Why isn't NCL cancelling due to coronavirus? Other cruise lines are.

[elwood_98034]

2 minutes ago, elwood_98034 said:

What people don't understand is that there is limited medical care capacity. Where I work we normally run at 101% productivity. I fear that there are already patients not getting the care that they would normally get. People assume that if they get sick and go to a hospital they will get looked after as per normal. That is changing very quickly. During Katrina some workers just gave up, and went home to save their own lives, and look after their families. Drop a few cruise ships full of suspected infected into the middle of somewhere like Seattle where the healthcare systems are already overloaded, and workers are vanishing, and hard, and even brutal decisions are going to be made.

I just got a text from a friend who works at an even bigger hospital to mine where I used to work. She describes it as a 'Sh it storm.'

She says that some staff are too casual, and others are going overboard. That is what I am seeing where I work. Most of us were not prepared.

[Greenpea2]

I get your point. But I don't see this as realistic. There are a lot of petri dish situations. Just going to the grocery store. Riding a bus. Taking a plane. Going to the movies. Where do you draw the line at doing something and then quarantining yourself? 

[Isabella Benjamin]

The real answer as to why NCL isn't cancelling is that the cruise lobby is fighting the government and making concessions to keep that from happening. 

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/coronavirus-pandemic-tests-clout-of-cruise-industry-and-its-long-standing-ties-to-trump/2020/03/12/3f79a1ba-63aa-11ea-912d-d98032ec8e25_story.html

 

I'll leave it to you to decide if these lobbyists have our best interest or cruise companies best interest at heart. 

[Georgia_Peaches]

20 minutes ago, Mammasan said:

Medical experts suggest that at this time, everyone should limit their exposure to others, whether in stores, crowds, hospitals, cruise ships, planes, etc., etc.  This behavior can help stop the spread of Covid-19 and the number of deaths from contracting the disease.

We agree on this.  In our area, schools have just been called off for the next 2 weeks.  This includes the university system as well.  Maybe a 2 week period of social distancing is what's needed for this thing to get under control.  Doesn't stop me from wanting to cruise in April.  Time will tell.

[DarkJedi]

1 hour ago, sailthesea said:

I shudder to think of all the passengers returning, not doing self-quarantine, and passing it on to vulnerable populations. People are DYING because of this. It's not the time to go on a cheap cruise.

It is scary I know, over 56,000 dead in the US alone for not doing self quarantine at the first sign of illness.

I mean really, people should just stay home the second they think that they are even slightly ill and not go to work or leave their homes at all.

 

The flu this year has killed so many people. Anyone who went outside over the last few months is just so inconsiderate, let alone ANYONE who dared to go on any sort of winter vacation. Those bastards just wanted to kill grandparents by getting the flu and bringing it home.

 

Oh, and there is this new virus that has killed just over 4,000 people on the entire planet so far that people are freaking out about. I don't understand that at all.

[ReturnCruiser]

Here is an interesting article in today's Washington Post. Troublesome, if accurate.

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/2020/03/12/norwegian-cruise-line-managers-urged-salespeople-spread-falsehoods-about-coronavirus/

[elwood_98034]

9 minutes ago, Greenpea2 said:

I get your point. But I don't see this as realistic. There are a lot of petri dish situations. Just going to the grocery store. Riding a bus. Taking a plane. Going to the movies. Where do you draw the line at doing something and then quarantining yourself? 

I am not taking a plane, going to the movies, riding on buses, and when I got to the store I am extremely careful, and practicing almost the same infection control measures that I do at work. 

Are we existing in different realities?

[elwood_98034]

If we go short on the Italian death and infection rate the USA is looking at around 20 million deaths. About the same as WW2 total. 40x US losses in Vietnam. This year. Washington and Oregon combined. +.  Plus a few more added in for giggles. One third of Cali. Manhattan x2. Like that. Have fun kids.

Edited March 12, 2020 by elwood_98034

[ColeThornton]

10 minutes ago, elwood_98034 said:

If we go short on the Italian death and infection rate the USA is looking at around 20 million deaths. About the same as WW2 total. 40x US losses in Vietnam. This year. Washington and Oregon combined. +.  Plus a few more added in for giggles. One third of Cali. Manhattan x2. Like that. Have fun kids.

 

Sometimes it's just a good idea to step away from the keyboard for a bit.

[NLH Arizona]

1 hour ago, lambs2 said:

I have been at Disney World all this week with extended family and you would never know there was a Corona Virus Pandemic. Been to all four parks and have only seen 3 or 4 folks wearing masks. DW has hand sanitizer available everywhere and I know we have been washing our hands with soap and water and not touching our faces.  Our NCL sailing is still on, so far, and we intend to take similar precautions and spend LOTS of time on our balcony breathing in FRESH air. 

Disneyland is now closed.  Disney World is still open

[njhorseman]

24 minutes ago, elwood_98034 said:

If we go short on the Italian death and infection rate the USA is looking at around 20 million deaths

No. For 20 million deaths to occur in the US at the Italian death rate, everyone in the US would have to become infected. 

 

The Italian death rate is a bit over 6.5%...and that will drop as more people get tested.

 

Edited March 13, 2020 by njhorseman

[elwood_98034]

5 minutes ago, ColeThornton said:

 

Sometimes it's just a good idea to step away from the keyboard for a bit.

We are special. I get it. We have Costco hotdogs, and big trucks. Trump and Biden will save us.

 

Sorry dude. I think we might have just trodden in it with both feet on this one. Speeches and happy thoughts aren't going to swing it this time.

