MSC to include service charge for UK passengers, will RCL be next?

[Thorben-Hendrik]

6 hours ago, goldfish65 said:

 

The bartenders can't be too happy about the change making it harder for people to tip extra if they want to, I feel bad for them.

They work to give service NOT to collect tip - money 💵! 🙄

Edited June 25, 2019 by Thorben-Hendrik

[SantaFeFan]

14 minutes ago, Thorben-Hendrik said:

They work to give service NOT to collect tip - money 💵! 🙄

 

Not sure about how they do things in your part of the world, but the vast majority of people around the world work for money. And tips are money. So tips are a part of what they work for. The service they provide is what they do to make that money. They don't do it because they love giving service and couldn't care less about the money!!! 

 

Working for money is pretty standard throughout the civilized world.

Edited June 25, 2019 by SantaFeFan

[Thorben-Hendrik]

4 minutes ago, SantaFeFan said:

 

Not sure about how they do things in your part of the world, but the vast majority of people I am aware of around the world work for money. And tips are money. So tips are a part of what they work for. The service they provide is what they do to make that money. They don't do it because they love working and could care less about the money!!! 

 

Pretty standard throughout the civilized world.

You will not get it.... 🙄

In some cultures people take pride in their work therefore  money - especially tips - are NOT the sole motivation to have a happy work life!

In some cultures one job and or management is as stupid as the next one.... so it is all about money and tips... 🙄 😱

Edited June 25, 2019 by Thorben-Hendrik

[SantaFeFan]

14 minutes ago, Thorben-Hendrik said:

You will not get it.... 🙄

In some cultures people take pride in their work therefore  money - especially tips - are NOT the sole motivation to have a happy work life!

In some cultures one job is as stupid as the next one.... so it is all about money and tips... 🙄 😱

 

And some people volunteer for the sake of helping others and want no money for it, tips or otherwise. I am semi-retired and I do volunteer work with local Habitat for Humanity chapters, so I know about "taking pride" in doing something as the only reward. So don't lecture me on the subject, with your drama emojis as a feeble attempt to insult.

 

We are talking about people who sign on to work on cruise ships for many months at a time, away from their home and families for all that time. They aren't doing this for "pride in their work". They are doing it for money. And tips given to them as appreciation for their hard work is part of the money they are there working for.

 

To think otherwise is very naive. 

Edited June 25, 2019 by SantaFeFan

[Thorben-Hendrik]

8 minutes ago, SantaFeFan said:

 

And some people volunteer for the sake of helping others and want no money for it, tips or otherwise. I am semi-retired and I do volunteer work with local Habitat for Humanity chapters, so I know about "taking pride" in doing something as the only necessary reward. 

 

But we are talking about people who sign on to work on cruise ships for many months at a time, away from their home and families for all that time. They aren't doing this for "pride in their work". They are doing it for money. And tips given to them as appreciation for their hard work is part of the money they are working there for. To think otherwise is very naive. 

Tried for years to explain it to American Managers that other cultures have other ways to motivate people and not all cultures value money as much as Americans ... I am done - total waste of time trying to get them to understand it... 🙄

Why do you think American tourists are least liked even so they tip the most? 🙄😱

Edited June 25, 2019 by Thorben-Hendrik

[tjwa]

10 hours ago, twangster said:

I've always imagined that Royal already bumps fares up in the UK knowing a consistent percentage of cruisers have them removed once on board.  

 

Totally agree and I believe Princess does the same.

[sgmn]

12 hours ago, twangster said:

I've always imagined that Royal already bumps fares up in the UK knowing a consistent percentage of cruisers have them removed once on board.  There is no way they will let this come off the bottom line or lower profits from it.  

If you are correct that RC UK charge more to cover the tips of people who take tips off, then that's not really fair on customers who Do always pay their gratuities. Are we expected to pay ours and others as well. So yes bring it on,   include gratuities in the base fare as they do in some other markets 

[nelblu]

4 hours ago, Thorben-Hendrik said:

Tried for years to explain it to American Managers that other cultures have other ways to motivate people and not all cultures value money as much as Americans ... I am done - total waste of time trying to get them to understand it... 🙄

Why do you think American tourists are least liked even so they tip the most? 🙄😱

Gee that is a novel idea.  Motivation without any monetary compensation.  MMMMMM! 

