It's even worse than we thought

[Cruise Raider]

1 minute ago, Bgwest said:

There's another thread discussing "number of cruises sailed" and "number of days sailed "still being credited into Captain Circle accounts for sailings cancelled by Princess. Wonder how they handled your sailing. If you would please, add how they handled this for you. 

 

Well, as of today, it is listed under my Captain's Circle account as a completed cruise and was counted under my total cruises and days cruised as well.  I've read that once a person has received their refund or FCC's, it was removed, though.  I've received neither of these as of yet.  It would be nice if they left it on there ... kind of as a little reward for all the waiting we've done.  

[Thrak]

5 minutes ago, Cruise Raider said:

 

Well, as of today, it is listed under my Captain's Circle account as a completed cruise and was counted under my total cruises and days cruised as well.  I've read that once a person has received their refund or FCC's, it was removed, though.  I've received neither of these as of yet.  It would be nice if they left it on there ... kind of as a little reward for all the waiting we've done.  

 

I wouldn't want to see a bogus "days at sea" count. I like knowing exactly how many days I've sailed with Princess. If my booked cruises are all cancelled I don't want an extra 58 days "at sea" showing when I didn't actually sail.

[gardenbunny]

And then there is this.....Makes sense and even Princess has said future itineraries will depend on  which ports will be open.  It is all very sad for the entire travel industry.  The effect this virus has had worldwide is monumental to every facet of life as “we knew it” before.  

 

https://www.forbes.com/sites/tamarathiessen/2020/04/11/europe-borders-may-close-to-september-due-to-us-covid-19-threat/

[Cruise Raider]

15 minutes ago, Thrak said:

 

I wouldn't want to see a bogus "days at sea" count. I like knowing exactly how many days I've sailed with Princess. If my booked cruises are all cancelled I don't want an extra 58 days "at sea" showing when I didn't actually sail.

 

 I can appreciate your opinion on that .. but, for me, I'd still like to see it on mine.  It will go away if they are consistent, so probably a moot point.  

[deadzone1003]

3 hours ago, voljeep said:

I'm thinking that the cruise lines will have to put up some kind of bond that the cruise ports could go against to insure that the cruise lines themselves bare this cost, not the cruise ports

 

How much of a bond ??? - I'd guess it would state in the $50 million minimum - or is that too low  ?

Too many variables to determine a possible outcome which is what you need.  Companies underwrite auto insurance because they expect a certain outcome.  The history data bears it out.  We don't have any data history to accurately determine outcome.  You may be able to cover certain small cruise ports, but how about the more popular places?  How about the fellow passengers who get sick on the ship?  Don't be surprised if they start suing the heck out of the cruise lines!  Virtually every scenario has alot of risks at this time.  Vaccine is maybe the only salvation.  The question is how long will it take?  

[Bgwest]

13 minutes ago, Cruise Raider said:

 

 I can appreciate your opinion on that .. but, for me, I'd still like to see it on mine.  It will go away if they are consistent, so probably a moot point.  

Ditto. The mental math to arrive at accurate numbers is easy. 

[Pierlesscruisers]

As to "days at sea" I can see a reason for yea and  one for nay.. For yea: Passengers/customers discomforted through no fault of their own by being held on board and not returned home when scheduled. For nay: Passengers/customers provided food & services that they did not pay for.  Who is caught in the middle?  Both Princess and the passenger/customer. Neither one was the cause but both are affected. Why should either one profit through something neither were responsible? Passenger doesn't increase their "days at sea" without paying for the time spent and Princess doesn't end up with more "senior" passengers without the income they would normally earn by the additional sailings of the passengers.

 

At least that's the way it seems to me, but I very well may have misunderstood the original premise that I read or thought I read. 

 

Tom

[Thrak]

2 hours ago, Pierlesscruisers said:

As to "days at sea" I can see a reason for yea and  one for nay.. For yea: Passengers/customers discomforted through no fault of their own by being held on board and not returned home when scheduled. For nay: Passengers/customers provided food & services that they did not pay for. 

 

I just don't want credit for days when I wasn't on a ship or anywhere near the water. If one was "stuck" on a ship through no fault of their own then I have zero issue with the days being added as they were definitely on a ship. I don't think I should be credited for days in my easy chair at home simply because the cruise was cancelled.

[Pierlesscruisers]

44 minutes ago, Thrak said:

 

I just don't want credit for days when I wasn't on a ship or anywhere near the water. If one was "stuck" on a ship through no fault of their own then I have zero issue with the days being added as they were definitely on a ship. I don't think I should be credited for days in my easy chair at home simply because the cruise was cancelled.

 

I would certainly agree with that.

