Compulsory offshore excursions due to Covid with P&O

[AnnieC]

9 minutes ago, Snow Hill said:

 

Dido Harding wasn’t involved in its development, whether she should be in charge of the Test & Trace process instead of someone with Public Health experience is another question.

Probably not, as she's possibly the person who recently said: "none of us were able to predict" coronavirus would mutate or variants would emerge, something an entire nation of armchair epidemiologists has known since they indulged themselves in a brief spot of self-education early last year.

Edited February 4, 2021 by AnnieC

[Windsurfboy]

Just because P&O are a business and want to make a profit is irrelevant. They are not above the law. If not letting you leave the ship on your own is a significant change in your contract then they must give a refund whether they like it or not. This can only be sorted when it's tested in court.

 

Glad I'm not going till 2022

 

 

[davecttr]

36 minutes ago, Snow Hill said:

My in-laws don’t. I know a number of people who still only have a basic phone.

I have both, a cheap smart phone which Which did not like but works great for me, it does not have a SIM but works via WiFi for a bit of browsing and news, running the NHS app etc. I also have a Doro big button mobile with PAYG on EE. Good for making/receiving calls and texts. My old hands hate those tiny touch screens on smart phones.

[Snow Hill]

12 minutes ago, AnnieC said:

Probably not, as she's possibly the person who recently said: "none of us were able to predict" coronavirus would mutate or variants would emerge, something an entire nation of armchair epidemiologists has known since they indulged themselves in a brief spot of self-education early last year.

She skipped Biology at school I guess.
 

Grant Shapps tried to out do her by saying Australia wasn’t an island, but a continent, guess he skipped geography lessons. 

[Snow Hill]

We have decided not to think about a cruise until 2022 or possibly 2023, I have a significant birthday in 2022, so currently looking at possible holiday options, probably will be land based, but cruise not completely ruled out yet. 
 

The possible restrictions on excursions are putting us off at the moment, we do like to wander around talk to the locals, try the local food, which doesn’t seem possible certainly this year. Plus if we want to get off the ship at every port then it could become expensive. 
 

This year thinking we might hire a motor home and travel around U.K. hopefully restrictions will be lifted. 

[tring]

38 minutes ago, Snow Hill said:

The Test & Trace app doesn’t capture any personal data, it works on proximity using Bluetooth capabilities of the phone, this was a joint development between Apple & Google. 
 

Dido Harding wasn’t involved in its development, whether she should be in charge of the Test & Trace process instead of someone with Public Health experience is another question.

 

I was not referring to Dido Harding, I was referring to a woman who is running the actual app from the IT side.  Previously she was running talk talk.  Not a case of what the app should/or should not do, but a concern that things can easily go wrong if not well administered.

 

I had quoted and was responding to someone who was equally non trusting of the computer systems used by the Government and the NHS. 

[joeecco]

43 minutes ago, Ardennais said:

 

As a matter of interest, are you the poster hoping to get married on Azura this summer?

 

 

Yes, I haven’t shut up about it haha! 174 days all being well...

[Ardennais]

3 minutes ago, joeecco said:

Yes, I haven’t shut up about it haha! 174 days all being well...

I really hope it goes ahead for you as planned. As a matter of interest, would you still sail if P&O decided that the wedding part would be unable to go ahead for some reason or other? 

[Snow Hill]

10 minutes ago, tring said:

 

I was not referring to Dido Harding, I was referring to a woman who is running the actual app from the IT side.  Previously she was running talk talk.  Not a case of what the app should/or should not do, but a concern that things can easily go wrong if not well administered.

 

I had quoted and was responding to someone who was equally non trusting of the computer systems used by the Government and the NHS. 

That is Dido Harding, former head of Talk Talk 

 

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2017/feb/01/talktalk-chief-executive-dido-harding-cyber-attack

 

 

[joeecco]

4 minutes ago, Ardennais said:

I really hope it goes ahead for you as planned. As a matter of interest, would you still sail if P&O decided that the wedding part would be unable to go ahead for some reason or other? 

Thank you, and yes we would. A land wedding is not what we want so if the cruise wedding is cancelled then we would have to push the date back but we would still sail. I’d board a ship tomorrow if I could ☺️

[Selbourne]

1 hour ago, joeecco said:

All of those issues except going ashore will be exactly the same on land, it’s the way of life for the foreseeable. 
I’m grateful that they are still afloat and can get back sailing when it’s safe, if they start handing out even more refunds then that just puts them more in the red. 

Not correct. We hired a holiday cottage in the autumn between lockdowns. No need to wear a mask around the cottage. No need to wear a mask walking around outside. We dined out every day where we liked and when we liked. We had to put a mask on for a matter of seconds as we walked in and out of each pub or restaurant and that was it. We were free to travel around and go where we wanted and whenever we wanted to. It was lovely. A cruise under the proposed restrictions would be anything but, as far as we are concerned.
 

