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June cruises cancelled

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I can't believe that there's so many Skeptics among you maybe you should call Crystal for yourself and ask them to explain to you what their new cancel policy is I was told that I could have price of my cruise Fair return to my credit card or applied as a future Cruise credit to another cruise I was also told that the $500 administrative fee would also be given back to me as a future Cruise credit to use on another Cruise but I actually don't think I'm going to be waiting until November 1st I may cancel this Cruise within the next 2-3 weeks and apply it to a cruise I already have booked for 2021 or at another I have Cruise booked for 2022

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Perhaps so many of us are skeptical because what you were told contradicts the new Crystal cancellation policy that was published on May 1 at https://www.crystalcruises.com/book-with-crystal-confidence .   The new policy implies that there will no longer be FCCs for the administrative penalty as has been the case in the past, but stops short of explicitly saying that. So although I find it encouraging that you were told there would be a FCC for the admin penalty, it is hard to know what that means since the rest of it is so markedly different from their published policy:

 

*CANCELLATION SCHEDULE

Days Shown are Before First Service

 

Table of the cancellation and future cruise credit policy for Crystal.

 

Standard cancellation penalties will apply to insurance and Personal Select Air. Pre- and post-cruise packages will mirror the updated temporary cancellation penalties. Port charges, taxes, and fees paid will be refunded to the original form of payment. *Admin Fees for Ocean are: $100 for voyages 13 days or less, $200 for voyages 14-21 days and $500 for voyages 22 days or more. Admin Fees for River, Yacht & Expedition voyages are $500 regardless of length. Future Cruise Credit may be applied to new bookings or existing bookings that have not been paid in full. Future Cruise Credit may not be used for initial deposit or split over multiple bookings and there is no refund value. Future Cruise Credit must be applied by 12/31/2020 to a booking departing by the end of 2022. Future Cruise Credit will be applied to guests’ profile within 30 days. Program’s cancellation, reduced deposit and final payment policies do not apply to charters or contracted groups. These temporary policies may change occasionally as conditions and events evolve.

 

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FWIW

 

From my TA, 28th April, cruise date 27 September.

 

Crystal have confirmed that if you cancel your sailing before the 15 June 2020 the charge would be only £154 per person with the remaining paid refunded back to you.
The £154 per person would be held to use as a future cruise credit within 1 year.”

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MBP&O2/O, my post above was quoted from the US website, so I don't know if the same schedule applies in the UK or elsewhere.  The policy is also dated May 1, but seems to match the dates you were given if your cruise is <= 13 days.  Again, I am very happy to hear that they are still offering FCC for the admin penalty.

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I canceled our 10/30 booking and a 2022 booking. The 10/30 cruise was 13 days and the $100pp admin fee will be a future cruise credit and the 2022 booking was for 24 days and the admin fee of $500pp will also be a future cruise credit.  I have one year from the cancellation date to book a cruise to use the admin fee credits.

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thanks for your comment, kathy.

i guess we're proving the skeptics totally wrong.2021 when i canceled my dec 2nd river cruise, they applied part of the money to my 2021 canada/new england cruise and part of the money to the 2022 lisbon to rome cruise so i didn't lose any money at all.

thanks again for your support.

 

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2 minutes ago, USC Adventurer said:

thanks for your comment, kathy.

i guess we're proving the skeptics totally wrong.2021 when i canceled my dec 2nd river cruise, they applied part of the money to my 2021 canada/new england cruise and part of the money to the 2022 lisbon to rome cruise so i didn't lose any money at all.

thanks again for your support.

 

 

I don't think you did.  Try getting your money back and see how successful you are.  

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kent, you are an expletive deleted.  i told you they put my cancellation money towards two other cruises i had booked.  to me, that's like getting my money back  but i don't think your brain can comprehend that.  i'm done with you now.

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1 hour ago, USC Adventurer said:

kent, you are an expletive deleted.  i told you they put my cancellation money towards two other cruises i had booked.  to me, that's like getting my money back  but i don't think your brain can comprehend that.  i'm done with you now.


You are so childish with that comeback.  Good luck sailing on those two other cruises.  

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David, believe it or not, my post yesterday was meant to be helpful to you.  I'm sorry you interpreted it as skeptical since that was not my intent.  I'm glad you moved quickly to cancel your river cruise and transfer the funds onto future cruises without losing anything at all. 

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Posted (edited)
3 hours ago, USC Adventurer said:

kent, you are an expletive deleted.  i told you they put my cancellation money towards two other cruises i had booked.  to me, that's like getting my money back  but i don't think your brain can comprehend that.  i'm done with you now.

