Are vaccines the light at the end of the tunnel?

[Charles4515]

3 minutes ago, TrulyBlonde said:

Exactly. I never cruise in the Summer with an exception because we had a week prior to closing on a new home and had never been to Bermuda. We took the Summit and it was packed with families in August. yuck.

 

I cruise to Bermuda now the first or second week of June when the kids are still in school. Prices are better too because of that and Bermuda weather is better, it is much less humid than July or August. 

[grandgeezer]

4 hours ago, TrulyBlonde said:

Look who is CC'd on the letter from Frank Del Rio. Let's play hardball 🙂

CC:
Hon. Xavier Becerra, Secretary of Health and Human Services
Mr. Ronald A. Klain, White House Chief of Staff
Mr. Jeffrey D. Zients, COVID Response Coordinator
Dr. Nathaniel Smith, Deputy Director for Public Health Services and Implementation Services, U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention
Mr. Andrew M. Slavitt, Senior Advisor to the COVID Response Coordinator
Governor Ron DeSantis, State of Florida
Senator Marco Rubio, State of Florida
Senator Rick Scott, State of Florida
Senator Dan Sullivan, State of Alaska
Mayor Daniella Levine Cava, Miami-Dade County
Representative Carlos Gimenez, Florida’s 26th Congressional District
Representative Gus Bilirakis, Florida’s 12th Congressional District
Representative Maria Salazar, Florida’s 27th Congressional District
Representative Ted Deutch, Florida’s 22nd Congressional District
Representative Federica Wilson, Florida’s 24th Congressional District
Representative Debbie Wasserman-Schultz, Florida’s 23rd Congressional District
Representative Mario Díaz-Balart, Florida’s 25th Congressional District

This seems to be more of a bullying tactic rather than playing hardball. I hope they either put it in the circular file or way on the bottom of the to do list. Looks like he's making sure everyone knows where the original idea came from, especially in Fllorida.

[TrulyBlonde]

7 minutes ago, Charles4515 said:

 

I cruise to Bermuda now the first or second week of June when the kids are still in school. Prices are better too because of that and Bermuda weather is better, it is much less humid than July or August. 

Same with Alaska. We went in May before schools were out. It was fabulous with no crowds and beautiful weather. 

[nocl]

4 hours ago, TrulyBlonde said:

Look who is CC'd on the letter from Frank Del Rio. Let's play hardball 🙂

CC:
Hon. Xavier Becerra, Secretary of Health and Human Services
Mr. Ronald A. Klain, White House Chief of Staff
Mr. Jeffrey D. Zients, COVID Response Coordinator
Dr. Nathaniel Smith, Deputy Director for Public Health Services and Implementation Services, U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention
Mr. Andrew M. Slavitt, Senior Advisor to the COVID Response Coordinator
Governor Ron DeSantis, State of Florida
Senator Marco Rubio, State of Florida
Senator Rick Scott, State of Florida
Senator Dan Sullivan, State of Alaska
Mayor Daniella Levine Cava, Miami-Dade County
Representative Carlos Gimenez, Florida’s 26th Congressional District
Representative Gus Bilirakis, Florida’s 12th Congressional District
Representative Maria Salazar, Florida’s 27th Congressional District
Representative Ted Deutch, Florida’s 22nd Congressional District
Representative Federica Wilson, Florida’s 24th Congressional District
Representative Debbie Wasserman-Schultz, Florida’s 23rd Congressional District
Representative Mario Díaz-Balart, Florida’s 25th Congressional District

The CC list doesn't really matter.  He could have CC'd the entire  Congress, Senate and all of the Governors and it really would not matter.

 

Finally you are getting a cruise line doing what they should have done 2-3 months ago.  Actually put together a proposal and submit it, instead of hiding behind CLIA playing the lobbying game.

[K.T.B.]

6 hours ago, Denny01 said:

This poster keeps throwing around misleading information. Most major airlines required masks 01 May 2020. 

