recent increase in prices?

[rkacruiser]

2 hours ago, Gail & Marty sailing away said:

The true fair prices are here

 

Whether we like it or not.

 

Might we even see a return to cruise brochures with "the brochure prices" shown?  And, that's what we really paid or close to that figure?  

[iancal]

I have little doubt that prices will be higher in the near term.  But the bottom line is that the cruise industry competes for leisure travelers budget with other leisure dollar options.   

 

This may be tempered by the fact that there are fewer cruise ships and fewer saleable cabins on each in the short term however you cannot discount competition.

 

 We may be willing to pay a premium but we have no intention of paying well above the odds just to be the first to board a mass market cruise line post covid.   There are more equally or more attractive alternatives in the marketplace. 

 

We like cruising.  We are more than willing to pay.  But there is a value scale for us.  IF cruise lines price themselves out of the market for average travelers, those travelers will simply select different options.

 

I suspect that pricing will level out in time.   I also suspect that some of the smaller, more upscale, market specific lines will bleed even more  custom away from the mass market cruise lines.

Edited April 15, 2021 by iancal

[rkacruiser]

49 minutes ago, iancal said:

I have little doubt that prices will be higher in the near term.  But the bottom line is that the cruise industry competes for leisure travelers budget with other leisure dollar options.   

 

This may be tempered by the fact that there are fewer cruise ships and fewer saleable cabins on each in the short term however you cannot discount competition.

 

 We may be willing to pay a premium but we have no intention of paying well above the odds just to be the first to board a mass market cruise line post covid.   There are more equally or more attractive alternatives in the marketplace. 

 

We like cruising.  We are more than willing to pay.  But there is a value scale for us.  IF cruise lines price themselves out of the market for average travelers, those travelers will simply select different options.

 

I suspect that pricing will level out in time.   I also suspect that some of the smaller, more upscale, market specific lines will bleed even more  custom away from the mass market cruise lines.

 

Lots to which to respond to your excellent post!

 

Cruising is going to become less affordable to segments of the vacationing market that it has attracted for many years.  This will not last, however.  What the cruise industry learned in the past when cruising began with lots of competition will re-learned or re-tuned to meet the market's situation at that time.  This is going to take some time for this to happen, in my opinion.

 

As a patron of the mass market cruise lines, I am one who is seriously considering migrating to a Silverseas or Seabourn experience.  My experience during January, 2020 in YC on MSC Meraviglia told me:  why have you waited so long to do this?  

 

Because of the pandemic, the economy is still on Meclizine, I think.  The Markets are up irrationally one day; down irrationally down the next.  The employment numbers are encouraging, but so many who might want to take a cruise are not earning the discretionary income to allow that to happen.  

 

I am sure you will agree.  The next months and few years as observers and participants in the cruising industry will be an interesting story to learn.  

[goldsmip115]

As a bit of an observer now, but a long time HAL cruiser with over 20 HAL cruises under my belt I will weigh in.  This post won’t be applicable to everyone so please don’t flame me.  I’ve never sailed in less than a Neptune Suite and several times in a Pinnacle suite.  Then I discovered the Celebrity Suite experience and it was all over with HAL.  There is simply no comparison.  The HAL experience even in a Pinnacle suite is so severely lacking compared to the Celebrity suite experience.  
 

it all depends upon what is important to the cruiser.  Covid pricing has been crazy on all lines including the very top suites on Celebrity.  However, for those that are considering Silversea or Seabourn I would encourage you to look at a true even lower level suite on Celebrity.  It’s the best of both worlds with a larger ship and the associated activities, entertainment and yet a dedicated suite restaurant and lounge, premium beverage package included, tips and WiFi included, butler service, some ships with a dedicated retreat with pool and hot tub, etc.

 

We have sailed 4 times in a Penthouse suite on Celebrity.  The first two times were at very competitive pricing with a HAL suite.  Just pointing out that before you jump to Silversea or Seabourn look at your options.  Admittedly pricing is crazy right now.  Happy sailing all!

[rkacruiser]

21 hours ago, goldsmip115 said:

 However, for those that are considering Silversea or Seabourn I would encourage you to look at a true even lower level suite on Celebrity.

 

Have you sailed on Seabourn or Silverseas?  

[Laxer]

I am disappointed to see HAL raising the price of cruising at this time. With so many people with FCC needing to book. Our intention was to wait for more stable Covid times to book, but PCC recommended we book soon as demand was increasing, so we did. Two weeks ago we booked a June 2022 Med cruise to replace the June 2020 we canceled 13 months ago. We booked using FCC just in time as prices jumped ($600) since. Our fear was the demand would be heavy and prices would increase and it appears it has. 

Now all those cruisers that are still waiting to book are faced with using FCC on more expensive cruises.

I've read, that's supply and demand. True but HAL is culpable partly in creating the supply and demand issue. They put limits on how long you have to book your FCC and a deadline when you have to cruise by using FCC. So now it's a feeding frenzy to get your FCC booked? HAL also contributed to supply issue by reducing its fleet. So now they raise rates while holding onto your cash in the form of a FCC that you can't use anywhere else.

