Elderly & medical issues - thought triggered by grandeur fire

[CruiseQueen1960]

I usually lurk but after hearing about Grandeur, as well as the past several Carnival cruises that involved ships dead in the water, it brings to mind this issue.

 

My parents loved to cruise. But a good 10 years ago, they stopped due to my father's medical issues. His logic was that if anything ever happened where he required quick emergency care, a cruise is the last place he should be. He knew he needed to be able to reach professional emergency care in a timely manner so sadly he stopped.

 

Every time I hear of one of these emergencies (Grandeur, Triumph and Splendor come to mind), I am really puzzled when I hear about the passengers that are elderly or have serious medical issues being onboard.

 

Please don't think I don't want anyone elderly or ill not to be allowed to travel. Far from it. But is a cruise the wisest choice? A fire or losing power on land is far different than being stranded at sea without it. I even recall hearing on Splendor there was an elderly woman traveling alone who had to rely on strangers and crew for assistance. Many cruisers travel who require the basics we take for granted like refrigeration and electrical power. To lose it for even a short time is life threatening where for most of us, it is a minor (sometimes major) inconvenience.

 

I realize these are isolated incidents but it seems the Personal Responsibility factor is losing ground here. I know the Special Needs departments on cruiselines do an amazing job to make even the most physically and mentally challenged passengers comfortable.

 

While I am sad that my parents can't cruise with us, I am proud that he made a decision that protected his health and life, even if it was a long shot. When I hear about these at sea emergencies, no matter how rare they are, I think about the passengers who didn't make the same types of decision and the stress, fear and possible danger they may be in.

 

I would love to hear different perspectives on this issue. I feel this is not addressed enough by cruisers and cruise lines. Please don't flame me for being "mean" to the old and ill - I just think this is worthy of discussion.

[Dawniepoo]

I completely understand your point. I have an elderly mother, who loves to cruise. She's been on close to 100 of them. Her health is not the best, and we both worry when she leaves for a cruise; however, to her, the benefits far outweigh the risks, at least in her instance. When the day comes that she tells me she can't go on cruises anymore, that will be a sad day.

[BeachChik]

I agree with you. Ships just aren't prepared to treat people with major medical problems and for people that do have major issues IMO a cruise is not a vacation I would chose. At least on a land vacation you have more access to medical care and hospitals. Even though a ship can airlift an emergency case off, it takes time for them to get there, pick up the patient and transport them to a medical facility.

[Eriksgarden]

We held onto Mom the whole week. We even joked, "Don't break Mom!" We cannot live thinking of "what ifs". Every day is a gift and life is a risk worth taking.

[jgregory]

Please forgive my extreme oversimplification of this complex issue, but:

 

If you had a choice between living safely, watching TV, wearing an "I've fallen and I can't get up" safety pendant for 20 years, or living an interesting full life and perhaps only making it a few more years, which would you choose?

[cherylandtk]

I once knew a mountain climber who would take off into the wilds for weeks at a time. He proactively had his appendix removed so that he did not have to worry about needing medical treatment for a burst appendix while so far removed from civilization. I had never though about that sort of thing before talking about it with him.

 

I know of several cruisers who do not take itineraries that are more than one day from a port, so no TA's, no Hawaii. That is their choice based on their medical needs and their comfort level. I presume there are also many cruisers who do not think about this sort of thing at all, and perhaps now they will.

 

I think it all comes down to individual opinion as to how prepared you need to be for an emergency, whether that is on vacation or at home with a natural disaster or a wide variety of other potential 'what ifs'.

[gsully]

I'm 70 +, which to some is still young. It's all about your attitude. I love to cruise and hope I can cruise for many more years. I see folks much older than me on cruises, many in wheel chairs and on O2. I think if it's something you really enjoy doing, it will actually lengthen your life to continue doing it. Ship medical facilities are pitiful and I hope they will begin to improve them because of the aging of the cruising population. But medical evacuation happens often, either by helicopter or the ship detouring to a nearby port. I'd rather leave this world doing something I enjoy than sitting around the house wishing I were on a cruise.

