Jump to content
Cruise Critic Community
ATC cruiser

Toddler Death Law Suit Update

Recommended Posts

I wonder if the GF truly doesn’t remember because he repressed the memory due to the shock of the situation. Just a horrible situation and I feel horrible for the family losing their child. At the same time I also hope the case doesn’t go through now against RCCL. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Have not been on the boards in a while but news came into my newsfeed on this topic a short while ago. Not sure if anything was posted in the past few hours  and potentially removed due to controversy. I’m not looking to start controversy but the findings by the cruise line were substantial and I’m wondering if anyone saw them. 
 

I’m not trying to start conflict. I promise! So please tell me if I need to ask to get this post deleted for fear of causing drama. Or if I’m late to the dance and missed something today already that may have been moderated. 
 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If that’s true and the evidence supports that he knew the window was open it’s so Painfully sad that these family members have been in such a state that the alternate reality has been their truth. I’d pray to never be in their shoes with each segment together and and odds spiritually.  Such a tragedy. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

And how do they now cope with what can’t be refuted if they believed all along what they were saying as a coping mechanism. It breaks my heart. And I just wanted to share that part if it. The part that my heart breaks for all of them. 

Edited by MizDemeanor

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The poor family.  They have been through enough.  Even if he knew the window was open, I still believe it's a tragic accident.  An article states that he's being charged with murder in PR.  That's a serious charge for an accident that he probably regrets to this day.  The family lost a child and another family member could go to jail for the rest of his life.  I could be wrong, but I think that's his defense for the charge and probably a coping mechanism as well as someone stated.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

From what I can tell he actually held the girl out of the window - I would never ever do that with a child, let alone even hold them high near a balcony!  Yes, he has to live with this forever but I'm glad it wasn't the cruise's fault.  I noticed a lot of these sliding windows recently on Reflection and I'd hate to see a law suit make them all become barred up or something.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Maybe the thing to consider is his to manage the air flow on the pool decks. Is it by Louvers or some other method? From my perspective in certain climates it’s necessary for cross breeze and air flow as much as possible. 
 

In this world Today we seem to be needing to be protecting ourselves from our own feeble and worst selves, so what can be engineered into the window wall system to allow for the ventilation needs and protection from openings at heights that can create deaths from heights at the same time.

 

Granted that there are many open decks on a ship with less restrictions and many scenarios for not climbing over balconies. 
 

Maybe it’s part of understanding what a cruise ship does and does not offer in terms of exterior barriers and as part of what is signed off on as part of the cruise contract for acceptance of on board responsibilities for yourself and minors. 


 

 

 

 

Edited by MizDemeanor

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
13 hours ago, cgolf1 said:

I wonder if the GF truly doesn’t remember because he repressed the memory due to the shock of the situation. Just a horrible situation and I feel horrible for the family losing their child. At the same time I also hope the case doesn’t go through now against RCCL. 

I would not be surprised if his brain shut down and he doesn't remember what happened immediately preceding the incident.  ~30 years ago, as a new driver, I was in a car accident that ended up breaking my pelvis and putting me in the hospital.  I'm told I ran a stop sign and got T-boned.  To this day, I don't remember anything of the 5 minutes before the accident until I was waking up in the ER.  

 

However, the GF never said "I don't remember".  It's been "I thought the window was closed."  The video (from two different angles) plainly shows him put his head either right at the window frame if not totally outside the frame before picking the toddler up.  Kind of makes his claim ridiculous at best.

 

IIRC, the child's dad is a police officer and the mom is a prosecutor.  While I can't imagine where their minds were in the days after, the fact they let themselves (I hope to god they didn't instigate it) get swept up by a lawyer baffles me.  You would think people with that background would understand ambulance chasers, and at least pause before filing suit. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
18 hours ago, blueridgemama said:

Please let's not comment on this extremely sad story. 

You just commented.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
17 hours ago, BeachChik said:

It still was an accident. He didn't deliberately drop her.

I don't think that anyone thinks this.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
16 hours ago, reallyitsmema said:

There are multiple videos, from different angles, that show what the grandfather did.  If you search, they aren't hard to find, but they are very hard to watch.  The grandfather made a terrible mistake.  My heart breaks for the family.

I don't believe any video has been made public. The only thing the public has seen are the very blurry stills. I think if there were a video out there, it would have been posted here by now.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
11 hours ago, hiccups said:

He leaned out the window, so he had to know it was open.  It was a terrible accident, but Royal Caribbean isn't to blame, and a lawsuit won't bring back their child.

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/cruise-ship-death-royal-caribbean-says-video-shows-grandfather-knew-window-was-open-seeks-to-dismiss-lawsuit/

 

 

I agree with you.  The text below is taken from this article. 
 

The Wiegand's lawsuit alleges that the specific Royal Caribbean ship — Freedom of the Seas — that the family was on is not compliant with industry standards and window fall prevention laws, according to Winkleman.

 

"Royal Caribbean played a major role in the death of our child. There is no reason for this ship to have walls of glass surrounding the 11th floor with portions that open," Chloe's mother, Kim Wiegand, said at a press conference announcing the lawsuit. "... We believe that filing a lawsuit against the cruise line sends a message to them that they were wrong."