 

My point HAL doesn't have to raise the rates for cruisers trying to use their FCC.

 

I love cruising HAL but I don't care for this strategy at all.

 

 

 

[DaveOKC]

Its obviously a situation of "supply and demand".  Demand has been increased by the need to use credits and people wanting to travel after a year off.  Supply has been restricted by the number of ships the major lines have sold off or retired.  Put the two together and you have an increase in pricing - no big surprise to anyone who took Econ 101.  

 

[iancal]

HAL is a business.  Not a charity, not a social club.  No different that any other cruise line.

 

They will raise prices to the point where they feel it is negatively impacting the demand required to fill their available cabins.

 

Who can blame them?    It is just business.

[JeffElizabeth]

While many have suffered financially during last year, many others, like us, have seen our wealth increase. And since we spent very little last year, I can see the cruise lines getting away with increasing prices.  I know we booked the best cabin they had left in October this year. And we have also booked a cruise for 2022, and are looking at booking another one in 2023. 

[iancal]

What I find interesting is that we see cruise pricing increasing and resort pricing decreasing.

 

Simply an issue of supply and demand.

[Mary229]

2 hours ago, iancal said:

What I find interesting is that we see cruise pricing increasing and resort pricing decreasing.

 

Simply an issue of supply and demand.

Resort people and cruise people are not the same necessarily.  The cruise people are in droves buying RVs and driving up prices there.  I think there are two kinds of cruise people,  those who roam and those who lounge.

 

 

[AtlantaCruiser72]

2 hours ago, Mary229 said:

Resort people and cruise people are not the same necessarily.

 

I agree - while I love to cruise and look to it as my primary vacation option, I would consider an all-Inclusive or other beach resort as one of my LAST options for vacation.  Even city stays in major metropolitan areas that I may look into are not at competition with my cruise plans/thoughts.  Two separate animals.

[Roz]

3 hours ago, Mary229 said:

The cruise people are in droves buying RVs and driving up prices there.  

 

Huh?  Cruising and RVing are two completely different experiences.  I don't know anyone who cruises on a regular basis who's bought an RV.  Is there data available from the RV industry that supports this?  Are RV dealers marketing to grounded cruisers?

[Mary229]

17 minutes ago, Roz said:

 

Huh?  Cruising and RVing are two completely different experiences.  I don't know anyone who cruises on a regular basis who's bought an RV.  Is there data available from the RV industry that supports this?  Are RV dealers marketing to grounded cruisers?

I know quite a few plus my brother owns a resort campground and he is reporting a booming business with many people saying they bought a RV because they couldn’t travel frequently mentioning cruising.  He is on the gulf  coast where many people do cruise out of New Orleans, Mobile and Galveston for vacation. Now when people say they bought is subjective, they could mean long term lease.  Glamping and resort campgrounds are very big right now.   Also golf resorts but they have always had a following. We frequent state park lodges and cabins and this year many of our regular haunts are fully reserved all week 

 

I have found it interesting as many of the people I know who are now “campers” used to consider such mundane activities as cute or folksy. I think it is healthy particularly for young families and had encouraged my nieces and nephews for many years but they were “Disney and cruises”, now they rent cabins, RVs and lodges 

Edited April 17, 2021 by Mary229

[iancal]

Since retiring we typically  intersperse independent land travel with cruises, AI's and resorts.   Makes for a nice change.   Often late bookings.

 

RV dealers where we live have been doing a land office business since last  summer. 

 

Edited April 17, 2021 by iancal

[sail7seas]

I'm not sure if my  PCC tired of me or   if I  got sick of his  lack of interest in working on bookings for me but....  I am curernt ly deciding if I wish to get a TA ( or continue witha PCC

 

 

 

With respect to  high cruise prices ..  cruise  lines s are smarting from the loss of billions of dollars,  it is  no surprise      they have  t o   play   "catch up"

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[cruisemom42]

On 4/15/2021 at 10:33 PM, goldsmip115 said:

As a bit of an observer now, but a long time HAL cruiser with over 20 HAL cruises under my belt I will weigh in.  This post won’t be applicable to everyone so please don’t flame me.  I’ve never sailed in less than a Neptune Suite and several times in a Pinnacle suite.  Then I discovered the Celebrity Suite experience and it was all over with HAL.  There is simply no comparison.  The HAL experience even in a Pinnacle suite is so severely lacking compared to the Celebrity suite experience.  
 

it all depends upon what is important to the cruiser.  Covid pricing has been crazy on all lines including the very top suites on Celebrity.  However, for those that are considering Silversea or Seabourn I would encourage you to look at a true even lower level suite on Celebrity.  It’s the best of both worlds with a larger ship and the associated activities, entertainment and yet a dedicated suite restaurant and lounge, premium beverage package included, tips and WiFi included, butler service, some ships with a dedicated retreat with pool and hot tub, etc.