[abridalmaven]

I usually lurk but after hearing about Grandeur, as well as the past several Carnival cruises that involved ships dead in the water, it brings to mind this issue.

 

My parents loved to cruise. But a good 10 years ago, they stopped due to my father's medical issues. His logic was that if anything ever happened where he required quick emergency care, a cruise is the last place he should be. He knew he needed to be able to reach professional emergency care in a timely manner so sadly he stopped.

 

Every time I hear of one of these emergencies (Grandeur, Triumph and Splendor come to mind), I am really puzzled when I hear about the passengers that are elderly or have serious medical issues being onboard.

 

Please don't think I don't want anyone elderly or ill not to be allowed to travel. Far from it. But is a cruise the wisest choice? A fire or losing power on land is far different than being stranded at sea without it. I even recall hearing on Splendor there was an elderly woman traveling alone who had to rely on strangers and crew for assistance. Many cruisers travel who require the basics we take for granted like refrigeration and electrical power. To lose it for even a short time is life threatening where for most of us, it is a minor (sometimes major) inconvenience.

 

I realize these are isolated incidents but it seems the Personal Responsibility factor is losing ground here. I know the Special Needs departments on cruiselines do an amazing job to make even the most physically and mentally challenged passengers comfortable.

 

While I am sad that my parents can't cruise with us, I am proud that he made a decision that protected his health and life, even if it was a long shot. When I hear about these at sea emergencies, no matter how rare they are, I think about the passengers who didn't make the same types of decision and the stress, fear and possible danger they may be in.

 

I would love to hear different perspectives on this issue. I feel this is not addressed enough by cruisers and cruise lines. Please don't flame me for being "mean" to the old and ill - I just think this is worthy of discussion.

 

Funny I just started a similar thread, I agree. time to stop with heavy medical issues.

[BeachChik]

Please forgive my extreme oversimplification of this complex issue, but:

 

If you had a choice between living safely, watching TV, wearing an "I've fallen and I can't get up" safety pendant for 20 years, or living an interesting full life and perhaps only making it a few more years, which would you choose?

 

It doesn't mean someone should sit at home and wait to die. It's about being realistic with what you are capable of doing.

 

I am far from elderly however I have several back issues. I spent ten days in Costa Rica and wanted so badly to do white water rafting. However after a lot of thought about what that could do to my back I decided it wasn't worth the risk. And it is the same reason i decided not to do the flowrider on the freedom. One good fall and i would have been in serious trouble. This is basically what the op is saying. You have to weigh the risk of having a major medical problem against being trapped on a cruise ship with no access to real medical care. Have your read the thread about how the person was treated onboard for something simple as dehydration?

[BeachChik]

I'm 70 +, which to some is still young. It's all about your attitude. I love to cruise and hope I can cruise for many more years. I see folks much older than me on cruises, many in wheel chairs and on O2. I think if it's something you really enjoy doing, it will actually lengthen your life to continue doing it. Ship medical facilities are pitiful and I hope they will begin to improve them because of the aging of the cruising population. But medical evacuation happens often, either by helicopter or the ship detouring to a nearby port. I'd rather leave this world doing something I enjoy than sitting around the house wishing I were on a cruise.

 

I don't think it's really about age. Someone 70 can be in excellent health and someone 25 can have major medical problems.

[Bill&Karen]

I think its an individual choice. Your dad made the decision he made, my 93 year old grandmother has decided she'd just as soon die on a cruise as anywhere else. She told someone "I'd rather go doing something I enjoy, then never do anything for fear of dying".

 

To each his own I guess.

[wander]

I think this is a highly individualized issue. I have seen young people, like 15 - 30 cruise with "heavy" medical issues, and those over 80 with basically no medical issues at all.

 

My friends, he is 100 and she is 95 just got back from cruise to Hawaii, had a wonderful time although their schedule would have certainly been boring to me. I must say I was concerned about their going without aid, but they did just fine, limiting their onboard life to what they could handle, and no shore trips. I am very grateful they did not experience rough weather, that would have been problematic as they have problems walking on land.

