Changing Dining room Etiquette

[Been There, Planning That]

The evolution has been taking place over the last decade, I'd guess, in the timing of clearing plates from a table.

 

In the long past, the steward would wait until all diners at a table had completed a course before removing all plates at the same time.  The new trend is to immediately remove an individual's completed plate no matter the eating speed of others at the table.  (This seems to always have been done in the Lido where eating is very informal).  This is the new norm in family style restaurants and and even in land formal ones.

 

This was taken to the extreme at our table for two, at early traditional,  last month on the Volendam.  As soon as one of us was done, the plate was removed the instant the steward saw it.  One night my husband was still enjoying his main course when my plate was whisked away.  The dessert menu was immediately brought over to me and my husband's left on this bread plate until he was done and ready to order.  We were always on time so this wasn't the issue and rather 'speedy diners.'

 

I understand the principle of not leaving a dirty dish for the first diner to have in front of him.  But on this trip one of us was given the impression that we needed to hurry up so we could both get on to the next course.

 

We didn't notice this in the Pinnacle Grill.

Edited March 15, 2019 by Been There, Planning That

[Krazy Kruizers]

We always have a table for 2 and certainly wouldn't like that.

 

Did you notice if this was happening at other tables as well?

[VennDiagram]

7 minutes ago, Been There, Planning That said:

This was taken to the extreme at our table for two, at early traditional,  last month on the Volendam.  As soon as one of us was done, the plate was removed the instant the steward saw it.  One night my husband was still enjoying his main course when my plate was whisked away.  The dessert menu was immediately brought over to me and my husband's left on this bread plate until he was done and ready to order.  We were always on time so this wasn't the issue and rather 'speedy diners.'

 

 

I think those stewards need some retraining.

[Mary229]

We always have a table for two and have never noticed that and we do eat at far different paces.   As in any restaurant politely state your preference, I am sure they would be happy to comply.  

[RDC1]

Clearing away dishes, yes.  Bringing appetizers if everyone did not have the same number, yes. Bring dessert to one while the other is still finishing their entree, no. Have not seen that.

[Been There, Planning That]

19 minutes ago, Mary229 said:

We always have a table for two and have never noticed that and we do eat at far different paces.   As in any restaurant politely state your preference, I am sure they would be happy to comply.  

 

 

We considered that but our dear steward seemed so anxious we feared adding to his stress.  And he was very experienced.  

 

Of course this was the norm when we dined with a group at either  breakfast or lunch in the dining room.  

 

Ruth

[Been There, Planning That]

5 minutes ago, RDC1 said:

Bring dessert to one while the other is still finishing their entree, no. Have not seen that.

 

Neither was this the case for us;  I did not intend to imply this.  It was just the menu.

[Been There, Planning That]

29 minutes ago, Krazy Kruizers said:

 

Did you notice if this was happening at other tables as well?

 

Yes

[RDC1]

2 minutes ago, Been There, Planning That said:

 

Neither was this the case for us;  I did not intend to imply this.  It was just the menu.

Have not encountered dropping off a menu before both have finished the entree either.

[OlsSalt]

Don't think it is a trend. Probably a nervous new waiter. Agree, see something say something. They want you to have an enjoyable time when dining in the main dining room - their job depends on this in the hospitality industry. 

[sevenseasnomad]

Agree that preferences should be stated to the wait staff.  I've found them to be very attentive to requests.  

 

We've never experienced the whisking away of a plate while others are still dining.  Normally, waiters remove plates once all diners at a table have finished.  I too would find it disconcerting to have plates snatched off the table before everyone is finished.  Is this a new trend?  Has anyone else witnessed it?  I'll be on Oosterdam in two weeks and will report back if I notice it at our table or others.  

[kazu]

I hate a dirty plate in front of me, but nevertheless, I don’t remove plates until DH and I are both done.

 

That’s been my experience on cruises.  

 

Sounds like you had a waiter who wanted to give you really good service and didn’t realize this was not it.

 

I would have just said nicely (if it bothered you) that you preferred plates weren’t removed until everyone was done.  It’s that easy.  You can say things nicely without offending anyone and the waiters are happy to please in my experience.

 

 

[Fouremco]

We experienced the same plate removal issue in both the MDR and popup Sea de Mer on the Nieuw Amsterdam in February. No problem with dessert menu being brought out too soon, however. Service in the Tamarind was impeccable. 

[dundeene]

My Mom taught me to place my knife and fork at about 11 o'clock with the fork prongs pointed down to signal for the waitstaff to clear plates away.

I don't know if this is an American thing because my Mom is French.

[Caribbean Chris]

I agree with saying something. I’m not a very confrontational person, but waiters need to know if they’re getting carried away with being speedy.

