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Mrs applehead
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One particular issue with Iona may concern anyone who feels that ballroom and Latin dancing are an integral part of their cruise. When we were last on Britannia a couple of months ago I had (finally) the chance to talk to one of the future cruises reps about the facilities on Iona.

 

There will be no ballroom on Iona, and they will generally not have professional ballroom instructors on her cruises. There will be no regular ballroom dancing, and they will only on a few occasions have ballroom dancing on that ship. So it certainly looks like the target audience will be families and younger people. 

 

Of course many passengers have no interest in dancing on a cruise - but on the ships we sail there has always been a regular core of couples, and singles, who dance every night, but in addition a much larger group of passengers who love watching the dancing over a cocktail or glass of wine, or several over the whole evening - and of course for them this particular form of entertainment will no longer be there on Iona - which seems a sad loss to me.

 

Maybe sufficient numbers of people won't miss the dancing on Iona - but we won't be there to find out as we have already booked on cruises where we will know we can dance.

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9 minutes ago, mcloaked said:

One particular issue with Iona may concern anyone who feels that ballroom and Latin dancing are an integral part of their cruise. When we were last on Britannia a couple of months ago I had (finally) the chance to talk to one of the future cruises reps about the facilities on Iona.

 

There will be no ballroom on Iona, and they will generally not have professional ballroom instructors on her cruises. There will be no regular ballroom dancing, and they will only on a few occasions have ballroom dancing on that ship. So it certainly looks like the target audience will be families and younger people. 

 

Of course many passengers have no interest in dancing on a cruise - but on the ships we sail there has always been a regular core of couples, and singles, who dance every night, but in addition a much larger group of passengers who love watching the dancing over a cocktail or glass of wine, or several over the whole evening - and of course for them this particular form of entertainment will no longer be there on Iona - which seems a sad loss to me.

 

Maybe sufficient numbers of people won't miss the dancing on Iona - but we won't be there to find out as we have already booked on cruises where we will know we can dance.

I know a lot of people will be disappointed about the lack of a ballroom. However professional instructors are only ever on longer cruises (according to a very experienced member of the Ents Team). So not surprising, given the itinerary, that they will not be on board. 

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1 hour ago, FangedRose said:

I know a lot of people will be disappointed about the lack of a ballroom. However professional instructors are only ever on longer cruises (according to a very experienced member of the Ents Team). So not surprising, given the itinerary, that they will not be on board. 

 

I am not sure what you mean by 'longer' cruises?  Mostly we have been on two-week or a bit longer voyages, but even some years ago on a one-week cruise on Ventura we had an experienced dance couple teaching ballroom and Latin dancing every sea day (he had been a dance pro who had taught the pros on Strictly for several years!), with ballroom dancing every evening, though on that ship it was (and still is) in the atrium, which was at least fun even if the atrium floor was not an ideal shape or size.  I guess 'professional' is interpreted differently on different cruise lines - but in general we have had reasonably competent dance instructors on all P&O ships who can teach basic introductory steps for the main ballroom and Latin dances, as well as the occasional salsa or Argentine tango, and who host the evening dancing in between sets of dance music played by the resident ballroom band every evening of the voyage. The dance instructors also are usually happy to dance with any single man or lady who hasn't got a dance partner.

 

In the case of Cunard there is a much bigger presence of a larger ballroom with a good sized dance floor on all their ships, and the dance couples on Cunard are generally at a level where they can teach not only basic classes every sea day but also in private lessons to competition standard, and who have had significant high level competition experience of their own previously.

 

Clearly when you look at what is provided by other cruise lines the availability of ballroom and Latin dancing is missing, and usually only a small dance floor with less frequent ballroom dancing than every night, and often more of the American style of dancing or party dancing, rather than the classic International ballroom and Latin styles, and often not for the entire evening. 

 

So Cunard and P&O have a captive audience of ballroom dancers - and having had conversations with quite a few dancers on cruises it seems that for those passengers a ship without ballroom facilities will not be on their list of cruise bookings - so it is possible that the loss of any ballroom opportunities on Iona will lead to an increase in bookings on the Cunard ships where ballroom dancing is a central attraction and a special part of the cruise for passengers who love to dance or who really enjoy watching the dancing. There is a huge following for ballroom dancing - the ten million or so TV viewers who follow Strictly are a testament to that!

