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Seabourn Sunbed Timer

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Personally, I do not think it should be up to the HD to decide this issue. It should be a Seabourn policy firmly stated and consistent on every ship.

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I firmly agree with Wripro that these sorts of policies and enforcement thereof should be consistent throughout the fleet and not subject to the whims of a particular HD.   Similarly, the decision of whether to open The Restaurant for lunch on port days should be based on a company policy and clearly communicated to prospective pax.

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Ok, then. For discussion purposes, how long do you think sunbeds should be left "claimed" but with no one seated there while the claimant is elsewhere?

 

20 minutes?

30 minutes?

45 minutes?

60 minutes?

 

Remember that no one will be standing around with a stop watch. The idea is to give passengers the sense that there is a program in place that seeks equitable use of and access to sunloungers while giving those who claim them some time to use the pool area, away from the sunlounger they had been using earlier. Also, the time period gives deckstaff the time to notice when things go sloppy at their discretion, and can remove the stuff for a staging point on deck before it all goes to Seabourn Square's lost and found drawer.

 

Happy and healthy sailing!

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35 minutes ago, markham said:

Ok, then. For discussion purposes, how long do you think sunbeds should be left "claimed" but with no one seated there while the claimant is elsewhere?

 

20 minutes?

30 minutes?

45 minutes?

60 minutes?

 

 

I would say 60 minutes. I think it's reasonable for people to go, for instance, to lunch without feeling rushed or that they have to go individually or grab a plate of food and wobble back to the pool deck with it. Or go to a lecture perhaps, they're about that long, or trivia. It does however mean you can't stick two books on a sunbed, go to breakfast, go on tour, return at 2pm and sit down. 

 

We, and I doubt we're alone in this, so have places we prefer to sit if possible and if we're staying on the ship and arrive early enough to claim one we do stay there for a good part of the day.

 

I'd actually be quite happy if I could request one of those timers in the original post from the pool staff, have it set it for one hour (or whatever time is deemed acceptable) and leave it there so pool staff and other guests could see the space was in use and the people using it will be returning shortly. If I didn't make it back by the appointed time, I would have no issue with another guest asking the pool staff to make the space available. But I guess asking people to do that isn't very luxury ... 

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, markham said:

Ok, then. For discussion purposes, how long do you think sunbeds should be left "claimed" but with no one seated there while the claimant is elsewhere?

 

20 minutes?

30 minutes?

45 minutes?

60 minutes?

 

Remember that no one will be standing around with a stop watch. The idea is to give passengers the sense that there is a program in place that seeks equitable use of and access to sunloungers while giving those who claim them some time to use the pool area, away from the sunlounger they had been using earlier. Also, the time period gives deckstaff the time to notice when things go sloppy at their discretion, and can remove the stuff for a staging point on deck before it all goes to Seabourn Square's lost and found drawer.

 

Happy and healthy sailing!

 

30 minutes on a mass market line like Celebrity.

 

60 minutes on a luxury line like Seabourn that charges a hefty premium for providing a stress- and issue free vacation. That  in my opinion should include enough sunbeds so nobody has to worry about losing a bed when going for a Yountwurst or swim. 

 

Remove the Retreat, open up this space to ocean views, add a second jacuzzi up there plus 100 sunbeds or so - problem solved. Just saying.

 

Floris

Edited by florisdekort

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18 minutes ago, florisdekort said:

Remove the Retreat, open up this space to ocean views, add a second jacuzzi up there plus 100 sunbeds or so - problem solved. Just saying.

 

Ah yes there's that. The whole 'sunbed' issue isn't as bad on the Odyssey class as it is on the new Encore class. We were on Encore last August and it was a hot, hot cruise and finding space around the pool in the shade even on a port day (they were all port days) was actually tricky sometimes. So as well as removing the Retreat idiocy, opening up the view and adding beds up there, they'd have to arrange shade for some of them and staff a bar .. if they did that it would greatly reduce the pressure on the pool deck. 

 

Any sign Seabourn is getting real about The Retreat yet? 

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6 hours ago, markham said:

30 minutes?

45 minutes?

60 minutes?

 

In my experience, 99% of the people who cruise on SB are kind, friendly and courteous passengers. Even the best of us sometimes forget to consider the ramifications of our actions (like claiming our favorite deck chair and leaving it unused for way too long). I think the "sun bed timer card" with maybe a '60 minute return or vacate policy' would be self policing.  It would remind all of us to be considerate of our fellow passengers.

