Lift and Shift - any exceptions?

[Lolou127]

2 hours ago, sippican said:

 

What are you trying to lift and shift to? 

 

2 hours ago, sippican said:

 

What are you trying to lift and shift to? 

Well it is a bit of a nightmare, the direct replacement doesn’t include a port we really wanted to do, the cruise that does is on a ship of a different class,  they then said we could of moved to a completely different cruise, right no. Of nights and class of ship, but all the cabins in our category are sold out!!

[dabear]

We tried to L & s from a Sept, 2020 european 10 day cruise on Infinity to the exact 10 day cruise in Sept 2021. Since we tried to be proactive & cancelled our 2020 cruise a few days before the 5/6 starting date we were advised we cannot do the L & S. Thus we're paying for a 2a cabin for about the same price as our S1 suite. 

[Diane Rose]

We did it early on, and we were able to transfer from an 11 day Iberian to a 12 day Iberian Cruise.  No extra charges.  Some of the Roll Call members also switched, but later on in the process it seemed as if Celebrity would not make the change.

 

Diane

[Bruin Steve]

We were able to negotiate one of those rare exceptions.  But it was certainly not easy.

 

First, realize that everyone at Celebrity is overworked and stressed.  And most of the the agents simply do not have the leeway to make any exceptions absent specific approval from someone higher up.

 

The standard policy is that you can move to the same ship, same basic part of the world,same length of cruise, same cabin category within 30 days the following year (but not a holiday cruise) and retain the same deal.  And, yes, that is extremely limiting--especially since many itineraries have changed.  Ports are different, number of nights are often different.  Some ships have been moved to other locations.  But any variation from that requires additional work.

 

And, Celebrity doesn't want it to be used as a method for people to greatly improve their deal--to get a more expensive cruise at a  far lower price--like to move to a longer cruise, a nicer newer ship (that they typically get a premium for), a more popular destination or a holiday cruise that also usually sells at a premium.  The primary logic in the "Lift-and-Shift" is that your same exact cruise might be offered at a higher price next year and it would be unfair to cancel your cruise and then charge you a higher fare to simply rebook it.  Originally, Celebrity thought they took care of this with the 125% FCC offer--that the extra 25% would take care of the higher prices.  I remember the first time I contacted them about it, the agent gleefully told me that I could use that extra 25% to move up to a suite.  But, in many cases, people were finding that it didn't--next years offered rates, if reconstructed with the same perks, were often 40% more, 50% more or even as much as twice what people had paid for 2020...and those customers were complaining. So, the Lift-and-Shift was added to solve that bad PR situation.

 

It was the 125% FCC offer that was designed to take care of people wishing to change to a longer cruise, a different ship or a different itinerary.

 

Which leaves us with the issue of those of us whose cruises were pretty much unmatchable in 2021.  Of course, in all of our minds, it is patently unfair to offer this Lift-and-Shift to people with easy straightforward options but not to us.

 

So, if you can get through to the right people at Celebrity--someone who isn't stressed out and tired of dealing with a lot of angry folks who want more complicated arrangements than the standard...and who are either higher up in the organization or are willing to work with those people on your behalf to get the necessary approvals, it is possible to get one of those exceptions...But, here;s some advice in doing it:

 

First and always--be nice, be civil...don't get overly angry, raise your voice, use bad language or threaten...voice your appreciation and show understanding that they are stressed and overworked, probably working from home with all the same outside stresses we all have at this time.

 

Have a cogent argument for why you need to get that exception--why your 2020 itinerary doesn't exist in the same form and the 2021 itineraries are markedly different (ie.  there are no cruises of the exact same number of nights...or the ports have materially changed--not just, say, one port, like same itinerary but they substituted La Spezia for Livorno).  An argument that scored points for me, for example, is that I had booked not one, but back-to-back cruises--which due to the shuffled itineraries, could not practically be reconstructed in the same manner to a similar effect. 