 


What industry standards would this ship not be constructed too?  Would it not have  had to pass the standard on day one, to become a certified vessel in the first place. (Tongue in cheek font)

 

IMO the only “major” role RC played was that they booked their cruise on their ship. Regretfully, after that it was the GF decisions that led to the unfortunate incident.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
16 hours ago, reallyitsmema said:

There are multiple videos, from different angles, that show what the grandfather did.  If you search, they aren't hard to find, but they are very hard to watch.  The grandfather made a terrible mistake.  My heart breaks for the family.

I don't believe any video has been made public. The only thing the public has seen are the very blurry stills. I think if there were a video out there, it would have been posted here by now.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
16 hours ago, reallyitsmema said:

There are multiple videos, from different angles, that show what the grandfather did.  If you search, they aren't hard to find, but they are very hard to watch.  The grandfather made a terrible mistake.  My heart breaks for the family.

 

Edited by rusty nut

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, rusty nut said:

I don't believe any video has been made public. The only thing the public has seen are the very blurry stills. I think if there were a video out there, it would have been posted here by now.

A quick Google search  "cruise ship grandfather" is all you need.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, rusty nut said:

I don't believe any video has been made public. The only thing the public has seen are the very blurry stills. I think if there were a video out there, it would have been posted here by now.

 

The video was broadcast on a local Puerto Rican daily show and is on that shows FB page.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
11 hours ago, Want2Cruise 701 said:

An article states that he's being charged with murder in PR.  That's a serious charge for an accident that he probably regrets to this day.

 

He's been charged with negligent homicide.

 

He's been offered a plea deal that would have no jail time and just probation. From what his defense attorney stated, Anello doesn't want to take the plea and wants to prove his innocence in court. With the surveillance video being shown on broadcast TV last month, I doubt that an impartial jury can be found.

 

14 hours ago, cgolf1 said:

I wonder if the GF truly doesn’t remember because he repressed the memory due to the shock of the situation

 

His statements to police shortly after the death were closer to what was seen on the video. It wasn't until after the family got the attorney did the "...bang on the glass...I didn't know that the window was open..." story materialize.

 

32 minutes ago, S.A.M.J.R. said:

However, the GF never said "I don't remember".  It's been "I thought the window was closed." 

 

See above. Anello's initial statement was that he was holding the child outside of the window and he lost his grip. What was reported by a PR Port Authority spokesperson (Jose Carmona) matches what was seen in the video. Carmona's statements were reported the day of the incident.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, rusty nut said:

I don't believe any video has been made public. The only thing the public has seen are the very blurry stills. I think if there were a video out there, it would have been posted here by now.

 

Video was broadcast on a PR television show last month. The video was on the internet shortly after that. The video with Spanish commentary is 130MB.

 

I think that the mods do not want the video posted/linked here (deleted post from yesterday).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 minutes ago, Two Wheels Only said:

He's been charged with negligent homicide.

 

This right here.  And, I'm assuming if they would have won the court case against RCI, that could have been used as a defense against the negligent homicide charge to keep Grandpa out of jail.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
15 hours ago, BeachChik said:


I’m sure they are blinded by grief right now.  When stuff like this happens there is a need to blame someone. And with the grandfather saying it wasn’t his fault, the cruise line gets the blame. 

But they seen the video showing him leaning over to look out the open window before he put the little girl up there, clearly showing he ws at fault, so they should be blaming the grandfather.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, marci22 said:

I don't think that anyone thinks this.

My comment was directed to post 11. He said . “ It was not an accident,“

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
36 minutes ago, rusty nut said:

I don't believe any video has been made public. The only thing the public has seen are the very blurry stills. I think if there were a video out there, it would have been posted here by now.

The video HAS been made public and it's not hard to find.  I've watched it.  

2 minutes ago, NLH Arizona said:

But they seen the video showing him leaning over to look out the open window before he put the little girl up there, clearly showing he ws at fault, so they should be blaming the grandfather.

Actually, I would not be surprised if the parents have NOT watched the video.  However, they should have family, friends, or the lawyer or HAS watched it and been able to tell them what it shows.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, NLH Arizona said:

But they seen the video showing him leaning over to look out the open window before he put the little girl up there, clearly showing he ws at fault, so they should be blaming the grandfather.


I’m not disagreeing that he probably knew the window was open. But if this was your family member I’m sure you would want to believe that he didn’t know as well. No one would want to think he knew the window was open and hung her out it anyway. I would imagine it makes them feel better thinking he didn’t know it was open. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
20 minutes ago, jk04 said:

 

This right here.  And, I'm assuming if they would have won the court case against RCI, that could have been used as a defense against the negligent homicide charge to keep Grandpa out of jail.

That's assuming the civil case came to a decision before the criminal trial.  I don't think that was ever going to happen. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

  • Forum Jump
    • Categories
      • Forum Assistance
      • SPECIAL EVENT: Q&A with the Quark Expeditions Team!
      • New Cruisers
      • Cruise Lines “A – O”
      • Cruise Lines “P – Z”
      • River Cruising
      • ROLL CALLS
      • Digital Photography & Cruise Technology
      • Member Cruise Reviews
      • Special Interest Cruising
      • Cruise Discussion Topics
      • UK Cruising
      • Australia & New Zealand Cruisers
      • North American Homeports
      • Ports of Call
      • Cruise Conversations
×
×
  • Create New...