Suite guests in Blu - enough!

[phoenix_dream]

7 minutes ago, GRBlizz said:

 

Last time we sailed in AQ, we always did let Blu know when to expect us. We're cruising AQ on Apex in April. Will that not be possible any more?

You can let them know when to expect you, but you can't expect them to save you a table.  

[terrydtx]

27 minutes ago, bEwAbG said:

Celebrity has a much better suite class product in that it includes a lot of stuff.  However, Celebrity's prices are generally much higher as a result, even if you opt for a bare bones fare.  I've done Neptune on HAL for less than half the cost of an equivalent Celebrity trip. Celebrity also has plenty of ability for you to pay more & get more, so that is not unique to HAL.  "The grass is always greener" as they say.

On HAL we usually book their Signature Suites which other than a bigger cabin got nothing else of value for the cost, the new CO is NOT included for SS's. Celebrity AQ Class is very similar in price to HAL SS but with Blu and the other benefits, AQ is much preferable to HAL SS even with the smaller AQ cabin size. This is why we are going to try Celebrity for awhile and quit HAL for now.

[phoenix_dream]

I thought this topic would generate some opinions, and you did not disappoint😉.  I wanted to make a few points based on some comments.  

 

In the past three years, I have sailed more than 20 times on Celebrity - one in a suite and the rest in Aqua Class (and a number of cruises in AQ before then).  In all of those cruises, I have never encountered Blu "half-full", except right before the 9:00 close.  (I never showed up before 7:00, so perhaps it is half-empty at that time but I certainly don't want to eat that early)

 

I realize that there may be Maître d's who turn suite guests away in Blu.  In all of those cruises I have never encountered one to my knowledge, and regularly encounter suite guests regardless of the crowds.  I don't deny it can happen, but I can say for sure it does not happen enough.

 

I acknowledge that Reflection is the worst case scenario, but I have encountered difficulty in getting seated between 7:00 and 8:30 on almost all of the cruises.  Certainly not every single time, but enough to make it problematic.

 

As I stated in my original posting, yes, I understand why the process was initially started.  But much has changed since then (in particular the addition of Luminae) so I think the process needs to be re-evaluated.  

[Loracpin2]

4 hours ago, ghstudio said:

I fully agree with the OP.....but clearly suite guests can walk on water so the chances of a maitre d actually telling a suite guest that they have to wait is very unlikely to happen.  We only book Aqua on M-class ships because we like the rear facing cabins on deck 11....we actually prefer 1A's on S-class ships and find that the food/service in the MDR is as good as aqua....and often there is less wait since we book reservations for every night which you can't do in Blu.  

 

IMHO, Celebrity is making a marketing mistake by not allowing aqua passengers to even try luminae.  If it's as good as Celebrity would like us to think it is, then maybe it would sway us to book a suite.  We'll just never know. 

DITTO!!!!!!!!

[hcat]

4 hours ago, upwarduk said:

Maybe this is the way forward, get Blu guests to book a time!

That would be terrible and another dilution of the concept!

AQ and BLU...always Select Dining,,,

Maybe offer limited suite guest res...maybe 5 per night at staggered hrs.

Edited February 4, 2020 by hcat

[bEwAbG]

1 hour ago, terrydtx said:

My information is correct, while on the Noordam last July, the Hotel manager had a discussion on the CO conversion for non Pinnacle class ships and said that all non Pinnacle class ships would be adding CO by October 2019 with an area in the MDR having a roped off area for only CO guests. I believe that 9 HAL ships had already done this prior to last September.  He also said that Neptune suites would lose the PG breakfast when the ships were converted over to CO. The third Pinnacle ship the Rydam will have the dedicated CO dining room when launched in May next year.

 

Here is a link for HAL explaining the CO roil out schedule;

https://www.hollandamerica.com/en_US/news/2019-press-releases/news-20190911-ClubOrangeExpand19.html

 

One thing I see in this link is the prices have dropped from original quotes to $35pppd on Pinnacle and $25pppd all other ships, which tells me it is not as popular as HAL states..