 

Next, it helps if you can show that the net effect of your desired exception does not result in a materially higher priced cruise.  For example, if you could ALMOST shoehorn it into the 125% FCC deal, but you'd still be a couple of hundred dollars off--or lose your drink package perk.  Assure them it's not that you are trying to get away with a killer new deal, you are just trying to replace what you had with something that works...and should not be penalized because they aren't offering the same cruise.  Often, the pricing on that 11-night cruise that replaced your 10-nighter in the schedule really isn't drastically higher than other 10-nighters...or the different ship isn't priced generally higher.  Point that out to them.

 

In the end, it is to their benefit to have you move your booking to a 2021 reservation.  They keep your business and your money.  They know that merely giving you a refund means you might not book a cruise...or you might find a different cruise--on Princess, HAL or Oceania.  They really don't know what 2021 has in store...they might get a rush of people itching to cruise and willing to pay high prices...or they may find that people are still worried about cruising and they can't fill the ships--even that they fill them, then the bookings drop away as the cruises get closer and people still aren't ready.  They don't know...but, they are still better served to work with you and get you booked...They just don't want to give you a 14 night Med cruise on the Apex over Christmas for the price and terms of your 7 night Caribbean cruise on Constellation in November.

 

Good luck.

[pasta1]

4 hours ago, Bruin Steve said:

We were able to negotiate one of those rare exceptions.  But it was certainly not easy.

 

First, realize that everyone at Celebrity is overworked and stressed.  And most of the the agents simply do not have the leeway to make any exceptions absent specific approval from someone higher up.

 

The standard policy is that you can move to the same ship, same basic part of the world,same length of cruise, same cabin category within 30 days the following year (but not a holiday cruise) and retain the same deal.  And, yes, that is extremely limiting--especially since many itineraries have changed.  Ports are different, number of nights are often different.  Some ships have been moved to other locations.  But any variation from that requires additional work.

 

And, Celebrity doesn't want it to be used as a method for people to greatly improve their deal--to get a more expensive cruise at a  far lower price--like to move to a longer cruise, a nicer newer ship (that they typically get a premium for), a more popular destination or a holiday cruise that also usually sells at a premium.  The primary logic in the "Lift-and-Shift" is that your same exact cruise might be offered at a higher price next year and it would be unfair to cancel your cruise and then charge you a higher fare to simply rebook it.  Originally, Celebrity thought they took care of this with the 125% FCC offer--that the extra 25% would take care of the higher prices.  I remember the first time I contacted them about it, the agent gleefully told me that I could use that extra 25% to move up to a suite.  But, in many cases, people were finding that it didn't--next years offered rates, if reconstructed with the same perks, were often 40% more, 50% more or even as much as twice what people had paid for 2020...and those customers were complaining. So, the Lift-and-Shift was added to solve that bad PR situation.

 

It was the 125% FCC offer that was designed to take care of people wishing to change to a longer cruise, a different ship or a different itinerary.

 

Which leaves us with the issue of those of us whose cruises were pretty much unmatchable in 2021.  Of course, in all of our minds, it is patently unfair to offer this Lift-and-Shift to people with easy straightforward options but not to us.

 

So, if you can get through to the right people at Celebrity--someone who isn't stressed out and tired of dealing with a lot of angry folks who want more complicated arrangements than the standard...and who are either higher up in the organization or are willing to work with those people on your behalf to get the necessary approvals, it is possible to get one of those exceptions...But, here;s some advice in doing it:

 

First and always--be nice, be civil...don't get overly angry, raise your voice, use bad language or threaten...voice your appreciation and show understanding that they are stressed and overworked, probably working from home with all the same outside stresses we all have at this time.

 

Have a cogent argument for why you need to get that exception--why your 2020 itinerary doesn't exist in the same form and the 2021 itineraries are markedly different (ie.  there are no cruises of the exact same number of nights...or the ports have materially changed--not just, say, one port, like same itinerary but they substituted La Spezia for Livorno).  An argument that scored points for me, for example, is that I had booked not one, but back-to-back cruises--which due to the shuffled itineraries, could not practically be reconstructed in the same manner to a similar effect. 

