IS THIS TRUE OR JUST MISINFORMATION?

[SW.FloridaPhil]

I just read this on another thread. 

 

"There may be an issue if you are embarking in Honolulu and debarking in Seattle. It’s a violation of the PVSA (Passenger Vessel Service Act). Most cruise reps will refer to it incorrectly as the Jones Act, which is cargo. It is embarking in a US port and debarking in a different US port, without stopping in a distant foreign port (Canada is not considered distant). Did you book online or a TA? You may have been able to book it, but just expect to probably hear you have to cancel a leg. This happens quite often. The CBP looks at travel from beginning point to end point, regardless of how many legs".

 

We are flying to Hawaii, sailing from Hawaii to Vancouver, then doing an Alaskan cruise ending in Seattle.

[Ourusualbeach]

3 minutes ago, SW.FloridaPhil said:

I just read this on another thread. 

 

"There may be an issue if you are embarking in Honolulu and debarking in Seattle. It’s a violation of the PVSA (Passenger Vessel Service Act). Most cruise reps will refer to it incorrectly as the Jones Act, which is cargo. It is embarking in a US port and debarking in a different US port, without stopping in a distant foreign port (Canada is not considered distant). Did you book online or a TA? You may have been able to book it, but just expect to probably hear you have to cancel a leg. This happens quite often. The CBP looks at travel from beginning point to end point, regardless of how many legs".

 

We are flying to Hawaii, sailing from Hawaii to Vancouver, then doing an Alaskan cruise ending in Seattle.

If it is on the same cruise line for both cruises and they are right  after the other it is not allowed. 
 

you cannot sail from Hawaii and end in Seattle, not allowed under the PVSA 

Edited April 2, 2021 by Ourusualbeach

[Biker19]

15 minutes ago, SW.FloridaPhil said:

We are flying to Hawaii, sailing from Hawaii to Vancouver, then doing an Alaskan cruise ending in Seattle.

While against PVSA rules, RCI may still sell them to you, then try to "fix" it later.

[Rewind]

Details are under the second bullet point here:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Passenger_Vessel_Services_Act_of_1886

 

The Passenger Vessel Services Act, however does not prohibit foreign-flagged ships departing from a U.S. port, visiting a distant foreign port, and then continuing to a second U.S. port. However, in order to embark in a U.S. port and disembark in a second U.S. port, the vessel must visit a distant foreign port outside of North America (Central America, Bermuda, the Bahamas, and all of the Caribbean except Aruba, Bonaire, and Curaçao, count as part of North America);

[SW.FloridaPhil]

7 minutes ago, Biker19 said:

While against PVSA rules, RCI may still sell them to you, then try to "fix" it later.

Our TA booked them and sent us our confirmation. We have used him for years, can't see how he doesn't know about this. Just emailed him.

[1025cruise]

I'm sorry, but your B2B isn't allowed. There is no stop at a distant foreign port. 

[Biker19]

5 minutes ago, SW.FloridaPhil said:

Our TA booked them and sent us our confirmation. We have used him for years, can't see how he doesn't know about this. Just emailed him.

It's an obscure enough rule that some TAs may not know it.

[not-enough-cruising]

Just out of curiosity. Is there a time frame one could stay in Vancouver, to make this compliant?

[Ourusualbeach]

12 minutes ago, Heymarco said:

Does your second cruise stop in Vancouver on day 2? If so, maybe you could get approved to board a day late?

The second cruise departs from Vancouver 

[Merion_Mom]

1 hour ago, SW.FloridaPhil said:

I just read this on another thread. 

 

"There may be an issue if you are embarking in Honolulu and debarking in Seattle. It’s a violation of the PVSA (Passenger Vessel Service Act). Most cruise reps will refer to it incorrectly as the Jones Act, which is cargo. It is embarking in a US port and debarking in a different US port, without stopping in a distant foreign port (Canada is not considered distant). Did you book online or a TA? You may have been able to book it, but just expect to probably hear you have to cancel a leg. This happens quite often. The CBP looks at travel from beginning point to end point, regardless of how many legs".

 

We are flying to Hawaii, sailing from Hawaii to Vancouver, then doing an Alaskan cruise ending in Seattle.

 

Phil, you are talking about the Ovation, back to back?  Not allowed under the PVSA.

 

(I'm afraid that the very convenience of it - flying home from Seattle instead of from Vancouver - is what makes it illegal. 😞)

[Merion_Mom]

2 minutes ago, Merion_Mom said:

 

Phil, you are talking about the Ovation, back to back?  Not allowed under the PVSA.

 

(I'm afraid that the very convenience of it - flying home from Seattle instead of from Vancouver - is what makes it illegal. 😞)

 

Now, if you hung around Vancouver for three days, which is a good thing to do, and hopped on the Serenade which is round trip Vancouver, you could have your Alaska cruise.  But then you'd have to fly home from Vancouver.  

[twangster]

The good news is... now you can justify adding the transpacific from Australia to the beginning your adventure to make it legal.  