 

Most people won't park in the  "loading zone - no parking" or the "20 minute parking only"  spots because it's in our very natured to follow the rules in our lives.    The mean spirited jerks mentioned above are less than 1% and will never follow any rules anyway.  

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60 minutes and then off with their heads. Or at least transfer their belongings to a sun bed in the brig!

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19 hours ago, florisdekort said:

 

30 minutes on a mass market line like Celebrity.

 

60 minutes on a luxury line like Seabourn that charges a hefty premium for providing a stress- and issue free vacation. That  in my opinion should include enough sunbeds so nobody has to worry about losing a bed when going for a Yountwurst or swim. 

 

Remove the Retreat, open up this space to ocean views, add a second jacuzzi up there plus 100 sunbeds or so - problem solved. Just saying.

 

Floris

I agree totally that 60 minutes is reasonable to let one socialize, have lunch (although iif we are having lunch in the MDR we take our belongings back to the suite and remove our towels as we often spend well over an hour in the MDR), take care of an issue with Guest Services etc.. IMO the people who put 2 books out and don't appear for 3 plus hours and those with multiple locations are the bigger problem.  Not someone who actually occupies the location and leaves for XX minutes for lunch, a lecture whatever but then returns.  It is not that hard to figure out who reserves a chair at 7 and does not occupy it until 2 or goes off the ship or has multiple locations.  

 

As Raphael wrote above most of SB pax follow the stated policy, it is that small percentage who do not who cause the problems.  Similar to those who can't be bothered to adhere to the dress code, not talking during Muster drill, etc.

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23 hours ago, florisdekort said:

 

Remove the Retreat, open up this space to ocean views, add a second jacuzzi up there plus 100 sunbeds or so - problem solved. Just saying.

 

Removing the Retreat is never going to happen.  SB are going to make money from this area one way or another and putting sun beds up there is not going to make them $$$$.  After several repositioning cruises, I was amazed that Seabourn would have a space that so few people were interested in paying for. 

 

Then I took a 14 night Hong Kong-Singapore cruise and it was busy every day and full on sea days.  Certain passengers will pay for the exclusivity of it just like the suites.  Why pay a 4X multiple of your cruise fare on SB for what amounts to a slightly larger stateroom and not really anything else?  Yet the suites are often the first to sell out...

 

Finally, the Retreat could be repurposed into suites at a future drydock.  I am sure the exec's have already discussed this and perhaps they have had preliminary plans drawn up.  The stretching of the little sisters was not Windstar's idea.  The HD on the Legend actually showed me the proposed plans prior to their sale to Windstar.

 

Oh, but I like the idea of the timer!

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On 8/6/2019 at 3:09 AM, Pendle Witch said:

We have watched one couple with three sets of two sunbeds saved, they just moved from one to another depending on whether they were in the sun, in the shade or by the pool. They left belongings on each for most of the afternoon and were never challenged, even though there were few spare.

Ahhhh, my favorite Dutch couple.

However, I would never confuse a deck chair on SB with a sunbed.

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6 hours ago, texanaust said:

Then I took a 14 night Hong Kong-Singapore cruise and it was busy every day and full on sea days. 

ok that's new. I've not seen a cruise nor heard a poster here say that The Retreat was ever more than a ghost town, port or sea day. I wonder what happened on the cruise you were on because I've so far seen nobody willing to fork out money for that soulless, airless carbuncle on the top deck. 

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16 hours ago, texanaust said:

Then I took a 14 night Hong Kong-Singapore cruise and it was busy every day and full on sea days.

 

Busy does not equal profitable or successful.  We’ve spent 6 full days in The Retreat to date and never paid a dime.  Always “by special invitation”. 

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We have never spent a day in the Retreat but do know some people who like Floris were given complimentary access so suspect that may account for the business observed.  Given no views nor air I have no desire to be there, even if offered.

