Would you go iv everyone is not vacinated?

[Horizon chaser 1957]

3 hours ago, syesmar said:

So much hinges on the answer to one question: “what will happen to a sailing if a single passenger tests positive?” I agree that every precaution must be taken onboard, to include being vaccinated.

 

IMHO it will be different this time. March 2020 Covid was new, and scary, and not much was known about it. There were no plans in place, no vaccine, and there were not known treatments. Ports just panicked and left people, even their own citizens, at sea to rot. The ships didn’t have test kits, so they didn’t know who was positive until they became gravely ill.

Going forward, ships will be required to have protocol agreements with the ports they visit. They will also be equipped with test kits and treatment options we didn’t have then. A single positive case will likely be quarantined immediately and put ashore at the next port with the rest of their party. Even ports that can’t handle a full shipload of people can deal with one or two. There may be specific ports missed, but that has always happened for various reasons.
A fully, or nearly fully, vaccinated ship will have its own herd immunity, and the odd case will not trigger mass contagion. Being caught falsifying your vaccine status will likely mean expulsion at the next port, just like any other necessary document. 
I’m not worried about the odd positive case on a long journey. People debark for medical reasons fairly often without affecting the rest of the cruise. It’s a mass outbreak with significant numbers of vulnerable passengers that turn an 80 day cruise into an 8 day one.

[Horizon chaser 1957]

On 5/2/2021 at 7:48 AM, kazu said:

 

If everyone is vaccinated, then even if they do contract the virus, the side effect should be minimal.   Your statement I bolded points to the reason 100 % vaccination is key.  The effect on the unvaccinated is far different than those who have been vaccinated IF the vaccinated contract it.

 

 

+1👍🏻

[ChutChut]

24 minutes ago, Horizon chaser 1957 said:

 

 

+1👍🏻

Key word here is "should" be minimal. We don't know how that will play out. If one person gets off the boat at a port and encounters someone with the virus and brings it back - we don't know what will happen or how severe any one person's reaction will be. It's all a risk and all an unknown.

[harkinmr]

1 hour ago, ontheweb said:

Just want to modify your question slightly. What happens if the threshold of Covid cases onboard is passed? And what is the threshold? Is the threshold a specific number, or is it a percentage of the passengers and crew aboard?

 

There is so much we do not know!

"Threshold" is currently undefined.  Below is the text in the CSO.  Best hope it changes.

 

(a) Based on a threshold of COVID-19 being detected in passengers or crew, as determined through CDC technical instructions or orders, a cruise ship operator must immediately take the following actions:

(1) Conduct such notifications of passengers, crew members, and other government entities as CDC may require.

(2) Immediately end the restricted passenger voyage, cancel future restricted passenger voyages until directed by CDC that such voyages may resume, and return the ship to the U.S. port of embarkation.

(3) Immediately isolate any sick or infected passengers and crew in single occupancy

cabins with private bathrooms and quarantine all remaining passengers and non-essential crew.

[ChutChut]

30 minutes ago, Horizon chaser 1957 said:

IMHO it will be different this time. March 2020 Covid was new, and scary, and not much was known about it. There were no plans in place, no vaccine, and there were not known treatments. Ports just panicked and left people, even their own citizens, at sea to rot. The ships didn’t have test kits, so they didn’t know who was positive until they became gravely ill.

Going forward, ships will be required to have protocol agreements with the ports they visit. They will also be equipped with test kits and treatment options we didn’t have then. A single positive case will likely be quarantined immediately and put ashore at the next port with the rest of their party. Even ports that can’t handle a full shipload of people can deal with one or two. There may be specific ports missed, but that has always happened for various reasons.
A fully, or nearly fully, vaccinated ship will have its own herd immunity, and the odd case will not trigger mass contagion. Being caught falsifying your vaccine status will likely mean expulsion at the next port, just like any other necessary document. 
I’m not worried about the odd positive case on a long journey. People debark for medical reasons fairly often without affecting the rest of the cruise. It’s a mass outbreak with significant numbers of vulnerable passengers that turn an 80 day cruise into an 8 day one.

How do you know it won't trigger a mass contagion? There have been no studies at all on the effect of bringing an infected person onto a ship of vaccinated pax. Theoretically, some may get it but have milder symptoms, etc. However, I've had a flu vaccine before and gotten the flu - a horrible case - a month later. I've had years when I wasn't vaccinated, that I didn't get it at all.  It's all an unknown.

[Horizon chaser 1957]

2 minutes ago, ChutChut said:

How do you know it won't trigger a mass contagion? There have been no studies at all on the effect of bringing an infected person onto a ship of vaccinated pax. Theoretically, some may get it but have milder symptoms, etc. However, I've had a flu vaccine before and gotten the flu - a horrible case - a month later. I've had years when I wasn't vaccinated, that I didn't get it at all.  It's all an unknown.

