White Island erupts.

[valantine80]

6 hours ago, Fletch1 said:

Not too sure if this has been mentioned yet, I read a news report earlier today of some passengers on the OTS are complaining that they will now miss Dunedin and the sounds, due to the extended stay in Tauranga. 

 

Mindboggling! 

Heard an ABC reporter from Brisbane who is on the ship holidaying  with her family giving a report today and saying there was a lot of angry people at Guest Services complaining about the change in itinerary so is not just hearsay.

[Pushka]

40 minutes ago, valantine80 said:

Heard an ABC reporter from Brisbane who is on the ship holidaying  with her family giving a report today and saying there was a lot of angry people at Guest Services complaining about the change in itinerary so is not just hearsay.

Incredibly disappointing. I’d be happy to just be with family at this time. This is ‘entitlement’ gone to an awful level. Sometimes I despair of humanity. 

[Hawka]

4 hours ago, aussielozzie18 said:

Apparently skin grafts have been ordered from the US by the NZ doctors.  These are required due to the complex nature of the burns.  I wonder if this is the first time some of the doctors/surgeons have dealt with volcanic burns.  My thoughts are with those patients and thanks to the medical staff working around the clock to treat them.

Read Australia is sending that stuff too

 

[lyndarra]

1 hour ago, valantine80 said:

Heard an ABC reporter from Brisbane who is on the ship holidaying  with her family giving a report today and saying there was a lot of angry people at Guest Services complaining about the change in itinerary so is not just hearsay.

Probably the same people who would complain about missing their flights if the ship arrived back a day late.

[TLCOhio]

11 hours ago, possum52 said:

Sorry Terry, I usually love the links to articles you post but not this one. I am amazed at the number of people and media outlets (mainly not Australian or New Zealand) who are more interested in laying blame. The major concern should be the welfare of the those who have survived and their families and the loved ones of the deceased not finger pointing. That will happen when the coronial investigations and hearings are complete.  Leigh

 

   1 hour ago,  Woodinville said: 

Update - Ovation of the Sea & White Island Volcano - Warnings had been issued! Yet private tour operators say it didn't pass their threshold for danger.  RCI - Ovation of the Seas shore excursions did not appear to include White Island. 

https://securelytravel.com/travel/update-ovation-of-the-sea-white-island-volcano-warnings-had-been-issued/

 

Appreciate the above point and correct concern from Leigh.  YES, most attention now should be on the victims, their families, etc.  BUT, while this issue is "current", being covered by the media and of interest to the traveling public, is is ALSO vital for us as travelers to benefit from  "What Lessons Can Be Learned from this Tragedy?".  

 

Why?  Yes, there will be later investigations and reports.  But, that will take many months and such details later on will get only a very small amount of world-wide attention.  Those reports tend to be complicated, long and confusing.  Above on another CC Board, you see a help link from Woodinville with added reporting/background regarding the details as to how these private tour operators handled these issues.  From my perspective, it makes a key point that both the cruise line and/or individual travelers need to consider, carefully, the risks and trade-offs connected with certain "adventures".  We might seek, desire and like "excitement".  But, how much do we want to risk too much and too close to the "edge"?  

 

It appears from this article/sources that this White Island excursion was NOT offer by or through the Ovation of the Seas cruise ship.  Private tours can be good, but it places a higher burden on the passengers to check and double-check the levels of risk and the quality of the tour operator.  If there is a small amount of "good news" from this sad situation, it will hopefully alert us all to ask key questions and do some independent research before signing up for potentially challenge ship or private tours.  

 

THANKS!  Terry in Ohio

 

From late 2018, see “Holy Lands, Egypt, Jordan, Oman, Dubai, Greece, etc.”, with many visuals, details and ideas for the historic and scenic Middle East. Now at 16,770 views.  Connect at:

www.boards.cruisecritic.com/topic/2607054-livenautica-greece-holy-lands-egypt-dubai-terrypix’s/

 

From our local Columbus Dispatch on page two this morning, here is how they headlined and featured that NY Times story on this New Zealand White Island tragic situation.  It is interesting as to how they billed it as a "deadly tourist trap".:

(Open your screen/viewer wider to see these pictures larger/better!)