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From the renderings released so far, it seems pretty obvious to me that Iona will be a game-changer for P&O.  The public rooms shown so far all look very casual and contemporary.  It will be interesting to see what they are doing with The Crows Nest and Anderson's.  Can't quite see how Anderson's can have a traditional look when it will incorporate a Library and a Gin Distillery...

 

I don't think it is going to be designed to attract traditionalists. 

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2 hours ago, mcloaked said:

 

I am not sure what you mean by 'longer' cruises?  Mostly we have been on two-week or a bit longer voyages, but even some years ago on a one-week cruise on Ventura we had an experienced dance couple teaching ballroom and Latin dancing every sea day (he had been a dance pro who had taught the pros on Strictly for several years!), with ballroom dancing every evening, though on that ship it was (and still is) in the atrium, which was at least fun even if the atrium floor was not an ideal shape or size.  I guess 'professional' is interpreted differently on different cruise lines - but in general we have had reasonably competent dance instructors on all P&O ships who can teach basic introductory steps for the main ballroom and Latin dances, as well as the occasional salsa or Argentine tango, and who host the evening dancing in between sets of dance music played by the resident ballroom band every evening of the voyage. The dance instructors also are usually happy to dance with any single man or lady who hasn't got a dance partner.

 

In the case of Cunard there is a much bigger presence of a larger ballroom with a good sized dance floor on all their ships, and the dance couples on Cunard are generally at a level where they can teach not only basic classes every sea day but also in private lessons to competition standard, and who have had significant high level competition experience of their own previously.

 

Clearly when you look at what is provided by other cruise lines the availability of ballroom and Latin dancing is missing, and usually only a small dance floor with less frequent ballroom dancing than every night, and often more of the American style of dancing or party dancing, rather than the classic International ballroom and Latin styles, and often not for the entire evening. 

 

So Cunard and P&O have a captive audience of ballroom dancers - and having had conversations with quite a few dancers on cruises it seems that for those passengers a ship without ballroom facilities will not be on their list of cruise bookings - so it is possible that the loss of any ballroom opportunities on Iona will lead to an increase in bookings on the Cunard ships where ballroom dancing is a central attraction and a special part of the cruise for passengers who love to dance or who really enjoy watching the dancing. There is a huge following for ballroom dancing - the ten million or so TV viewers who follow Strictly are a testament to that!

 

The main reason for cruises without dance instructors is lack of sea days a lot only have one and some have two. It’s the same with Bridge and other activities involving instructors.

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That's very disappointing if there will be no facilities for Ballroom Dancing on Iona.

We enjoy Dancing and find it an important part of our cruising experience.

Currently all the other ships in the P&O fleet offer Ballroom Dancing so I guess us dancers will avoid Iona in the future and cruise on one of their other ships.

Lets hope P&O change their mind before Iona comes into service.

 

 

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They don't seem to be ones to change thier minds - or at least if they do, it's not a quick decision. If there's enough demand, they might consider working in some sort of dance floor - but they probably won't do it until she has a spruce up - which I guess won't be until '25 or beyond.

 

Shame there isn't a dedicated location - but surely they'll work something out with one of the existing venues?

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Sorry but personally I think they really do not want a 'Ballroom Vibe' on Iona.  The Emerald Bar is meant to have "Covent Garden" chic and The 710 Club is "Cocktails and acoustic music sets". My guess would be that Britannia is the last P&O ship that will have been - or will be - built with a space dedicated to Ballroom/Sequence dancing.  Unless they ever get around to building or acquiring another small ship... 

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10 minutes ago, Monorail Orange said:

Oh if only they were to build another 'mid-size'. It's a shame they are (sort of) being phased out.

 

It is a P&O/Carnival decision, based on economics.  Viking Ocean are building 'small' ships as are Saga but their prices are considerably higher than P&O.

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17 minutes ago, Monorail Orange said:

Oh if only they were to build another 'mid-size'. It's a shame they are (sort of) being phased out.