I fully accept that for some people, yourself included, the desire to get back on a cruise ship is so strong that they will live with all the restrictions. I am pleased, as that gets cruise ships going again and means that they will still be there when we are willing to go on them again, when none of these restrictions are required. However for many, us included, it would be an ordeal rather than an enjoyable holiday and had we booked we would want to cancel and would expect our deposit back. Thankfully we are not in that situation but I have every sympathy for those who are. BTW, P&O are not ‘in the red’ so should, IMO, do the honourable thing. As always, they will do so for those who persevere, but it shouldn’t have to be a battle. 

[jeanlyon]

Yes have to agree with all that.  Not for us.

[AnnieC]

32 minutes ago, Selbourne said:

Not correct. We hired a holiday cottage in the autumn between lockdowns. No need to wear a mask around the cottage. No need to wear a mask walking around outside. We dined out every day where we liked and when we liked. We had to put a mask on for a matter of seconds as we walked in and out of each pub or restaurant and that was it. We were free to travel around and go where we wanted and whenever we wanted to. It was lovely. A cruise under the proposed restrictions would be anything but, as far as we are concerned.
 

I fully accept that for some people, yourself included, the desire to get back on a cruise ship is so strong that they will live with all the restrictions. I am pleased, as that gets cruise ships going again and means that they will still be there when we are willing to go on them again, when none of these restrictions are required. However for many, us included, it would be an ordeal rather than an enjoyable holiday and had we booked we would want to cancel and would expect our deposit back. Thankfully we are not in that situation but I have every sympathy for those who are. BTW, P&O are not ‘in the red’ so should, IMO, do the honourable thing. As always, they will do so for those who persevere, but it shouldn’t have to be a battle. 

What he said. I also haven't anything booked so can view this objectively and, had I booked before covid appeared, would expect a refund. 

[jeanlyon]

Thanks, that's how we feel too.

[tring]

38 minutes ago, Snow Hill said:

That is Dido Harding, former head of Talk Talk 

 

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2017/feb/01/talktalk-chief-executive-dido-harding-cyber-attack

 

 

 

Oops, sorry I misunderstood that.  TBH it is something DH has decided as he was very annoyed with the data breach, and from what I have seen of her on TV, must say I am not impressed and can see why he took a great dislike to her at that time.  Quite happy to take his lead and go with this.  I may be the scientist in the family, but have never got deeply into any IT stuff - just expect it to be available to use when I want it, which is fine in my books as I take on other important functions - like lead holiday booker and expert 🙂

 

I am assured he did know it was Dido Harding.  Seems strange the way the app works as far as we have seen as well, for instance they were asking for it to be scanned when we called at a few service stations last summer, yet we may not have any contact with others who have logged in whilst we just popped to the loo and back.  Much prefer to just give our details if we go out for a meal or drink (in the days when we were allowed to do that).  Since we are retired we have very little contact with anyone over the last year and have been very careful as well. 

[bee-ess]

2 hours ago, jeanlyon said:

Yes totally agree I'm afraid.  We booked our cruise back in October 2019, so it won't resemble anything we are used to.

Exactly how we feel Jean, it would a significantly different holiday. Considering that we also booked in Oct 2019 I feel a refund of the deposit is the fairest option.

 

]]]

[AnnieC]

1 hour ago, Snow Hill said:

She skipped Biology at school I guess.
 

 

So did I. It took all of two seconds to catch up.

 

If this goes on much longer, we'll each have our very own mutation.

[jeanlyon]

20 minutes ago, bee-ess said:

Exactly how we feel Jean, it would a significantly different holiday. Considering that we also booked in Oct 2019 I feel a refund of the deposit is the fairest option.

 

]]]

Hmm, what will you do then?  Are you on the same cruise as us>  Aurora to the Greek Islands?  We have until July at the moment but that of course may change.

[Snow Hill]

28 minutes ago, tring said:

 

Oops, sorry I misunderstood that.  TBH it is something DH has decided as he was very annoyed with the data breach, and from what I have seen of her on TV, must say I am not impressed and can see why he took a great dislike to her at that time.  Quite happy to take his lead and go with this.  I may be the scientist in the family, but have never got deeply into any IT stuff - just expect it to be available to use when I want it, which is fine in my books as I take on other important functions - like lead holiday booker and expert 🙂

 

I am assured he did know it was Dido Harding.  Seems strange the way the app works as far as we have seen as well, for instance they were asking for it to be scanned when we called at a few service stations last summer, yet we may not have any contact with others who have logged in whilst we just popped to the loo and back.  Much prefer to just give our details if we go out for a meal or drink (in the days when we were allowed to do that).  Since we are retired we have very little contact with anyone over the last year and have been very careful as well. 