 

https://www.afar.com/magazine/face-masks-now-required-provided-on-these-us-airlines  

whats the point except to ‘have fun’ at the expense of people’s health. Don’t wear a mask - I’ll avoid you. Don’t get vaccinated - I’ll not have to be concerned you are on a cruise with me. Make everything a political divide and I’ll keep conversations at the level of exchanging pleasantries......from across the room, not on a cruise ship!
 

as this Pandemic subsides because of the rational actions of the great majority of us, the result will be all are protected, even those who enjoy their little game. 
 

den
 

 

 

 

 

 

As of February it's now federal law:  https://thepointsguy.com/news/us-airline-mask-exemptions/#:~:text=As of Feb.,temporary or permanent flying ban.

[K.T.B.]

5 hours ago, verizon said:

CNBC just announced.

It seems the rule is 60% capacity.

 

NOT seeing anything about that anywhere, especially not on CNBC's site.

[NMTraveller]

21 minutes ago, nocl said:

The vaccine works very well.  The issue is that we are still in a pandemic.  The Moderna and Pfizer vaccines seems to deal with the E484K mutation (B.1.351 and B.1.1.28) pretty well.  Not so much with the AZ vaccine (showed 10% efficacy in a trial in South Africa against B.1.351).  Novavax demonstrated 60% efficacy and J&J 57%.  E484K has also shown up in a number of home grown variants in the US.

 

Now you have a new strain from India that includes not only the E484K mutation but anther major mutation as well.  No data there yet.

 

Some of the new variants are also proving to be more infectious and virulent (cause more serious cases) in those that are unvaccinated, including children.  As a result in several of the miswestern states the outbreaks are showing more people under 50 ending up with serious cases.

 

Now if everyone would get vaccinated so we can get the number of cases down while variants can be fairly well handled by the vaccines we have.  All it takes is one fully resistant variant to take us back to last year.

Based upon the CDCs updated recommendations for travel and cruises I would have to believe that we are headed out of a pandemic.  But I suppose you  are an Impending Doom sort of person?

 

The CDC giving the green light to travel for vaccinated people is a gigantic leap for an organization that tends to lean towards the pessimistic.  Twindemic?  Really?

Edited April 5, 2021 by NMTraveller

[TrulyBlonde]

2 minutes ago, K.T.B. said:

 

NOT seeing anything about that anywhere, especially not on CNBC's site.

FYI. Del Rio will be on CNBC tonight to discuss. His full letter to the CDC can be found online on the financial news websites. Just google NCL stock and you will find the news. Also, go to Oceania board.

[nocl]

4 hours ago, TeeRick said:

hcat here is an update.  The US HHS has put J&J in control of the Emergent BioSolutions plant in Baltimore and they will assume full responsibility for their own vaccine production.  It was also announced that the AZ vaccine would no longer be made there.  I find it unusual for HHS to do this rather than FDA.  But good news anyway.

 

https://www.cnbc.com/2021/04/04/us-puts-jj-in-charge-of-plant-that-botched-covid-vaccine-removes-astrazeneca.html

Depends.  If the vaccine is being made under government contract  and paid for under a government program which both J&J and AZ then it would make sense that HHS made the decision to shift to one vaccine only.

 

If the FDA stepped in, it would take an inspection violation and a major violation of GMP for them to take action.  If they did take action it would probably be a shutdown because the decision of what the company wants to make is a business decision, not an FDA inspection decision.

 

So HHS putting pressure on them to shift to one product, the one actually approved in the US makes sense, since no one wants the plant shutdown.

[nocl]

3 minutes ago, TrulyBlonde said:

FYI. Del Rio will be on CNBC tonight to discuss. His full letter to the CDC can be found online on the financial news websites. Just google NCL stock and you will find the news. Also, go to Oceania board.

The real question is if they provided a detailed plan to go along with the letter.  If it is just the letter with its general statements then it will probably not go anywhere.

 

If they provided a detailed plan, then I think they have a good chance of success.

[nocl]

11 minutes ago, NMTraveller said:

Based upon the CDCs updated recommendations for travel and cruises I would have to believe that we are headed out of a pandemic.  But I suppose you  are an Impending Doom sort of person?

