Possible COVID Case on SeaDream

[Ragnar Danneskjold]

The pandemic is giving me time to do what I really like, sitting in my recliner with a frosty IPA and posting my wisdom on CruiseCritic 🙂

[Jim Avery]

Raggy, at least you know what you are good for.....  Poor Carol...🍸

[Ragnar Danneskjold]

Hey, I am making her orange chicken with rice for dinner, to be accompanied by a nice french pouilly-fuisse.  I suppose you are making beer can chicken, accompanied by Schlitz?

 

 

[Jim Avery]

17 minutes ago, Ragnar Danneskjold said:

Hey, I am making her orange chicken with rice for dinner, to be accompanied by a nice french pouilly-fuisse.  I suppose you are making beer can chicken, accompanied by Schlitz?

 

 

Haha, not everyone can find Schlitz these days....

[giustot]

15 hours ago, Jim Avery said:

And I submit a few hours in a crowded aircraft is worse than a few days on a sparsely loaded ship. 

Jim, the evidence does not bear this out. COVID outbreaks on cruise ships have turned into nightmares where passengers have died. In contrast, a recent Harvard study concluded flying on a plane is low risk.

 

Tom.

[LouChamp]

Just learned if correct that passengers are flying home to their respective countries.  Sea Dream I believe has handled the situation horrendously. No press releases, nothing different than a few months ago on other lines.  To tout no need to wear masks was reckless. I understand each person has/had the right to decide whether to cruise or not, I don't believe we are their yet   I for one will not risk it.  After 50 plus cruises I can wait.  The risk is not worth it.  We do dine outdoors but have modified our social activities.   The 1918 pandemic took two years.  We are too much of a now society.   I haven't been to my home in Hawaii in a year. I can wait but will not subject my family to getting quarantined on a ship and with all the requirements necessary to cruise. That said I have stock in all the cruise lines, hotels and airlines and want everyone well and to succeed but the vitriol is ridiculous. Finally civic fatigue is also ridiculous. The virus can't read.

[LouChamp]

I meant covid fatigue.  Sorry!

[Ragnar Danneskjold]

That’s ok Lou, I also have civic fatigue 🤪

[Zimmy]

14 minutes ago, LouChamp said:

Just learned if correct that passengers are flying home to their respective countries.  Sea Dream I believe has handled the situation horrendously. No press releases, nothing different than a few months ago on other lines.  

While you may think that SD has handled this poorly, that is the opposite of what the passengers who are actually on the ship think, based on videos I've seen from those same passengers. They have stated that in their opinion, SD has done everything possible to make it a safe environment. It is not SD's responsibility to put out press releases so that you can stay informed - their responsibility is not to you, but to the passengers, crew,  and to the government of Barbados. 

 

In this pandemic everyone must make their own judgments and decide what is best, and most responsible, for them. While I have cancelled my cruises, that is my decision only. I don't need to stand in judgment of those who have different circumstances and made different decisions. 

 

I wish SD well, and I wish all of the passengers and crew involved good health and safety. And I can't wait until I can sail on SD again.

[Cruise Critic Chris]

Our writer has made it back to the UK. Here's her last dispatch, which is part of our larger article: 

 

Leaving The Ship

 

On Friday, the group of six and the couple who had tested positive departed SeaDream I, transferring to an isolation facility at Harrison Point on Barbados. The ship’s crew later told me that the group of six, including the man with the original Covid case, had returned home to the US by private jet, five of them having tested positive. In total, ten people left the ship on Friday; one British couple had booked a villa on Barbados where they intended to quarantine and then see out the UK’s lockdown.

 

Crewmembers began to move into vacated guest cabins, which makes sense, given that single occupancy of cabins is better for social distancing. This inspired further rumours that a crewmember had tested positive – but this had not been confirmed by the captain when I left the ship yesterday Saturday afternoon. There was yet more gossip that the original COVID-19 case had felt unwell before boarding – but after getting through two negative tests, was free to sail. This is pure speculation, but having to rely on passengers’ integrity could be the weak link in the chain, as cruise lines plot their return.

