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Toddler Death Law Suit Update

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37 minutes ago, brillohead said:

 

Not all states allow this anymore.  It's up to the state to prosecute or not, instead of an individual.  

Do some states allow it?  What about Puerto Rico?

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16 minutes ago, time4u2go said:

Do some states allow it?  What about Puerto Rico?


I know that several states changed their laws so that the cooperation / testimony of the victim was no longer needed to prosecute domestic violence -- the prosecution uses the testimony of witnesses and/or responding police officers.  I do not know, however, if all states have the same rules for evidence.

I also have no idea if PR prosecutes without the consent of the victim in cases of domestic battery.   However, in a homicide case like this one, the victim is dead, and cannot consent or decline to press charges.  That's why the prosecutor looks at the details of the case and makes a decision to prosecute or not based on the facts available.  

In this case, there was adequate evidence that the baby died (homicide) due to the negligence of the person who was responsible for her care (Anello), hence the prosecution charged him with negligent homicide.

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5 hours ago, KelSny1011 said:

It's quite shocking being a parent on what reckless things parents will allow their kids do in their presence (or assistance). 

 

I learned that at the Grand Canyon. There aren't a lot of safety railings, certainly not everywhere. And yet, there are children climbing around on wet rocks near the edge of canyon. Scared the daylights out of me.

 

Then again, when I read a book on Grand Canyon deaths a few years back, I seem to remember that almost no kids died falling in, maybe none, but adults sure did. No surprise the falls skewed to young males, with their brains not fully developed and feelings of invincibility still.

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It occurs to me we are all providing great insight for the family's lawyer to understand how to proceed with his case, what will likely be dismissed in the minds of potential jurors, what will cause uncertainty and doubt and what will work to forward his case.

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If this was so cut and dried, and one sided, why wasn’t this tossed out long ago? If this goes to a jury trial, RCL better get out their checkbook. Jurors are human, and it’s the big bad huge corporation with billions of dollars against a grieving family who lost their precious baby on one of the big bully’s ships.

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7 hours ago, KelSny1011 said:

Is it possible that stepGF placed the baby up on the railing, and assumed that he had a good grip, and also assumed she wouldn't lean forward?

 

 

 

Anello said in his interview that he leaned her in so that she could reach the glass.

 

5 hours ago, Two Wheels Only said:

 

You might have seen the version that was recorded on someone's phone of what they were watching on TV. I understand that many people have only seen that version. The version shown by the TV station shows a view from the rear of Anello as well as the side view. It is over 16 minutes long (several replays/analysis in Spanish) and is 130MB in size. 

 

You have mentioned downloading the video and high resolution several times. I haven't been able to find anything more than 6 minutes long and they are all the same crappy video that isn't clear. Where do you find this and how did you download it? I haven't seen anything that can be downloaded.

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26 minutes ago, grandgeezer said:

If this was so cut and dried, and one sided, why wasn’t this tossed out long ago?

 

No one reaches in to toss out a case in the middle of discovery. 

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9 minutes ago, mitsugirly said:

 

Anello said in his interview that he leaned her in so that she could reach the glass.

 

 

You have mentioned downloading the video and high resolution several times. I haven't been able to find anything more than 6 minutes long and they are all the same crappy video that isn't clear. Where do you find this and how did you download it? I haven't seen anything that can be downloaded.

 

It was last month when the video was posted online. You can download videos from Twitter, Facebook, YouTube,  etc. with the right tools.

 

The quality of the video isn't good but it is better than what people captured with their phone. The TV segments (puppeteer) are higher quality. I don't speak Spanish so I am going on what I can see. The commentary doesn't influence me.

 

We cannot post links to the videos. The post will get deleted and/or the thread could get locked or deleted.

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55 minutes ago, mitsugirly said:

 

Anello said in his interview that he leaned her in so that she could reach the glass.

 

 

You have mentioned downloading the video and high resolution several times. I haven't been able to find anything more than 6 minutes long and they are all the same crappy video that isn't clear. Where do you find this and how did you download it? I haven't seen anything that can be downloaded.

I see how the top windows bump out.  

