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14 minutes ago, blcruising said:

Aw man, I love this strategy! Lets rip off and gouge affluent people. They can afford it, and might enjoy being gouged. I don't know too many affluent people that enjoy being ripped off on a regular basis.  I wonder why more businesses haven't thought of this, first. Or maybe they have, and failed miserably.

 

The fact remains NCL is the entry level (budget) brand for Norwegian Cruise Line Holdings.  Many of NCL passengers are budget-minded, working class folks, that spend their hard earned money to enjoy a vacation. It is the Carnival of Carnival Corporation and the Royal Caribbean of the RCL Group. When a think about upscale cruise lines, I think Silversea, Cunard, or Regent Seven Seas and Oceania (which are part of  NCL Holdings).

For the most part you are right, except I wouldn't call it the line of working class cruisers, but middle class for sure. I do, however know a lot of people that are closer to upper middle class that will continue to sail NCL, just like some will always sail RCI> By no means is NCL geared to luxury and should not be compared. There is a need for lines lines NCL for sure. I do wish NCL would have thought this through a little closer. I wish there was an answer, but feat the decision will never be changed. In fact it probably wouldn't be good business to say: OK we drop the price back down cause you guys are happy. Now, they could think of something that would soften the blow: maybe add coffee and water to the UBP? Just a thought. 

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14 minutes ago, blcruising said:

Aw man, I love this strategy! Lets rip off and gouge affluent people. They can afford it, and might enjoy being gouged. I don't know too many affluent people that enjoy being ripped off on a regular basis.  I wonder why more businesses haven't thought of this, first. Or maybe they have, and failed miserably.

 

The fact remains NCL is the entry level (budget) brand for Norwegian Cruise Line Holdings.  Many of NCL passengers are budget-minded, working class folks, that spend their hard earned money to enjoy a vacation. It is the Carnival of Carnival Corporation and the Royal Caribbean of the RCL Group. When a think about upscale cruise lines, I think Silversea, Cunard, or Regent Seven Seas and Oceania (which are part of  NCL Holdings).

And there you have it! 

Frank Del Rio wants NCL’s profit margin to mirror his upscale lines. If he is  successful, he will be the hero. If not.........?

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On 1/23/2019 at 6:50 AM, SeaShark said:

 

Exactly. What they really fear is the "silent" lost customer...not the whiners.

 

To put it another way...

 

FDR made changes that people do not like. When the people complain, write letters, and explain what they are upset about, FDR has the OPPORTUNITY to adjust his strategy. (IIRC, at one point he said in an interview that he wanted to clear out the budget cruisers that NCL had attracted...people who worried over the cost of each and every little thing...and replace them with a more affluent group who wasn't as concerned about the cost of things).

 

However...the "silent" cruiser is lost business without an explanation as to why...when customers start disappearing without explanation, you don't "adjust", you replace. And if enough business disappears, the Board will eventually show FDR...and his policies...the door.

 

Interesting philosophy of FDR.  Funny, the more money we make, the more careful with money we are.  All the affluent people I know chafe at getting ripped off and are quite financially savvy.   Frankly, the very wealthy people I know are downright cheap.  Lol.  Good luck with that strategy, Frank.  

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7 minutes ago, Cafedumonde said:

 

Interesting philosophy of FDR.  Funny, the more money we make, the more careful with money we are.  All the affluent people I know chafe at getting ripped off and are quite financially savvy.   Frankly, the very wealthy people I know are downright cheap.  Lol.  Good luck with that strategy, Frank.  

Yeah, I agree.  I see folks living hand to mouth, paycheck to paycheck, and spending freely.  Folks I know who ARE affluent in many cases got that way by being smart with their spending.  Not being a miser - Haven certainly is NOT for misers - but recognizing value vs ripoff, and choosing their "splurges" based on value.

 

DH used to have a delivery route to a relatively low income area of Philadelphia.  He was a distributor for snack cakes.  He did the most single-pack business in the lower-income neighborhoods; the upper middle class ones were more likely to buy family pack because it's a better deal.   'nuff said

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4 hours ago, vicnsue said:

And there you have it! 

Frank Del Rio wants NCL’s profit margin to mirror his upscale lines. If he is  successful, he will be the hero. If not.........?


i wont be surprised to see FDR try to make the Haven experience very similar to the Regent Seven Seas and Oceania experience. 