 

With respect USC, and without knowing all of the details, I suspect what he meant was if you have to/try to cancel either of those two bookings, you will find that the amounts transferred to them from your river cruise booking will be in the form of an FCC. That FCC, in all likelihood will not come with a refund option. To kent9xxx1, assuming USC in fact does end up taking these cruises, he has, de facto, if not de jure, "got his money back" in the sense that he will not have to come up with that money at final payment. Different story if he has to cancel either/both those bookings.

 

Edited by Roland4

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Mighty Quinn thank you very much for your last post I appreciate it very much everything turned out fine the money from the river cruise with supplied and completely paid for my 2022 Crystal Symphony cruise and I have the money I have left over I can either apply to my 2021 Crystal Serenity Cruise or save that money as a down payment on a Christmas Market Cruise in December of 2023

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Roland thank you for your comment I don't think you really need to defend Kent but I'm happy with the outcome I've got money in the bank with Crystal to use however I want and I have a another Cruise completely paid in full I do feel good about the whole situation except for one horrible thing is that I can't go on the Christmas Market cruise this year but I feel good that I was able to cancel everything I just don't feel comfortable getting on an airplane 411 hours with total strangers and then flying again to Budapest stayed in a hotel for three nights and getting on a ship that I don't know anything about the other passengers then flying back to London from Vienna and then back to Phoenix from London it's just I'm just not comfortable doing it this year cheers

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David, I am so happy all of this worked out for you.

 

We were in a similar boat having cancelled one cruise and having money applied to two other cruises and it worked like a charm.

 

Best to you.

 

Keith

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We are a few days away from a decision point on a September river cruise.  The decision - do I want 75% of our payment returned in money or zero (we do get FCCs) if we decide to wait until we get closer to the cruise departure date.  And if the cruise goes as scheduled, can we get there and not have a 14 day quarantine before boarding or a 14 day quarantine upon return.  We do expect our current flights to be canceled complicating arrival and return. (I tried a ghost booking on the same flights without luck.  The flight does not exist to book yet DL does not reflect them being canceled currently.)

We are OK with FCC's but who knows what will happen more than a year out.  Thankfully we can wait longer for our Jabauary 2021 Serenity cruise.  

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thanks for your support, keith.

yes, it really worked wonderfully for me and i'm sure other people too.

and good to hear from you since your serenity cruise days and holiday in australia with your family.  hope you and anne are staying healthy these days.

 

cheers

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Not trying to start an arguement here and I am curious.

For those that took what would have been a refund and applied it to other cruises as a FCC: what happens if Crystal goes bankrupt before those cruises happen?  Is your money not lost in that case?  Personally, I would rather take a credit on my credit card now than get a FCC that may or may not be worthless in the future.

 

 

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3 hours ago, cruisr said:

 

For those that took what would have been a refund and applied it to other cruises as a FCC: what happens if Crystal goes bankrupt before those cruises happen?  Is your money not lost in that case?  Personally, I would rather take a credit on my credit card now than get a FCC that may or may not be worthless in the future.

 

 

This is why I cancelled my 2022 Cruise. I'd rather risk $1000 now than the $6000 I have on deposit.

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28 minutes ago, ChatKat in Ca. said:

This is why I cancelled my 2022 Cruise. I'd rather risk $1000 now than the $6000 I have on deposit.

 

I wouldn't risk $6,000 on Crystal at this point. I vacillate daily on my long term confidence in their continuing to be a cruise line that I'd want to sail. Waited until they canceled my June cruise and have a fair confidence that I will get the $6,400 they owe me in a 90 day time frame. I have final payment on my October cruise due the second week in June. Will almost surely cancel before the payment is due. I might (or might not) leave my deposit on that one with them as a FCC as it's under $1,300.

 

Patty

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Folks here may know that I have a very conservative attitude regarding future cruises.

If the cruise line go bankrupt your money in the cruise company will be gone.

You are deemed to be an 'unsecured creditor' and the last to get a fraction of payment if there is any left. I think the moderators here will allow me to say this much only.

 

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21 hours ago, datolim said:

Folks here may know that I have a very conservative attitude regarding future cruises.

If the cruise line go bankrupt your money in the cruise company will be gone.

You are deemed to be an 'unsecured creditor' and the last to get a fraction of payment if there is any left. I think the moderators here will allow me to say this much only.