 

When we were around 40, went on a cruise with a friend. Her folks would have loved to have gone as well, but they were too concerned about the types of things noted by OP (they lived in fine shape for about 15 more years). My friend, however, had an acute gall bladder attack and was hospitalized for surgery the day before we were to leave. No warning, just out of the blue. One never knows.

 

We are planning a small boat cruise with friends, she HAS to be near medical care so we are going on an inter-coastal way cruise on the east coast (Fla to RI). Never more than a day away from good hospitals. This will be just fine for her and OK with her doctor. So there are options other than going to exotic places and across oceans.

[gaechann]

I think its an individual choice. Your dad made the decision he made, my 93 year old grandmother has decided she'd just as soon die on a cruise as anywhere else. She told someone "I'd rather go doing something I enjoy, then never do anything for fear of dying".

 

To each his own I guess.

 

Absolutely! My 87-year-old Mother has just recently discovered cruising and though she was a little apprehensive before her first cruise thinking that she would probably get sea-sick, she is now hooked and is very excited about our next 16-day cruise.

 

We are yet to book for next year but I know that once on board this year will we be booking again for next year.

 

Gae

[CruiseQueen1960]

Thanks for taking my post as it's meant - to promote discussion. To clarify, my dad's issues are easily controlled - he has lived to be 90, still mentally with it and he is not sitting in front of the tv waiting to die. His point was - he was taking what he believed (rightly) to be needless risk when he could take land based vacations and still get the medical care he required if necessary. He also didn't think it was right to impact other's vacations - as he knew a cruise interruption or emergency would. This is the man who every time we cruise, he laughs and tells us if anything happens while we are gone, he has orders to leave us alone and to put him "on ice" until we get back. :D Hopefully - that will never be the case.

 

I just see complaints sometimes during these emergencies and wonder why they feel a cruise should be able to administer cutting edge life saving procedures when almost any resort or hotel would be able to call 911 and actually bring trained professionals to them in a timely manner. I'm not referring to accidents where the Coast Guard and cruiselines have done some amazing feats, I'm talking knowingly boarding a ship where you know you require extra care to live. But thank you - I do appreciate that some people are more adventurous.

[Eriksgarden]

My Dad refuses to travel anymore even though he is physically able to. We take Mom on vacations, because he won't. Definitely, everyone has different comfort levels.

[LBeeE]

I'm 36 years old and have major medical problems. I am getting ready to cruise in 2 days. I am worried sick about not being able to get the care I need should I have a problem. My issues are not run-of-the-mill. They are complex, and my own ER doesn't know what to do with me, they hate to see me coming, and I no longer have a primary care, he didn't know what to do with me and asked me not to come back. My husband desperately wanted to do this cruise for our 15th anniversary, so I am going along with it, worried sick about being out to sea if I need medical attention. At the same time, I'm 36 and have spent the last 5 years sitting around waiting to die. That's no life. My family is right, I'm not living, I'm existing. So I am doing the cruise, but I am worried sick. It may not be a good idea, you are certainly right, but if I am able to make it through without problems, I can guarantee you I will feel empowered over my health, and I will gain the emotional strength I need to keep pushing forward each day. Just praying I make it through the cruise without any problems and can build some wonderful memories with my husband.

[Eriksgarden]

LB, I hope you and your husband have an awesome time!

[LBeeE]

Thank you!

[Eriksgarden]

Freedom is AMAZING...We were on it in April.

[read52]

Here's another opinion. We started cruising after my husband was sick with two illnesses (viral encephalitis and prostate cancer). He was 54 with the first illness and 55 with cancer. When he pulled through both and we won free airline tickets, we decided that we were not going to put life off. We have been on 10 cruises because it is an easier way to travel---no driving, finding places to eat, unpacking multiple times, etc. There is always a doctor onboard. My husband has seizures and other neurological problems. If he gets tired, we can go back to the cabin to rest or order food. We have traveled more since he has been sick than before because life can not wait.

[Donut23]

Last fall DH and I had a leisurely and lovely cruise on the Brilliance in Canada. Little did I know at the time, my consuming exhaustion was heart related (resolved with a little heart proceedure early this year.)

