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Sony A6400 intrp had a few surprises...


pierces
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Just finished watching the intro and I was somewhat impressed. Maybe a little more than somewhat.

 

  • Still 24MP but rated at ISO 32000 now expandable to ISO 102400
  • Real time Eye-AF now works on animals as well. Eye-AF include settings for Auto / Right Eye / Left Eye, and a Switch Right / Left Eye.
  • 425 focus points with A9-generation Bionz processor for advanced tracking
  •  .02 sec AF acquisition (optimal conditions).
  •  Touchscreen can now trigger shutter and initiate focus tracking.
  •  Flip-up 180° LCD for vloggers and narcissists.
  •  BUILT-IN INTERVALOMETER!
  •  Back to 116 frames JPEG Standard / 46 frames RAW compressed buffer but 11 fps mechanical and 8 fps silent with full AE and AF functionality.
  • $900 MSRP

 

Not the Holy Grail, but my wish for a strong small-form APS-C camera may have been heard. Thanks, Santa!

 

Won't pre-order but I'm not turning my nose up at it either.

 

 

Dave

 

P.S. Havoc: this looks an awful lot like the model consolidation you were postulating.

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5 minutes ago, pierces said:

 

Just finished watching the intro and I was somewhat impressed. Maybe a little more than somewhat.

 

  • Still 24MP but rated at ISO 32000 now expandable to ISO 102400
  • Real time Eye-AF now works on animals as well. Eye-AF include settings for Auto / Right Eye / Left Eye, and a Switch Right / Left Eye.
  • 425 focus points with A9-generation Bionz processor for advanced tracking
  •  .02 sec AF acquisition (optimal conditions).
  •  Touchscreen can now trigger shutter and initiate focus tracking.
  •  Flip-up 180° LCD for vloggers and narcissists.
  •  BUILT-IN INTERVALOMETER!
  •  Back to 116 frames JPEG Standard / 46 frames RAW compressed buffer but 11 fps mechanical and 8 fps silent with full AE and AF functionality.
  • $900 MSRP

 

Not the Holy Grail, but my wish for a strong small-form APS-C camera may have been heard. Thanks, Santa!

 

Won't pre-order but I'm not turning my nose up at it either.

 

 

Dave

 

P.S. Havoc: this looks an awful lot like the model consolidation you were postulating.

 

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I'd call that a nice update to the A6000/6300 line - likely replacing both.  Not enough to make me feel I need to upgrade to it from the A6300, but not disappointing either.  One thing they didn't mention, so I assume it doesn't exist - did the silent shooting/electronic shutter also inherit the A9's readout rate that allows it to shoot action without rolling shutter?  Otherwise the 8fps tracking in silent shutter won't have much use...but mechanical shutter tracking remains up to 11fps like the current models, so nothing lost there.

 

I was worried the flippy 180 screen, touch screen stuff, and numerous references to 'vlog' were going to take the A6000/6300 in a completely different, consumer/phone direction, so happy to hear it takes all the same good still camera attributes and even improves on them.

 

Now I'm really looking forward to seeing what the higher-end APS-C rumors turn out to be in a month or so. 

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32 minutes ago, tommui987 said:

Thanks for the update!

 

What is the site where you got the update?

 

 

Originally sonyalpharumors.com but it's popping up on DPReview and all of the othersby now.

 

Dave

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42 minutes ago, zackiedawg said:

..did the silent shooting/electronic shutter also inherit the A9's readout rate that allows it to shoot action without rolling shutter?  Otherwise the 8fps tracking in silent shutter won't have much use....

 

The next-gen Bionz processor will improve buffer clearing and fuel the AI on the tracking AF, Eye-AF, playback, HDR, etc., but unless the new sensor has the stacked memory of the A9 sensor, readout will likely not be much, if any faster than the current generation. They would have mentioned that since it would have been a big deal, so I assume that whiz-bang feature along with a blackout-free viewfinder is limited to the APs-C/whatever camera.

 

Just a note. All of the specs aren't out yet but I went back over the press release and see no mention of IBIS. May explain the less-than-expected $900 MSRP.

 

 

Dave

Edited by pierces
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Well, well, well...

 

That improved Eye-AF with the eye-choice options and Animal Eye-AF that I mentioned will be added to the A9, A7rIII and A7III models via firmware updates.

 

Oh, they're adding the intervalometer too! 😄

 

 

Dave

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Yup, looks a bit like they took my suggestions. (not that I think they literally took them from me).

Really, it's a pretty amazing camera for $900. A clear upgrade from the A6300. It really looks like an upgrade from the A6500 -- Except for IBIS and buffer depth. Yet, the buffer depth is still excellent for 99% of people. And IBIS isn't a big deal if you are using the Sony aps-c lenses, which mostly have OSS.  (It's a big deal for adapting lenses or using certain FE lenses).  

