CtheW0rld Posted July 27, 2012 #1526 Share Posted July 27, 2012 Rather that releasing Schitino from house arrest, they should have transfered him to this room and shackled him to the iron balcony fence to watch the continuing results of his arrogance and incompetence. The iron balcony fence would also be a constant reminder of the coming iron bars in his jail cell..............;) good idea. too bad nobody thought of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
loubetti Posted July 27, 2012 #1527 Share Posted July 27, 2012 Right now I am sitting on the fence when it comes to Schettino (not "Schitino"). I have not tried and convicted him yet as some of your have. I have no doubt that he is, as least, in part to blame, as he was the captain. I want a full inquiry and all the facts first (of course I fear a cover up, and he'll be the scape goat). I am not into trying, convicting, sentencing, and executing someone before all the facts are in and, the blonde aside, we do not have all the facts yet, just lots of conjecture. Does anyone here know all the facts? Please, let me know them and provide your evidence! Comparing Concordia to Titanic is ludicrous. Aside from from striking an object, they are completely different accidents. Unless you know who David Blair is, do not talk about Titanic. Titanic was an accident chain of events that should be studied by all mariners and even aviators, perhaps Concordia also, but we wont know the latter until all the facts are in. Everyone runs to Google to look up David Blair. ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
loubetti Posted July 27, 2012 #1528 Share Posted July 27, 2012 As we do the Titanic / Concordia analogy (which makes absolutely no sense): What happened to Titanic as she left port in Southampton, and with what ship? What did Smith do to avoid a collision? Anyone, anyone? Run to Google. This was not shown in James Cameron's movie. What was happening down below in a coal bunker space? Also not shown in the movie. Don't ever compare Concordia to Titanic until you know what you're talking about. You do NOT know the facts by watching a movie. Also, there is no proof whatsoever that William Murdoch committed suicide. Cameron was pressured to build a statue of him in Murdoch's home town, as he showed him killing himself in the movie. I would highly suggest we leave the Concordia / Titanic analogy out of this thread, as they have little in common, and most of you do not know what you're talking about when it comes to a comparison. Everyone still running to Google "David Blair". :cool: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uniall Posted July 27, 2012 #1529 Share Posted July 27, 2012 Right now I am sitting on the fence when it comes to Schettino (not "Schitino"). I have not tried and convicted him yet as some of your have. I have no doubt that he is, as least, in part to blame, as he was the captain. I want a full inquiry and all the facts first (of course I fear a cover up, and he'll be the scape goat). I am not into trying, convicting, sentencing, and executing someone before all the facts are in and, the blonde aside, we do not have all the facts yet, just lots of conjecture. Does anyone here know all the facts? Please, let me know them and provide your evidence! Comparing Concordia to Titanic is ludicrous. Aside from from striking an object, they are completely different accidents. Unless you know who David Blair is, do not talk about Titanic. Titanic was an accident chain of events that should be studied by all mariners and even aviators, perhaps Concordia also, but we wont know the latter until all the facts are in. Everyone runs to Google to look up David Blair. ;) There is more than enought evidence to find Schitino guilty of criminal homicide and deriliction of duty. In my considered opinion, anyone who maintains otherwise is closing their eyes and ears to the truth in a misguided belief that it is improper to decide a persons guilt or innocence until a jury has spoken. Heck, most people correctly believe OJ Simpson was guilty of murder even after the jury found him not guilty. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cruiserfanfromct Posted July 27, 2012 #1530 Share Posted July 27, 2012 hey now....that could be considered a insult to water rats! *G* True -- it's not fair to the water rat. Unlike Cap'n Crunch everyone knows a water rat would have given a rat's a$$. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cruiserfanfromct Posted July 27, 2012 #1531 Share Posted July 27, 2012 Does anyone here know all the facts? Please, let me know them and provide your evidence! You want evidence? Just look out the window of Room 37 of the Hotel Saraceno. Seriously, evidence of what? That Concordia ran into the rocks under his command? That he abandoned ship? That he refused to return? That he gave slapstick explanations for his actions? You must make Google your friend. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cruiserfanfromct Posted July 28, 2012 #1532 Share Posted July 28, 2012 Just found the British documentary, "The Sinking of The Concordia: Caught on Camera" which aired in the UK on channel 4 and not available in the US. Someone uploaded it to YouTube and now US viewers can see it. For all you evidence seekers, this documentary is the most comprehensive that I've seen thus far. It has much more passenger videos and testimonies and has pieced together the timeline very nicely. You can hear Schettino telling the Coast Guard that there is just an electrical problem on board when he knew that water was gushing in. I believe that had the Coast Guard been told the truth, they would have been able to deploy much faster and possible have saved more lives. There are a few commercials at the beginning and in the middle. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lcXtrUfDEeQ&feature=related Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DocF Posted July 28, 2012 #1533 Share Posted July 28, 2012 Hmmm, something very different is going on at the wreck site. There is a 350 foot or so engines aft ship that has been maneuvered in on the land side of the hulk. The removal of the funnel may be about to happen. Doc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MorganMars Posted July 28, 2012 #1534 Share Posted July 28, 2012 (edited) Just came across another John Wayne quote that I thought you might want to add to your collection. 'Each of us is a mixture of some good and some not so good qualities. In considering one's fellow man it's important to remember the good things ... We should refrain from making judgments just because a fella happens to be a dirty, rotten SOB.' -John Wayne AKK Here's some John Wayne Rules to Live By: John T. Chance (Rio Bravo): "Sorry don't get it done, Dude." Sergeant John M. Stryker (Sands of Iwo Jima): "A lot of guys make mistakes, I guess, but every one we make, a whole stack of chips goes with it. We make a mistake, and some guy don't walk away - forevermore, he don't walk away." John Bernard Books (The Shootist): "I won't be wronged, I won't be insulted, and I won't be laid a hand on. I don't do these things to other people and I expect the same from them." Ringo Kid (Stagecoach): "Well, there are some things a man just can't run away from." Hondo Lane (Hondo): "I don't guess people's hearts got anything to do with a calendar." Hondo Lane (Hondo): "Yup. The end of a way of life. Too bad. It's a good way. Wagons forward! Yo!" Capt. Rockwell Torrey (In Harm's Way): "All battles are fought by scared men who'd rather be some place else." Colonel Madden (Back to Bataan): "This kind of war, you've gotta believe in what you're fighting for." Tom Doniphon (The Man Who Shot Liberty Valance): "Out here a man settles his own problems." Duke Gifford (Operation Pacific): "He was a good man. Make sure that it says so on the patrol report." Tom Dunson (Red River): "Every time you turn around expect to see me. 'Cause one time you'll turn around and I'll be there, and I'll kill you, Matt." Marshall J.D. Cahill (Cahill, U.S. Marshall): "Cause even grown men need understanding." Col. Michael Kirby (The Green Berets): "Out here, due process is a bullet." Col. David Crockett (The Alamo): "Republic. I like the sound of the word." Edited July 28, 2012 by MorganMars Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sidari Posted July 28, 2012 #1535 Share Posted July 28, 2012 CT ... Having seen the C4 programme when it was aired there is little if any proof that it was Schettino talking to the coastguard in the initial call. David Blair was he not the guy who was replaced on Titanic and took a set of Binoculars with him ? thats without google or any search engine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MorganMars Posted July 28, 2012 #1536 Share Posted July 28, 2012 Loubetti, While I agree with you that one cannot compare the sinking of Titanic to the Costa Concordia, after listening to the passengers who use the Titanic to describe their experience, I believe that what they are referring to is the movie. Since many do not share our interest in nautical history, that is their only point of reference and James Cameron did a pretty good job of depicting the process. Regards, MorganMars Comparing Concordia to Titanic is ludicrous. Aside from from striking an object, they are completely different accidents. Unless you know who David Blair is, do not talk about Titanic. Titanic was an accident chain of events that should be studied by all mariners and even aviators, perhaps Concordia also, but we wont know the latter until all the facts are in. Everyone runs to Google to look up David Blair. ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cruiserfanfromct Posted July 28, 2012 #1537 Share Posted July 28, 2012 CT ... Having seen the C4 programme when it was aired there is little if any proof that it was Schettino talking to the coastguard in the initial call. David Blair was he not the guy who was replaced on Titanic and took a set of Binoculars with him ? thats without google or any search engine. Other than the voice sounding very much like Schettino, I don't have proof. Do you have proof that it wasn't his voice? Even if it wasn't his voice, it is doubtful that any officer would have blatantly lied to the Coast Guard without the direct orders of his commander. Re David Blair -- some historians are of the opinion that the binoculars would have made not one bit of difference in spotting the iceberg on the night of the sinking given the conditions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sidari Posted July 28, 2012 #1538 Share Posted July 28, 2012 (edited) John .... i may have missed it somewhere in the earlier pages but when was O.J. Simpson in charge of a ship ..... :D CT ... I think that at the time the coastguard spoke to a person/s on the bridge they would have been dealing with a Blackout and that is what they were told, however where it falls down is that there appears to be no later call to the ship from the coastguard asking for an update on the situation! and the much later one was the much published arguement between the Coastguard and the Captain. It is easy for a Historian to make a statement on an issue that happened 100 years ago! at best its a guess. Edited July 28, 2012 by sidari Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
my_crib_too Posted July 28, 2012 #1539 Share Posted July 28, 2012 There is more than enought evidence to find Schitino guilty of criminal homicide and deriliction of duty. In my considered opinion, anyone who maintains otherwise is closing their eyes and ears to the truth in a misguided belief that it is improper to decide a persons guilt or innocence until a jury has spoken. Heck, most people correctly believe OJ Simpson was guilty of murder even after the jury found him not guilty. +1 Well written... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MorganMars Posted July 28, 2012 #1540 Share Posted July 28, 2012 In the testimony of Silvia Coronika, http://www.quotidiano.net/file_generali/documenti/PDF/2012/01/silvia-coronika.pdf he states (translated from page 5): The Port Authority of Civitavecchia asked specifically whether there were any problems on board and the captain ordered Officer in charge of radio, Canessa Simone, to report that there was a blackout on board. Other than the voice sounding very much like Schettino, I don't have proof. Do you have proof that it wasn't his voice? Even if it wasn't his voice, it is doubtful that any officer would have blatantly lied to the Coast Guard without the direct orders of his commander. Re David Blair -- some historians are of the opinion that the binoculars would have made not one bit of difference in spotting the iceberg on the night of the sinking given the conditions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cruiserfanfromct Posted July 28, 2012 #1541 Share Posted July 28, 2012 In the testimony of Silvia Coronika, http://www.quotidiano.net/file_generali/documenti/PDF/2012/01/silvia-coronika.pdf he states (translated from page 5): The Port Authority of Civitavecchia asked specifically whether there were any problems on board and the captain ordered Officer in charge of radio, Canessa Simone, to report that there was a blackout on board. Thanks for this MM. Yes, I went to page 5 and that's exactly what Silvia Coronika said. So that was the voice of Simone Canessa, who was ordered to lie to the Coast Guard. Not that it matters but I believe the third officer, Silvia Coronika or Coronica, is a woman. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cruiserfanfromct Posted July 28, 2012 #1542 Share Posted July 28, 2012 (edited) CT ... I think that at the time the coastguard spoke to a person/s on the bridge they would have been dealing with a Blackout and that is what they were told, however where it falls down is that there appears to be no later call to the ship from the coastguard asking for an update on the situation! and the much later one was the much published arguement between the Coastguard and the Captain. At the time the Coast Guard spoke to Simone Canessa, it was well known to everyone on the bridge that they had hit a rock and water was gushing in. The Concordia crewman speaking with the Coast Guard was the ship’s navigation officer, a 26-year-old Italian named Simone Canessa. “The Captain ordered … Canessa to say that there was a blackout on board,” third mate Silvia Coronica later told prosecutors. “When asked if we needed assistance, he said, ‘At the moment, no.’ ” The first mate, Ciro Ambrosio, who was also on the bridge, confirmed to investigators that Schettino was fully aware that a blackout was the least of their problems. “The captain ordered us to say that everything was under control and that we were checking the damage, even though he knew that the ship was taking on water.” It is easy for a Historian to make a statement on an issue that happened 100 years ago! at best its a guess. That was several historians -- not just one -- and that is true for all statements made regarding the binoculars. Edited July 28, 2012 by cruiserfanfromct Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MorganMars Posted July 28, 2012 #1543 Share Posted July 28, 2012 You are correct, of course. I had forgotten that. She is also one of the people who swam to shore. There is a photo of her here: http://www.la****one.it/grosseto/cronaca/2012/02/23/671744-costa-indagati-naufragio-sette-nuovi.shtml Not that it matters but I believe the third officer, Silvia Coronika or Coronica, is a woman. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cruiserfanfromct Posted July 28, 2012 #1544 Share Posted July 28, 2012 You are correct, of course. I had forgotten that. She is also one of the people who swam to shore. There is a photo of her here: http://www.la****one.it/grosseto/cronaca/2012/02/23/671744-costa-indagati-naufragio-sette-nuovi.shtml That's her. Here she is: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MorganMars Posted July 28, 2012 #1545 Share Posted July 28, 2012 (edited) It is also worth noting that the Vanity Fair article, http://www.vanityfair.com/culture/2012/05/costa-concordia-sinking-scandal-italy , identifies Simone Canessa as the ship's officer that worked with Mayor Pellegrini in the rescue of the passengers left stranded on the port side of the ship. According to Mario Pellegrini, who was mired in the chaos above, two crewmen worked with him to supervise the aborning escape attempt: the doctor, Sandro Cinquini, and especially young Simone Canessa, the same officer who earlier in the evening told the Coast Guard the ship had suffered only a blackout. Canessa’s role in the evacuation has not been mentioned publicly; yet according to Pellegrini, he was the single most effective crewman still working to evacuate the ship during the long night’s most harrowing hours. “When I got up there and saw Simone, he was the boss, he was the only one up there really helping,” says Pellegrini. “When he realized I was there to help, he saw we could work together. He was fantastic. Simone, I think, created this whole escape route. He was at the top. I did my best to help him.” “I am not a hero: I did my job,” Canessa told VANITY FAIR in a brief telephone interview. “I did everything I could to save everyone I could.” So that was the voice of Simone Canessa, who was ordered to lie to the Coast Guard. Edited July 28, 2012 by MorganMars Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cruiserfanfromct Posted July 28, 2012 #1546 Share Posted July 28, 2012 It is also worth noting that the Vanity Fair article, http://www.vanityfair.com/culture/2012/05/costa-concordia-sinking-scandal-italy , identifies Simone Canessa as the ship's officer that worked with Mayor Pellegrini in the rescue of the passengers left stranded on the port side of the ship. According to Mario Pellegrini, who was mired in the chaos above, two crewmen worked with him to supervise the aborning escape attempt: the doctor, Sandro Cinquini, and especially young Simone Canessa, the same officer who earlier in the evening told the Coast Guard the ship had suffered only a blackout. Canessa’s role in the evacuation has not been mentioned publicly; yet according to Pellegrini, he was the single most effective crewman still working to evacuate the ship during the long night’s most harrowing hours. “When I got up there and saw Simone, he was the boss, he was the only one up there really helping,” says Pellegrini. “When he realized I was there to help, he saw we could work together. He was fantastic. Simone, I think, created this whole escape route. He was at the top. I did my best to help him.” “I am not a hero: I did my job,” Canessa told VANITY FAIR in a brief telephone interview. “I did everything I could to save everyone I could.” Thanks for this info MM. Do you remember what exactly happened with the anchors? Did Schettino order them to be dropped and if so, when? Did this help or hinder the evacuation process? I read there is a video out there by the Guardia di Finanza who arrived onsite 10 minutes after the disaster and shows that the anchor had not been lowered at that point. Do you know anything about this? Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uniall Posted July 28, 2012 #1547 Share Posted July 28, 2012 Thanks for this MM. Yes, I went to page 5 and that's exactly what Silvia Coronika said. So that was the voice of Simone Canessa, who was ordered to lie to the Coast Guard. Not that it matters but I believe the third officer, Silvia Coronika or Coronica, is a woman. You are correct, of course. I had forgotten that. She is also one of the people who swam to shore. There is a photo of her here: http://www.la****one.it/grosseto/cronaca/2012/02/23/671744-costa-indagati-naufragio-sette-nuovi.shtml That's her. Here she is: Why don't you get some real proof. Your just going by news reports. How do you know Sylvia Coronica was the 3rd officer? For that matter, was voice on the radio a male with a high pitched Alto voice? How do you know that photo is really Sylvia Coronica? Could it be a Giglio islander who was on the pier with her boyfriend for a secluded tryst at the time? In fact, how do you know for sure it's even a female? You shouldn't be posting personal theories as facts until a judge and jury have evaluated some real proof. ;):rolleyes::D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cruiserfanfromct Posted July 28, 2012 #1548 Share Posted July 28, 2012 (edited) Why don't you get some real proof. Your just going by news reports. How do you know Sylvia Coronica was the 3rd officer? For that matter, was voice on the radio a male with a high pitched Alto voice? How do you know that photo is really Sylvia Coronica? Could it be a Giglio islander who was on the pier with her boyfriend for a secluded tryst at the time? In fact, how do you know for sure it's even a female? You shouldn't be posting personal theories as facts until a judge and jury have evaluated some real proof. ;):rolleyes::D ;):rolleyes::D...this is just one big conspiracy theory and Schettino is being unfairly scapegoated --- NOT! Edited July 28, 2012 by cruiserfanfromct Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MorganMars Posted July 28, 2012 #1549 Share Posted July 28, 2012 CFFC, I followed discussions regarding the deployment of the anchors closely as initial reports showing the movement of the ship during the turn that resulted in the grounding on the starboard side was reminiscent of a maneuver that I had been trained to use in emergency situations. At some point though, I believe it was the release of the video of the bridge, I became convinced that the anchors were not dropped at an appropriate time to use them in such a maneuver. In the opinion of Captain John Konrad, Schettino deployed the anchors during the grounding in order to help prevent the capsize but, by allowing too much chain to be released, that maneuver was ineffective. However, it may be that the chain brake on the ship was not operational without power. I must leave it to others who are more familiar with that machinery to enlighten us. A video of a chain brake failing can be found at . Regards, MorganMars Thanks for this info MM. Do you remember what exactly happened with the anchors? Did Schettino order them to be dropped and if so, when? Did this help or hinder the evacuation process? I read there is a video out there by the Guardia di Finanza who arrived onsite 10 minutes after the disaster and shows that the anchor had not been lowered at that point. Do you know anything about this? Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vampire Parrot Posted July 28, 2012 #1550 Share Posted July 28, 2012 Interesting :eek: video. If I'd been on that deck I would have run away terribly quickly and told everyone else around me to do the same... only once the chain had run out past the bitter end would I even think about getting back on that deck! On a ship, it's the weight of chain on the seabed that anchors the ship in position, not the anchor itself. Once their is sufficient weight on the seabed, additional chain will increase the distance the ship can move.... it's as much art as science, a balance between how much slack chain their is, and weight of chain on seabed as too little chain will increase the risk of anchor drag. VP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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