 

Next, it helps if you can show that the net effect of your desired exception does not result in a materially higher priced cruise.  For example, if you could ALMOST shoehorn it into the 125% FCC deal, but you'd still be a couple of hundred dollars off--or lose your drink package perk.  Assure them it's not that you are trying to get away with a killer new deal, you are just trying to replace what you had with something that works...and should not be penalized because they aren't offering the same cruise.  Often, the pricing on that 11-night cruise that replaced your 10-nighter in the schedule really isn't drastically higher than other 10-nighters...or the different ship isn't priced generally higher.  Point that out to them.

 

In the end, it is to their benefit to have you move your booking to a 2021 reservation.  They keep your business and your money.  They know that merely giving you a refund means you might not book a cruise...or you might find a different cruise--on Princess, HAL or Oceania.  They really don't know what 2021 has in store...they might get a rush of people itching to cruise and willing to pay high prices...or they may find that people are still worried about cruising and they can't fill the ships--even that they fill them, then the bookings drop away as the cruises get closer and people still aren't ready.  They don't know...but, they are still better served to work with you and get you booked...They just don't want to give you a 14 night Med cruise on the Apex over Christmas for the price and terms of your 7 night Caribbean cruise on Constellation in November.

 

Good luck.

My TA tried to do the lift and shift 10 day cruise to exact same itinerary with 1 less day which is one less port and will not do it.

[Bruin Steve]

1 hour ago, pasta1 said:

My TA tried to do the lift and shift 10 day cruise to exact same itinerary with 1 less day which is one less port and will not do it.

Same time of year?  Same category?  Perhaps your TA is overworked and didn't want to push it...Or, they spoke toi the wrong person at Celebrity.  If it is otherwise the same cruise, same ship, same time of year...just a day SHORTER, Celebrity WILL do that without much of an argument.

[wrk2cruise]

2 hours ago, pasta1 said:

My TA tried to do the lift and shift 10 day cruise to exact same itinerary with 1 less day which is one less port and will not do it.

 

We moved Equinox 10 night Sept 4, 2020 to Equinox 9 night Sept 17, 2021 without an issue.   Multiple others on our Roll Call did the same.   Have your TA push it to Resolutions department.

[NBliving]

I'm sure this was incorrect information on the X agent I was speaking to, but maybe not...  We had a 10 day Aruba, Curacao, Bonnaire cruise on the Equinox on May 13, 2020 that was cancelled.  I called about the lift and shift because there is a May 14, 2021 9 night cruise (just left off Key West).  The agent looked at what cruises were being offered for a L and S and she came back with a 14 night Iceland/Irish coast cruise.  What the heck?  I am going to call later and see if a different agent has a different answer. 

[Fouremco]

12 minutes ago, NBliving said:

I'm sure this was incorrect information on the X agent I was speaking to, but maybe not...  We had a 10 day Aruba, Curacao, Bonnaire cruise on the Equinox on May 13, 2020 that was cancelled.  I called about the lift and shift because there is a May 14, 2021 9 night cruise (just left off Key West).  The agent looked at what cruises were being offered for a L and S and she came back with a 14 night Iceland/Irish coast cruise.  What the heck?  I am going to call later and see if a different agent has a different answer. 

Looks to me like an excellent candidate for L&S. A good number of posters have been able to switch to cruises that were a day longer, so I can't see there being an issue switching it to one that is a day shorter. Try a different agent, but if unsuccessful, push it to the next level.

Edited June 11, 2020 by Fouremco

[Bruin Steve]

29 minutes ago, NBliving said:

I'm sure this was incorrect information on the X agent I was speaking to, but maybe not...  We had a 10 day Aruba, Curacao, Bonnaire cruise on the Equinox on May 13, 2020 that was cancelled.  I called about the lift and shift because there is a May 14, 2021 9 night cruise (just left off Key West).  The agent looked at what cruises were being offered for a L and S and she came back with a 14 night Iceland/Irish coast cruise.  What the heck?  I am going to call later and see if a different agent has a different answer. 