 

My guess is that the A6500 will be replaced soon -- maybe next month. There just isn't much reason to take the A6500 except for IBIS.

 

And this plays into my suggestion: IBIS is more of an enthusiast feature. So the A6500 gets replaced with an A7000 -- Mostly the same stuff as the A6400, but the addition of IBIS and an A7-like body. (and probably the addition of an A9 blackout free EVF).

 

That's a pretty rational lineup: For those that want performance in a compact body, the A6400. For those that want longer battery life, bigger grip, dual card slots, etc, with all that performance -- a $1500 A7000.

 

 

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6 hours ago, zackiedawg said:

I'd call that a nice update to the A6000/6300 line - likely replacing both.  Not enough to make me feel I need to upgrade to it from the A6300, but not disappointing either.  One thing they didn't mention, so I assume it doesn't exist - did the silent shooting/electronic shutter also inherit the A9's readout rate that allows it to shoot action without rolling shutter?  Otherwise the 8fps tracking in silent shutter won't have much use...but mechanical shutter tracking remains up to 11fps like the current models, so nothing lost there.

 

I was worried the flippy 180 screen, touch screen stuff, and numerous references to 'vlog' were going to take the A6000/6300 in a completely different, consumer/phone direction, so happy to hear it takes all the same good still camera attributes and even improves on them.

 

Now I'm really looking forward to seeing what the higher-end APS-C rumors turn out to be in a month or so. 

 

The silent shutter will be very useful — but not so much for a wildlife photographer. 

 

For or shooting candids, events, street photography — any time you want discretion. 

 

My guess is that the readout speed will be better than the a7 cameras but not as good as the A9 — it’s simply faster to read a smaller sensor. 

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3 hours ago, havoc315 said:

That's a pretty rational lineup: For those that want performance in a compact body, the A6400. For those that want longer battery life, bigger grip, dual card slots, etc, with all that performance -- a $1500 A7000.

 

 

 

My A77 was a bad boy in its day and was $1598. $1600-$1700 for a A7-bodied APS-C rocketship would turn a head or two.

 

Come to think of it, that's cheaper than buying a longer lens for the full-frame camera you bought only a year ago... 😉

 

Dave

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12 hours ago, havoc315 said:

 

The silent shutter will be very useful — but not so much for a wildlife photographer. 

 

For or shooting candids, events, street photography — any time you want discretion. [/quote]

I've used it on occasion with my A6300 - it definitely has its uses - I shot some quiet stage shows that didn't involve huge fast movements and it worked great.  With the various other A9 focus updates claimed, and the fact that they touted the 8fps in silent shutter mode, it made me wonder if they might have tried to increase the read-out speeds - though clearly not up to A9 standards.  I would like to see that in the higher-end APS-C body to come though...essentially an A9 in every performance way except with APS-C sensor.  Budget wouldn't be an issue for me personally...I've been highly tempted to even get the A9 more than a few times, but the 24MP full-frame holds me back every time I'm cropping into a 24MP APS-C wildlife or bird shot, and try to imagine how much more I'd need to crop if full frame.

 

 

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39 minutes ago, zackiedawg said:

I've used it on occasion with my A6300 - it definitely has its uses - I shot some quiet stage shows that didn't involve huge fast movements and it worked great.  With the various other A9 focus updates claimed, and the fact that they touted the 8fps in silent shutter mode, it made me wonder if they might have tried to increase the read-out speeds - though clearly not up to A9 standards.  I would like to see that in the higher-end APS-C body to come though...essentially an A9 in every performance way except with APS-C sensor.  Budget wouldn't be an issue for me personally...I've been highly tempted to even get the A9 more than a few times, but the 24MP full-frame holds me back every time I'm cropping into a 24MP APS-C wildlife or bird shot, and try to imagine how much more I'd need to crop if full frame.

 

 

 

I still suspect there will be an a7000 — a9 with crop sensor. It would make sense for enthusiast sports/wildlife shooters. Akin to the Nikon d500, which is largely a mini d5. 

 

The a9 is pretty amazing and the new firmware will really fix some of my complaints. 

 

Yes, for your birding, aps-c probably makes more sense. You need to consider how much your cropping. And what lens you’re using. If you are already cropping many of your images to 100% with the 100-400.... then you’d need to add the 1.4 converter on the a9. If you’re already cropping 100% with the 1.4 converter.. you start running out of options. 

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13 hours ago, pierces said:

 

My A77 was a bad boy in its day and was $1598. $1600-$1700 for a A7-bodied APS-C rocketship would turn a head or two.

