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MMDown Under

List of Dates Australian ports are closed to?

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Princess thread has a cruise critic list of ports which are open and which are closed (Maine ports thread).

For Australia it says 15/6, with Tasmania 30/6.

I was surprised to read this, as I didn't realise any dates had been announced.  Is anyone aware of any announcement of dates ports will be open?

 

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56 minutes ago, MMDown Under said:

Princess thread has a cruise critic list of ports which are open and which are closed (Maine ports thread).

For Australia it says 15/6, with Tasmania 30/6.

I was surprised to read this, as I didn't realise any dates had been announced.  Is anyone aware of any announcement of dates ports will be open?

 

No, I haven't seen anything about ports opening to cruise ships.

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11 minutes ago, By The Bay said:

No, I haven't seen anything about ports opening to cruise ships.

I just saw a live interview by PM and he said no mention worldwide (except maybe Greece).

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That list is nonsense. A port may be open, but only for merchant ships for trade. And for Australia international travel, with the exception of NZ in the future, ports will be blocked to cruise ships for some time yet. Many of the European ports are open for their local ferries etc. And many of the European cities are closed for tourism until much later in the year but obviously allowing locals to transit. 

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The original ban was to 15/6 in my understanding, but now it's open ended.

 

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Ports being open may be referring to any ship from foreign ports (i.e Cargo etc) and would be a lot different to ports being open to cruise ships. 

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If anyone reading this would care to speculate, I'd be most appreciative:

 

I am booked on the Oosterdam sailing from Seattle on September 27 and ending in Auckland on November 7.  There are three port calls in Australia and six in New Zealand.

 

What is your opinion about whether Australia and New Zealand will open for visas before the end of July? 

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5 minutes ago, DeeDee Groff said:

What is your opinion about whether Australia and New Zealand will open for visas before the end of July? 

 

I don't know about the visa situation, but wouldn't the almost certainty that no Australian or NZ ports will be open to cruise ships for the rest of this year be an even bigger problem?

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3 minutes ago, SinbadThePorter said:

 

I don't know about the visa situation, but wouldn't the almost certainty that no Australian or NZ ports will be open to cruise ships for the rest of this year be an even bigger problem?

Yes, port closures are definitely a "bigger problem," but the situation with Holland America is that if they cancel a cruise, they will either give double the amount of the deposit in a future cruise certificate or a refund; if I were to choose a refund, then I must wait between four and ten weeks for the refund.  If I cancel, that the same policy on the refund applies, but the future cruise credit in lieu of a refund would yield 125% instead of 200%.

 

Last Wednesday HAL announced many cancellations through the end of this year including Europe.  I had $600.00 US as a deposit on two cruises; that $1200.00 morphed into a $2400.00 future cruise certificate that I asked to be applied to the Oosterdam sailing that I'm inquiring about here.

 

Has it been announced in the Australian or New Zealand mainstream media that ports in either country are closed to cruise ships through the end of this year?

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3 minutes ago, DeeDee Groff said:

 

Has it been announced in the Australian or New Zealand mainstream media that ports in either country are closed to cruise ships through the end of this year?

 

There has been no mention of ports opening for cruise ships. Even flying between Australia and NZ does not have a start date. The current situation is, Australian citizens and permanent residents cannot travel overseas due to COVID-19 restrictions, strict exemptions apply. All international travellers arriving in Australia regardless of nationality or point of departure must complete self-isolation for 14 days in designated facilities before they can go home. Self-isolation must happen in your city of arrival into Australia, no matter if you arrive by plane or cruise ship.

 

There has been talk between Oz and NZ about operating "in a bubble". No mention of cruise ships operating "in the bubble". Lots of negative comment about cruise ships, especially Ruby Princess. The first of three inquiries will be handed down in Mid August. Things might be clearer then around cruise ships re-starting.

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I think the important issue is the official statement that borders are closed. Only in or out flows Require strict approvals.

 

The government keeps saying this will flow into 2021, except for the mooted bubble with New Zealand.

 

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2 hours ago, By The Bay said:

All international travellers arriving in Australia regardless of nationality or point of departure must complete self-isolation for 14 days in designated facilities before they can go home. Self-isolation must happen in your city of arrival into Australia, no matter if you arrive by plane or cruise ship.