Used the scanning function, have to scan to enter my local pharmacy when I pick up prescription, used it at Costa Coffee when you could go there, also a couple of other shops. In theory the app should work in other countries that use the under Apple/Google Framework, but as travel is effectively come to grinding halt no need to find out 

[bee-ess]

10 minutes ago, jeanlyon said:

Hmm, what will you do then?  Are you on the same cruise as us>  Aurora to the Greek Islands?  We have until July at the moment but that of course may change.

No, we are on Azura Fly cruise to Med Sept 2nd. We don't want to go if we cannot get off in ports, we could maybe handle the on board Covid requirements, but getting off would be a step too far for us.

 

We have 2 other cruise booked in 2022 so moving the Sept one is not really an option for us.

 

Edited February 4, 2021 by bee-ess

[jeanlyon]

1 minute ago, bee-ess said:

No, we are on Azura Fly cruise to Med Sept 2nd. We don't want to go if we cannot get off in ports, we could maybe handle the on board Covid requirements, but getting off woule be a step too far for us.

 

We have 2 other cruise booked in 2022 so moving the Sept one is not really an option for us.

 

Yep same here, although we could move to Spring 2022 if pushed.

[No pager thank you]

6 hours ago, Ardennais said:

Yes, we all know that and I have no problem with that at all. But I still think that cruisers should be able to cancel their booking and get their deposit back if they decide that the cost is too much for them, especially those who booked before Covid19 emerged. 
I don’t know whether you’ve cruised with teenagers (3 in our case which also meant 2 cabins) but believe me, add a few excursions and the overall cost will rocket. We always accepted that, and we would pick and choose excursions carefully for some stops and would just mooch around in some other ports.

Exactly.  The principle of going on a cruise has been, if you so choose, that you can enjoy the holiday you have booked at the original price paid. 

 

Most people choose to pay more, be this on drinks, specialty restaurants, shops, excursions, but you don't have to.  Now, in effect, you must, unless you wish to have a scenic cruise, which is not what anyone booked.

 

I don't buy the argument why P&O are advertising excursions at an increased cost now on their cruise personaliser, as opposed to wait until an eight week release.  There is nothing that I have seen on the personaliser telling you to delay making these bookings until eight weeks beforehand.  The personaliser was quite happy to add the excursions to the basket.  Will you be refunded if your excursion goes down in price?

 

I do understand that if the ports place restrictions on disembarkation then that is not within P&O's control.  I also understand that a temporary change to balance payment dates has been made.  I further understand why, in practice, P&O will get away with denying relief to refunds because this can be seen as not being a significant change.  I further appreciate that  "bubbled" tours are better than nothing.

 

However, if P&O can launch the excursions 100+ days in advance and want their passengers to part with significant extra money for excursions, and freely take monies, then they should make a commitment to present an effective choice to the customer clear before the balance is due (I.e., pay balance or transfer). 

 

This is not a commitment which P&O has made beyond a temporary stop gap, which also does not correlate with how long, in reality, port restrictions will be in place, based on what we know already.

 

We are also taking it on trust that they will reduce the excursion costs; there is no evidence that I have seen yey.  If they do so by a notional 5% or so then the practical costs, including to families and larger groups will still be very significant indeed of any holiday they choose to proceed with. 

 

In these circumstances, and taking in to account what is and is not under P&O's control, fair criticism may be levelled, in my opinion.

[tring]

8 minutes ago, No pager thank you said:

 

We are also taking it on trust that they will reduce the excursion costs; there is no evidence that I have seen yey.  If they do so by a notional 5% or so then the practical costs, including to families and larger groups will still be very significant indeed of any holiday they choose to proceed with. 

 

 

 

I did not get the impression they are reducing the excursion costs, but that they were bringing in some cheaper excursions (perhaps short walking tours or similar).  Also Moley said they may do offers like three for two, if I remember correctly.  Remains to be seen.

[No pager thank you]

1 minute ago, tring said:

 

I did not get the impression they are reducing the excursion costs, but that they were bringing in some cheaper excursions (perhaps short walking tours or similar).  Also Moley said they may do offers like three for two, if I remember correctly.  Remains to be seen.

Hello, yes I agree, awaits to be seen.  I have seen the possibility of lower excursion costs being discussed, but even the walking tours seem to have been bumped up in price at the moment, up to now, roughly looking at like for like.  I can't see many people actually booking them to be honest in the current climate.

 

The cynical side of me says that they will go up 50% and then a "3 for 2" will be announced, or some sort of similar package come up with, like they do with the wine. 

 

Bit like the DFS sale🤦

[Adammara]

1 hour ago, joeecco said:

Thank you, and yes we would. A land wedding is not what we want so if the cruise wedding is cancelled then we would have to push the date back but we would still sail. I’d board a ship tomorrow if I could ☺️

We really hope it happens for you, we celebrated our 40th wedding anniversary on Arcadia's maiden cruise in 2005 a very memorable evening ceremony somewhere of the coast of Portugal.  All the more special as wife was diagnosed with cancer on our return.  Today we are celebrating our 56th anniverary at home, no nice meal out tonight sadly!