 

We remained isolated in our cabins until 2 p.m. Saturday, when most guests departed for the airport in the same government-approved transfers as SeaDream used for arrival. Our flight wasn't until 9 p.m. but any thoughts of booking a day room in an hotel had been banished; the government seemed to want us on the ship and then straight to the airport, rather than wandering around Barbados. This seems reasonable, as community spread would be a disaster for the island.

 

The remaining 12 or so passengers were, however, allowed on deck in the afternoon for some much-needed fresh air. The mood was upbeat as we knew we were going home – although one couple, who had been difficult throughout, were still complaining loudly. I doubt they will be back.

 

I still wonder why we were allowed to leave Barbados rather than made to quarantine, but the official line was that we had all presented two negative tests, one government-approved, and were free to go. My opinion is that they wanted us off the island as soon as possible.

 

And for all the effort that both SeaDream and Barbados made to handle this situation, the final scene at Grantley Adams International Airport made a mockery of social distancing. We were made to use buses to travel the short distance from the gate to the British Airways aircraft and there was a virtual stampede as passengers jostled to board a busy flight, crammed into each bus shuttle, some with masks dangling off one ear and one even drinking rum punch out of a plastic cup.

 

What has become clear to me: Cruise lines can put in place all the protocols you want, wherever you are, but ultimately, human behaviour is what will cause COVID-19 to spread.

 

 

[Ragnar Danneskjold]

Well, at least here is some good news, especially for us “elderly” folks:

 

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8949605/Arthritis-drug-cuts-elderly-Covid-19-deaths-two-thirds-say-researchers.html

 

[kent9xxx1]

On 11/13/2020 at 10:17 PM, giustot said:

Kent, you can't compare a trip to Costco with being on a cruise ship.

 

People go to Costco for an hour and then go home.

 

Passengers are on a cruise ship for a week confined in a small space that is conducive to spreading viruses.

 

Tom.

Each day, there are 150k+ new infections.  Those people definitely don’t get them from a cruise ship.  They probably got them from spending an hour in a local grocery store or costco or walmart or wherever.  You don’t shut those places down if there is a positive case.  Cruising will not spread if you follow protocol and quarantine the people who happen to get it.  Just like going to costco will not spread if you wear mask, practice social distance, follow protocol.  

[Jim Avery]

13 hours ago, giustot said:

Jim, the evidence does not bear this out. COVID outbreaks on cruise ships have turned into nightmares where passengers have died. In contrast, a recent Harvard study concluded flying on a plane is low risk.

 

Tom.

Hi Tom,

Let me say this about that.  People do not show symptoms on the aircraft as they are not on long enough. Keep those same folks stuck in those conditions on the aircraft for 5 to 7 day incubation period and I guarantee you will have a plane full of sickos.  My point was they contract the virus in the crammed in planes and are already on a ship or in a hotel by the time symptoms develop.  Worst sick I have ever been from travel all over the world is a few days after a long haul flight.  Inescapable to breathe the same air breathed by others.  And I don't believe they change filters or have such great filters on aircraft anyway.  Sorry to be so cynical but I have a lot of butt hours in airplane seats over the decades.🍸

[LouChamp]

2 hours ago, Zimmy said:

While you may think that SD has handled this poorly, that is the opposite of what the passengers who are actually on the ship think, based on videos I've seen from those same passengers. They have stated that in their opinion, SD has done everything possible to make it a safe environment. It is not SD's responsibility to put out press releases so that you can stay informed - their responsibility is not to you, but to the passengers, crew,  and to the government of Barbados. 

 

In this pandemic everyone must make their own judgments and decide what is best, and most responsible, for them. While I have cancelled my cruises, that is my decision only. I don't need to stand in judgment of those who have different circumstances and made different decisions. 

 

I wish SD well, and I wish all of the passengers and crew involved good health and safety. And I can't wait until I can sail on SD again.

 

[LouChamp]

while i do agree, as a lawyer i would advise SD not to provide press releases. As a consumer however, before i spend thousands of dollars, i want them to be transparent.  Other posters have compared cruises to costco. In my humble opinion...wrong.  i only spend a few hours if that in a big box store versus days on a ship.  I think that’s only the would be cruiser trying to convince themselves all is well aka the stockholm syndrome. not for me yet.  that said, i respect everyone’s opinion. All the best. 