 

Except the actual implementation has been different than what you heard last July.  The price change is only one aspect.  The other stuff I noted earlier (CO is not a separate roped off area and Neptune suites can use Pinnacle Grill for breakfast on ships that don't have a dedicated CO restaurant) is also different.  This has been reported by many people who have experienced it first hand since that press release was put out.

[terrydtx]

26 minutes ago, bEwAbG said:

 

Except the actual implementation has been different than what you heard last July.  The price change is only one aspect.  The other stuff I noted earlier (CO is not a separate roped off area and Neptune suites can use Pinnacle Grill for breakfast on ships that don't have a dedicated CO restaurant) is also different.  This has been reported by many people who have experienced it first hand since that press release was put out.

I do not know what reports you have seen but the ones I have read in the HAL CC forum have reported that the MDR roped off CO area is happening, there is nowhere else that CO be used on the non Pinnacle class ships. The reality is HAL CO is a joke to try and compare to Celebrity Blu and Luminae. 

[MEcruzr]

We only sail in suites (CS, RS, PH). I've asked two times to eat in Blu and we were refused both times. So it DOES happen... and based on the others who have also been denied it's not entirely uncommon. 

[K12Guy]

7 hours ago, ghstudio said:

clearly suite guests can walk on water

As a consistent suite guest I can say it's not true. The truth is we know where the rocks are, thus it appears we are walking on water. 😎

[Silkroad]

I agree with the OP. I know for a fact that some Suite passengers were dining in Blu every night of my sole cruise in Aqua. Meanwhile 10 -20 Aqua passengers were given pagers and made to wait 20-50 minutes every single night! This happened regardless of what time we arrived at Blu (and we tried various times). My experience was on Summit, not Reflection. DH and I were so disgusted that we swore we’d not book Aqua again Summit. In fact, we’ve not tried Aqua since. Why should we pay a ridiculous premium for Blu if we (and other Aqua passengers) don’t have priority in our own restaurant? And it’s disingenuous to say Suite passengers can only dine in Blu on a space available basis, when - supposedly- no reservations are taken in Blu, so it’s impossible for them to know how many Aqua passengers want to dine in Blu on at a given time.

Edited February 4, 2020 by Silkroad

[C-Dragons]

4 hours ago, Want2Cruise 701 said:

While we usually sail in Suites, we have never dined in Blu.  I might be in the minority, but I just don't find the menu appealing.
.....

I could also argue that it bothers me when suite pax bring guests into Luminae.  Yes, they are charged, but I don't think it's right either.  We pay for Luminae for the small, quiet and intimate atmosphere.  My main draw for booking a suite.  I hate when there are large groups making it quite noisy and unenjoyable.  I feel your pain.  

We have eaten in Luminae ever since it was first introduced by X. On many of our cruises there have been large groups, sometimes up to 12 at one table, dining in Luminae almost every night. These groups were compromised of friends, all booked in Suites. Yes, they were noisy and disruptive, but Luminae was their assigned dining room, no one was a “guest”.
Feeling the pain too... personally, I wish that X would not allow groups that large in a smaller dining venue such as Luminae, not only because of the excessive noise, but because of the delay it causes for other guests' dinner orders.

We choose not to eat in BLU because, in our opinion, it too is a small dining venue and should be for AQ guests .

 

[Gracie115]

7 hours ago, terrydtx said:

At least X handles their suites only Luminae, differently than HAL's answer, Club Orange. Last Year HAL introduced the new Club Orange (CO) as the answer to Celebrity's Blu and Luminae dinning. With the exception of the 3 new Pinnacle class ships, CO is only a roped off area in the 1st floor of the MDR. The current 3 Pinnacle Class ships CO have a  exclusive private CO dinning room. CO has the same MDR menu with one or two added "special" entrees. For all Neptune Suite passengers CO is included in the fare, however anyone else no matter what class of booking can purchase CO for $35pppd on non Pinnacle ships and $50pppd on all other ships.  Supposedly HAL says they limit the number of CO's sold on any cruise, but I have not seen on their boards that anyone was refused the upgrade. This makes CO nothing special and for us was the biggest reason we are leaving HAL after 10 years and doing a Infinity AQ Class cruise next year. CO does have some other added "perks" like a private line for guest relations, a free one category cabin upgrade (if available), priority tender use and a bottle of sparkling wine on embarkation, all hardly worth the extra cost IMHO. HAL Neptune suite passengers lost the one nice perk of breakfast in the Pinnacle Grill for breakfast in the CO dining room or area.