[Iamcruzin]

15 hours ago, SantaFeFan said:

 

Makes no difference to me if it's included in the base fare or added on a daily basis. It's all the same money in the end since the fares will have to rise accordingly to make up the difference. Anyone who thinks that the cruise lines will be charging the same fare and paying the crew's gratuities themselves out of the same revenue earnings is smoking some pretty good weed! 😉

 

I consider the auto gratuities no different than port taxes and fees - all are just part of the total cost of cruising. We pre-pay the gratuities along with those port fees, so including the gratuities in the base fare would only be a very minor convenience. 

I never could understand the difference between paying out of your left pocket or your right pocket. A service charge by any other name is still a gratuity.

[Iamcruzin]

5 hours ago, Thorben-Hendrik said:

Tried for years to explain it to American Managers that other cultures have other ways to motivate people and not all cultures value money as much as Americans ... I am done - total waste of time trying to get them to understand it... 🙄

Why do you think American tourists are least liked even so they tip the most? 🙄😱

We are demanding, entitled and self centered, and before anyone posts the cliche', "Don't paint everyone with the same brush", there are exceptions.

[mugtech]

5 hours ago, Thorben-Hendrik said:

 ... I am done - total waste of time trying to get them to understand it...

 

Best news I heard all day.

[GarlicBread]

6 hours ago, Thorben-Hendrik said:

Tried for years to explain it to American Managers that other cultures have other ways to motivate people and not all cultures value money as much as Americans ... I am done - total waste of time trying to get them to understand it... 🙄

Why do you think American tourists are least liked even so they tip the most? 🙄😱

 

I've worked on cruise ships. More than one company. And actually most people's least favourite guests are the entitled and annoying Europeans and Brits! 

Americans (and I'm not American) are our favourites because they're friendly, chatty and tip well 👍🤣🤣

[Beachammo]

If you remove the opportunity for an employee to make extra money by giving excellent service to a customer....the majority of those people will become just adequate employees. Just human nature. 

 

As others have said....they are there to make Money for themselves and family at home. Money is the motivation.

[Balsam12]

In Australia, there are no added "Gratuity" or "Service" charges. Yes, we pay more for the cruise, but we don't have to think about whether or not to prepay these charges, and there's no debate about removing them because you simply can't do that.

 

Yes, I also tip crew at certain times. Firstly when I get service that I consider above the normal high standard on RC. Secondly, when I want to encourage good service in the future.

 

Once I work out the bars where I will spend more time, the bartenders get a couple of tips. Surprisingly, they then remember me, what I drink, and how I like it served. I also find that I get served a bit faster. Money well spent.

 

MDR waiters are the same... if they're good the first night,  they get a tip, maybe 10 dollars each. Again, the service is good for following nights.

 

The whole point is that tipping is completely optional rather than expected... but that's pretty much how it works everywhere in Australia to start with.

[twangster]

4 hours ago, sgmn said:

If you are correct that RC UK charge more to cover the tips of people who take tips off, then that's not really fair on customers who Do always pay their gratuities. Are we expected to pay ours and others as well. So yes bring it on,   include gratuities in the base fare as they do in some other markets 

 

Indeed.  Once critical mass is reached (enough EU guests remove them) they'll bump fares even more and remove the DSC like they did in Australia.  

[Big_G]

5 hours ago, GarlicBread said:

 

I've worked on cruise ships. More than one company. And actually most people's least favourite guests are the entitled and annoying Europeans and Brits! 

Americans (and I'm not American) are our favourites because they're friendly, chatty and tip well 👍🤣🤣

 

Especially when we've been drinking.

[LXA350]

The US is one of the only countries where mandatory tipping is applied and since the cruising business also started from there the model with the seperate tipps was also applied. Nevertheless Europeans or also Australians are not used tipping and do not see why we need to add 15 or 20% to a bill. I mean in the US everyone grows up with it and it's a natural thing however for Europeans or Australians for instance we prefer to know what we need to pay at the begining without having a mandatory additional charge. Of course if service is excellent thent you round up the bill in a Resraurant etc. From a psychilogical factor the gratuities should be automatically be included in the total price and this will then probably also have less people remove them, since they knew from the begining their total fare without any suprises.