Having cruised both to the ABC islands AND to Ireland/Iceland, I can flat out say that if I were booked on a 10 night ABC cruise and was offered a 14 night Ireland/Iceland cruise at the same rate and on the same terms as a straight across replacement, I would grab it in a heartbeat and not question it...

 

Go to the ABCs another time...

[pasta1]

22 hours ago, Bruin Steve said:

Same time of year?  Same category?  Perhaps your TA is overworked and didn't want to push it...Or, they spoke toi the wrong person at Celebrity.  If it is otherwise the same cruise, same ship, same time of year...just a day SHORTER, Celebrity WILL do that without much of an argument.

Still denied.TA spoke to district manager for TA'S!

[Bruin Steve]

Okay...You are not supposed to go around your TA when you are booked through a TA...but that seems to be what you have to do.  Call Celebrity directly...or email them at CelebrityOneTouch@celebrity.com.

 

If necessary, since you won't have a reservation left anyway, you can always just pull it from the TA...But, likely you won't have to.  Get Celebrity to agree to do it, then you'd have to get your TA to make the phone call.  If it shows up in the notes with Celebrity, the TA should be able to do it.

[wrk2cruise]

3 hours ago, pasta1 said:

Still denied.TA spoke to district manager for TA'S!

 

Is this Equinox 10 night and you are trying to move to Equinox 9 night, same itinerary minus Key West?  What date is your current reservation?  Many people myself included have been able to do this.  I agree with the previous poster to go to Celebrity directly, if no joy by phone use CelebrityOneTouch.  Be polite yet firm.   Remind them that you are giving up 10% of your holiday by doing this.

[pasta1]

11 minutes ago, wrk2cruise said:

 

Is this Equinox 10 night and you are trying to move to Equinox 9 night, same itinerary minus Key West?  What date is your current reservation?  Many people myself included have been able to do this.  I agree with the previous poster to go to Celebrity directly, if no joy by phone use CelebrityOneTouch.  Be polite yet firm.   Remind them that you are giving up 10% of your holiday by doing this. 

09/25/2020 10 Day Equinox to 9 day Equinox 09/17/2021 minus Key West.

[wrk2cruise]

1 minute ago, pasta1 said:

09/25/2020 10 Day Equinox to 9 day Equinox 09/17/2021 minus Key West.

 

Yes this really shouldn't be an issue.  I did 9/4/2020 to 9/17/2020.  If you look at the 9/17 roll call there are multiple people there who have been successful.   They gave people we were traveling with a bit of a hassle but when they provided our reservation number they were taken care of.   I know it's a pain but continue to push.  My rate this year was about 1/2 of what they were charging for next.  I have found that CelebrityOneTouch people seem to be empowered to make exceptions others are not but I think they want you to exhaust regular channels first.   Try calling Captains Club number and discussing with them.  If you get flat no, ask to speak to someone in resolutions.  If you strike out there then email CelebrityOneTouch.   Can you tell this isn't my first rodeo...   If you want additional advise privately you can contact me at wrk2cruise at gmail.com

[pasta1]

13 minutes ago, wrk2cruise said:

 

Yes this really shouldn't be an issue.  I did 9/4/2020 to 9/17/2020.  If you look at the 9/17 roll call there are multiple people there who have been successful.   They gave people we were traveling with a bit of a hassle but when they provided our reservation number they were taken care of.   I know it's a pain but continue to push.  My rate this year was about 1/2 of what they were charging for next.  I have found that CelebrityOneTouch people seem to be empowered to make exceptions others are not but I think they want you to exhaust regular channels first.   Try calling Captains Club number and discussing with them.  If you get flat no, ask to speak to someone in resolutions.  If you strike out there then email CelebrityOneTouch.   Can you tell this isn't my first rodeo...   If you want additional advise privately you can contact me at wrk2cruise at gmail.com

 Thank you for your help. A reservation number and name would be a great help.

