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Hand sanitizers still in use? "Corporate" has decided to eliminate them??

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The CDC has done many studies on ships that offer hand sanitizers and those that do not.

 

Ships with the sanitizers have higher outbreak numbers; when hand sanitizers are present, fewer people wash their hands - believing that the sanitizers are a substitute for washing. Sanitizers are not nearly as effective as washing - hence the higher infection numbers.

 

USPH is now recommending that ships use the hand sanitizers only after an outbreak has started. At that point, pax get a bit scared into using their brains and washing PLUS sanitizing.

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1 hour ago, freestyling said:

We wash hands very often , also carry/use small hand sanitizer , use tissues when handling public utensils and  for opening/closing doors. Don’t wish to jinx our record but so far over 300 sea days and no sicknesses. 

 

Interesting. I wash my hands but do not use hand sanitizer, do not use tissues when handling public utensils or for opening/closing doors. Additionally I push elevator buttons with my bare hands and even have been known to hold onto railings on staircases when the ship is moving.

 

I don't have any idea how many days I've spent at sea, but I have been cruising for more than 45 years and ..... no sicknesses either. :classic_laugh:

 

What does all this mean? It means that it is difficult to impossible to reliably interpret anecdotal medical evidence....

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34 minutes ago, cruisemom42 said:

 

Interesting. I wash my hands but do not use hand sanitizer, do not use tissues when handling public utensils or for opening/closing doors. Additionally I push elevator buttons with my bare hands and even have been known to hold onto railings on staircases when the ship is moving.

 

I don't have any idea how many days I've spent at sea, but I have been cruising for more than 45 years and ..... no sicknesses either. :classic_laugh:

 

What does all this mean? It means that it is difficult to impossible to reliably interpret anecdotal medical evidence....

 

Cruisemom42, it means that you are blessed with an awesome immune system.  Some's got it and some's don't.   Count yourself very lucky and keep doing what you're doing,  😊

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Currently on the Amsterdam on the Incan Empires cruise (just left Fuerte Amador, Panama a couple of hours ago) , and the Purell dispensers are all over the place with one or two outside every dining venue.  They have a “travel well” video that runs on a loop about how to prevent shipboard illness that includes details proper use of the dispensers.  It looks like maybe they’re phasing it in.

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Wow, we are just off a back to back on Koningsdam, half way through the first cruise we were in code red.   Staff had you sanitize,  before entering ship at port and in dining room.   Last cruise normal sanitizer availability. Now zero?  Seems  shortsighted.

 

I too sanitized after menus, use knuckles for elevators but do use railings. I have not gotten Noro in twenty cruises, but have gotten the flu.   I was appalled the last cruise by people coughing up a lung in the main dining room.  No wonder we became code red!  

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7 hours ago, kevingastreich said:

My guess is that your diligence has resulted in very few if any ship board illnesses being contracted?

Haven't been sick, even when sailing on one ship with the noro virus, in over twenty years.

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I am a firm believer in hand washing to eliminate germs but also bring my own hand sanitizer that will kill norovirus (since the Purell offered on most ships does not kill viruses). I opt for Clorox Hand Sanitizing Spray for my hands and Clorox Healthcare Hydrogen Peroxide Disinfectant wipes to wipe down surfaces. This is a good site to reference for your options for sanitiers that kill norovirus, it also includes links to the official testing http://www.stopthestomachflu.com/Home/which-hand-sanitizers-kill-stomach-flu-viruses

 

Clorox Healthcare Hydrogen Peroxide Disinfectant Wipes: 

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B078HRLXZ5/ref=ox_sc_saved_title_9?smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER&psc=1

 

Clorox Bleach-Free Hand Sanitizer: 

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00DDZMLLK/ref=ox_sc_saved_title_1?smid=A1EJK2H1BM60M5&psc=1

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2 minutes ago, summer slope said:

Thank you for the links.  I'm going to be super pro-active on our next cruises.