I don’t. Hence the ‘in my opinion’ not ‘due to my superior all seeing medical knowledge’.  Any longer cruise seems to have what’s lovingly known as cruise crud give a lot of passengers coughs and sniffles. They don’t end the cruise for it. The studies so far indicate that while breakthrough cases can happen, serious illness and death don’t. They indicate that the level of risk drops dramatically. Just like crossing the street, it all depends on what level of risk you’re comfortable with to make the go/ no go decision.

[jakers]

My daughter says that she doesn't care if the ship is full of zombies. She wants to go cruising to Alaska.

We are vaccinated, we are protected and we won't spread it. The best part of all this is that "Cruise Crud" is harder to get. All of you who deal in "theories" need to realize the difference between possibility and probability.

[syesmar]

9 hours ago, harkinmr said:

"Threshold" is currently undefined.  Below is the text in the CSO.  Best hope it changes.

 

(a) Based on a threshold of COVID-19 being detected in passengers or crew, as determined through CDC technical instructions or orders, a cruise ship operator must immediately take the following actions:

...

(2) Immediately end the restricted passenger voyage, cancel future restricted passenger voyages until directed by CDC that such voyages may resume, and return the ship to the U.S. port of embarkation.

(3) Immediately isolate any sick or infected passengers and crew in single occupancy

cabins with private bathrooms and quarantine all remaining passengers and non-essential crew.

Thanks for posting this. 

[sofietucker]

Is the OP running a survey and/or keeping count of yes/no replies? Our answer: NO. and we are 4-star Mariners.  Have no idea what HAL plans. Disappointing

.

[kazu]

4 hours ago, sofietucker said:

Is the OP running a survey and/or keeping count of yes/no replies?

 

If you vote in the poll / survey at the top of the page, then yes, your no reply is counted.

[Boatdrill]

On 5/2/2021 at 10:31 PM, Cruising Is Bliss said:

 

If someone unvaccinated on a cruise gets sick, every other person on that ship gets treated like they're radioactive.

If the cruiselines treat "every other person on the ship" the same (vaccinated or not), then what is the point of being vaccinated ? They are admitting that there is no protection from being vaccinated.   Otherwise the vaccinated people would be treated differently,  i.e. non-radioactive. 

Edited May 4, 2021 by Boatdrill

[The-Inside-Cabin]

We are scheduled to sail on the NS on 11 July from Amsterdam.   We plan to go regardless of what the vaccine requirements may be or port restrictions.    If the ship sails, and we can get there, we will be onboard.

 

Can't wait!

[Heartgrove]

16 minutes ago, The-Inside-Cabin said:

We are scheduled to sail on the NS on 11 July from Amsterdam.   We plan to go regardless of what the vaccine requirements may be or port restrictions.    If the ship sails, and we can get there, we will be onboard.

 

Can't wait!

 

Do you think that the Netherlands will relax entry requirements for US citizens by then? Currently US citizens are not allowed. If they are admitted, it looks like up to ten days of quarantine. You will like the Nieuw Statendam.

[The-Inside-Cabin]

51 minutes ago, Heartgrove said:

 

Do you think that the Netherlands will relax entry requirements for US citizens by then? Currently US citizens are not allowed. If they are admitted, it looks like up to ten days of quarantine. You will like the Nieuw Statendam.

Yes - I think they will relax requirments by then.    Summer starts June 20 and we don't fly out of the USA until 8 July.  

 

From the NY Times

Published April 25, 2021Updated April 29, 2021

BRUSSELS — American tourists who have been fully vaccinated against Covid-19 will be able to visit the European Union over the summer, the head of the bloc’s executive body said in an interview with The New York Times on Sunday, more than a year after shutting down nonessential travel from most countries to limit the spread of the coronavirus.

 

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/04/25/world/europe/american-travel-to-europe.html

[KirkNC]

1 hour ago, The-Inside-Cabin said:

We are scheduled to sail on the NS on 11 July from Amsterdam.   We plan to go regardless of what the vaccine requirements may be or port restrictions.    If the ship sails, and we can get there, we will be onboard.

 

Can't wait!

Good luck with that.

[Heartgrove]

2 minutes ago, The-Inside-Cabin said:

Yes - I think they will relax requirments by then.    Summer starts June 20 and we don't fly out of the USA until 8 July.  

 

 

Okay, because the EU Union is leaving it up to the individual countries for the final decision. Things are not too good in the Netherlands right now. Good luck, and Happy Sailing!

[The-Inside-Cabin]

8 minutes ago, Heartgrove said:

 

Okay, because the EU Union is leaving it up to the individual countries for the final decision. Things are not too good in the Netherlands right now. Good luck, and Happy Sailing!