This partly why i hate the stupid ship within a ship concept, greed will take over and sooner or later that portion of the ship will effect the whole ship in someway or other. 

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It's ridic.  And those of us bothered should help spread the word on other social media,  Twiiter,  Instagram,  FB. Maybe this will give first-time cruisers pause when considering NCL, being lured by the "free" drink package. 

 

Want a double shot of Grey Goose? Here's the cost breakdown:

 

Without UBP perk: $47.88 each double

 

With UBP perk: $11.88 each double,  plus $19.80 daily service charge on UBP.

 

With "premium" UBP: covered at a cost of $54.60 per person per day. 

 

The $54.60 pp/pd is fairly inline with what other lines charge in the first place. NCL's UBP is pretty much a bad joke at this point, especially as offered as a "perk." 

 

 

 

Edited by AlexandNessa

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1 hour ago, Cafedumonde said:

 

Interesting philosophy of FDR.  Funny, the more money we make, the more careful with money we are.  All the affluent people I know chafe at getting ripped off and are quite financially savvy.   Frankly, the very wealthy people I know are downright cheap.  Lol.  Good luck with that strategy, Frank.  

 

This is exactly our situation as well. For us, we believed that the value was on par with the price they were asking ... so we kept cruising with NCL.

 

We averaged about $12,000/week for the two of us in DOS on the Breakaway and Escape over the past 3 years. Each time we kind of felt the price/value was knocked down a peg. Whether it was the constant $2-3 charge for a drink, the continually abysmal wine list, the so so food quality any place outside the Haven, or the DSC increases (for, if anything, worse quality service). Again, none of these things were bad in and of themselves, but they added up. We still loved our cruises, but now feel the value (especially in the Haven) is just not there.

 

For us, the final blow was when we priced out a cruise on Seabourn to join my brother and sister in-law next year. I told my brother “no way, that would be too much money for a cruise.” Frankly, when I priced it out, I was shocked. Granted, we won’t have that massive suite and deck we are used to inside the peaceful Haven, but I was able to secure an Owner’s suite (about 1/2 the size of a DOS it looks like) for only $1,000 more per person!

 

That may seem like a lot more, but included with my Seabourn fare is ALL meals at ALL restaurants (including their Thomas Keller restaurant), unlimited open bar with all premium brands, unlimited in suite bar stocked to my requests, on demand champagne and caviar (ok, not at all my thing but my spouse is psyched about this one), unlimited internet, 24 hr complimentary room service (no menu restrictions),  specialty coffee drinks from the cafe, bottled still and sparkling water, free car service to and from airport and port, and a suite butler. All of that would certainly add up to more than $1,000/pp on an NCL ship (if it is even possible).

 

In short, the value proposition of sailing on a luxury line seems much higher than sailing in the Haven on a mass market line. Now, i’ll admit, the jury is still out on how we will handle a 450 passenger ship with a crew to guest ratio of roughly 1:1 or a more formal dress code or how we will hit it off with other passengers (by all accounts it looks like we will be about 20yrs younger than average). But for us, a true luxury cruise for only $1,000/pp more just seemed like a no brainer.

 

I will miss sailing on the larger NCL ships as we always had a good time and met some great people, but the value is simply not there anymore.

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8 hours ago, gmbhardy said:

 

As a customer service professional why don’t you write a form letter on the issue that everyone could copy and paste over their own signature and send to NCL.

I am still waiting for that generic letter to be posted by people smarter than the average bear!  Can someone FINALLY provide it?  Not too short, not too long.  Hit hot spots.  Be concise.  Refrain from dangling participles.  Watch punctuation.  I will have to review it, before sending to higher hierarchy.

It is easy to criticize others, everyone/anyone can do it.  It takes a smarter/stronger person to actually offer a solution and take action.

We solved the problem by talking it out!  Now we just need someone to post the "generic form letter" which satisfies everyone!  Good grief...

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24 minutes ago, OceanBlueWaters said:

I am still waiting for that generic letter to be posted by people smarter than the average bear!  Can someone FINALLY provide it?  Not too short, not too long.  Hit hot spots.  Be concise.  Refrain from dangling participles.  Watch punctuation.  I will have to review it, before sending to higher hierarchy.