 

Tom

[Bgwest]

1 hour ago, Thrak said:

 

I just don't want credit for days when I wasn't on a ship or anywhere near the water. If one was "stuck" on a ship through no fault of their own then I have zero issue with the days being added as they were definitely on a ship. I don't think I should be credited for days in my easy chair at home simply because the cruise was cancelled.

I'll bet that if you were to find yourself in that position, a call to Princess customer service with a request to remove the unearned days would be honored. 

[Thrak]

1 minute ago, Bgwest said:

I'll bet that if you were to find yourself in that position, a call to Princess customer service with a request to remove the unearned days would be honored. 

 

I would definitely do so. WHY would I want unearned "days at sea" to show in my profile? I will never be the most sailed passenger. It wouldn't help me get to Elite. It "might" boost me toward the loyalty OBC but I don't tend to rip off folks for stuff I'm now owed so I don't care about that either. I give back extra change at the cash register. I tell folks if I see them drop money or something. It's easy to be honest and doesn't hurt me at all.

[Bgwest]

1 minute ago, Thrak said:

 

I would definitely do so. WHY would I want unearned "days at sea" to show in my profile? I will never be the most sailed passenger. It wouldn't help me get to Elite. It "might" boost me toward the loyalty OBC but I don't tend to rip off folks for stuff I'm now owed so I don't care about that either. I give back extra change at the cash register. I tell folks if I see them drop money or something. It's easy to be honest and doesn't hurt me at all.

Do you also return to Princess any "goodwill" OBCs that you receive?

 

I've received several of these over the years when they identify something they've done, or have not done. These have always been initiated by Princess not by me. 

 

I've always looked upon these as a gift from Princess that they are providing simply because they believe it's what they feel like they need to do as a goodwill gesture.  

 

How is Princess adding "goodwill" days/credits any different?

[dockman]

On 4/11/2020 at 11:28 AM, deadzone1003 said:

Too many variables to determine a possible outcome which is what you need.  Companies underwrite auto insurance because they expect a certain outcome.  The history data bears it out.  We don't have any data history to accurately determine outcome.  You may be able to cover certain small cruise ports, but how about the more popular places?  How about the fellow passengers who get sick on the ship?  Don't be surprised if they start suing the heck out of the cruise lines!  Virtually every scenario has alot of risks at this time.  Vaccine is maybe the only salvation.  The question is how long will it take?  

 

Have you read the cruise contract all passengers sign?  Good luck with those law suits.

[resistk]

1 hour ago, dockman said:

 

Have you read the cruise contract all passengers sign?  Good luck with those law suits.

 

I agree the lawyers have their work cut out for them however given the relatively high numbers of death and illness across numerous ships and lines, I suspect they will find a way to get a multidistrict  class action going.  Here are just a few of the tsunami of lawsuits.  The courts have a way of fashioning a remedy when there is overwhelming concensus there has been alleged wrong doing:

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/travel/2020/04/07/costa-cruises-slapped-with-proposed-class-action-suit-over-handling-coronavirus-aboard-luminosa-ship/

 

"It’s become apparent that the cruise industry as a whole grossly mismanaged the coronavirus outbreak, and it’s clear that there will be a significant amount of litigation on the horizon related to it”

 

https://www.newsweek.com/covid-19-class-action-lawsuits-1496027

 

"Consumer and shareholder fraud, in addition to violations of employment law, have become the most common harms committed during the crisis. Consumers and shareholders are often alleging that they were misled about the risks of COVID-19, and employees caught up in the ensuing economic downturn have objected to mass-scale firings."

 

https://www.law.com/2020/03/16/mikal-watts-sues-princess-cruise-lines-over-covid-19-outbreak/?slreturn=20200313194709

 

Edited April 13, 2020 by resistk

[Lucky TGO]

On 4/3/2020 at 4:35 PM, Mackenzie1 said:

Yikes!  Carnival is burning through $1 billion per month with it’s ships not sailing!  I hope that’s not our refund money. 

Guess again 😳.

Tony

[AF-1]

Did you ever hear the line; rob peter to pay paul?  Guess who Peter is?  you and me.  

[Daniel A]

A lot of these postings keep reminding me of the TV Ad where the people yell "It's my money and I want it NOW!"  Princess has been upfront asking please allow approximately 60 days to get your refund.  Posters who claim to be great lovers of Princess suddenly turn on Princess and accuse Princess of being criminal because they didn't get their refund immediately.  Why not take a breath and give Princess the time they committed to instead of trying to push your way to the head of the line?  (I've seen these people on cruises too - they're too important to wait.)

[PORT ROYAL]

18 minutes ago, Daniel A said:

A lot of these postings keep reminding me of the TV Ad where the people yell "It's my money and I want it NOW!"  Princess has been upfront asking please allow approximately 60 days to get your refund.  Posters who claim to be great lovers of Princess suddenly turn on Princess and accuse Princess of being criminal because they didn't get their refund immediately.  Why not take a breath and give Princess the time they committed to instead of trying to push your way to the head of the line?  (I've seen these people on cruises too - they're too important to wait.)