[crzndeb]

That was my quote from the Roll Call, and this happens every year. Literally dozens of posts on this subject. There are ways around it, but it either means embarking the cruise in a foreign country or jumping to a different ship for one leg.

This happened to friends many years ago, after they had made air and hotel reservations. It was another cruise line, but the cruise line was very accommodating in helping them with cancellation fees.

Since their fiasco, I have become quite knowledgeable on the PVSA and would not pass misinformation. I try to let people know ahead of time, so they don’t make non refundable hotel and air reservations.

[Biker19]

1 hour ago, not-enough-cruising said:

Is there a time frame one could stay in Vancouver, to make this compliant?

One day.When this happened on Ovation, RCI took the B2Bers off the ship in Victoria (the stop/day before Vancouver) and transported them to Vancouver. Usually they try to fix this before people board by asking them to cancel one of the legs.

Edited April 2, 2021 by Biker19

[easyqueasy]

7 minutes ago, crzndeb said:

That was my quote from the Roll Call, and this happens every year. Literally dozens of posts on this subject. There are ways around it, but it either means embarking the cruise in a foreign country or jumping to a different ship for one leg.

This happened to friends many years ago, after they had made air and hotel reservations. It was another cruise line, but the cruise line was very accommodating in helping them with cancellation fees.

Since their fiasco, I have become quite knowledgeable on the PVSA and would not pass misinformation. I try to let people know ahead of time, so they don’t make non refundable hotel and air reservations.

In this case if the ship leaves from Vancouver for the second leg, but you embark a day later in Victoria instead, does a day break in sailing suffice? Would Royal let you do that? Good to have learned such rules existed as I thought about doing what the poster purchased.

[Biker19]

2 minutes ago, easyqueasy said:

Would Royal let you do that?

They will likely catch the non-compliant sailing before you get a chance to ask for a downline embarkation. 

[mom4mom]

My understanding is a B2B cruise really is 2 separate cruises.  So you are using a foreign port by ending in Vancouver and starting in Vancouver.

 

[FionaMG]

There was a similar case a few years back reported here on CC, caused, if I am remembering correctly, by an itinerary change. I tried to find that thread but wasn't able to; maybe someone else who remembers it will be able to find it and post the link.

 

But anyway, long story short, it was resolved by having the affected passengers debark a day early, in Victoria, where they were overnighted, and then transferred to Vancouver (?) the next day. So, if your Hawaii - Vancouver cruise stops in Victoria that might be an option you could explore.

[Biker19]

1 minute ago, mom4mom said:

My understanding is a B2B cruise really is 2 separate cruises.  So you are using a foreign port by ending in Vancouver and starting in Vancouver.

 

The first part is why RCI let's you book them initially, but the second part doesn't matter as only the embarkation port and end port matter making it non-PVSA compliant. 

[Ourusualbeach]

3 minutes ago, mom4mom said:

My understanding is a B2B cruise really is 2 separate cruises.  So you are using a foreign port by ending in Vancouver and starting in Vancouver.

 

Even though Royal treats it as 2 separate cruises in the eyes of the CBP it is one cruise.  Your initial embarkation port and final destination are all that matters

[crzndeb]

10 minutes ago, easyqueasy said:

In this case if the ship leaves from Vancouver for the second leg, but you embark a day later in Victoria instead, does a day break in sailing suffice? Would Royal let you do that? Good to have learned such rules existed as I thought about doing what the poster purchased.

Unfortunately, the Ovation is not stopping in Victoria in 2022, the day before Vancouver, it is stopping in Seattle. I am actually on a B5B, embarking in Sydney.

Some Seattle locals, who are embarking in Sydney, are hoping to disembark on the Seattle stop.

Edited April 2, 2021 by crzndeb

[Biker19]

3 minutes ago, FionaMG said:

So, if your Hawaii - Vancouver cruise stops in Victoria that might be an option you could explore.

But, RCI may catch their mistake and make you cancel one of the legs.

[robtulipe]

15 minutes ago, easyqueasy said:

In this case if the ship leaves from Vancouver for the second leg, but you embark a day later in Victoria instead, does a day break in sailing suffice? Would Royal let you do that? Good to have learned such rules existed as I thought about doing what the poster purchased.

Yes that would work but next year's Ovation Transpacific and first Alaska cruise doesn't stop there.

These only goes to or sail from Vancouver as its Cdn port.

 

• •  
• •  

Edited April 2, 2021 by robtulipe

[1025cruise]

2 hours ago, mom4mom said:

My understanding is a B2B cruise really is 2 separate cruises.  So you are using a foreign port by ending in Vancouver and starting in Vancouver.

 

All that matters for the PVSA is where you got on and where you get off. If its two different US ports, unless the ship has gone to a distant foreign port, its not allowed by non-US flagged ships.

[Merion_Mom]

2 hours ago, crzndeb said:

Unfortunately, the Ovation is not stopping in Victoria in 2022, the day before Vancouver, it is stopping in Seattle. I am actually on a B5B, embarking in Sydney.

Some Seattle locals, who are embarking in Sydney, are hoping to disembark on the Seattle stop.

 

Clever.  I have seen this done on other cruises successfully.