It is easy to criticize others, everyone/anyone can do it.  It takes a smarter/stronger person to actually offer a solution and take action.

We solved the problem by talking it out!  Now we just need someone to post the "generic form letter" which satisfies everyone!  Good grief...

 

Yes we had a number of customer service people critize the OP’s effort (I personally though it was very good) yet none of them have come forward with a more “acceptable” complaint letter.

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I think a short letter written by individuals beats the form letter every time, and will be taken more seriously.

 

Disclaimer:  I don't work in this type of customer service, nor have I ever - no professional knowledge, just common sense.

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3 minutes ago, gmbhardy said:

 

Yes we had a number of customer service people critize the OP’s effort (I personally though it was very good) yet none of them have come forward with a more “acceptable” complaint letter.

Don't hold your breath.  The same people will jump in with their 2 cents which offer no value to the convo.  I still think it is a race for the "post count".  I can do without that and try to skip over those people.  I come here for info and 90% is same people posting and piggy-backing off a question that was answered 10 pages ago.  Raising their Post count?  I don't have time for that...

JMO 🙂

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38 minutes ago, OceanBlueWaters said:

I am still waiting for that generic letter to be posted by people smarter than the average bear!  Can someone FINALLY provide it?  Not too short, not too long.  Hit hot spots.  Be concise.  Refrain from dangling participles.  Watch punctuation.  I will have to review it, before sending to higher hierarchy.

It is easy to criticize others, everyone/anyone can do it.  It takes a smarter/stronger person to actually offer a solution and take action.

We solved the problem by talking it out!  Now we just need someone to post the "generic form letter" which satisfies everyone!  Good grief...

 

One...as adults, we should write our own letters, not expect someone else to do it for us. Don't know how to write a proper letter? Then it is time to learn how. Everyone should be able to write a proper letter. (Free lesson #1: Write a letter, not an email.)

 

Two...Remember how you feel when a company responds to you with a form letter. For those same reasons, you don't want to use a form letter to complain...especially a copy & paste letter.

 

Three...If an issue is important enough to you, it is important enough to write your own letter...not just copy someone else's. Nothing would hit the round file faster than receiving the same letter from multiple people. The very definition of spam. Put in some effort, don't grab on to someone else's work with a "me too".

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43 minutes ago, OceanBlueWaters said:

We solved the problem by talking it out!  Now we just need someone to post the "generic form letter" which satisfies everyone!  Good grief...

 

I have never worked in a company where the letters get read by anyone other than someone who reads them quickly, makes sure they are "just" a complaint, and tallies up the complaint for a report to management. By the time it gets to management the individual complaint is averaged and smoothed and compared to the ratio of complaints for prior periods. If 1% of passengers complained last year and this year the percentage is only .75% then the company is doing good. If it's 1.2% then the company has to address some areas. Then they dig deeper.

In some cases the letter will get escalated because it's a legal issue, or the FBI has to be called in. But otherwise there isn't too much you have to worry about.

"I took a cruise last week and it was really cool, but the drink prices are way too high. Thanks for listening" is as good (actually better) than a long treatise because the person doing the reports can figure out what the  heck you're mad at.

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6 minutes ago, SeaShark said:

 

One...as adults, we should write our own letters, not expect someone else to do it for us. Don't know how to write a proper letter? Then it is time to learn how. Everyone should be able to write a proper letter. (Free lesson #1: Write a letter, not an email.)

 

Two...Remember how you feel when a company responds to you with a form letter. For those same reasons, you don't want to use a form letter to complain...especially a copy & paste letter.

 

Three...If an issue is important enough to you, it is important enough to write your own letter...not just copy someone else's. Nothing would hit the round file faster than receiving the same letter from multiple people. The very definition of spam. Put in some effort, don't grab on to someone else's work with a "me too".

I was being sarcastic.  People on this thread criticized OP's letter/email....

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12 minutes ago, gmbhardy said:

 

Yes we had a number of customer service people critize the OP’s effort (I personally though it was very good) yet none of them have come forward with a more “acceptable” complaint letter.

GMB, let me start by saying I don’t agree how NCL handled the situation of the cost increase one bit, but it’s like most of the price increase we see we are not given warning before hand.  