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I find this topic an interesting one.  It is very difficult for staff to enforce the rule of not reserving sunbeds as passenger numbers have increased on Seabourn.  When we first sailed on the little ships I was wandering around looking for a sunbed when a staff member approached me to offer assistance in obtaining a sunbed. He removed a towel and book from a sunbed and mentioned that the guest had been away from the sunbed for a lengthy period of time.  Not 15 minutes later the lady came out shocked to find someone on her sunbed.  I could see her making a bee line for me but the staff member intercepted her and had a conversation with her and returned her book.  Fast forward to the Odyssey when she was very new.  I had wanted to try one of the Balinese sun beds on deck 5 but they were never available.  Staff in this area are not often seen so after the bed had been vacant for over an hour I removed the book and towel and took up my position.  About 30 minutes later a gentleman came back and stated that this was his sunbed and he had just gone to the bathroom and I had no right to remove his things.  I gently corrected him saying I waited an hour before removing his things and that perhaps he should aquatint himself with the rules posted by seabourn regarding sunbeds.  He was not happy and I did not like have to confront someone whilst I was trying to enjoy my holiday.  I like the suggestion of going to the HD if I saw a serial offender and there were a shortage of sunbeds.  I probably would not remove someones belonging again as it was an awkward situation to confront another guest.  I would probably try and find a staff member to help me out. I thought the time you could leave a sunbed unattended was 20-30 minutes.  I find this topic interesting as what one person considers within the rules and acceptable another guest would not.  I can only say that if the deck was busy and sunbeds were at a premium I would not go to lunch and leave my belonging on the sunbed.  Just because other guests do does not make this acceptable.  Having said that if you can lunch with 30 minutes then of course that would be acceptable (or within the time posted on the signs).  We all have our own moral compass and just because we are on holiday does not mean we should leave it at home.  I find most guests on Seabourn to be considerate and the few that are not in the minority.

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14 hours ago, rols said:

ok that's new. I've not seen a cruise nor heard a poster here say that The Retreat was ever more than a ghost town, port or sea day. I wonder what happened on the cruise you were on because I've so far seen nobody willing to fork out money for that soulless, airless carbuncle on the top deck. 

 

I was also very surprised, especially when I stuck my head in on a sea day and saw all the cabanas full.  This was completely opposite to Athens-Dubai where the only people I observed in The Retreat were the trivia prize winners.  

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I had a slightly unpleasant incident regarding my sun lounger. I left it for literally 5 minutes. A couple came along, and told the pool bar manager that I'd been gone ages. My belongings were removed.When I came back I confronted them about their lies. Neither of them had the good grace to apologise or even try to bluff it out. Shameful and petty behaviour. The staff member was put in an unpleasant position. Some people really have no class. Thankfully this has never happened to me before and most of the passengers we have met have been fantastic. 

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By all means let’s have a firm but fair policy (1 hour is reasonable) applicable in all venues across the fleet, but most important of all it must be consistently enforced. This seems to be where the problem lies. Oh, and inconsiderate, selfish people who don’t believe the rules apply to them or choose to ignore them. I think if chairhogs actually saw the policy being applied they might think twice. As things stand they know they’ll probably get away with it?

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It's very interesting to me that so many people feel it is fine to save a sun lounger for  an hour. I would feel embarrassed to leave my things for an hour and expect to come back to that spot. If I go to lunch, I believe I should take my things and give someone else a chance to enjoy that space. A thirty minute grace period is quite generous.

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I am with Sunshineocean13 about holding down “my” sun-lounger when I am not even there using it and when others might be seeking out sun-loungers. Thirty minutes is enough time to shmooze friends, freshen up, and get a new book from your suite, while showing common courtesy to those you would appreciate your punctuality and who notice such things. Seabourn’s relatively small ships allow for the discerning to develop camaraderie quickly in that way among people with similar interests in same venues on subsequent days- such as the deck areas.

 

Anyway, I would use the parking time indicator showing when you step away from the sun-lounger so that it is easy for staff and others to guage what is going on and to focus your own mind on returning well within the Herald-posted time. If you cannot bother with such civilities then maybe you should stay on your own verandah where you can do as you please apart from loud yodeling, obviously. 

 

Oh, and then there is the Retreat on Encore and Ovation, two of the most ridiculous and embarrassing space wasting failure “game-changing design features” Seabourn has ever executed for “corporate revenue enhancement”. For $350 per couple per day you can reserve your own territory and come and go for hours all day long without anyone giving you looks. How's that? Chances are you’ll be alone up there anyway so you won’t have to consider any civilities at all and how your acts relate to others. Which is what this thread is REALLY all about, if you think hard enough about it. And if you personally somehow aspire to the Retreat Class then go for it! That’s how Retreat would become a win-win for everyone including whoever dreamt it up. Yodelers, take note!