 

 

[possum52]

3 hours ago, TLCOhio said:

 

   1 hour ago,  Woodinville said: 

Update - Ovation of the Sea & White Island Volcano - Warnings had been issued! Yet private tour operators say it didn't pass their threshold for danger.  RCI - Ovation of the Seas shore excursions did not appear to include White Island. 

https://securelytravel.com/travel/update-ovation-of-the-sea-white-island-volcano-warnings-had-been-issued/

 

Appreciate the above point and correct concern from Leigh.  YES, most attention now should be on the victims, their families, etc.  BUT, while this issue is "current", being covered by the media and of interest to the traveling public, is is ALSO vital for us as travelers to benefit from  "What Lessons Can Be Learned from this Tragedy?".  

 

Why?  Yes, there will be later investigations and reports.  But, that will take many months and such details later on will get only a very small amount of world-wide attention.  Those reports tend to be complicated, long and confusing.  Above on another CC Board, you see a help link from Woodinville with added reporting/background regarding the details as to how these private tour operators handled these issues.  From my perspective, it makes a key point that both the cruise line and/or individual travelers need to consider, carefully, the risks and trade-offs connected with certain "adventures".  We might seek, desire and like "excitement".  But, how much do we want to risk too much and too close to the "edge"?  

 

It appears from this article/sources that this White Island excursion was NOT offer by or through the Ovation of the Seas cruise ship.  Private tours can be good, but it places a higher burden on the passengers to check and double-check the levels of risk and the quality of the tour operator.  If there is a small amount of "good news" from this sad situation, it will hopefully alert us all to ask key questions and do some independent research before signing up for potentially challenge ship or private tours.  

 

THANKS!  Terry in Ohio

 

From late 2018, see “Holy Lands, Egypt, Jordan, Oman, Dubai, Greece, etc.”, with many visuals, details and ideas for the historic and scenic Middle East. Now at 16,770 views.  Connect at:

www.boards.cruisecritic.com/topic/2607054-livenautica-greece-holy-lands-egypt-dubai-terrypix’s/

 

From our local Columbus Dispatch on page two this morning, here is how they headlined and featured that NY Times story on this New Zealand White Island tragic situation.  It is interesting as to how they billed it as a "deadly tourist trap".:

(Open your screen/viewer wider to see these pictures larger/better!)

 

 

Thank you Terry for your concise explanation. As to whether the excursion was offered by RCL, I have read it was offered by them. But only someone who was/is on the cruise could answer that question. 

 

By the way I have an relative who is a paediatrician in Columbus.

 

Leigh

 

[Pushka]

Details of the excursion have now been removed from RCL site but someone posted a cache version. 

[Beanb41]

Latest update at 9.45 am NZ Time

 

We have been advised that two more passengers died overnight and at least one Australian injured passenger has been medivacd to Austrlia. The RAAF are in the throes of medivacing more Australians back to Australia for hospital care.

 

120 sq metres of skin are estimated to be required to treaty the burns suffered over 95% of the body for some patients.

 

It is still too dangerous to return to the island to recover the bodies.   Last evening the Minister of Police lambasted the NZ Police for its handling of the event and taking into account the knowledge and experience of the local helicopter pilots who fly in and out of White Island daily. The Officer in charge of the exercise has since been replaced.

 

The Ovation of the Seas has now docked in Wellington. On its way into the harbour this morning local Maori gathered in Seatoun and blessed the ship as she sailed in through the heads. The blessing lifted the Tapu on the ship put on whilst the ship was berthed in Tauranga.

 

I note comments have been made about apportioning blame. NZ is covered by a no fault Accident Compensation scheme whereby all accident costs are covered by the Accident Compensation Corporation. It is not possible to sue for such accidents in NZ. The injured are covered under the scheme until they leave the country. I hope they all have adequate travel insurance.

[lyndarra]

5 minutes ago, Beanb41 said:

Latest update at 9.45 am NZ Time

 

We have been advised that two more passengers died overnight and at least one Australian injured passenger has been medivacd to Austrlia. The RAAF are in the throes of medivacing more Australians back to Australia for hospital care.

 

120 sq metres of skin are estimated to be required to treaty the burns suffered over 95% of the body for some patients.