[mading57]

I really appreciate all the responses as well as the advise. I emailed Celebrity Corporate last night and this morning received a canned reply to expect up to 3 weeks for a response. YIKES, 3 weeks!!! Well, at least they replied. Hate to call directly as we booked with a TA and I don't want to get into that hastle with Celebrity that I have to go through the TA. The reason is that I booked through Costco Travel and it takes forever to speak with someone in addition to the long wait for them to contact Celebrity. 

[sippican]

33 minutes ago, mading57 said:

I really appreciate all the responses as well as the advise. I emailed Celebrity Corporate last night and this morning received a canned reply to expect up to 3 weeks for a response. YIKES, 3 weeks!!! Well, at least they replied. Hate to call directly as we booked with a TA and I don't want to get into that hastle with Celebrity that I have to go through the TA. The reason is that I booked through Costco Travel and it takes forever to speak with someone in addition to the long wait for them to contact Celebrity. 

 

Sorry you are having this difficulty. Difficult lesson to learn that the big box stores may have attractive prices on travel, but they are not known for their customer service.

Wishing you the best. 

[Fouremco]

23 minutes ago, sippican said:

 

Sorry you are having this difficulty. Difficult lesson to learn that the big box stores may have attractive prices on travel, but they are not known for their customer service.

Wishing you the best. 

I guess it all depends on what you are looking for in the way of customer service, as we've had nothing but excellent service from out big box store's travel arm. So far this year, they took one issue up to the level of their resolution team dealing with Celebrity's resolution team and secured the result I was looking for; in March, they cancelled a cruise for which we received a combination of FCC and refund, all coming within 15 days; completed an L&S with original fare and all perks with no complications; and later refared the L&S cruise when the Captains Club loyalty promo came along. Maybe some customers need a greater degree of hand holding, but I've had no issues at all with their customer service since they opened in Canada a few years ago.

 

The complaint from @mading57 about it taking a long time on the phone is by no means unique to this big box store. Go through the threads since the beginning of March and you'll find hundreds of posters complaining about the time it takes to get through to Celebrity directly. And as @mading57 says, Celebrity can take three weeks to respond to emails. None of this is surprising, given the extraordinary circumstances, so pointing fingers at the big box store and putting it down to poor customer service isn't justified IMO.

[sippican]

46 minutes ago, Fouremco said:

I guess it all depends on what you are looking for in the way of customer service, as we've had nothing but excellent service from out big box store's travel arm. So far this year, they took one issue up to the level of their resolution team dealing with Celebrity's resolution team and secured the result I was looking for; in March, they cancelled a cruise for which we received a combination of FCC and refund, all coming within 15 days; completed an L&S with original fare and all perks with no complications; and later refared the L&S cruise when the Captains Club loyalty promo came along. Maybe some customers need a greater degree of hand holding, but I've had no issues at all with their customer service since they opened in Canada a few years ago.

 

The complaint from @mading57 about it taking a long time on the phone is by no means unique to this big box store. Go through the threads since the beginning of March and you'll find hundreds of posters complaining about the time it takes to get through to Celebrity directly. And as @mading57 says, Celebrity can take three weeks to respond to emails. None of this is surprising, given the extraordinary circumstances, so pointing fingers at the big box store and putting it down to poor customer service isn't justified IMO.

 

So  happy to hear that you have had a great experience, but I'll stick to my opinion that big box stores are not as well-known  for a level of excellence in service as they are for low pricing and great incentives. Some of the reasons may be higher staff turnover and lack of specialization and training in the travel industry. Of course there are exceptions to that and everyone has their own priorities and risk tolerance.