 

The CDC giving the green light to travel for vaccinated people is a gigantic leap for an organization that tends to lean towards the pessimistic.  Twindemic?  Really?

No.  Just stating the facts as they exist.  The CDC recommendations for travel still keep the safety protocols in place.

 

Fully vaccinated people can travel within the United States and do not need COVID-19 testing or post-travel self-quarantine as long as they continue to take COVID-19 precautions while traveling – wearing a mask, avoiding crowds, socially distancing, and washing hands frequently.

 

Unfortunately many of those vaccinated will ignore the precautions.  And many of the unvaccinated with travel against the advice of the recommendations.

 

We certainly may be heading out of the pandemic but WE ARE NOT THERE YET.

 

 

[TrulyBlonde]

4 minutes ago, nocl said:

The real question is if they provided a detailed plan to go along with the letter.  If it is just the letter with its general statements then it will probably not go anywhere.

 

If they provided a detailed plan, then I think they have a good chance of success.

I guess you will have to tune in.

[4774Papa]

1 hour ago, Charles4515 said:

I guess you have never been on a Celebrity cruise in the summer. I remember 600 kids on Celebrity Century in the Caribbean one July. Also many children on the Zenith and Summit cruises to Bermuda every July and August. 

We do mostly 14 day cruises and it is rare to see children on those cruises.  Also, we don't do Caribbean cruises any more.  

[K.T.B.]

I know many will be upset by this, but cruises for the foreseeable future need to sail with 100% of the people on board vaccinated.  Period.  Yes, that mean no children under a certain age.  Right now that would be 16.  Yes, it sucks, but this is a freakin' pandemic.  If I had a young child, there is no way I'd consider booking a cruise or even going on vacation.  Once they can be vaccinated, and by every account they should be able to well before the end of the year, THEN book a family cruise.

 

What's more important at this point?  Cruising without children and knowing it's 100% safe so cruise lines can once again operate or having unvaccinated guests on board and taking the chance of another Diamond Princess? The travel industry as a whole needs to take baby steps. First step is making sure its safe and showing that to the public at large.

 

If you have children, be patient.  I know, easy for me to say, but this is not the time to take yet another step backwards.  Let's see how these early cruises go and let's get the kids vaccinated!  I'm confident by 2022 family cruises will in full force then.

[D C]

1 hour ago, Charles4515 said:

I guess you have never been on a Celebrity cruise in the summer. I remember 600 kids on Celebrity Century in the Caribbean one July. Also many children on the Zenith and Summit cruises to Bermuda every July and August. 

Nope. I have not.  Mostly 7n Caribbeans with very few kids.  Don't think I'll be booking one of those summer cruises anytime soon.  Must be miserable for the kids being on X instead of RCL. 

[Jeremiah1212]

1 hour ago, nocl said:

Makes me wonder if we are starting to see a break in the united CLIA front.  NCL was the line that started to bring back crew members a few months ago but then changed their mind and sent them home.

 

And unfortunately for NCL who had to repatriate crews a second time, Encore is in Jakarta today offloading crew. I don't think the CDC will give them an absolute green light for July, but the timing probably couldn't be worse for them if the CDC does loosen the reigns. 

[Ken the cruiser]

1 hour ago, nocl said:

The real question is if they provided a detailed plan to go along with the letter.  If it is just the letter with its general statements then it will probably not go anywhere.

 

If they provided a detailed plan, then I think they have a good chance of success.

From reading this news release describing Del Rio's letter to CDC:

 

Norwegian Cruise Line Holdings Submits Plan to CDC. Asks for July 4 Restart - Cruise Industry News | Cruise News

 

And then comparing his reference in the letter to the NCL SailSAFE Health & Safety Protocols document:

 

MK_APR2101116 NCLH Flyer - SailSAFE Health & Safety Protocols.indd (nclhltdinvestor.com)

 

I'm trying to find how those two documents address the various issues, especially those portside, that CDC defines in their Technical Instructions.

