living there. I got to watch fireworks shooting off behind the arch, it was fantastic.

[Nikki Lisette]

Hi, Not sure what Christmas is like there. If you do want a little time off the ship just take a taxi or if there's a shuttle to the main part of town which is one long street of shops and restaurants. I've been there a few times and felt perfectly safe.

 

I felt safe there too. But if my cabin mates are staying on board

I don't want to be out roaming the plaza alone. :cool:

[beachesanywhere]

Nikki, I was in Cabo on a 7 day cruise last Christmas with my DS...he decided our last stop he didn't want to get off the ship. I got off and walked all over Cabo alone! I felt perfectly safe the entire time even when I got a little lost looking for Cabo Wabo (had to buy Tequila for a present). I travel in Mexico with friends and family most of the time but have also traveled there alone and have Never felt afraid....I guess it's different strokes for different folks!;)

[Laughing Angel]

I'm with beachesanywhere. I've walked around Cabo by myself and felt very safe. Never had any issues where I felt scared or uneasy. Of course, you should always be aware of your surroundings and exercise due caution when you are alone, but that goes for just about any location.

 

All the facts are not in about this shootout, but I am hoping it is most likely an anomaly.

 

I love Cabo, and would fly down there tomorrow if I could.

[richard1s]

It is so unfortunate to continuously see on these boards the comparisons of crime in the US to the violence that is beleaguering Mexico. While it is true that criminal acts can happen anywhere, and at any time, it is totally naïve to ignore and understand the extent of crime in Mexico. And it is not confined to border towns between bad guys that will somehow miraculously spare tourists. The good citizens of Mexico are being victimized by systemic crime, abetted by police, and without regard for anyone's civilian status or Nationality. Because you "feel safe" doesn't mean that you are safe. And most unfortunately, the police are part of the corrupt system and if anyone thinks that they will diffuse a situation with them by "demanding to call the Port Director" or any other such nonsense, they are mistaken. The sad thing is that there are people that read comments like that and convince themselves that it is true. Do your own research, heed the advise of State Department advisories and be aware of what you are getting into.

[revel]

Throwing our 2 cents in on this discussion, having only recently been, what we believe, the near targets of a crime in Cabo (see my post "WARNING: Dangerous Excursion in Cabo..."), a shooting in a market is unfortunate but no more worrisome than most of what you find happening across the United States.

 

We live in Las Vegas, on the Strip. About 2 months ago, 2 people were stabbed to death using pedestrian bridges that connect the major casinos. Both were gang related and both happened during peak tourism hours. But in both murders, tourists were not the target. Local thugs were hunting each other. There really is a difference between attacks on tourists and crimes of opportunity, versus gang related violence that is primarily confined within their own wars.

 

I also grew up in the Northeast and have lived in Baltimore, Philadelphia, and Boston. All "dangerous" cities if you want to wallpaper your mind in press clippings. But the reality is, beyond a few bar brawl street fights, I never saw a stabbing or a shooting in my life. I was robbed, with friends, at gunpoint, once as a kid and that was only after my instincts knew we were in the wrong neighborhood and I had unsuccessfully tried to plea with my friends to move butt out of there. Too late, we got robbed. But again, none of us were physically harmed.

 

The reality is that the world is a big, beautiful, often intimidating place, but crime can and does happen anywhere -- although rarely. Most of us will fortunately never experience such things personally.

 

Just stay aware, wherever you are, remain alert of your surroundings, and keep a smart head on your shoulders. Convincing yourself that some place is always "safe" or always "dangerous" is the first way to find yourself in trouble. Also, when you're in an unknown place, just move quickly. Don't be the slow gazelle the predators go after. Move quick, be aware, be kind to anyone you meet, and there is no rationale reason to expect harm.

 

And for godsake, turn off the news once in a while. Our minds and emotions just weren't built to imagine and suffer constant dreams of ills and drudgery. There is no reason for you to feel crappy and unsafe about things that happened to people, somewhere, you'll never know.

