RCI new muster process - should CCL follow?

[Al Aboard]

I read this article on CC a few days back:   https://www.cruisecritic.com/news/5482/

 

I liked the new process.  It is patented but any cruise line can license the method for free.  Curious how many feel this would be a better procedure and if CCL should license it.  Apparently NCL already has. 

[Tampa Girl]

45 minutes ago, Al Aboard said:

I read this article on CC a few days back:   https://www.cruisecritic.com/news/5482/

 

I liked the new process.  It is patented but any cruise line can license the method for free.  Curious how many feel this would be a better procedure and if CCL should license it.  Apparently NCL already has. 

 

I like it.  

[grsnovi]

It does seem to be a better way. I always wonder how effective the whole thing would be anyway. Actually going to your muster station helps = we didn't even do that the last couple of times on HAL.

[BJzink]

23 minutes ago, grsnovi said:

It does seem to be a better way. I always wonder how effective the whole thing would be anyway. Actually going to your muster station helps = we didn't even do that the last couple of times on HAL.

Anything to avoid the horrific mess on Costa Concordia!

 

[VMax1700]

36 minutes ago, grsnovi said:

Actually going to your muster station helps = we didn't even do that the last couple of times on HAL.

How did that occur?

Even on the Koningsdam/Nieuw Statendam you must attend your muster station (being MDR, Pinnacle Grill, Main Stage etc).

[rafinmd]

12 minutes ago, VMax1700 said:

How did that occur?

Even on the Koningsdam/Nieuw Statendam you must attend your muster station (being MDR, Pinnacle Grill, Main Stage etc).

I'm pretty sure a lot of people still consider their muster station to be a lifeboat.  As you obviously know, muster is not about abandoning ship but about accountability.  It scares me to think that some people may have even gone to their muster stations and not realized they were there.

 

Roy

[Sir PMP]

I think  this a good way to do the drill.

[rafinmd]

Are the TV's on all HAL ships sufficiently interactive to support this?

 

Roy

[YXU AC*SE]

Recall it is not television based.   Scott.

 

 

[KirkNC]

My concern is that the ship will not sail until everyone has 1.  Watched the tv, 2.  Completed the quiz and 3.  Checked in to their muster station.  My fear is that it could be very problematic to get everyone “cleared” causing significant delays in sailing.  As to the process itself, I am fine.

Edited July 29, 2020 by KirkNC

[ontheweb]

1 hour ago, KirkNC said:

My concern is that the ship will not sail until everyone has 1.  Watched the tv, 2.  Completed the quiz and 3.  Checked in to their muster station.  My fear is that it could be very problematic to get everyone “cleared” causing significant delays in sailing.  As to the process itself, I am fine.

And what about those world cruises like the ones you have done. New passengers getting aboard would have to do the muster. And at each of those times you would have that problem of getting everyone cleared in order to set sail.

[Despegue]

14 hours ago, rafinmd said:

I'm pretty sure a lot of people still consider their muster station to be a lifeboat.  As you obviously know, muster is not about abandoning ship but about accountability.  It scares me to think that some people may have even gone to their muster stations and not realized they were there.

 

Roy

Officially, a Muster station is called ASSEMBLY station. 

Assembly stations have several reasons of existence, but the most Important are :

*Mustering the passengers 

* Crowd control and ease of informing

* preparation for a decision to evacuate In orderly way.

*especially on Inside Assembly Stations ( which are actually Better for many reasons and should be adopted on all vessels in my opinion as an Evacuation procedures expert), the option to easily assign different Lifeboats than the original linked ones, or assign an alternative evacuation method.

 

 

The RCCL new procedure is actually something I have been advocating for years so am very pleased to see it finally being implemented. The Maritime world is very traditional in terms of Safety procedures and it sometimes takes a rough wake-up call for things to change. ( just look at the use of checklists and simulators, somethings that only recently became the norm, and actually still need improvement, but I digress).

 

[rafinmd]

On 7/30/2020 at 2:22 AM, Despegue said:

The RCCL new procedure is actually something I have been advocating for years so am very pleased to see it finally being implemented. The Maritime world is very traditional in terms of Safety procedures and it sometimes takes a rough wake-up call for things to change. ( just look at the use of checklists and simulators, somethings that only recently became the norm, and actually still need improvement, but I digress).

Do you happen to know Captain Aseem Hashmi of Cunard.  I know he was a pilot until about 9/11/01 when aviation took a nose dive and ended up on ships instead.  I know he was also heavily involved in modernizing things on ships.

 

Roy

[Despegue]

9 minutes ago, rafinmd said:

Do you happen to know Captain Aseem Hashmi of Cunard.  I know he was a pilot until about 9/11/01 when aviation took a nose dive and ended up on ships instead.  I know he was also heavily involved in modernizing things on ships.

 

Roy

Yes I know him 😉 

[Aquahound]

On 7/29/2020 at 8:38 AM, rafinmd said:

Are the TV's on all HAL ships sufficiently interactive to support this?

 

Roy

 

That's a good question.  RCI has had fully interactive TVs for decades and is far ahead of CCL brands.  You've been able to order room service via your TV on RCI since the late 90s when Voyager was built.  I have no doubt RCI can pull this off with their current programming.  HAL?  Well, I'm not sure.  