Your example of long hold times is a great one!  Why on earth would somone expect long hold times when trying to contact their TA?  You engage a TA becuase you have expectations, one of which should be good personal service. Even now, TAs, if they are good at their profession,  have little to no waits whatsoever to answer a phone or e-mail and facilitate communication with their clients.They may not have answers, but they should be readily accessible. Seems like you are excusing the long waits to  contact  a travel agent because it equates to the current experience trying to contact X.  Apples to oranges. If someone's having lengthy waits to communicate with their TA, they need a new one. IMHO

 

 

[Fouremco]

5 minutes ago, sippican said:

 

So  happy to hear that you have had a great experience, but I'll stick to my opinion that big box stores are not as well-known  for a level of excellence in service as they are for low pricing and great incentives. Some of the reasons may be higher staff turnover and lack of specialization and training in the travel industry. Of course there are exceptions to that and everyone has their own priorities and risk tolerance.

Your example of long hold times is a great one!  Why on earth would somone expect long hold times when trying to contact their TA?  You engage a TA becuase you have expectations, one of which should be good personal service. Even now, TAs, if they are good at their profession,  have little to no waits whatsoever to answer a phone or e-mail and facilitate communication with their clients.They may not have answers, but they should be readily accessible. Seems like you are excusing the long waits to  contact  a travel agent because it equates to the current experience trying to contact X.  Apples to oranges. If someone's having lengthy waits to communicate with their TA, they need a new one. IMHO

 

 

My experience dealing with the Canadian big box store's call centre, located just down the road in Montreal, has been minimal wait time getting through to them, but then they are a l-o-n-g time getting through to Celebrity. Now, I don't call at peak times, so that makes a big difference. Also, the agents are trying to speed things along: on my last call, as soon as I identified the cruise I was calling about, the agent asked me to hold while she initiated a call to Celebrity. That way she was already in the queue while we discussed my issue with her.

 

I'm not excusing long wait times to get through to the TA because I'm not experiencing long wait times.

 

In any event, there is always debate over whether or not to use a TA, and if so, what type. At this point in time, I generally know exactly what I want, including the cabin number if it's a new booking, before I even pick up the phone.  Consequently, I'm not looking for the type of advice and support from my TA that I needed when I started cruising. On the other hand, I do enjoy getting  8-10% worth of additional perks and rebates. While that it more common in the US, it's almost unheard of here in Canada.

 

 

[dabear]

2 hours ago, sippican said:

 

So  happy to hear that you have had a great experience, but I'll stick to my opinion that big box stores are not as well-known  for a level of excellence in service as they are for low pricing and great incentives. Some of the reasons may be higher staff turnover and lack of specialization and training in the travel industry. Of course there are exceptions to that and everyone has their own priorities and risk tolerance.

Your example of long hold times is a great one!  Why on earth would somone expect long hold times when trying to contact their TA?  You engage a TA becuase you have expectations, one of which should be good personal service. Even now, TAs, if they are good at their profession,  have little to no waits whatsoever to answer a phone or e-mail and facilitate communication with their clients.They may not have answers, but they should be readily accessible. Seems like you are excusing the long waits to  contact  a travel agent because it equates to the current experience trying to contact X.  Apples to oranges. If someone's having lengthy waits to communicate with their TA, they need a new one. IMHO

 

 

I agree with you. We're also willing to pay more to have good customer service.  We've used the same TA for about 15 years (replaced a former one). If she is unable to answer our call ,we get a return call within a reasonable time period. She's favorably resolved many issues for us. She also has been able to provide most, if not all of the perks and discounts (sometimes greater)(other than the big box gift card). When you're spending thousands on a cruise, we think adding $50 to $100 more for customer service is a worthwhile cost..

[Maebers]

Hi Msteg,

I'm on the same cruise, Hawaii to Australia 2020.  After two called made to Celebrity saying No, I contacted the Ceo of celebrity and it got done, now I'm on the 2021 sailing.

[mading57]

Just received my first no. How where you able to reach the CEO? I'd like to try that.

 

[wrk2cruise]

You really need to use proper escalations paths before going to the CEO.  Did you speak with a supervisor?  Get to resolutions department?  Contact CelebrityOneTouch@celebrity.com.   I would  make sure you exercise the above AND have a good case prior to emailing the office of the CEO.

 

I just read above you do have a TA.  You would need to exhaust any escalation path available to them as well.