[ctbjr1309]

3 minutes ago, LouChamp said:

 i respect everyone’s opinion.

That is a refreshing sentiment given some of the posts on this board in the last few weeks.  Thank you.

[LouChamp]

28 minutes ago, ctbjr1309 said:

That is a refreshing sentiment given some of the posts on this board in the last few weeks.  Thank you.

Thank you 

[vandrefalk]

Just watched Ben and David - does anyone know who the server is who tested positive?  My heart goes out to ALL the crew!

Vandrefalk

[Ragnar Danneskjold]

29 minutes ago, commander courageous said:

back to my Molson Lite!

You have lost all credibility 🙂

[andreas_seadream]

12 hours ago, LouChamp said:

while i do agree, as a lawyer i would advise SD not to provide press releases.

Lack of press releases or any form of transparency has nothing to do with legal concerns or desires to not share information. We have done our best to share information, but we have not done a good enough job. If I have enough energy (the past few days have been a bit long), I will have a webinar tomorrow where I will talk about what happened, what went wrong, our future plans etc. 

[jtwind]

First, it appears that, so far, only 2 cases can be attributed to a lack of mask wearing or other onboard protocols.  There may be more to come, but with everyone flying home before the average incubation period, we'll probably never know how many more.

 

Does anyone know if the family of 6 was living under one roof?  My guess is that this was an extended family.  And if so, this kind of spread will be seen over and over again during Thanksgiving gatherings.  Be careful folks. 

[Cruise Critic Chris]

3 hours ago, andreas_seadream said:

Lack of press releases or any form of transparency has nothing to do with legal concerns or desires to not share information. We have done our best to share information, but we have not done a good enough job. If I have enough energy (the past few days have been a bit long), I will have a webinar tomorrow where I will talk about what happened, what went wrong, our future plans etc. 

 

Andreas, thank you for continuing to provide our members with info and feedback. I'm sure many will want to attend the webinar. 

[Ragnar Danneskjold]

30 minutes ago, jtwind said:

And if so, this kind of spread will be seen over and over again during Thanksgiving gatherings.  Be careful folks. 

And now there are two US vaccines showing greater than 90% efficacy.  Plus the distribution network is now in place, thanks to the Trump administration’s Operation Warp Speed.  And other effective vaccines have been developed outside the US.

 

In a few short months you will be ablevto get a highly effective vaccination,  so let’s redouble our efforts at mask wearing, social distancing, etc.  Most importantly, have single household holidays this year, using zoom, etc.  to visit with friends and relatives.

 

Hang in there a little while longer, 2021 will be a bright new day!

 

I know, I know,  its a bit early to be hitting the scotch 🙂

 

 

[jtwind]

8 minutes ago, Ragnar Danneskjold said:

And now there are two US vaccines showing greater than 90% efficacy.  Plus the distribution network is now in place, thanks to the Trump administration’s Operation Warp Speed.  And other effective vaccines have been developed outside the US.

 

In a few short months you will be ablevto get a highly effective vaccination,  so let’s redouble our efforts at mask wearing, social distancing, etc.  Most importantly, have single household holidays this year, using zoom, etc.  to visit with friends and relatives.

 

Hang in there a little while longer, 2021 will be a bright new day!

 

I know, I know,  its a bit early to be hitting the scotch 🙂

 

 

 

I was surprised to find out that Pfizer wasn't part of operation warp speed.

 

The Moderna vaccine doesn't need the ultra cold storage that was part of the warp speed plan.  But I'd guess that much of the warp speed plan would still be valuable.

 

 

[Ragnar Danneskjold]

16 minutes ago, jtwind said:

 

I was surprised to find out that Pfizer wasn't part of operation warp speed.

 

The Moderna vaccine doesn't need the ultra cold storage that was part of the warp speed plan.  But I'd guess that much of the warp speed plan would still be valuable.

 

 

Pfizer paid for development and trials, OWS set up the distribution and pre-ordered a zillion doses.

 

Looks like emergency approval will happen quickly:

 

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/11/16/coronavirus-hhs-secretary-azar-says-fda-will-move-as-quickly-as-possible-to-ok-moderna-and-pfizers-vaccines.html