 


That’s true in the case of an FCC (and even that’s not a given), but not a credit card deposit/payment on a particular sailing.  Your bank would be the creditor because you would do a chargeback, and their claim isn’t unsecured — travel suppliers are required to put up large bonds for the processors against the volume of transactions they process in advance of delivering services, and those claims go specifically against those funds.  
 

The banks are no fools, they get left holding the bag on chargebacks in this case, and they don’t let anyone promise to deliver services in the future for money they fork out today without some kind of cover.
 

I’d also add that most likely a line would want to go chapter 11 and try to reorganize their other (non-deposit) debts first, before they go chapter 7.  In chapter 11, odds are VERY slim that the bankruptcy wouldn’t fund existing passenger deposits from all sources. It’s really chapter 7, which I personally think is further down the road for our cruise lines than chapter 11, where the passengers have to worry about their non-card charges.

 

Vince

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40 minutes ago, BWIVince said:

 

The banks are no fools, they get left holding the bag on chargebacks in this case, and they don’t let anyone promise to deliver services in the future for money they fork out today without some kind of cover.
 

 


no bank is left holding the bag.  They just deny your chargeback.  Happens all the time even when the airlines went out of business and cannot deliver.

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6 minutes ago, kent9xxx1 said:


no bank is left holding the bag.  They just deny your chargeback.  Happens all the time even when the airlines went out of business and cannot deliver.


That’s unlikely, and only after the bonds are depleted, and those requirements went up exponentially after the last recession.  I personally wouldn’t be worried about a deposit on a specific voyage under the terms of my card.  YMMV of course.

 

Vince

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1 hour ago, BWIVince said:


That’s unlikely, and only after the bonds are depleted, and those requirements went up exponentially after the last recession.  I personally wouldn’t be worried about a deposit on a specific voyage under the terms of my card.  YMMV of course.

 

Vince

 

I personally got charge back denied after spanair went belly up.  I didn't know until I was at the airport asking where was the counter.  Chargeback filed, but ultimately denied.  Don't remember the exact reason, maybe force majeure (is BK a force majeure). 

 

The other thing is there is a time limit on your charge back.  If the charge went through a year back, it is unlikely they will do anything.  Most people paid way in advance for cruises.  Anyway, let's hope it doesn't get to that.  But the bank is not going to eat 4-5 figure if you do charge back and cruise line refuse to pay them.  They will not be holding any bag for either you or the cruise line.  

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6 hours ago, kent9xxx1 said:

 

I personally got charge back denied after spanair went belly up.  I didn't know until I was at the airport asking where was the counter.  Chargeback filed, but ultimately denied.  Don't remember the exact reason, maybe force majeure (is BK a force majeure). 

 

The other thing is there is a time limit on your charge back.  If the charge went through a year back, it is unlikely they will do anything.  Most people paid way in advance for cruises.  Anyway, let's hope it doesn't get to that.  But the bank is not going to eat 4-5 figure if you do charge back and cruise line refuse to pay them.  They will not be holding any bag for either you or the cruise line.  


I’ve never seen bankruptcy accepted as force majeure, but I guess anything is possible.

 

The time limit is the whole reason for the bonds, which retail merchants aren’t usually subject to because they are delivering goods around the time of payment — the window for a chargeback is much smaller, as is the risk.  With a payment in advance of services provided, a cardholder still has a narrow window to claim fraud on their entering the charge, but that doesn’t change the merchant’s failure to deliver services.  The merchant still has the obligation to deliver services — just because you bought them months in advance doesn’t give them carte blanche to cheat you, or people would use this loophole all the time.

 

Using an illustration from the board, two people claimed winning a chargeback and not just getting a temporary credit because Crystal didn’t respond fast enough.  If a credit card company is going to issue a permanent chargeback in 30-60 days for a refund under notice for 90 days because a line didn’t respond in 15-30 days to the chargeback, then how do you think a line is going to respond faster after it liquidates?  I would think that same rule applies.

 

This conversation is straying away from my original point that you don’t automatically lose all your money if a line fails.  No bond source is unlimited, and there IS always a risk some people will be left stuck.  That’s why I ALWAYS, not just in this case, recommend that people make sure their transaction is covered (to your actual spend) by:

 

1) a local statutory regulation covering a travel suppliers failure

2) an agency or consortium’s coverage against a travel suppliers failure
3) a travel policy that specifically covers failure of a supplier

 

This is a fast and easy conversation with your agent that everyone should always be having, because you just never know.  Points one and two cover a lot of people with no further action required, and point three you possibly already have (as I do), but it’s worth seeking coverage if you don’t already have it.

 

Vince

 

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