 

Just to further clarify. The only people even allowed to come to Australia currently are Australian citizens or permanent residents.  There are no cruise arrivals currently, cruise ships have been banned from Australian ports.

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It certainly was a shame that the way the ruby princess was mishandled led to such tragic events. Troubling that it occurred during a known event, a global pandemic.

Reading the published reports to date are exposing miscommunication by various authorities tasked to protect the public.

No doubt as is always said following inquiries, lessons have been learnt and positive changes will occur. 

People will still want to travel and are keen to do so.

Lets hope this current mess can be sorted asap and we can return to living our lives as we wish.

Many have died sadly and will not have the opportunity. 

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23 hours ago, DeeDee Groff said:

If anyone reading this would care to speculate, I'd be most appreciative:

 

I am booked on the Oosterdam sailing from Seattle on September 27 and ending in Auckland on November 7.  There are three port calls in Australia and six in New Zealand.

 

What is your opinion about whether Australia and New Zealand will open for visas before the end of July? 

I'd say your chances are somewhere between zero and non-existent.

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20 hours ago, pully8 said:

It certainly was a shame that the way the ruby princess was mishandled led to such tragic events. Troubling that it occurred during a known event, a global pandemic.

Reading the published reports to date are exposing miscommunication by various authorities tasked to protect the public.

No doubt as is always said following inquiries, lessons have been learnt and positive changes will occur. 

People will still want to travel and are keen to do so.

Lets hope this current mess can be sorted asap and we can return to living our lives as we wish.

Many have died sadly and will not have the opportunity. 

What irritates me is that the impact of allowing the passengers to disembark has actually been minimal.  The 700 passengers who subsequently tested positive already had the disease before they disembarked.  Nothing the Port Authority, ABF, or NSW Health could have done would have changed that.

 

The fiasco, caused by incompetence within NSW Health, has resulted in a small number of secondary infections - people who came into contact with CV-19 carriers - but these numbers have been surprisingly small.

 

Nothing NSW Health did, or could have done, would have prevented the 25 deaths.

 

What they really should be investigating, and none of the investigations is likely to even touch on it, is to figure out how the virus got onto the ship in the first place - and how the carrier(s) came to be in Australia in the first place?  Why was/were the carrier(s) not picked up at the airport, when they flew into the country?  This is the failure which resulted in 700 people catching the disease, and 25 people dying.

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Here are some comments from Australia's Chief Medical Officer today:



Aussies hoping for an overseas holiday will be waiting for a very long time, according to chief medical officer Dr Brendan Murphy.

Speaking at today's COVID Committee, Dr Murphy said while local border measures were "less important" in stopping the spread of coronavirus currently, international border measures were integral.

"Two thirds of our cases have been overseas acquired and recent analysis in academic literature has shown that those countries that have done the best have introduced border measures," Dr Murphy said.

"I cannot see border measures materially changing for some time and that presents a huge problem for the nation."

Dr Murphy said a relaxation of state and territory border measures could be in the near future.

Western states in particular had brought in border measures to "protect" themselves from the rest of Australia and its coronavirus surge.

"When NSW had a lot of cases I think that some of those states felt it would help their epidemiology if they closed borders," he said.

Dr Murphy said Australia was still seeing virus cases in returned international travellers, particularly from Europe and the UK, who are all spending two weeks in quarantine hotels.

While there's been talk of easing some coronavirus restrictions, Dr Murphy advised caution on borders.

"I cannot see border measures… they'll be one of the last things to go international border measures," he said.

Asked if he could see international borders reopening this year or next year, Dr Murphy admitted no one could be sure.

"There is no clear roadmap out of this, we have a strategy of maintaining strong suppression, potentially elimination in some parts of country while we relax restrictions," he said.

"But then we will have to reassess every few months to see what's happening with vaccines, treatments.

"I have no vision at the moment on the current international scene where strong border measures won't be necessary…the world situation will evolve over many months."

Cruise Ships won't be returning to Australia until after we re-open the borders for international travellers... and that's not happening for "a very long time".