 

I also have the same question about what videos people are watching bc the only ones I have seen are very grainy.  

 

I'll be on the Freedom in April and will be looking at this area to try to put myself in his shoes.  I just have a hard time understanding the rationalization this family has regarding this matter. 

 

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32 minutes ago, KelSny1011 said:

I see how the top windows bump out.  

 

I also have the same question about what videos people are watching bc the only ones I have seen are very grainy.  

 

I'll be on the Freedom in April and will be looking at this area to try to put myself in his shoes.  I just have a hard time understanding the rationalization this family has regarding this matter. 

 

 

I was on the Freedom a month or so before it happened.

 

Here's one of my overall pictures of the kids waterpark area and you can see to the side to the windows of the ship. You can TELL even from me standing all the way up at the top and taking an overall picture, which windows were open.

 

P1032338%20copy-L.jpg

 

 

 

This on the opposite side from where it happened (dive shop on one side and the squeeze on the other) and you can see the exact same window it was (except other side).

 

 

P4262345%20copy-L.jpg

 

 

Notice the windows go all the way down to the floor. If she wanted to look out or bang on the glass, no need to pick her up or put her over a railing.

 

 

 

Here's another view of the same windows, but located in the adult Solarium.

 

 

P4272676%20copy-L.jpg

 

 

 

RCCL has multiple "funny" signs on this deck to remind you of dangers. I imagine they will have to add another about the windows being open now. So sad all the way around. 😞

 

 

P4272658%20copy-M.jpg

 

 

 

P4272671%20copy-M.jpg

 

 

 

P4272674%20copy-M.jpg

 

 

 

Edited by mitsugirly

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16 minutes ago, mitsugirly said:

 

I was on the Freedom a month or so before it happened.

 

Here's one of my overall pictures of the kids waterpark area and you can see to the side to the windows of the ship. You can TELL even from me standing all the way up at the top and taking an overall picture, which windows were open.

 

P1032338%20copy-L.jpg

 

 

 

This on the opposite side from where it happened (dive shop on one side and the squeeze on the other) and you can see the exact same window it was (except other side).

 

 

P4262345%20copy-L.jpg

 

 

Notice the windows go all the way down to the floor. If she wanted to look out or bang on the glass, no need to pick her up or put her over a railing.

 

 

 

Here's another view of the same windows, but located in the adult Solarium.

 

 

P4272676%20copy-L.jpg

 

 

 

RCCL has multiple "funny" signs on this deck to remind you of dangers. I imagine they will have to add another about the windows being open now. So sad all the way around. 😞

 

 

P4272658%20copy-M.jpg

 

 

 

P4272671%20copy-M.jpg

 

 

 

P4272674%20copy-M.jpg

 

 

 

I've see those, but the fact you have to tell people, like not to take a hair dryer in the bathtub (or a toaster) just amazes me as much as those signs.  The fact anyone has to be told to watch their own children is just ridiculous.  SMH

Edited by BND

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It’s not just that people are stupid...you can blame the lawsuit happy world we live in.  In the absence of a sign telling me not to take a toaster into the bath with me...I could blame the cruise ship.

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Looking at the picture of the similar window by the dive shop and how obvious it is that the window is open, it gives me chills to think that an adult would hold up a child to the railing, let alone on the other side of it.

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3 minutes ago, TNcruising02 said:

Looking at the picture of the similar window by the dive shop and how obvious it is that the window is open, it gives me chills to think that an adult would hold up a child to the railing, let alone on the other side of it.

 

 

Not only that but notice in that picture there is a table there (it's bolted to the floor and you can't move it). Does there need to be a sign on it not to let your child climb on the table to look out? I mean isn't that a danger? It's just ridiculous.

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20 hours ago, Two Wheels Only said:

 

The civil attorney is trying to use pictures like this...

 

23794542-7922419-image-a-71_157981769715

 

...to try to fool people who have not seen the actual video. 

 

Notice how upright he is?  How upright was Anello?

Notice how close his hands are to his face? How far were Anello's hands from his face?

Notice how the doll is standing inside of the window? How was Chloe sitting on the window sill outside of the window?