 

With concern for my health, my DH arranged for a scooter for me at the last moment. After many cruises, we wisely headed for our muster station early-cocktail in hand. (No flaming about drinking and driving---haha).

 

Had it been a true emergency, we would have taken the stairs....slowly.

 

 

Everyone makes their own choices. My experience as a TA years ago, people SHOULD travel if they accept the responsibility (as long as they are not fearful). Excellent travel insurance is the key.

 

I helped cancer patients, heart patients....even had a perfectly healthy80 year old grandfather who took his grand daughter to Alaska. They travelled for 2 weeks and the second to last day he fell on the ship and broke a hip. Yes, it WAS a disaster. Luckily with gold standard trip insurance all it took was a call and a medical evacuation home was arranged. He brought in his photos for me to see a few months later---I cried as I listened to his memories shared with his grand daughter.

 

Yes, you have to accept personal responsibility. On the Brilliance last fall we would not have been the first to arrive at our muster station but I would never trade the memories of that cruise with my husband.

 

Just to clarify, had the heart problem been diagnosed close to the cruise, i would have not cruised. I would have taken my Travel Guard reimbursement and cruised later.

 

Perhaps you stay closer to home - avoid the cruises to The Cape if Good Hope or the Amazon River. Perhaps because I developed a niche of illness-challenged guests I see things differently than most. It just takes more planning and accepting a few limitations.

[cruzincurt]

Actually a cruise is cheaper per day than a nursing home, I'm trying to figure out how to take advantage of that. I seem to recall on one HAL cruise they said they have an on-board morgue and on the average lose 3 per cruise.

 

We each have to weigh the odds. On one cruise, my retina partially detached two sea days from home port. Nothing they could do on the ship. We all take chances. I had surgery the day I got back and saved my eye. I admire those I see pushing walkers and toting oxygen bottles. Why sit on the couch at home and wait?

[JFontaine]

I'm 36 years old and have major medical problems. I am getting ready to cruise in 2 days. I am worried sick about not being able to get the care I need should I have a problem.

 

First, to you, I wish you the best trip. May your anxiety vanish the moment you step on board. I hope you will let us know.

 

I worry (for my 84 year old mom) not about a personal medical issue, but about a Grandeur type incident. She has diabetes and must eat every few hours; traveling to and from a vacation is always carefully planned with food and snacks, sometimes hard on the way home. She doesn't need a wheelchair, but couldn't stand at muster for more than a little while. On the other thread we talk about those with medical issues getting off the ship among the first, but someone made a good point - how would the cruise ship know who has issues. I will admit that I take suites to cruise with her for the entire family, trying to give her every benefit in an emergency. Who knows if that would even help. She's now on the fence about cruising again, and I'm hesitant to push her because of these events, however rare they may be.

[linkerbink]

WOW! How refreshing to read a thread filled with thoughtful, articulate, and well thought out responses.

 

My sister and I have been on 12 cruises together. We recently cancelled our Alaska cruise set for next year in favor of an African safari (#2 on my life list....I fulfilled #1, Australia, last year!). We'd already been to Alaska and decided that given our ages,(67 and 66 respectively) we should do the more "adventurous" vacation while still able (God willing!). Yes, we should give some consideration to our capabilities, but I also believe we should do what we can while we can! Won't stop cruising, though!

 

Our mother always wanted to travel but our father was the "stay at home in front of the TV" type. After my father died, my mother started traveling at the age of 74. We went to England twice, to Switzerland, Canada, and three cruises plus several trips here in the US. She only stopped after she suffered a stroke. I think those were some of the best years of her life.

[BeachChik]

Actually a cruise is cheaper per day than a nursing home, I'm trying to figure out how to take advantage of that. I seem to recall on one HAL cruise they said they have an on-board morgue and on the average lose 3 per cruise.

 

We each have to weigh the odds. On one cruise, my retina partially detached two sea days from home port. Nothing they could do on the ship. We all take chances. I had surgery the day I got back and saved my eye. I admire those I see pushing walkers and toting oxygen bottles. Why sit on the couch at home and wait?

 

:eek: 3 per cruise??

 

Hal tends to have an older clientele don't they? Do all ships have a morgue?