 

 

Club Orange is much more like Club Class dining on Princess than it is like Luminae.  Very similar concept.  Club Class was started about 3 years ago and was successful which I imagine is why HAL has started a similar program.  

 

We have friends that sail HAL at least a couple times a year and in Neptune Suites and at least on their last cruise were still eating breakfast in the Pinnacle Grill.

[Gracie115]

I agree with the OP.  I also don't understand how anyone doesn't like Luminae, at least on the M & S class ships.  If there is something on the menu you don't like they will fix what you want if it's on the ship somewhere.  I've witnessed this many times.  The service is amazing (yes it's great in Blu too....but not as good as Luminae).  We have stuck with Celebrity mostly due to their suite class perks/amenities even though pricing is making us look elsewhere for some trips now.  

[bEwAbG]

3 hours ago, terrydtx said:

I do not know what reports you have seen but the ones I have read in the HAL CC forum have reported that the MDR roped off CO area is happening, there is nowhere else that CO be used on the non Pinnacle class ships. 

 

There are threads about Club Orange on the HAL board all the time, including many firsthand reports over the last several months as it's rolled out across the fleet. I'm not just making it up. 

For example, comment #39 from the linked thread below:  "We just got off the Zuiderdam on Nov. 10, and Club Orange wasn't a separate area of the dining room.  We were seated at tables with others some nights (our choice), and we were given the Club Orange menus while others at the table had the regular menus."

 

There have been zero reports of the existence of a roped off area of the MDR; that was simply rampant speculation from when it was first announced.  Even the press release that you linked to above only says that "priority seating" is offered; nothing about a special section of the MDR because that's not what they're doing.

 

 

[Pushka]

8 hours ago, warmwinds said:

Suites already HAVE a step up from the MDR in Luminae, why should they have 2 choices to the detriment of those who book and pay for AQ?

Because they are paying much more  than Aqua. 

[hcat]

2 hours ago, Silkroad said:

I agree with the OP. I know for a fact that some Suite passengers were dining in Blu every night of my sole cruise in Aqua. Meanwhile 10 -20 Aqua passengers were given pagers and made to wait 20-50 minutes every single night! This happened regardless of what time we arrived at Blu (and we tried various times). My experience was on Summit, not Reflection. DH and I were so disgusted that we swore we’d not book Aqua again Summit. In fact, we’ve not tried Aqua since. Why should we pay a ridiculous premium for Blu if we (and other Aqua passengers) don’t have priority in our own restaurant? And it’s disingenuous to say Suite passengers can only dine in Blu on a space available basis, when - supposedly- no reservations are taken in Blu, so it’s impossible for them to know how many Aqua passengers want to dine in Blu on at a given time.

 

 Very well expressed.  We are taking a break from  BLU for a  awhile, partly due to pricing vs value,  and fact that it is  recently too crowded and  chaotic....kitchen was  slow on EDGE.   Only thing we really miss is BLU breakfast, but the Elite breakfast is a nice substitute on sev days, supplemented by the buffet.

 

AQ is high priced  for what you get...most of which is BLU and Persian Gardens.

Lately,  Concierge guests are given some better perks and even priority boarding...for lesser cruise fare.

 

BLU's success is its downfall... Maybe give luminae guests  a few "BLU plate specials"  so they will stay put!