 

Not everyone has watched the videos and even some who have seen the videos are watching a version where someone used their phone to record what was on the TV (not good quality). Anyone who was watched the higher quality version or downloaded it in order to analyze it in full screen (as I did last month) will not fall for these staged photos. 

 

Another deceptive thing about this photo is the "bulk" of the doll compared to the bulk of a child. If the person in this photo was holding a doll of comparable bulk to that of the actual little girl, it would be pressed right up against the glass, even without the man's arms extended.

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That lawyer of the good Granpa is just plain greedy- there so a lot of money it for him- if the family wins that case. Which I don´t think they will- every court should dismiss this law suit without hesitation.

 

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1 hour ago, BND said:

The fact anyone has to be told to watch their own children is just ridiculous.  SMH

 

And this is why they now have lifeguards standing at the outdoor pool at 8 am when it's 45 degrees outside.

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2 hours ago, Germancruiser said:

That lawyer of the good Granpa is just plain greedy- there so a lot of money it for him- if the family wins that case. Which I don´t think they will- every court should dismiss this law suit without hesitation.

 

I've seen nothing that makes me think the Grandpa's lawyer is greedy. As a matter of fact, I haven't seen much of anything from his lawyer. The lawyer of the parents, who are also a lawyer & cop, is the one that is pursuing the civil case. The parents are the ones that are suing for monetary gain.

Edited by tarheelmjfan

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11 hours ago, legaljen1969 said:

I think we are all smart enough to understand this is splitting hairs. Yes, the "state" files charges. But "victims" drop charges all the time or tell the state not to press charges.
  The way the post was written-  " if the family had not hired an attorney and threatened a lawsuit, the GF would not have been charged" it appears that the person is saying the grandfather was only charged because the family hired an attorney and threatened a lawsuit.  

 

 

That is in the case of a person against person issue, without death involved.

 

You punch me, I decline to press charges, no trial.  You kill me, you go to trial.

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3 hours ago, mitsugirly said:

 

I was on the Freedom a month or so before it happened.

 

This on the opposite side from where it happened (dive shop on one side and the squeeze on the other) and you can see the exact same window it was (except other side).

 

 

P4262345%20copy-L.jpg

 

 

Notice the windows go all the way down to the floor. If she wanted to look out or bang on the glass, no need to pick her up or put her over a railing.

 

 

 

And for EXTRA CREDIT, which windows are open and which are not?

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16 hours ago, BeachChik said:

 

I 100% agree with this. Grief does funny things to people. And for it to be such a horrific loss makes it even harder. I think at this point they feel a need to blame someone else. No one would want to believe that someone would be so careless with a child. And unfortunately they probably have a lawyer encouraging them to pursue this.

They had a lawyer less than 24 hours after it happened.  How they could even think straight that soon after, I could never understand.

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1 hour ago, SRF said:

 

And for EXTRA CREDIT, which windows are open and which are not?

Is that a baby play area .?

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10 hours ago, grandgeezer said:

If this was so cut and dried, and one sided, why wasn’t this tossed out long ago? If this goes to a jury trial, RCL better get out their checkbook. Jurors are human, and it’s the big bad huge corporation with billions of dollars against a grieving family who lost their precious baby on one of the big bully’s ships.

Because proper legal procedure still has to be followed.  There needs to be ample time for answers and discovery, and if one or the other party files a specific motion, the other party gets time to respond.  Sometimes this is all done through paper and sometimes face-to-face.  And if they have done any depositions, it takes time to get through that. 

 

Once RCI had ample video confirmation of what happened, their attorneys may have been content to sit back and let the family's attorney continue to dig a deeper hole for themselves before filing a motion to dismiss or motion for summary judgment.

 

I also don't necessarily think a jury trial is a slam dunk for the family.  At least some of the potential jurors will have been on cruises with their families and never have dreamed of doing what the grandfather did.  Plus, I think it will be hard for them to explain the 30++ seconds that the grandfather dangled her outside the window before letting her go/slipping from his grasp.  And after seeing Mitsugirly's photos of the windows, they'd be hard pressed to find a juror that couldn't see the difference.

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