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50 minutes ago, Vader1111 said:

What they really should be investigating, and none of the investigations is likely to even touch on it, is to figure out how the virus got onto the ship in the first place - and how the carrier(s) came to be in Australia in the first place?  Why was/were the carrier(s) not picked up at the airport, when they flew into the country?  This is the failure which resulted in 700 people catching the disease, and 25 people dying.

That would be impossible to trace. The carrier(s) may or may not have had symptoms at any stage. If they didn't how could the finger be pointed at them? If they didn't when they boarded the ship but subsequently developed symptoms how could anyone be sure they were the carrier and not someone who was subsequently infected. Even if they had slight cold symptoms when they boarded they may have just put that down to the aftereffects of a long distance flight.

 

Even if there had been health checks at the airport those would not have detected someone who was asymptomatic.

 

The situation worldwide was evolving so rapidly that what we think should have happened with the perspective of 20-20 hindsight, was not seen as a big problem at the time.

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Posted (edited)
12 minutes ago, OzKiwiJJ said:

That would be impossible to trace. The carrier(s) may or may not have had symptoms at any stage. If they didn't how could the finger be pointed at them? If they didn't when they boarded the ship but subsequently developed symptoms how could anyone be sure they were the carrier and not someone who was subsequently infected. Even if they had slight cold symptoms when they boarded they may have just put that down to the aftereffects of a long distance flight.

 

Even if there had been health checks at the airport those would not have detected someone who was asymptomatic.

 

The situation worldwide was evolving so rapidly that what we think should have happened with the perspective of 20-20 hindsight, was not seen as a big problem at the time.

Hasn't stopped them from pointing fingers at an anonymous chef in the kitchen, when it probably came on board with a European or American passenger.

 

I agree that it would be very difficult to identify any individual(s) now, particularly given the number of people who are assymptomatic.  The point is that the real reason for the Ruby Princess deaths was a failure to control Australia's borders at the airports, allowing CV-19 carriers to enter the country without any screening whatsoever.

Edited by Vader1111

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1 hour ago, Vader1111 said:

Hasn't stopped them from pointing fingers at an anonymous chef in the kitchen, when it probably came on board with a European or American passenger.

 

 

No, but that just illustrated two things:

1. The police commissioner hasn't got a clue how crise ships operate so he lost credibility there.

2. It showed he had already decided who was to blame so that any investigation is a travesty, and he lost more credibility there.

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2 minutes ago, OzKiwiJJ said:

No, but that just illustrated two things:

1. The police commissioner hasn't got a clue how crise ships operate so he lost credibility there.

2. It showed he had already decided who was to blame so that any investigation is a travesty, and he lost more credibility there.

As I have said in other areas I do not believe criminal charges will ever be laid. I think he is just making these silly comments thinking the public appreciate them and need something to blame for the terrible situation. It is sad but that is what some people do. The reason I do not think there will be criminal charges as you have just said within my quotations and others have said the man has no credibility and has already tainted the investigation. With his perceived bias on public display with allegations that can be easily refuted by the general public any trial would be easy winnings for a skilled defence team. Not only that a highly resected barrister holding the commission of inquiry is likely to present a truthful and unbiased and honest report. It is unlikely the police would deviate from the status quo set by the final report by the special commission of inquiry. I note the police investigation is due to wrap up after the commission of inquiry and that being the case it will likely just be quietly shelved and go away.

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Yes, I think the police investigation will be tucked away in a dark place never to see the light of day again. Here's hoping anyway.

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https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/covid-19/414944/covid-19-customs-investigates-ruby-princess  There are reports of a cluster that might have originated from the ship, port visits in NZ. 

We may never get to bottom of all the origins of the infection.

Safe to assume viruses of all sorts surround us.

Some more deadly than others.

We cannot live with zero risks.

Hopefully our travel restrictions will not last and deny us from holidays to places and experiences that we enjoy.

 

 

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Given what we know now about the number of cases that developed on the ship it would be not be surprising to find cases in NZ that came from cruise ship passengers however since the ship couldn't test for the virus, it could only take swabs for testing which were checked in Wellington with negative results I can't see how the ship can be deemed responsible. It sounds like another case of "let's blame the cruise ship".

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