 

This made me recall a few years ago at one of the Mariners Club lunches. It was crowded, loud, and rushed, with plates cleared and next courses served immediately regardless of who was still eating an earlier course. The food was not up to par either, very annoying overall for such an occasion that should have been extra-gracious. Other times it has been nicer, but I don’t really care any more whether we go or don’t go.

[SJSULIBRARIAN]

50 minutes ago, dundeene said:

My Mom taught me to place my knife and fork at about 11 o'clock with the fork prongs pointed down to signal for the waitstaff to clear plates away.

I don't know if this is an American thing because my Mom is French.

I think this is a European tradition. My husband started doing this after he started traveling to Europe on business a lot. I picked up the habit and rather like it. Haven't eaten dinner in the MDR in awhile so don't know about the clearing plates so quickly. I do know it is done in most of the restaurants we eat in. Except I noticed last time we were at Fleming's Steak House in Tucson, no plate on any course was removed until all were finished eating. I rather liked that since it has been awhile since I have experienced that. I guess I am just old fashioned.

[whogo]

Are the stewards clearing the dinner plate in anticipation of an order for a second, third, fourth, and fifth main course?

[Langoustine]

One American thing is to place the knife and fork from 3 to 9 as a signal to the waiter.

Edited March 16, 2019 by Langoustine

[OlsSalt]

Not really a hill to die on. Remember, there is less regard for "formality" in the MDR from most passengers today. So this could be a reasonable slip-up and nothing deficient in service.  Certainly it is okay to let the waiter know what your personal preferences are.That is not confrontational. Just a simple preference request.  You will be a team for a while, if you are in fixed dining. 

 

No different than asking if you like your tea at the beginning of the meal, or if you like very small portions, or dressing or sauce on the side.  Personally, I would not have even noticed this. So it would not have mattered to me.  However while times and formality expectations are changing,  nothing has changed about letting your stewards know your own favorite things.  

 

Expecting them to know, or be trained, or to read your mind, or already committed  Emily Post from 1940's to memory --that may be a stretch today. They may well have had their last tables demand the plates be taken away immediately and concluded this is what was to be expected.

 

The dining stewards we have encountered have all been incredibly eager to honor any personal request ( in reason).  Just ask if they could wait, please because this is something you like. And maybe even remind them again if they forget the next night. They typically get personal preferences very quickly, and seem very happy to know they are providing special care. It makes their job more fun to tailor it to those they will be working with for the next period of time.

Edited March 16, 2019 by OlsSalt

[Despegue]

5 hours ago, Langoustine said:

One American thing is to place the knife and fork from 3 to 9 as a signal to the waiter.

It is actually the Continental “European” way of telling that you are done and satisfied.

knife and fork from right to left on the plate, sharp ends left left side slightly higher ( 4 to 10)

we also never first cut everything and then only use our fork, ( unless you are an infant) but we hold our knives and forks the whole time when eating a dish.

 

 

in the UK, tradition is to place the utensils from bottom to top of the plate, sharp ends top.

 

by the way, at Sea, one is perfectly permitted to put the elbows on the table when eating. 😀

[Katie52]

“in the UK, tradition is to place the utensils from bottom to top of the plate, sharp ends top.”

 

Being a Brit, I agree with that.  That is what we have taught our Thai grandson.  And we leave our plates in situ until the last person has finished. 

Edited March 16, 2019 by Katie52

[wales4ever]

WE noticed that waiter standars were slipping on our Niew Amstardam cruise a few weeks ago.  A few words with the head waiter soon changed things though.

[*Miss G*]

I am British and we were taught to put our knives and forks together and leave them in the 11:25 position to indicate that you are finished.  The reason behind this is so the server can easily steady the utensils when they clear.  (Serve to your left; clear from your right.) Empty plates are never to be removed until everyone at the table is finished that course.  Of course I never expect everyone to be taught the same so I am always pleasantly surprised when it happens.

[Diver2014]

"Emily Post from the 1940's"......ah yes, good ole Emily Post.  I suppose most people under a certain age would have no idea who or what Emily Post is (Emily Post was still popular in the 1950's in my family).  It's obvious to me that many parents do not teach manners, morals or just plain common sense any more. Such a shame.   On topic, our waiters on HAL have always waited until everyone was finished to remove plates unless some late comers were still eating then plates were removed while they still dined.  No need to make everyone wait. 

[ger_77]

We just returned from the Maasdam and didn't have that experience at all.  When people finished their dinners (at our table for 8), the wait staff would wait to clear until everyone had completed their meal.  We never felt rushed, or slowed down by the eating speed of others at the table, or by the early clearing of dishes.

 

Smooth Sailing! 🙂🙂🙂