[wendychloecruiser]

On 6/25/2019 at 12:25 PM, mugtech said:

Best news I heard all day.

   I second that motion.  

[SantaFeFan]

1 hour ago, LXA350 said:

The US is one of the only countries where mandatory tipping is applied and since the cruising business also started from there the model with the seperate tipps was also applied. Nevertheless Europeans or also Australians are not used tipping and do not see why we need to add 15 or 20% to a bill. I mean in the US everyone grows up with it and it's a natural thing however for Europeans or Australians for instance we prefer to know what we need to pay at the begining without having a mandatory additional charge. Of course if service is excellent thent you round up the bill in a Resraurant etc. From a psychilogical factor the gratuities should be automatically be included in the total price and this will then probably also have less people remove them, since they knew from the begining their total fare without any suprises.

 

If you believe what you wrote, you are admitting that when you travel you don't bother to learn the local customs in places where you visit. Not knowing about tipping cultures in countries visited is being willfully ignorant of local customs, and you have only yourselves to blame. Anyone who travels and expects everywhere to do things like at home are uninformed travelers at best, and arrogant travelers at worst. Isn't a large part of traveling the desire to experience the sights AND cultures of the places being visited? 

 

I get so tired of reading posts from people who criticize how things are done in the US, or with US based companies. Your way is your way. It isn't the only way, and it isn't necessarily the best way. If you can't be gracious visitors and take a few minutes to become informed about how things are done where you will be traveling, and then politely accept whatever custom is prevalent in those places without complaining, then stay home.

 

 

Edited June 29, 2019 by SantaFeFan

[Billy Baltic]

3 hours ago, SantaFeFan said:

 

If you believe what you wrote, you are admitting that when you travel you don't bother to learn the local customs in places where you visit. Not knowing about tipping cultures in countries visited is being willfully ignorant of local customs, and you have only yourselves to blame. Anyone who travels and expects everywhere to do things like at home are uninformed travelers at best, and arrogant travelers at worst. Isn't a large part of traveling the desire to experience the sights AND cultures of the places being visited? 

 

I get so tired of reading posts from people who criticize how things are done in the US, or with US based companies. Your way is your way. It isn't the only way, and it isn't necessarily the best way. If you can't be gracious visitors and take a few minutes to become informed about how things are done where you will be traveling, and then politely accept whatever custom is prevalent in those places without complaining, then stay home.

 

 

 

I don’t think people are criticising. They’re just saying in other parts of the world things are different. The tipping culture just doesn’t exist in Europe. It does in the US. That doesn’t make one culture right and another wrong. 

[Saab4444]

3 hours ago, SantaFeFan said:

 

If you believe what you wrote, you are admitting that when you travel you don't bother to learn the local customs in places where you visit. Not knowing about tipping cultures in countries visited is being willfully ignorant of local customs, and you have only yourselves to blame. Anyone who travels and expects everywhere to do things like at home are uninformed travelers at best, and arrogant travelers at worst. Isn't a large part of traveling the desire to experience the sights AND cultures of the places being visited? 

 

I get so tired of reading posts from people who criticize how things are done in the US, or with US based companies. Your way is your way. It isn't the only way, and it isn't necessarily the best way. If you can't be gracious visitors and take a few minutes to become informed about how things are done where you will be traveling, and then politely accept whatever custom is prevalent in those places without complaining, then stay home.

 

 

If I am from Europe and cruise in Europe what is your point?

[LXA350]

3 hours ago, SantaFeFan said:

 

If you believe what you wrote, you are admitting that when you travel you don't bother to learn the local customs in places where you visit. Not knowing about tipping cultures in countries visited is being willfully ignorant of local customs, and you have only yourselves to blame. Anyone who travels and expects everywhere to do things like at home are uninformed travelers at best, and arrogant travelers at worst. Isn't a large part of traveling the desire to experience the sights AND cultures of the places being visited? 