[Loujul]

13 hours ago, phoenix_dream said:

Ok, I know this will get some people flaming me, but here goes anyway.  IMHO it is time to stop the practice of letting suite guests eat in Blu on a 'space available basis'.  I am a regular Aqua Class passenger and now retired, sail Celebrity 7-8 cruises per year (some 10+ days).  My observations here are based on many, many nights in Blu.  I will also say that occasionally I do sail in suites and I have no issue with the changes I suggest.  I am a big believer that rules should be fair to everyone, and followed by everyone.

 

Why do I have that opinion?  With the revolutionizing of the ships, more Aqua Class cabins are being added.  Logically, this increases the number of passengers eating in Blu exponentially.  There is not room in Blu to add more tables (on M class at least, and little room on S class), so the restaurant is becoming more and more crowded.  On our last cruise on Reflection, which already had more AQ cabins even before any revolutionizing, there were extra tables crammed into Blu which made it less comfortable, more noisy, and still there were lines out the door 10-12 couples deep at all times before 8:30 p.m.  And yet suite guests were allowed in (I know this for a fact). 

 

Second, it has been our experience that most Maître d's do not follow the 'space available basis' rule (not saying it never happens, but we have yet to see it).  On our most recent cruise, the Maître d' actually told us that 1/3 of the suite guests were eating in Blu on a daily basis.  This did not sit well with us, as we had to wait for a table 6 out of the 7 nights of our cruise - getting a beeper and needing to go sit in a bar as there was no seating outside the M class Blu restaurant.  The wait times ranged from 15 to 45 minutes.  So much for the 'space available basis' rule. 

 

Third, when suite guests eat in Blu it has been our experience that extra 'perks' are offered to them that are not offered to everyone actually paying for the restaurant.   Specifically, at least on our Reflection cruise, they were allowed to order off the MDR menu which caused the waiters to have to make the long trek down to the MDR kitchen, meaning they were off the floor for as much as 10-15 minutes at a time (this info came from the waiters themselves).  This obviously considerably delayed service for everyone else.  It is not really an issue on M class as they share kitchen space, but on S class this should not be allowed.

 

Fourth, when in Luminae, the guests have the option of ordering off the MDR menu if they do not like their own menu (at least I know on S class they do).  So they already have two full menus to choose from.

 

Finally, AQ guests are not allowed to eat in Luminae, so why are suite guests allowed to eat in Blu??

 

On a more subjective level, it is my opinion that this is wrong, and is just not fair to the paying Aqua Class passengers!  I understand why the process was initiated back in the days before Luminae.  Celebrity created a special, nicer (than MDR) restaurant and suites (who paid more) were not allowed to use it.  So they decided to let them enter on a space available basis.  Ok, I can understand that.  But now there IS a special restaurant that is nicer than Blu and yet the practice continues.  They've added more AQ cabins, and yet the process continues.  This is just not right and it is time to stop the practice.  Suite guests sailing with non-suite customers have the option of paying for them to eat in Luminae with them.   If they will not completely stop the practice, perhaps rather than limiting suite entry into Blu on the not-usually-followed practice of 'space available' suite guests should be required to pay to eat in Blu as they are taking up space originally planned for AQ passengers.  That would at least slow down the practice.

So happy for your post.  We sailed the Infinity in January and every night there was a minimum of 30 minute wait for Blu.  We were furious!  I made sure that I told Celebrity on my exit survey.   I will never book Aqua Class again.

[phoenix_dream]

49 minutes ago, Pushka said:

Because they are paying much more  than Aqua. 

And they are also getting much more than Aqua.  Much bigger cabins, bigger balconies with nicer furniture, a nicer restaurant with more comfortable seating, better service, and more upscale food, butler service, Retreat Lounge, Retreat Deck, included perks,  reserved seats on EC nights in the theater, separate boarding area, priority embarkation and tendering, and on and on.  How much is enough?!?!  Where does it end?! I say it ends when it starts impinging on the services others have paid for and have a right to expect to enjoy what they paid for.  Suite guests pay a lot of money so it is fine that they get the services they paid for.  But Blu is paid for by AQ guests and they are the ones who have the right to enjoy it in comfort.