I remain optimistic.   If it gets canceled at the last second, no biggie.  I need to cancel my flights at least 72 hours in advance to get my miles back (Delta)

Edited May 4, 2021 by The-Inside-Cabin

[syesmar]

On 5/4/2021 at 4:46 PM, The-Inside-Cabin said:

I remain optimistic.   If it gets canceled at the last second, no biggie.  I need to cancel my flights at least 72 hours in advance to get my miles back (Delta)

It's been a while since I flew Delta. I'm very familiar with AA AAdvantage, though. Does Delta re-deposit miles without a charge, or would travel insurance kick in in such a scenario?

Edited May 6, 2021 by syesmar

[The-Inside-Cabin]

25 minutes ago, syesmar said:

It's been a while since I flew Delta. I'm very familiar with AA AAdvantage, though. Does Delta re-deposit miles without a charge, or would travel insurance kick in in such a scenario?

Delta charges s150 unless you have good reason.

 

if you are platinum level you get free redeposits.    Since I retired I can't maintain that level anymore.    

 

    They quit charging at all during COVID.    Don't know about travel insurance.    I always by my insurance from myself.!   I cover everything that way. No forms!  😊

[syesmar]

On 5/6/2021 at 1:51 PM, The-Inside-Cabin said:

...They quit charging at all during COVID.    Don't know about travel insurance...

That’s good. I have a credit card that has re-deposit insurance and buy travel insurance specifically for cruises, but I’ve read AA now waives redeposit fees for changes, which will give more flexibility when the time comes. 

All the Best!

[syesmar]

Yesterday, during the live "Hal Aboard" with Seth and Gus, HAL President Gus Antorcha spoke of the summer cruises from Alaska and Greece requiring 100% vaccination. But he also said that 3 to 4 months down the road and into winter, they weren't sure what was going to happen (regarding vaccination requirements), and are pretty confident that HAL will be operating the fall/winter schedule out of Florida as planned.

(If you missed the interview, some notes plus the link to view it are here: https://boards.cruisecritic.com/topic/2782021-holland-america-president-gus-antorcha-live-today-tuesday-may-25/?tab=comments#comment-61168639 )

 

In light of this and other Threads where it's clear that the vast majority of HAL clientele wants a 100% vaccinated sailing, I wonder what will happen over the next few months, and when we might have more answers. Time will tell!

 

Edited May 26, 2021 by syesmar

[ChutChut]

Yes - I would go on an unvaccinated cruise if I loved the itinerary and the price was right. I'm fairly young and very healthy with no co-morbidities (still got vaccinated though). I dine at restaurants, go into grocery stores, etc. every day with unvaccinated people. However, it would be interesting to see whether the cruise lines have vax and unvaccinated cruises and whether there is a price differential, etc. Even vaccinated, one can come down with Covid, etc. 

Edited May 26, 2021 by ChutChut

[ChutChut]

On 5/3/2021 at 1:01 PM, Horizon chaser 1957 said:

I don’t. Hence the ‘in my opinion’ not ‘due to my superior all seeing medical knowledge’.  Any longer cruise seems to have what’s lovingly known as cruise crud give a lot of passengers coughs and sniffles. They don’t end the cruise for it. The studies so far indicate that while breakthrough cases can happen, serious illness and death don’t. They indicate that the level of risk drops dramatically. Just like crossing the street, it all depends on what level of risk you’re comfortable with to make the go/ no go decision.

Actually serious illness and death have resulted even with the vaccination. Not large numbers though. 300 have died and thousands have been hospitalized with Covid after being fully vaccinated.

[syesmar]

Interesting article on cruises resuming out of Florida: https://www.usatoday.com/story/travel/cruises/2021/05/27/cruise-ship-covid-vaccine-rule-cdc-florida-vaccine-passport-ban/7464685002/

 

“According to (maritime and cruise ship attorney) Walker, the CDC trumps DeSantis’ authority in terms of health requirements on board a cruise ship. That said, a cruise line would need to take DeSantis to court for that to be made clear. But there are many reasons cruise companies might not want to make an enemy out of DeSantis, who, as governor of Florida, heads one of the world's cruise capitals....”

Edited May 28, 2021 by syesmar

[iancal]

Why on earth try to convince someone that there opinion on this is wrong?  It seems so pointless to me.

 

We will not be cruising on any ship that does not insist on vaccination.  We do not care what anyone else's opinion or belief on this subject is.    We could care less what a self serving politician like DeSantis says or does.  Completely meaningless to us.

 

What is with all the debate?  Make a choice and live with it.

 

Really, who on earth is going to be swayed by any posted medical or pandemic information they happen to read on CC????   We certainly are not.

Edited May 28, 2021 by iancal