Edited August 1, 2020 by Aquahound

[Himself]

This sounds like a good way to do a drill.  The Boat number should be on the life vest. Not too hard to find the life boat.  On the Pinnacle ship some one would have to be at the muster station to check one off.

[rafinmd]

5 minutes ago, Himself said:

This sounds like a good way to do a drill.  The Boat number should be on the life vest. Not too hard to find the life boat.  On the Pinnacle ship some one would have to be at the muster station to check one off.

Actually, on the Pinnacle ships it's the Muster (Assembly) station number that's on the cards and life vests, not the lifeboat.  The station commanders PROBABLY have a standard lifeboat they would use, but the flexibility to go to a different boat in case there's a problem with one or an unbalance in the passenger counts initially assigned to different boats.

 

Roy

[Himself]

2 hours ago, rafinmd said:

Actually, on the Pinnacle ships it's the Muster (Assembly) station number that's on the cards and life vests, not the lifeboat.  The station commanders PROBABLY have a standard lifeboat they would use, but the flexibility to go to a different boat in case there's a problem with one or an unbalance in the passenger counts initially assigned to different boats.

 

Roy

Thanks for the clarification Roy

[Full-Count]

Have only cruised twice, first Nieuw Amsterdam and NCL Epic.  I did not feel comfortable with NCL’s muster drill.  We mustered to an entertainment venue to watch a video.  At least on HAL I actually learned where my assigned lifeboat was.  In a true emergency being considered for abandoning ship, I would rather make my way to my lifeboat instead of deeper into the bowels of the ship.

Edited August 25, 2020 by Full-Count

[chengkp75]

7 hours ago, Full-Count said:

Have only cruised twice, first Nieuw Amsterdam and NCL Epic.  I did not feel comfortable with NCL’s muster drill.  We mustered to an entertainment venue to watch a video.  At least on HAL I actually learned where my assigned lifeboat was.  In a true emergency being considered for abandoning ship, I would rather make my way to my lifeboat instead of deeper into the bowels of the ship.

And this is just the wrong idea.  As stated above, muster is about accountability, not about getting into boats.  In virtually all emergencies, passengers will be called to muster long before any consideration of getting them into boats is made, if ever.  Muster gets all passengers into limited, controlled locations, where a head count is made so that crew can be sent to find missing people, or use those crew more effectively to deal with the actual emergency.

[KirkNC]

19 minutes ago, chengkp75 said:

And this is just the wrong idea.  As stated above, muster is about accountability, not about getting into boats.  In virtually all emergencies, passengers will be called to muster long before any consideration of getting them into boats is made, if ever.  Muster gets all passengers into limited, controlled locations, where a head count is made so that crew can be sent to find missing people, or use those crew more effectively to deal with the actual emergency.

Not sure that was the way it worked on the Costa Concordia.

[bobpell]

Having cruised on the Koningsdam and Nieuw Statendam for the last 3 trips I learned quickly to wander down to our muster station way earlier than the required time

We watched the milling masses merge , looking for the crew person who enters your card number into the computer. It was always chaotic.

Afterwards we rested our tushes (sp) for upwards of an hour before the elevators weren't jammed packed with humanity

Any new muster  drill which spreads out the turgid seething masses is advantageous to me

PS... While mustering on the Noordam the drill was exasperated with having to stand tummy to butt in the blazing sun while 1 passenger was searched for, not showing up for their own personal reason

I would hope if HAL adopts this procedure that the crew member with the card recording pad shows up at each muster station well in advance of the specified muster time (maybe 1 hour before). Any procedure to  eliminate crowds or lines would be beneficial, plus the elevators wouldn't be over taxed afterwards!!

Take care

Bob

 

[chengkp75]

2 hours ago, KirkNC said:

Not sure that was the way it worked on the Costa Concordia.

As I've stated many times with regards to the Concordia, this was an outlier (both in terms of the damage done to the ship, and the response by the Captain), and blame falls squarely on Schettino for not calling for muster in a timely fashion.  He knew within 6 minutes of striking the rock that the ship was flooding, and he should have signaled for muster at that time, over an hour before the ship grounded a second time and started to list, instead of never signaling it.

 

And, do you think that this new muster procedure would have produced any different outcome?

Edited August 25, 2020 by chengkp75

[chengkp75]

1 hour ago, bobpell said:

Any new muster  drill which spreads out the turgid seething masses is advantageous to me

So, I guess that in an emergency, they should spread out the "turgid seething masses"?  As those in the safety business say, "train as you fight" (training should be as realistic as possible.

[KirkNC]

3 minutes ago, chengkp75 said:

As I've stated many times with regards to the Concordia, this was an outlier (both in terms of the damage done to the ship, and the response by the Captain), and blame falls squarely on Schettino for not calling for muster in a timely fashion.  He knew within 6 minutes of striking the rock that the ship was flooding, and he should have signaled for muster at that time, over an hour before the ship grounded a second time and started to list, instead of never signaling it.

Agreed but the result is it re-enforced the every man for himself mentality.