 

Cunard are building a mid-sized (around three thousand passengers) new ship due for 2022, and it will have a ballroom. I guess P&O are not interested in the same type of passenger that is attracted to Cunard.

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13 hours ago, mcloaked said:

 

Cunard are building a mid-sized (around three thousand passengers) new ship due for 2022, and it will have a ballroom. I guess P&O are not interested in the same type of passenger that is attracted to Cunard.

 

I guess it depends on your definition of mid-sized.  The new Cunarder will be 113,000 tons and around 3000 pax, making her almost identical in size to Azura/Ventura.  That to me is a big ship - even if she will carry less pax than the P&O pair.

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3 hours ago, Britboys said:

 

I guess it depends on your definition of mid-sized.  The new Cunarder will be 113,000 tons and around 3000 pax, making her almost identical in size to Azura/Ventura.  That to me is a big ship - even if she will carry less pax than the P&O pair.

Holland America ( also part of carnival of course) are bringing out new ships of 99,500 tons with around 2600 passaengers. One came out in 2016, another 2018 and one for 2019. P&O could use this design for a new build, if they though there were sufficient demand for it.

 

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20 hours ago, Spike11 said:

Holland America ( also part of carnival of course) are bringing out new ships of 99,500 tons with around 2600 passaengers. One came out in 2016, another 2018 and one for 2019. P&O could use this design for a new build, if they though there were sufficient demand for it.

 

 

I guess it will depend on how well the two new 5000+ pax ships sell for P&O.  If they do well enough, P&O may choose to go for a third and do away with the smaller ships as they age.  Personally I prefer Aurora-sized ships and Arcadia is about as big as I want to go.  Once these two come to the end of their lives, I will be saying goodbye to P&O (assuming I don't meet my demise before Aurora & Arcadia 😁).

 

HAL in some ways has a similar passenger base to P&O - i.e. a longstanding & loyal set of pax.  I understand that the new, larger ships have not gone down well with all their pax.

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22 hours ago, Monorail Orange said:

I know I've said it before, but I can see a time where Azura and Ventura are both called "our classic small ships".

 

I think you are right when it comes to P&O - that's when I will be sailing Saga, Fred Olsen or CMV!

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I think that Carnival has a plan for P&O and sadly I don't think it is for it to be the traditional line that it was and is now (sort of). When we were on Britannia on the Behind the Scenes Tour Paul Brown said that the future was big ships for P&O. That was in 2015 and it is certainly proving to be true.

I think that P&O will be Carnival's lower end of the market, cheep and cheerful, family orientated, more casual line and they will try to push anyone who wants something a notch up to Princess.

Just my thinking

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5 hours ago, Presto2 said:

I think that Carnival has a plan for P&O and sadly I don't think it is for it to be the traditional line that it was and is now (sort of). When we were on Britannia on the Behind the Scenes Tour Paul Brown said that the future was big ships for P&O. That was in 2015 and it is certainly proving to be true.

I think that P&O will be Carnival's lower end of the market, cheep and cheerful, family orientated, more casual line and they will try to push anyone who wants something a notch up to Princess.

Just my thinking

 

I fear you may be right. Once all of Oriana, Arcadia, Aurora and Oceana have gone (which hopefully won't be for quite a few years yet), I shall have to look elsewhere, as I wouldn't want to cruise on anything substantially bigger.

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10 minutes ago, jh1809 said:

 

I fear you may be right. Once all of Oriana, Arcadia, Aurora and Oceana have gone (which hopefully won't be for quite a few years yet), I shall have to look elsewhere, as I wouldn't want to cruise on anything substantially bigger.

 

We just have hope that Venice keep up the ban on big ships ! I think it saved Oceana's bacon - so to speak - as they had to replace Ventura for the fly med cruises as a result :-)

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On 11/8/2018 at 12:28 PM, Britboys said:

 

I think you are right when it comes to P&O - that's when I will be sailing Saga, Fred Olsen or CMV!

Saga will shortly have a brand new ship, CMV has acquired newer ships from Carnival recently, but Fred's newest ship is Braemar which was built in 1993, the other two date back to the 70's.  Surely they must be making enough profits at their prices to update their fleet?

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