You're very welcome! Ever since my entire family lost more than half of our vacation to norovirus on a cruise one year, we have been extra vigilant about staying healthy onboard. It only takes getting sick once to turn into a germophobe on a cruise ship, as it's one of the most unpleasant things anyone could ever experience. 

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We’re currently on the Nieuw Statendam. I used the hand sanitizer this morning, so if it is a “corporate decision”, it hasn’t hit us yet. 

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20 hours ago, AncientWanderer said:

 

Well, it says "aren't as effective" as washing hands.  To me, that means at least somewhat effective.  Every little bit helps.

Not necessarily so.  Hand sanitizers can give a false sense of security causing people to think they don't need to actually wash their hands if they use the sanitizers.  They can actually increase the chances of spreading viruses.   

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What did you do before hand sanitizers?  Were you more sick then than now?   

 

I grew up a tomboy in a small rural town in the 60s. Playing in the dirt, playing with friends, playing with everyone's toys, putting my fingers in my mouth, running my hand all the way down the handrails, all that stuff.  None of us were more sick than any other folks.    Just the usual kid stuff - measles, mumps, whooping cough and the occasional colds.  

 

I have had noro.  From a hotel, not a ship.  I still do not obsess on cleaning/"sanitizing" my hands after or before I touch anything.  I still punch elevator buttons with my fingers (I do it multiple times an evening at work).   I've not had an illness from my "lifestyle" choice of not sanitizing.  

 

I wash my hands as I always have.  the only time I'll resort to sanitizer is if I'm out in the wilds and there is no water available.

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4 minutes ago, slidergirl said:

What did you do before hand sanitizers?  Were you more sick then than now?   

 

I grew up a tomboy in a small rural town in the 60s. Playing in the dirt, playing with friends, playing with everyone's toys, putting my fingers in my mouth, running my hand all the way down the handrails, all that stuff.  None of us were more sick than any other folks.    Just the usual kid stuff - measles, mumps, whooping cough and the occasional colds.  

 

I have had noro.  From a hotel, not a ship.  I still do not obsess on cleaning/"sanitizing" my hands after or before I touch anything.  I still punch elevator buttons with my fingers (I do it multiple times an evening at work).   I've not had an illness from my "lifestyle" choice of not sanitizing.  

 

I wash my hands as I always have.  the only time I'll resort to sanitizer is if I'm out in the wilds and there is no water available.

 

Like many people in those days--including me, but a little before you--kids were allowed to get dirty. Exposure to day-to-day germs strengthened our immune systems. Many doctors now believe it also reduced the development of allergies. The old "peck of dirt" approach to life. 

 

I still believe in that. Unfortunately, now that we have some stronger/drug resistant viruses out there, we do have to be more careful in places where many people are close together and touching many of the same objects and surfaces. 

 

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29 minutes ago, 3rdGenCunarder said:

 

Like many people in those days--including me, but a little before you--kids were allowed to get dirty. Exposure to day-to-day germs strengthened our immune systems. Many doctors now believe it also reduced the development of allergies. The old "peck of dirt" approach to life. 

 

I still believe in that. Unfortunately, now that we have some stronger/drug resistant viruses out there, we do have to be more careful in places where many people are close together and touching many of the same objects and surfaces. 

 

 

To add to this...we've never before had a world where there is such easy movement of people and microorganisms.  We are exposed to things from far-flung corners of the world that our own immune systems are not prepared for.

 

Also, it would seem logical that some of us have stronger immune systems than others just by virtue of "dodging bullets" throughout life.  My mother-in-law catches nothing -- but coincidentally she has not taken many rounds of antibiotics throughout her life, so her immune system really works.  I've had to take them many times, and I catch virtually everything.  But then a lot of us would be dead without the antibiotics, so there is that to be grateful for.

 

Bottom line, as in most things, it's every man for himself.  I'll be washing, sanitizing, using napkins on tongs and staying away from the showroom when there is a lot of coughing onboard.  Don't judge me.

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8 minutes ago, AncientWanderer said:

Bottom line, as in most things, it's every man for himself.  I'll be washing, sanitizing, using napkins on tongs and staying away from the showroom when there is a lot of coughing onboard.  Don't judge me.