[richard1s]

If you are referring to the stabbing on the bridge connecting the MGM and NYNY; that incident occured about 4:00 AM. That is not peak exactly peak tourism hours but still something to be aware of since Vegas never really shuts down.

[lovevacadays]

It is so unfortunate to continuously see on these boards the comparisons of crime in the US to the violence that is beleaguering Mexico. While it is true that criminal acts can happen anywhere, and at any time, it is totally naïve to ignore and understand the extent of crime in Mexico. And it is not confined to border towns between bad guys that will somehow miraculously spare tourists. The good citizens of Mexico are being victimized by systemic crime, abetted by police, and without regard for anyone's civilian status or Nationality. Because you "feel safe" doesn't mean that you are safe. And most unfortunately, the police are part of the corrupt system and if anyone thinks that they will diffuse a situation with them by "demanding to call the Port Director" or any other such nonsense, they are mistaken. The sad thing is that there are people that read comments like that and convince themselves that it is true. Do your own research, heed the advise of State Department advisories and be aware of what you are getting into.

 

 

goodness - are there state advisories in regards to Cabo? I wasn't aware. I guess I will have to check and see if those advisories for Cabo (since this is a thread about Cabo) are still in place when I cruise there in about a year.

[lovevacadays]

Throwing our 2 cents in on this discussion, having only recently been, what we believe, the near targets of a crime in Cabo (see my post "WARNING: Dangerous Excursion in Cabo..."), a shooting in a market is unfortunate but no more worrisome than most of what you find happening across the United States.

 

We live in Las Vegas, on the Strip. About 2 months ago, 2 people were stabbed to death using pedestrian bridges that connect the major casinos. Both were gang related and both happened during peak tourism hours. But in both murders, tourists were not the target. Local thugs were hunting each other. There really is a difference between attacks on tourists and crimes of opportunity, versus gang related violence that is primarily confined within their own wars.

 

I also grew up in the Northeast and have lived in Baltimore, Philadelphia, and Boston. All "dangerous" cities if you want to wallpaper your mind in press clippings. But the reality is, beyond a few bar brawl street fights, I never saw a stabbing or a shooting in my life. I was robbed, with friends, at gunpoint, once as a kid and that was only after my instincts knew we were in the wrong neighborhood and I had unsuccessfully tried to plea with my friends to move butt out of there. Too late, we got robbed. But again, none of us were physically harmed.

 

The reality is that the world is a big, beautiful, often intimidating place, but crime can and does happen anywhere -- although rarely. Most of us will fortunately never experience such things personally.

 

Just stay aware, wherever you are, remain alert of your surroundings, and keep a smart head on your shoulders. Convincing yourself that some place is always "safe" or always "dangerous" is the first way to find yourself in trouble. Also, when you're in an unknown place, just move quickly. Don't be the slow gazelle the predators go after. Move quick, be aware, be kind to anyone you meet, and there is no rationale reason to expect harm.

 

And for godsake, turn off the news once in a while. Our minds and emotions just weren't built to imagine and suffer constant dreams of ills and drudgery. There is no reason for you to feel crappy and unsafe about things that happened to people, somewhere, you'll never know.

 

Thanks for your post.

 

And, for the other poster, crime doesn't just occur in the US at 4am.

[revel]

If you are referring to the stabbing on the bridge connecting the MGM and NYNY; that incident occured about 4:00 AM. That is not peak exactly peak tourism hours but still something to be aware of since Vegas never really shuts down.

 

This is irrelevant and I only picked the two stabbings (one on the MGM/NYNY bridge and the other on the Cosmopolitan/PH bridge), because they occurred in a major, heavily trafficked tourist area and they were recent. The first stabbing (Cosmopolitan/PH) was at about 11 PM, by the way. Prime time in Las Vegas. 4 AM is the second wind prime time because that's when the clubs begin to filter out.