 

I get so tired of reading posts from people who criticize how things are done in the US, or with US based companies. Your way is your way. It isn't the only way, and it isn't necessarily the best way. If you can't be gracious visitors and take a few minutes to become informed about how things are done where you will be traveling, and then politely accept whatever custom is prevalent in those places without complaining, then stay home.

 

 

Don't get me started on ignorance. Do you think just because cruising evolved in the USA there is a trademark on the concept and it can't be adjusted to local cultures. Just the way RCCL adjusts it's food items to local cultures when basing their ships in other parts of the world, they should also adjust the tipping culture, which at least with the gratuities has been done when the ship is based outside of the USA. With drink prices on board suffering of crazy inflation over th past years there is a high enough margin that the company should reward it's employees.

 

I am very sorry, the tipping culture in the USA is just absurd, add the full price to the items and use it to pay your employees make sure that minimum wages are secured in sectors such as gastronomy or retail. I will not generalize, but how many americans travel to Europe, but could not tell you the countries they visited and what the difference of Italy, France or Spain would be/ knowing if Barcelona is in Spain or Italy. Instead of enjoying the local cutture and food, they only look where the next Starbucks and McDonalds is located. Talking again about ignorance, if you watch local CNN or other news channels in the USA, you would get the feeling that the only country in the whole universe is the USA and somethimes you would even have doubts if another state than the one you are currently located in even exisits.

 

Concerning your point of being tired how things are done in the US, take a simple example, those surveys you receive at the end of the cruise and how these are evaluated. The only thing RCCL counts as good is 10/10, well let's face it nothing is absolutely perfect and you always need to be able to leave a motivation to become even better / contnue to work just as hard to keep the standards on this level and trying to even get them up one notch. Once you received a 10, you achieved everything and this extra hunger to go above and beyond is gone.

 

Now take a deep breath and think again about your post 😄

 

[Saab4444]

5 hours ago, LXA350 said:

The US is one of the only countries where mandatory tipping is applied and since the cruising business also started from there the model with the seperate tipps was also applied. Nevertheless Europeans or also Australians are not used tipping and do not see why we need to add 15 or 20% to a bill. I mean in the US everyone grows up with it and it's a natural thing however for Europeans or Australians for instance we prefer to know what we need to pay at the begining without having a mandatory additional charge. Of course if service is excellent thent you round up the bill in a Resraurant etc. From a psychilogical factor the gratuities should be automatically be included in the total price and this will then probably also have less people remove them, since they knew from the begining their total fare without any suprises.

Just one correction: The cruising business actually started in Europe and the first cruise was offered by a German company on the Auguste Victoria to the Mediterranean. Many many years after that also European companies from e.g. Greek, Italy and Norway brought cruising to America and started cruises to the Caribbean. Some of them like NCL, Royal and Celebrity became American companies later. 

[Saab4444]

44 minutes ago, Billy Baltic said:

 

I don’t think people are criticising. They’re just saying in other parts of the world things are different. The tipping culture just doesn’t exist in Europe. It does in the US. That doesn’t make one culture right and another wrong. 

In most European countries of course we have a tipping culture as well. You tip in restaurants, hotels and for taxi drivers but it is more in the range of 5-10% and not the ridiculous high amounts that became common in the US (which by the way were also much lower and close to the European 10% not so many years ago...).

[Thorben-Hendrik]

3 hours ago, SantaFeFan said:

you are admitting that when you travel you don't bother to learn the local customs in places where you visit.

Thats totally optional!👍

 

3 hours ago, SantaFeFan said:

Not knowing about tipping cultures in countries visited is being willfully ignorant of local customs,

Whats wrong with that?🤔

 

3 hours ago, SantaFeFan said:

Isn't a large part of traveling the desire to experience the sights AND cultures of the places being visited? 

Is it really?🤔

Not for us....👍

 

3 hours ago, SantaFeFan said:

I get so tired of reading posts from people who criticize how things are done in the US, or with US based companies. Your way is your way. It isn't the only way, and it isn't necessarily the best way. If you can't be gracious visitors and take a few minutes to become informed about how things are done where you will be traveling, and then politely accept whatever custom is prevalent in those places without complaining, then stay home.

Fine people on both sides!😁🖕