 

Come to think of it, that's cheaper than buying a longer lens for the full-frame camera you bought only a year ago... 😉

 

Dave

 

Mostly for curiosity, I just picked up an a77ii + 16-50/2.8 for only $550 used. They are still trying to get $1700 new. 

 

Dang... it’s outdated. But the ergonomics mostly still feel pretty good compared to e-mount. But iq, features, performance... all feel ancient. Feels more than 5 years old, it’s actual age. 

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5 hours ago, havoc315 said:

 

Mostly for curiosity, I just picked up an a77ii + 16-50/2.8 for only $550 used. They are still trying to get $1700 new. 

 

Dang... it’s outdated. But the ergonomics mostly still feel pretty good compared to e-mount. But iq, features, performance... all feel ancient. Feels more than 5 years old, it’s actual age. 

 

It is more than 5 years old. The A77II was an small incremental upgrade over the A77 with a slightly improved sensor, a better LCD and a very few internal improvements around the video subsystem. Move that tech back 4 years to when the A77 was released and it was a pretty impressive package. 

 

I personally feel the A77II was a bone thrown to the A-mount users since all the R&D was in E-mount at the time. A small bone. Almost devoid of meat. I didn't even blink when it was released since it honestly was the same camera. It never really had a chance since the A6000 was released at about the same time and sort of drove another nail into the A-mount's coffin.

 

Now, the 16-50 f/2.8 was a nice lens. It is the only thing I miss about the A-mount. (I kept the now-adapted 100mm Minolta macro or I'd miss it too.) I hope they put some of the new G-series magic into the rumored E-mount version for the new APS-C flagship which I won't be buying. Maybe. Depends on specs. I might be deluding myself.

 

Dave

 

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14 minutes ago, pierces said:

 

It is more than 5 years old. The A77II was an small incremental upgrade over the A77 with a slightly improved sensor, a better LCD and a very few internal improvements around the video subsystem. Move that tech back 4 years to when the A77 was released and it was a pretty impressive package. 

 

I personally feel the A77II was a bone thrown to the A-mount users since all the R&D was in E-mount at the time. A small bone. Almost devoid of meat. I didn't even blink when it was released since it honestly was the same camera. It never really had a chance since the A6000 was released at about the same time and sort of drove another nail into the A-mount's coffin.

 

Now, the 16-50 f/2.8 was a nice lens. It is the only thing I miss about the A-mount. (I kept the now-adapted 100mm Minolta macro or I'd miss it too.) I hope they put some of the new G-series magic into the rumored E-mount version for the new APS-C flagship which I won't be buying. Maybe. Depends on specs. I might be deluding myself.

 

Dave

 

 

The A77ii offered some major autofocus upgrades. It went from 19 focus points to 79 focus points. That was the big change. Also offered rudimentary eye-AF. (works only in AF-S), and lock-on AF.

 

Not sure whether I'm going to keep it. Or just use it as a basis to write a blog post about the continued relevance of the A-mount.

 

In theory, IQ should be 1 stop behind full frame. But it's more like 2-3 stops behind the IQ of today's Sony e-mount full frame. (At really low ISO, it still looks good.. but I did a night time test yesterday... the A9 took a fairly high quality handheld dark night shot at ISO 25,600 (1/6th, F4). ... the A77ii looked absolutely horrible at ISO 12,800. (shot at 1/6th F2.8).  I'll do some more testing but I feel like the A77ii goes south quickly after ISO 3200, which is disappointing even for an aps-c camera in 2019. 

 

The grip and buttons do mostly feel a heck of a lot better than the e-mount cameras. (though I prefer the joystick on the A7/A9 models).   The size of the A77ii is surprisingly close to the A7 models -- I'd be willing to buy an A7 camera stuck inside the A77ii body for the most part. (still smaller than a full frame dSLR body). 

 

The 16-50/2.8 is an excellent lens. I remember buying it used about 6 years ago for $500ish... now you can get it used for $200. If I was picking up an A6400, I would seriously consider using it with the 16-50/2.8 and the LAEA3 adapter. At least I'd test how well they worked together. 

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2 hours ago, havoc315 said:

 

In theory, IQ should be 1 stop behind full frame. But it's more like 2-3 stops behind the IQ of today's Sony e-mount full frame. (At really low ISO, it still looks good.. but I did a night time test yesterday... the A9 took a fairly high quality handheld dark night shot at ISO 25,600 (1/6th, F4). ... the A77ii looked absolutely horrible at ISO 12,800. (shot at 1/6th F2.8).  I'll do some more testing but I feel like the A77ii goes south quickly after ISO 3200, which is disappointing even for an aps-c camera in 2019. 

 

 

I seldom shot at ISO3200. Mostly I capped it at ISO1600 and shot like a sniper. 