If I were running a customer service department and saw several form letters saying the same thing but with different signatures I would deep six them, thinking the were a ploy by my competition.  I have read all of yours and others threads and studied the new pricing against previous pricing and from what I can gather we are discussing a decision that affects about 5% of the items listed in their menus.  I totally understand it has affected you and your beverage of choice and others, but after reading the threads it  is a commonality of about 5 liquiors, and I empathize with all. 

For me personally and I’m sure quite a few others it has not changed a thing now or on my future cruises with NCL.  But if beer ever gets to $15 I’m out of there. 

Not trying to start any arguments or personal battles just expressing a different view.

Thanks and the best of luck.  

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24 minutes ago, cheersforbeers said:

But if beer ever gets to $15 I’m out of there. 

 

I rest my case.

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On 1/22/2019 at 6:31 AM, shof515 said:

 

Carnival Cruises sail out of New York and there is a tax on alcohol when purchased on board the ship until it reaches international waters. The same thing happens when Carnival sails out of Texas. Royal Caribbean is the only cruise line that i read about that has no alcohol port tax during embarkation day 

I've had this same experience on Royal and Princess.  I think the OP missed the mark with that particular complaint.

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8 hours ago, fyree39 said:

I've had this same experience on Royal and Princess.  I think the OP missed the mark with that particular complaint.

The concern isn't charging taxes in port; the complaint was about continuing to charge tax after sailaway claiming the ship wasn't in international waters, yet the casino and shops were open. If your casino is open, you shouldn't be collecting taxes on drinks.

 

Edited by KateQ22003

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11 hours ago, erdoran said:

I think a short letter written by individuals beats the form letter every time, and will be taken more seriously.

 

Disclaimer:  I don't work in this type of customer service, nor have I ever - no professional knowledge, just common sense.

exactly, a generic letter is as bad as a too long letter. Just keep a letter short, make sure complaints are not too detailed and sandwich the complaint between a couple of positives.  And for heavens sake do not compare a product with a similar product or threaten to never use their product again. Give the company the chance to make you want to come back or want to use the product at least one more time. 

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2 hours ago, KateQ22003 said:

The concern isn't charging taxes in port; the complaint was about continuing to charge tax after sailaway claiming the ship wasn't in international waters, yet the casino and shops were open. If your casino is open, you shouldn't be collecting taxes on drinks.

 

This is exactly my big issue.  If it's legit to charge me taxes go ahead, it's not that much $$ in the scheme of things.  This ^^^ is a different story.  I would think, though, that if there was dishonesty the consequences would be so severe that it wouldn't be worth the risk for the relatively small $$ gained.

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21 hours ago, blcruising said:

Aw man, I love this strategy! Lets rip off and gouge affluent people. They can afford it, and might enjoy being gouged. I don't know too many affluent people that enjoy being ripped off on a regular basis.  I wonder why more businesses haven't thought of this, first. Or maybe they have, and failed miserably.

 

The fact remains NCL is the entry level (budget) brand for Norwegian Cruise Line Holdings.  Many of NCL passengers are budget-minded, working class folks, that spend their hard earned money to enjoy a vacation. It is the Carnival of Carnival Corporation and the Royal Caribbean of the RCL Group. When a think about upscale cruise lines, I think Silversea, Cunard, or Regent Seven Seas and Oceania (which are part of  NCL Holdings).

Isn't Cunard owned by Carnival?

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16 hours ago, AlexandNessa said:

It's ridic.  And those of us bothered should help spread the word on other social media,  Twiiter,  Instagram,  FB. Maybe this will give first-time cruisers pause when considering NCL, being lured by the "free" drink package. 

 

Want a double shot of Grey Goose? Here's the cost breakdown:

 

Without UBP perk: $47.88 each double

 

With UBP perk: $11.88 each double,  plus $19.80 daily service charge on UBP.

 

With "premium" UBP: covered at a cost of $54.60 per person per day. 

 

The $54.60 pp/pd is fairly inline with what other lines charge in the first place. NCL's UBP is pretty much a bad joke at this point, especially as offered as a "perk." 

 

 

 

I agree the first time cruiser should be informed. Social media may work, but a major newspaper or television network would really get Frank’s attention.

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