 

Technical Instructions for a Cruise Ship Operator’s Agreement with Port and Local Health Authorities under CDC’s Framework for Conditional Sailing Order | Quarantine | CDC

 

Sorry, my money is still on Celebrity to get their Phase 2A house in order, which I'm sure they are, before they make any moves to request CDC allow them to start sailing again.

[ch175]

2 hours ago, K.T.B. said:

 

As of February it's now federal law:  https://thepointsguy.com/news/us-airline-mask-exemptions/#:~:text=As of Feb.,temporary or permanent flying ban.

This is a law? Can you tell me the date Congress voted for it?

[terrydtx]

3 hours ago, K.T.B. said:

 

As of February it's now federal law:  https://thepointsguy.com/news/us-airline-mask-exemptions/#:~:text=As of Feb.,temporary or permanent flying ban.

So a certain poster who says he doesn't wear a mask when flying" would now be arrested and heavily fined.

[terrydtx]

2 hours ago, nocl said:

Fully vaccinated people can travel within the United States and do not need COVID-19 testing or post-travel self-quarantine as long as they continue to take COVID-19 precautions while traveling – wearing a mask, avoiding crowds, socially distancing, and washing hands frequently.

There is an exemption to this CDC ruling, you are still obligated to follow the rules of the destination you are traveling too. My Sister and BIL are flying to Hawaii next weekend and were told today that Hawaii still requires a proof of negative PCR test within 72 hours of landing even if you are fully vaccinated as they both are. No test and you face being sent back to the mainland or in house quarantine in Hawaii at your expense.  They are only there for one week so quarantine will not be their option. They are both getting tested on Thursday for their Saturday Flight.

[markeb]

27 minutes ago, ch175 said:

This is a law? Can you tell me the date Congress voted for it?

November 16, 2001.

[NMTraveller]

42 minutes ago, ch175 said:

This is a law? Can you tell me the date Congress voted for it?

It really doesn't matter as there is very little enforcement.  There are people who constantly are eating or drinking something.  Or not eating or drinking and are just not wearing their mask.

 

I wear a mask to protect myself.  If you are expecting everyoone to wear masks to protect you good luck.

 

Social distancing at the airport terminals?  LOL.  The major hubs could use every other terminal.  Instead they choose to use one section of the airport that is still crowded.

 

Your best bet is to get the vaccine.

 

Once cruising starts with vaccinated people, airports will still be the weakest link as they will allow unvacinnated people to travel.

Edited April 5, 2021 by NMTraveller

[ch175]

7 minutes ago, markeb said:

November 16, 2001.

Congress voted to require a mask on airlines in November 2001? I guess by extension you could also be forced to wear a pink tutu?

 

The mask thing is a mandate. It’s like a dictator swooped in and decided everyone needs to do something, because, you know. Regardless of how one feels about masks, this should worry you. 

[markeb]

9 minutes ago, ch175 said:

Congress voted to require a mask on airlines in November 2001? I guess by extension you could also be forced to wear a pink tutu?

 

The mask thing is a mandate. It’s like a dictator swooped in and decided everyone needs to do something, because, you know. Regardless of how one feels about masks, this should worry you. 

 

Last reply before I hit ignore since it has nothing to do with this thread.

 

That's the date Congress passed PL 107-71, creating the Transportation Security Administration, and granting what ultimately became the Administrator of the TSA the authority to write federal regulations. Once adopted, those take on the rule of law for enforcement purposes. Like pretty much every other executive branch agency. Like the CBP rule that directly contradicts the PVSA and allows a foreign flagged non coastwise qualified vessel to transport passengers between two US ports by calling on a distant foreign port, which is also not in law. But people around here don't complain about that one.

 

If you want to change how things are done, I suggest a TARDIS or a Way Back Machine to September of 1787,

Edited April 5, 2021 by markeb

[nocl]

3 hours ago, TrulyBlonde said:

I guess you will have to tune in.

Unfortunately just listened to Frank Del Rio.  Sounds like a request to drop the requirements here are all of the general things we can do,  not a here lets replace it with this detailed plan.