 

We have sailed 4 times in a Penthouse suite on Celebrity.  The first two times were at very competitive pricing with a HAL suite.  Just pointing out that before you jump to Silversea or Seabourn look at your options.  Admittedly pricing is crazy right now.  Happy sailing all!

 

It certainly does depend, as you say, on what things matter to the individual customer. 

 

I am one who does not like or appreciate the whole "ship within a ship" concept or the suite perks direction in which Celebrity has strongly moved in the last 5-6 years.  I appreciate that HAL has by and large NOT traveled that path. 

 

As a solo traveler and non-suite customer I used to consider HAL and Celebrity to be somewhat similar experiences, with HAL having the edge on itineraries and Celebrity on their on-board experience. However, with their much more aggressive caste system and the fact that they are now charging solo cruisers not only the 200% premium on cabins but also on "always included" perks -- well, lets' say they are not on my top 5 list any longer.

 

(For those HAL solo cruisers who may not be aware, Celebrity has introduced what they call "always included" pricing -- which is not optional in most cases -- through which solos not only now pay 200% for our cabin BUT ALSO pay double gratuities, double beverage package and double internet!)

 

 

[cruisemom42]

22 hours ago, Mary229 said:

Resort people and cruise people are not the same necessarily.  The cruise people are in droves buying RVs and driving up prices there.  I think there are two kinds of cruise people,  those who roam and those who lounge.

 

LOL, there must be a third type as well. I would not consider either an AI or an RV.  For me, there is independent land travel or cruising.

 

No doubt even more permutations exist...

[cruisemom42]

On 4/16/2021 at 11:11 PM, Laxer said:

Now all those cruisers that are still waiting to book are faced with using FCC on more expensive cruises.

 

None of the cruise lines ever promised that prices would stay the same. Year on year prices generally increase -- the cruise you took in 2017 cost less than the one in 2018 in real dollars (or whatever currency) because food prices increase, labor costs increase, port fees increase, fuel prices increase, and so on ad infinitum.

 

It would be one thing if the cancellation were HAL's fault due to the ship not being seaworthy or when an overbooking situation occurs. But this was no one's fault and it seems fair to me that HAL provided a full refund (in the form of FCC) that you can use as a credit on a future sailing. Expecting prices to be the same is not really "part of the deal"...

 

 

[iancal]

It is unclear to me why anyone would expect the prices to be the same from year to year...or even within the same year or same itinerary cruising season.

 

Prices vary depending on supply, demand and on the price and attractiveness of cruise travel alternatives.

 

It has always been so.

Edited April 18, 2021 by iancal

[Mary229]

2 hours ago, cruisemom42 said:

 

LOL, there must be a third type as well. I would not consider either an AI or an RV.  For me, there is independent land travel or cruising.

 

No doubt even more permutations exist...

That is the roaming category.  I am a roamer and will use a variety of means to accommodate my travels.  

Edited April 18, 2021 by Mary229

[Roz]

2 hours ago, cruisemom42 said:

 

It certainly does depend, as you say, on what things matter to the individual customer. 

 

I am one who does not like or appreciate the whole "ship within a ship" concept or the suite perks direction in which Celebrity has strongly moved in the last 5-6 years.  I appreciate that HAL has by and large NOT traveled that path. 

 

As a solo traveler and non-suite customer I used to consider HAL and Celebrity to be somewhat similar experiences, with HAL having the edge on itineraries and Celebrity on their on-board experience. However, with their much more aggressive caste system and the fact that they are now charging solo cruisers not only the 200% premium on cabins but also on "always included" perks -- well, lets' say they are not on my top 5 list any longer.

 

(For those HAL solo cruisers who may not be aware, Celebrity has introduced what they call "always included" pricing -- which is not optional in most cases -- through which solos not only now pay 200% for our cabin BUT ALSO pay double gratuities, double beverage package and double internet!)

 

 

 

Agree with you 100%.  A lot of inclusions don't work for solo cruisers, as you pay double but don't get 2 specialty dining pkgs., drink packages, internet packages, etc.  

 

Even on HAL, when I recently booked a South American cruise, I was better off booking at the regular fare than the promotional one.  At least HAL gives us a choice, Celebrity doesn't. 

[Roz]

The last thing I want to do is buy an RV.

[Mary229]

1 minute ago, Roz said:

The last thing I want to do is buy an RV.

Nor a vacation home.  I like footloose.   But people do - There were reports here of empty RV lots - they were being snapped up.  
 

Cruises always appealed to me - you have only the fun aspects of planning.   I traveled for business by vehicle for 25+ years and I am very aware of the amount of boring planning that goes into a successful road trip.   Everything from finding decent food in the desert southwest to finding yourself on a very steep road with no chance to turn around.  I could write an encyclopedia on road hazards.  That’s why I adopted cruising as a young person, the last thing I wanted to do is plan the route and deal with food and lodging issues when on vacation 

[cruisemom42]

13 minutes ago, Mary229 said:

the last thing I wanted to do is plan the route and deal with food and lodging issues when on vacation

 

Ditto to that. And with my daily long commute (until COVID), I really have no desire to physically drive on vacation either.