[nolegal22]

Hindsight will definitely be 20/20 here. The right thing to do would be to follow the lead of the rest of the world in making a major and significant effort to slow the spread of the virus. This would involve both cancellations and refunds. However, the truth is, when you answer to no one, you do what you want... until that day you are answering to everyone. Very shortsighted and shame on NCL and all who are “just trying to enjoy (their) vacation.”  Please.... if you truly can tune this all out while you listen to Bob Marley’s “3 Little Birds” on your NCL cruise ship while the world around you struggles....good for you. I guess. 
 

See the comments from the medical providers above and compare them to the “it’s my cruisey and I will cruisey if I want to” mentality.
 

As a citizen of the USA who knows we are “in this world together,” (whether we like it or not) I cancelled my H9 Haven Suite out of a sense of  personal responsibility and a commitment to slowing the spread of a virus that will likely never ever ever ever ever affect me. My family and I are young, strong and healthy, with no underlying health conditions. For that we are thankful.  However, I recognize that our health doesn't make us immune from spreading a virus to the weak while I sip my margarita in “Its 5’oclock Somewhere.”
 

One day, in hindsight, NCL will just be known as part of the spread, backed by the almighty dollar and lack of regulation. Unless

they pay their lobbyists enough to rewrite the story... which is more likely than NCL doing the right thing and cancelling their Petri dishes on the sea. 
 

Enjoy your vacation. Because “every little thing, is going to be alright.”

[njhorseman]

14 minutes ago, ColeThornton said:

 

Sometimes it's just a good idea to step away from the keyboard for a bit.

Or maybe buy a calculator, or understand mathematics or something...

[elwood_98034]

Just now, njhorseman said:

No. For 20 million deaths to occur in the US at the Italian death rate, everyone in the US would have to become infected. 

 

60% (per Merkel) of 330 million, and split the diff between the WHO 3.4%, and Italy running at about 7% last time I checked. Oh, you're right. It is only 10 million. My bad. I missed by 10 million. 

[luckyinpa]

when will NYC subway close. now thats some tight quarters

[Greenpea2]

35 minutes ago, elwood_98034 said:

I am not taking a plane, going to the movies, riding on buses, and when I got to the store I am extremely careful, and practicing almost the same infection control measures that I do at work. 

Are we existing in different realities?

Apparently you don’t live in a city or have to work outside of the home. But there are millions of people in a very different reality from that. 

[elwood_98034]

3 minutes ago, njhorseman said:

Or maybe buy a calculator, or understand mathematics or something...

"The death of one man is a tragedy. The death of millions is a statistic." – Josef Stalin

[elwood_98034]

1 minute ago, Greenpea2 said:

Apparently you don’t live in a city or have to work outside of the home. But there are millions of people in a very different reality from that. 

I work in a big ER in Seattle. Thank you.

[chipmaster]

Quality of management, culture and motivation drive decision.  Some have leaders some have bean counters and some are sheep following the herd.

[not-enough-cruising]

Man, I thought it was testy on the Royal Caribbean board, I had to pop over here for comparison. Crazy man, just crazy. 

[njhorseman]

Just now, elwood_98034 said:

60% (per Merkel) of 330 million, and split the diff between the WHO 3.4%, and Italy running at about 7% last time I checked. Oh, you're right. It is only 10 million. My bad. I missed by 10 million. 

 Merkel's 60% is at the extreme top end of the potential, and I won't accept even anything as high as the WHO's 3.4% because that's the current measurement when only a fraction of the actual infections are being detected due to inadequate availability of testing. That's not  me interpreting Merkel and the WHO, it's more in depth analysis of the number by experts in epidemics.

 

Try doing some research rather than reading sensationalistic headlines.

[erdoran]

@elwood_98034 thank you for talking about what’s what.  You medical professionals are true heroes, and unfortunately there is so much further to go, this is only the beginning of something like no one alive today has ever experienced (unless you were in the middle of the original SARS or Ebola).  

 

Not to rain on anyone’s parade, but when you talk about self-isolating if you were around someone who was infected or if you think you are, either can be true but you may not know, or won’t know for several days, and meanwhile you’re infecting others.

 

And the poster who said “what’s the big deal, it’s flu” - this is ~10x as deadly as flu.  We have vaccines and meds for flu.  We have none for Coronavirus, other than some untried experimental meds which I’ve heard have been given very, very rarely when someone is dying.  This is more contagious than the flu.  Many people have had flu vaccines, others have some immunity, since the generic influenza virus has been endemic for our lifetimes.  The thing about this virus is we have zero immunity.  Even if you place no value on your own life, please think of how many other lives you will put at risk....and all so you can take a cruise vacation.  So let’s see here. -cruise/legitimate risk of infecting people.  

 

I know what the right decision is.  Do you?

 

There is such a thing as a staycation too, you know, if you can only take that one week-or by then maybe you won’t need a vacation because of all the turmoil, either your vacation will be cancelled entirely or your workplace will be turned upside down.

[vinotinto]

Well, Disney has now closed all of its parks worldwide, including Disneyland and Walt Disney World, and Disney Cruise Line. Kudos to Disney for “flattening the curve.”

 

My DH is a healthcare worker and if he were faced with the position that Italian health care workers are facing - deciding who to give that last ventilator that is available - I know that would destroy him.

 

Edited March 13, 2020 by vinotinto

[JustAPilot]

I can guarantee you more people have it then you think. In Canada they are reporting that 30 to 70 percent of the population will get it. Most of us will have that annoying itchy throat, maybe headache. We will pop a halls or Advil and go about our day.
 

The people with underlying conditions or elderly won’t be so lucky. Unless we take drastic actions like quarantining major metropolitans like China, Italy and South Korea did, people will go on about their day.

 

Look at the NBA player on the Utah Jazz who caught it, he said he felt fine to even play that night before they confirmed he had it.

Edited March 13, 2020 by JustAPilot