[wallysdtr]

10 hours ago, Happy Cruiser 6143 said:

I've sailed in both AQ and suites.  The only reason I would ever choose to eat in Blu vs. Luminae was when they had the muesli cart in Blu at breakfast.  Since that's long gone, no reason at all that I can see to choose Blu over Luminae.

when did they get rid of the muesli cart?  we have friends that will be sailing with us in March and one of the wives was looking forward to this. 

[phoenix_dream]

7 minutes ago, wallysdtr said:

when did they get rid of the muesli cart?  we have friends that will be sailing with us in March and one of the wives was looking forward to this. 

It's been gone for years.  They have muesli on the menu but not the cart.  They cut that when they cut the staff.

Edited February 5, 2020 by phoenix_dream

[warmwinds]

39 minutes ago, phoenix_dream said:

And they are also getting much more than Aqua.  Much bigger cabins, bigger balconies with nicer furniture, a nicer restaurant with more comfortable seating, better service, and more upscale food, butler service, Retreat Lounge, Retreat Deck, included perks,  reserved seats on EC nights in the theater, separate boarding area, priority embarkation and tendering, and on and on.  How much is enough?!?!  Where does it end?! I say it ends when it starts impinging on the services others have paid for and have a right to expect to enjoy what they paid for.  Suite guests pay a lot of money so it is fine that they get the services they paid for.  But Blu is paid for by AQ guests and they are the ones who have the right to enjoy it in comfort.

Could not agree more, Phoenix.  We are lucky we dine early and do not have to put up with this nonsense.

 

As I've said upstream, which has been lost, just give them the Blu menu in Luminae (as they also get the MDR menu) and have them choose to their heart's content.  No need to take up space in Blu.  It really is not fair.

[CruzeBoozer]

We’ve sailed in AQ many times and have really enjoyed Blu on all the S class ships.  We have waited in line or with a buzzer many times even though we usually arrived around 8:30-9 no big deal.  We moved up to Suites and really enjoy Luminae so haven’t felt the need to go to Blu.  

 

On a recent Equinox cruise we stopped by to ask the Maitre D if we could dine in Blu at some point and he explained they were too full on that particular cruise again no big deal.  This does happen!

 

I really would like to meet these Suite guests that wall on water, are over pampered, catered to etc. because I think Suite guests as a whole get a bad rap for being demanding etc.  I have encountered many demanding guests on various cruises and I know for a fact they were not in Suites by their pass in the lanyard around their neck.  If Celebrity would better manage this dining room policy a lot of people would have to move on to another topic to gripe about. 

[excitedofharpenden]

To the OP, no flames from me. I totally agree with your thought process. I don't have a horse in the race because I don't travel AQ, but can understand you pay extra for a speciality restaurant which is not so special because it's noisy and busy. 

 

Just a question. Is it often the that Blu is so crowded?

 

Phil 

[Pushka]

1 hour ago, phoenix_dream said:

And they are also getting much more than Aqua.  Much bigger cabins, bigger balconies with nicer furniture, a nicer restaurant with more comfortable seating, better service, and more upscale food, butler service, Retreat Lounge, Retreat Deck, included perks,  reserved seats on EC nights in the theater, separate boarding area, priority embarkation and tendering, and on and on.  How much is enough?!?!  Where does it end?! I say it ends when it starts impinging on the services others have paid for and have a right to expect to enjoy what they paid for.  Suite guests pay a lot of money so it is fine that they get the services they paid for.  But Blu is paid for by AQ guests and they are the ones who have the right to enjoy it in comfort.

Yes. But I guess that the pricing has taken all the amenities available into account when setting the price. I’ve not been in a suite before but have been in an Aqua and did have to wait and felt exactly the same. However suite prices are eye-watering.  The lowest suite on our cruise being almost double the price of an Aqua cabin. 
 

Perhaps Celebrity put a much higher price on the Spa inclusions in Aqua than we might expect. 

Edited February 5, 2020 by Pushka

[NCHPcruiser]

We too have been refused entry into Blu (twice) while sailing in a suite.   Each time it was on a longer cruise where we simply wanted a change in venue but it was no problem and we understood completely when told space was not available.