 

It is still too dangerous to return to the island to recover the bodies.   Last evening the Minister of Police lambasted the NZ Police for its handling of the event and taking into account the knowledge and experience of the local helicopter pilots who fly in and out of White Island daily. The Officer in charge of the exercise has since been replaced.

 

The Ovation of the Seas has now docked in Wellington. On its way into the harbour this morning local Maori gathered in Seatoun and blessed the ship as she sailed in through the heads. The blessing lifted the Tapu on the ship put on whilst the ship was berthed in Tauranga.

 

I note comments have been made about apportioning blame. NZ is covered by a no fault Accident Compensation scheme whereby all accident costs are covered by the Accident Compensation Corporation. It is not possible to sue for such accidents in NZ. The injured are covered under the scheme until they leave the country. I hope they all have adequate travel insurance.

I was a beneficiary of that scheme when I had a motorcycle accident near Arthur's Pass earlier this year. It included helicopter evacuation and a week stay in Christchurch hospital. The only expense for me was the business class return flight to Oz which was covered by my travel insurance. A good scheme scheme for accident victims, not so much for lawyers.😉

[lissie]

There is even a NZ$6600 funeral grant for the deceased apparently - which can be used to defray repatriation costs.  I didn't know that. 

[lissie]

I think this piece sums up what's different about NZ. This is why people were so pissed off with Princess recently with their fake Maori welcome to the ship for photographers. 

 

https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/405325/ngati-awa-to-play-a-key-role-in-the-whakaari-white-island-recovery-operation

[NSWP]

1 hour ago, lissie said:

There is even a NZ$6600 funeral grant for the deceased apparently - which can be used to defray repatriation costs.  I didn't know that. 

Your national insurance scheme is quite unique. I might move to the shaky isles.

 

I disagree with the NZ Minister for Police getting involved in operational policing issues, so he knows better than experienced senior police officers so he thinks?  Typical pollie.😣  He is supposed to be supporting the police not 'lambasting them.' 

 

So  were these private tours, not RCI shorex?   As for White Island, close it forever.

Edited December 11, 2019 by NSWP

[lissie]

17 minutes ago, NSWP said:

Your national insurance scheme is quite unique. I might move to the shaky isles.

 

I disagree with the NZ Minister for Police getting involved in operational policing issues, so he knows better than experienced senior police officers so he thinks?  Typical pollie.😣  He is supposed to be supporting the police not 'lambasting them.' 

 

So  were these private tours, not RCI shorex?   As for White Island, close it forever.

 

There   is only one operator who does boat tours to white island - White Island Tours - anyone can book like we did.  They have 3 boats and I suspect they put on a boat for a group from the cruise ship - but its exactly the tour we did - there is now video taken by someone on the tour prior to the eruption - they did exactly what we did.  

 

There is at least one helicopter tour operator - they were on the island too - and it was the owner of that company who jumped in a copter and recovered about 12? in the immediate aftermath - along with the cruise boat who was already  leaving with a previous group who turned around and went back. Those  men deserve medals. 

 

I may be wrong- but I don't think any cruise ship does their own tours in NZ (or elsewhere?) - its all subcontracted to local tour operators 

[NSWP]

47 minutes ago, lissie said:

 

There   is only one operator who does boat tours to white island - White Island Tours - anyone can book like we did.  They have 3 boats and I suspect they put on a boat for a group from the cruise ship - but its exactly the tour we did - there is now video taken by someone on the tour prior to the eruption - they did exactly what we did.  

 

There is at least one helicopter tour operator - they were on the island too - and it was the owner of that company who jumped in a copter and recovered about 12? in the immediate aftermath - along with the cruise boat who was already  leaving with a previous group who turned around and went back. Those  men deserve medals. 

 

I may be wrong- but I don't think any cruise ship does their own tours in NZ (or elsewhere?) - its all subcontracted to local tour operators 

Correct, cruise ships subcontract out to local tour operators world wide.  My son's company (Chimu) operates Antarctic and Arctic expedition cruises, they do not sub contract out as they charter the vessel and use the vessels experienced expedition staff to take the pax on to the ice etc in the zodiacs - rubber boats.