 

Two things are different from the A77II to today's Sony APS-C sensors, BSI and much improved processing for both RAW and JPEG. The BSI design along with the use of copper wiring on the chip instead of aluminum was a major leap in sensor tech and I have a sneaky feeling we're due for another one in a year or two.

 

IAGTTBAP!

 

Dave

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Sony sent me an email on Tuesday or Wednesday. I had a bunch of points and thought about using them which I spend about an hour getting my login set back up, my points have been being removed every year.

Anyway

 

https://www.sony.com/electronics/interchangeable-lens-cameras/ilce-6400/specifications?cpint=SG_PRODUCT_DETAILS_PRI-TOUT-PDP-ILCE-6400-EN_GL-2018-11-M01-GRABBEST#specifications

 

And its on amazon today for preorder with 3 different prices, 899 no lens, 999 16-50 and 1299 18-135

 

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On 1/17/2019 at 9:26 AM, havoc315 said:

Please share: 

 

My recommendations if you are considering purchasing the Sony A6400 and building a system around it: https://enthusiastphotoblog.com/2019/01/17/recommended-sony-a6400-lenses-and-accessories/

Thank you, great read. I have bee thinking about this type of camera for the last 3-4 months, almost pulled the trigger at Christmas time. I think I will buy on release to take with me in May to Alaska.

 

Any recommendations on filters for taking shots on and at Glaciers?

 

Thanks

 

 

 

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2 minutes ago, AlanF65 said:

Thank you, great read. I have bee thinking about this type of camera for the last 3-4 months, almost pulled the trigger at Christmas time. I think I will buy on release to take with me in May to Alaska.

 

Any recommendations on filters for taking shots on and at Glaciers?

 

Thanks

 

 

 

You really don't need filters for those types of images with today's cameras.

There are 3 main common types of filters:

UV filters: These basically just protect the lens. Some people recommend against them, as why would you add extra glass in front of your lens? THey basically are like phone screen protectors.

ND filters: These are sunglasses -- they are helpful if you are shooting long exposure on a tripod. You can read about it here:https://enthusiastphotoblog.com/2018/07/02/long-exposure-with-sony-a7riii/

 

The last common type of filter (there are lots of other less common filters) are polarizing filters. They "polarize" the light -- the effect being they will make your skies darker and bluer. So that can be desirable for shoot glaciers but you can easily achieve the same effect --- with better control -- in post processing the image.

 

For Alaska -- the A6400 with:

10-18/4 (Alaska has sprawling landscapes)

70-300 (for wildlife)

 

Something in the "normal" range -- the 18-135 zoom or, personally, I'd carry the 35/1.8 as my normal lens, in between the wide and telephoto zooms.

 

If you are going to get a chance to shoot waterfalls on land, then also bring a small tripod and ND filters.

 

Remember, expensive lenses can be rented instead of purchased. 

 

 

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On 1/17/2019 at 7:26 AM, havoc315 said:

Please share: 

 

My recommendations if you are considering purchasing the Sony A6400 and building a system around it: https://enthusiastphotoblog.com/2019/01/17/recommended-sony-a6400-lenses-and-accessories/

 Your website ethusiastphotoblog.com is always filled with useful information and should be permanently bookmarked.

 

Tempted to replace my A6300 for the A6400 but anxious to see what the A7000(?) will be like.

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38 minutes ago, tommui987 said:

 Your website ethusiastphotoblog.com is always filled with useful information and should be permanently bookmarked.

 

Tempted to replace my A6300 for the A6400 but anxious to see what the A7000(?) will be like.

 

No reason to rush. 

If there is any truth to the rumors (and my own guess), the a7000 with be a $1500-$2000 mini A9.  Expect the a7/a9 body (only the sensor is the mini part), all the advantages of the bigger body — IBIS, dual slots, bigger battery.  And if it’s truly a mini A8, then a fantastic silent shutter with blackout free EVF.

 

The a6400 is certainly an upgrade over the a6300 but not sure it’s a big enough upgrade to rush out and spend $900.  Some people are annoyed that the a6400 is basically an a6300 + flip screen + “firmware upgrades.”

But the fact is, the a6300 isn’t getting those upgrades and they are significant. 

So I’m on the fence as to whether it’s a good upgrade for a6300 owners. 

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On 1/19/2019 at 11:50 AM, havoc315 said:

 

No reason to rush. 

Thanks but ... 🙂

The eye-focus is appealing to me plus the firmware upgrade.

Having a bunch of batteries for the A6300 and my RX10-III, all Sony lenses stabilized except for the 10mm, I don't think the IBIS, dual slots is that big a deal.

Would IBIS and stabilized lenses be redundant?

 

On the other hand, who knows what wonders will be in the A7000?

 

Should wait and see but the temptation is there!

 

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