 

No, they think they're too important.

[AF-1]

Danial A;  yea what's up with these loyal Princess followers?   I accepted FCC on both Princess and AMA Waterways.  Let's see how things shake out.  People have knee jerk reactions for things that have no control over.  People need to calm down take a deep breath and wait it out.  Nothing we do today can guarantee tomorrow will even come.  I agree about the people who have think they are the most important person on the ship  .

[fishin' musician]

Yes, take a breath and feel blessed to even have "disposable income". 

 

 

[jagoffee]

On 4/10/2020 at 4:55 PM, npcl said:

Actually quite a few.  Which specific ones would you think would as you put it "barely exist"

 

I suspect one of the biggest impacts of the ships being shut down is that many cruise ports might just find that they like it better without cruise ships.

 

 

Perhaps.  There are always some residents of any country or city that would prefer not to have a cruise port stop or any tourism.  Most of the places around the world that we visit would be have a very tough time without the revenue from both cruises and general tourism.

As far as I know it is a local decision to make deals with cruise companies to stop at their location.  No River boats in Europe or cruise ships in the Caribbean would be a disaster for the local economies, but it is certainly their right to survive with less money/jobs. 

[npcl]

2 hours ago, Daniel A said:

A lot of these postings keep reminding me of the TV Ad where the people yell "It's my money and I want it NOW!"  Princess has been upfront asking please allow approximately 60 days to get your refund.  Posters who claim to be great lovers of Princess suddenly turn on Princess and accuse Princess of being criminal because they didn't get their refund immediately.  Why not take a breath and give Princess the time they committed to instead of trying to push your way to the head of the line?  (I've seen these people on cruises too - they're too important to wait.)

Probably because the airlines are dealing with just as many, if not more cancellations, yet I have received my refunds from United in 5 days, Hawaiian Air in 9 days, Alaska Air in 11 days, and Delta in 8 days.

 

On the other hand with Princess, a normal cancellation of a cruise prior  to full payment date is still waiting 42 days later. At the time I called for the refund they indicated that I should receive it with in 10 days.

The FCC's were returned to my account within 2 days and my prepaid gratuities made it back in 4 days.  About the normal time for their refund system.  Normally the main refund would have arrived with in 10 days.  The fact that the others were processed that fact, but the main refund has not makes it very clear that they are slow walking refunds.

 

So yes, even with over 300 days on Princess, even though my last two cruises ended on January 14, 2020 and March 7, 2020 (Royal Princess)  I am at this stage getting  annoyed with Princess.

[PrincessLuver]

49 minutes ago, npcl said:

Probably because the airlines are dealing with just as many, if not more cancellations, yet I have received my refunds from United in 5 days, Hawaiian Air in 9 days, Alaska Air in 11 days, and Delta in 8 days.

 

On the other hand with Princess, a normal cancellation of a cruise prior  to full payment date is still waiting 42 days later. At the time I called for the refund they indicated that I should receive it with in 10 days.

The FCC's were returned to my account within 2 days and my prepaid gratuities made it back in 4 days.  About the normal time for their refund system.  Normally the main refund would have arrived with in 10 days.  The fact that the others were processed that fact, but the main refund has not makes it very clear that they are slow walking refunds.

 

So yes, even with over 300 days on Princess, even though my last two cruises ended on January 14, 2020 and March 7, 2020 (Royal Princess)  I am at this stage getting  annoyed with Princess.

 

Princess is the only travel company that we have had a problem in getting a significant refund returned from......hotels, airlines, private excursion companies no problem.....but Princess who supposedly values people's loyalty is showing just how little they really value being loyal back and doing what is right for thousands of their cruise guests......it is really turning into a ripoff....they started with 30 days and then went to 60 days and you can bet it is going to go to 90 days and continue on to probably never......so funny that some people sing the praises of Princess for doing nothing......I guess they have no problem with people lying to them.....

Edited April 14, 2020 by PrincessLuver

[Roberto256]

 

At one time, you could fill out a section in your cruise history to "report a missing cruise".

 

There was a poster here who advocated reporting your way to elite.

 

She was then banned for life by another cruise line, and disappeared.

 

Edited April 14, 2020 by Roberto256

[npcl]

4 minutes ago, PrincessLuver said:

 

Princess is the only travel company that we have had a problem in getting a significant refund returned from......hotels, airlines, private excursion companies no problem.....but Princess who supposedly values people's loyalty is showing just how little they really value being loyal back and doing what is right for thousands of their cruise guests......it is really turning into a ripoff....

Yes I am in the same situation.  Private tour company in England - refunded in 14 days. Several different airlines - all prompt. Hotels - no problem immediate on line.

 

Princess - still waiting.