 

I do feel sorry for the workers at White Island Tours, they currently would not have employment and things do not look to good for them in the future, likewise the economic impact on towns that service visitors to White Island.

 

I agree there was some heroic rescue work done by tour and helicopter crews in the aftermath.  A bit more to be done yet - retrieval of deceased.

Edited December 12, 2019 by NSWP

[Beejay4016]

23 hours ago, valantine80 said:

Heard an ABC reporter from Brisbane who is on the ship holidaying  with her family giving a report today and saying there was a lot of angry people at Guest Services complaining about the change in itinerary so is not just hearsay.

 

Staggering, isn't it?

[Mishclark]

15 hours ago, lissie said:

I think this piece sums up what's different about NZ. This is why people were so pissed off with Princess recently with their fake Maori welcome to the ship for photographers. 

 

https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/405325/ngati-awa-to-play-a-key-role-in-the-whakaari-white-island-recovery-operation

I really llove living in Nz-from this Aussie. 

 

I'm very saddened about the whole situation 😓

[pully8]

https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/118125541/whakaariwhite-island-boat-tours-generate-45m-a-year-for-iwi

Some interesting history about the commercial interests of the island.

Sadly no stranger to deaths when sulphur mining was tried there.

Terrible loss of life currently and human suffering associated with this island.

Serious questions will be asked about safety versus a profit making tourist venture. 

[Beanb41]

Update Friday 13th Dec at 0830

 

Military and Police are back on White Island in an effort to recover the 8 bodies. We are awaiting news.

The authorities are aware of 6 bodies but apparently will need to search for the other two.

Families were taken out to the Island for a blessing earlier today and have now returned to Whakatane.

5 Passengers have been repatriated to Australia and more are due to cross the ditch later today.

[possum52]

37 minutes ago, Beanb41 said:

Update Friday 13th Dec at 0830

 

Military and Police are back on White Island in an effort to recover the 8 bodies. We are awaiting news.

The authorities are aware of 6 bodies but apparently will need to search for the other two.

Families were taken out to the Island for a blessing earlier today and have now returned to Whakatane.

5 Passengers have been repatriated to Australia and more are due to cross the ditch later today.

Saw the coverage on TV news this morning. Hopefully the deceased are able to be all found and returned to the mainland without any further incident. I feel for those doing the recovery. 

 

Leigh

[MicCanberra]

Hopefully things will go well with the recovery of the bodies this morning, it would be devastating if there were further incidents

[Esilef]

Once the victims of this tragedy are returned to their families, hopefully they can start to find peace with what has happened 

[Esilef]

I hope Royal Caribbean is being king and helpful to their staff and captain whom have suffered so much during this cruise.

 

lets hope the cruise hating media don’t make a scene at the return of the ship on Monday and go looking for passengers to state “I will never cruise again”.

[icat2000]

1 hour ago, possum52 said:

Saw the coverage on TV news this morning. Hopefully the deceased are able to be all found and returned to the mainland without any further incident. I feel for those doing the recovery. 

 

Leigh

I have mixed feelings about the recovery of the bodies. I know that the family want the bodies back for their closure but it would be terrible if further incidents happened during the recovery. Especially in light of news that they have to search to find the other two. Very risky. 

[lissie]

4 minutes ago, icat2000 said:

I have mixed feelings about the recovery of the bodies. I know that the family want the bodies back for their closure but it would be terrible if further incidents happened during the recovery. Especially in light of news that they have to search to find the other two. Very risky. 

 Iwould have agreed with you yesterday - but now its defence going in I believe they are going in with full hazmat- chemical warfare style suits and breathing gear. There was considerable delay this morning while they go suited up.  Sound like they would survive a similar eruption as that of Monday 

 

They're in the process of removing 6 bodies -  they havent found the other 2 

[icat2000]

Just now, lissie said:

 Iwould have agreed with you yesterday - but now its defence going in I believe they are going in with full hazmat- chemical warfare style suits and breathing gear. There was considerable delay this morning while they go suited up.  Sound like they would survive a similar eruption as that of Monday 

 

They're in the process of removing 6 bodies -  they havent found the other 2 

I just reading the site. They were saying it was taking longer than they anticipated due to the gear that the Army personnel is wearing, plus they have to search for the other two bodies.