 

THIS!!! Yes!!! 👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻

 

I’m right there with you!!!

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Posted (edited)
32 minutes ago, AncientWanderer said:

 

 I'll be washing, sanitizing, using napkins on tongs and staying away from the showroom when there is a lot of coughing onboard.  Don't judge me.

 

I will not judge you. But I ask the same when I walk by the hand sanitizers on board ship and do not stop to use them. Please do not give me the stink eye!!!

 

Edited by cruisemom42

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Posted (edited)
19 hours ago, Donald said:

The CDC has done many studies on ships that offer hand sanitizers and those that do not.

 

Ships with the sanitizers have higher outbreak numbers; when hand sanitizers are present, fewer people wash their hands - believing that the sanitizers are a substitute for washing. Sanitizers are not nearly as effective as washing - hence the higher infection numbers.

 

USPH is now recommending that ships use the hand sanitizers only after an outbreak has started. At that point, pax get a bit scared into using their brains and washing PLUS sanitizing.

 

 

The Best is to wash your hands with soap, vigorously and often,  If you feel insecure not using  the gunk on a ship then EASY<    carry your own small bottle  of it  .  Go to a Dollar store and get a   personal  supply or go to   a  CVS type store. Try and find a convenience

store that does not stock them in large number 🙂 

 

I am one who thinks far too many people do not hand wash well or often because of a  false sense of security   they won' t contract  or spread noro seeing they used the gooey gunk.   All  those small bottles of goo I mention above are providing good profits for suppliers, shopkeepers etc.  but many who  'know' say they provide little help in preventing spread of  noro  or much else.

 

Personal responsibility is a Very good thing.

image.png.12eea9bf09294d03ccff6cd562ca8d6c.png

 

sail.noordam@gmail.com

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited by sail7seas

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25 minutes ago, cruisemom42 said:

 

I will not judge you. But I ask the same when I walk by the hand sanitizers on board ship and do not stop to use them. Please do not give me the stink eye!!!

 

Yes!!!!!!!  

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22 minutes ago, cruisemom42 said:

 

I will not judge you. But I ask the same when I walk by the hand sanitizers on board ship and do not stop to use them. Please do not give me the stink eye!!!

 

 

Oh, I won't...because you're a female and I'd automatically assume you had washed your hands.  Now, if you were a male, I would assume you had not washed your hands or used sanitizer.  And how's that for a sexist comment!  lol

😂

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10 minutes ago, AncientWanderer said:

 

Oh, I won't...because you're a female and I'd automatically assume you had washed your hands.  Now, if you were a male, I would assume you had not washed your hands or used sanitizer.  And how's that for a sexist comment!  lol

😂

:classic_biggrin::classic_biggrin::classic_biggrin:

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Common sense says that using hand sanitizer is better than using nothing at all.  It kills 99% of the germs that are already ON YOUR OWN hands. In this way, you help not giving the germs that are ALREADY on your hands, to others.

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Does anyone else hum or sing inside your head "Happy Birthday" twice while you wash your hands???  I still do.  I sing inside my head...  

It has something to do with the amount of time it takes to sing is the time you need to adequately wash your hands...

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On 10/9/2019 at 12:18 PM, Donald said:

The CDC has done many studies on ships that offer hand sanitizers and those that do not.

 

Ships with the sanitizers have higher outbreak numbers; when hand sanitizers are present, fewer people wash their hands - believing that the sanitizers are a substitute for washing. Sanitizers are not nearly as effective as washing - hence the higher infection numbers.

 

USPH is now recommending that ships use the hand sanitizers only after an outbreak has started. At that point, pax get a bit scared into using their brains and washing PLUS sanitizing.

Give me a break. So what they are saying is people are stupid. So cruise lines like HAL save some money and put those sanitizer dispensers away until a certain percentage of the stupid people start showing up at the Dr’s office complaining of being sick. Then and only then strategically place them around the ship so as to scare folks into washing their hands. The day HAL starts invoking that practice is the day we stop booking HAL cruises. 

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