 

Happy and healthy sailing!

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Markham 

Sorry to go off topic but  is a dark day indeed as you have just burst my bubble. I have been diligently been practicing my yodeling in anticipation of my December cruise thinking I could stand  on my balcony and engage in said activity. I really do think it is the perfect way to ingratiate myself with my neighbors. Why wait for the block party? Yes, yes, I know smoking, spitting and and hanging laundry are banned from those spaces but NO YODElING? Please, you have me running to review the thousand page small print edict known as the cruise contract (which I will do as soon as I remember where I left my reading glasses). Not that I doubt your credibility but do tell me there just might be a loophole for certain tiered Club Members. Otherwise just might have to pony up for the Retreat. Perhaps the enhanced champagne served up there might even improve my yodeling.  

 

Okay back to loungers !

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Posted (edited)

The timer shown in the first post is a great idea and definitely a step in the right direction.  I read this post with disappointment, but it was certainly a factor in our decision not to sail Encore any longer.  The pool deck there was not pleasant, people were packed in like sardines - and that was just the pool itself.   It does seem that Seabourn is starting to suffer from the 'Carnival' effect.  Perhaps the behaviour from the larger ships owned by the group is starting to make itself felt.   Its a great shame and disappointment that people can be so selfish - especially on Seabourn.

Edited by Joolsverne

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We have just returned from cruises on Odyssey and Encore, bed saving was alive and well on both ships. On Encore the bar staff started removing belongings after and hour. One woman was so rude to the staff, even though she constantly every day saved up to 8 beds for her crowd and never used them for upwards of 3-4 hours. We actually went to Seabourn square and reported her behaviour towards the staff. I'm in the camp of having lunch and returning to our lounger but we always ate at the Patio and 9 times out of 10 our lunch table was next to our loungers so we could see if we were causing a problem, plus we occupied our loungers day in day out after we had been ashore, we don't do excursions and it is nice to have the ship to ourselves for half a day!! A few altercations we witnessed were due to people reserving loungers by 8am and then going off for excursions and expecting to return to 'their' spot, one 'gentleman' swore at the lady who had 'taken' his seat albeit he had not shown his face for 5 hours!! Unfortunately it is something that is always going to happen but just needs to be monitored more by staff and perhaps making the policy a bit more visible rather than a small warning fitted to the towel boxes or printed in the Herald. Sea days were the worst, we would go on deck about 8 am to settle down for the day to find 80% of the loungers were already reserved and not used until well after 11am onwards.

 

Reminds me of holidays many moons ago in Spain or the Canaries where the sunbeams were always reserved by the Germans, so the Brits would get up earlier and so it went on that we even noticed towels out 'before' we went to bed!!! Those were the days

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Qld13,

 

A couple of observations:

 

1- You are the considerate type of Seabourn passenger who get the poolside dynamic and respect others.

You make “sense” to us whereas the others you describe are more or less anathema to me. So we have to get to the bottom of this.... So good of you to contact Seabourn Square to out the offenders who were so rude. 

 

2- This is all on the shoulders of the HD, unless the captain wants to handle the mess or hand it off to the staff captain. Clear bulletins for passengers and instruction to staff must be concise, clear and obvious to all, including those who like to make up their own rules.

 

3- The routine of certain national groups claiming ship property as your own did not change on its own, and what you describe remains the norm in many places. You just haven’t been there in recent years. Or have you? That’s what you (and I) are seeing on Seabourn! That’s why these customs are being extended by a minority of people as they “outsmart” you with their usual-to-them land-claim initiative - which those early risers can do when they, the keen, active and virtuous ones, establish their own rules over their -and your and my - domain, the deck. Surely the HD knows all this and has to do his job. If he won’t the captain must be so advised.

 

The combination of clear rules and enforcement of them together is the only answer. Maybe the parking disk idea will work and help, and give some structure for the benefit of all.

 

Happy and healthy sailing!

 

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Seen at a resort on Ibiza. 

Every pool or beach lounge had a note stating a "45 minutes unoccupied.. " with a bar code.

Staff was constantly roaming the area, zapping unoccupied chairs with stuff on them. Lounges still unoccupied after the allowed time were mercilessly cleared all items. 

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