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RC just announced vaxxed passengers on AoS must get rapid test at checkin


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Posted (edited)
7 hours ago, not-enough-cruising said:

Another "wild card" that would prevent me from cruising from Nassau at this time.  Even with the smallest chance of a false positive, I could not afford to be away for 14 days.

Away,,, locked up in a Bahamas isolation ward by the locals,,, while your clothes and belongings go on a cruise. Oh yeah, you better have a international data plan on your phone to get your test results while waiting with all of the others in the Hilton ballroom. 

 

  • Our testing partner, Doctors Hospital, will send your results via email.
    • Please note, your results will also be shared with Royal Caribbean International.
  • If your result is negative and you’re approved to sail, our shuttles will be waiting to take you to the ship!
  • If your result is positive or inconclusive, a pier agent will share next steps with you. Rest assured, we will take care of you.
Edited by BirdTravels
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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, RFerrington said:

I completely agree with you.  They can make the test results come out any way they want them to.

Tinfoil hat conspiracy theories are cute.

 

is the boogeyman out to get you as well?

Edited by Moltar
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So it appears that RCG doesn't believe the vaccine is working enough. So let's review...

 

Today word from RCL comes out suddenly that all vaccinated passengers to be tested for a future cruise on the Adventure.

Today, word is released that two passengers test positive on a vaccinated cruise from Celebrity.

 

Naw... now way these two things are related.

 

Sure sounds like RCG is starting to question vsaccines.  

 

 

 

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4 minutes ago, Goodtime Cruizin said:

So it appears that RCG doesn't believe the vaccine is working enough. So let's review...

 

Today word from RCL comes out suddenly that all vaccinated passengers to be tested for a future cruise on the Adventure.

Today, word is released that two passengers test positive on a vaccinated cruise from Celebrity.

 

Naw... now way these two things are related.

 

Sure sounds like RCG is starting to question vsaccines.  

 

 

 

 

Let's say that you are correct that RCG is starting to "question vaccines". How is this significant in any capacity? As far as I can tell, fully vaccinated cruises will continue sailing in a normalized (pre-COVID) manner. RCG has yet to make an announcement that ships from Caribbean homeports will no longer require the vaccine for those 16 and up (12+ starting in August).

 

Full disclaimer, we still have yet to learn more information surrounding the positive tests. Were they false positives? Were these people actually fully vaccinated, or did they pull off a "here's my card but please don't actually look at the numbers/dates"? What will RCG's official response to this situation be in terms of changing their health protocols moving forward?

 

If I had to bet money, I highly doubt that this is a precursor to RCG making vaccines completely optional. If an unmasked, fully vaccinated cruise at 30% capacity yielded two positive tests, how many would an unmasked, vaccine-optional cruise at higher capacities yield?

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7 minutes ago, BOOKBOOKBOOK said:

 

Let's say that you are correct that RCG is starting to "question vaccines". How is this significant in any capacity? As far as I can tell, fully vaccinated cruises will continue sailing in a normalized (pre-COVID) manner. RCG has yet to make an announcement that ships from Caribbean homeports will no longer require the vaccine for those 16 and up (12+ starting in August).

 

Full disclaimer, we still have yet to learn more information surrounding the positive tests. Were they false positives? Were these people actually fully vaccinated, or did they pull off a "here's my card but please don't actually look at the numbers/dates"? What will RCG's official response to this situation be in terms of changing their health protocols moving forward?

 

If I had to bet money, I highly doubt that this is a precursor to RCG making vaccines completely optional. If an unmasked, fully vaccinated cruise at 30% capacity yielded two positive tests, how many would an unmasked, vaccine-optional cruise at higher capacities yield?

 

I recognize that the many theorize that the two covid passengers used a fake card. But understand this, RCG has to very very careful on this one. They'll have to prove it beyond a shadow of doubt or they be sued big time. Next is the PR problem they'll be facing if they do tell us the vaccine cards are fake. They lose all credibility because the required documentation was not verified but yet demanded. That's a serious problem for RCG.  Because of these two reasons, I seriously doubt that we'll hear anything going forward about them.  

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13 hours ago, not-enough-cruising said:

But they aren't requiring vaccines, different scenario all together.

I'm currently on MSC Virtuosa. I'Ve been double vaccinated as have 75% of guests. We had a test when we boarded on Sat and another one yesterday which took a few minutes of our time. I'm sure there were no positive results because we'd have heard about it by now. It really has been no problem and I don't know what all the fuss is about. Just happy to be cruising again.

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2 hours ago, Goodtime Cruizin said:

 

I recognize that the many theorize that the two covid passengers used a fake card. But understand this, RCG has to very very careful on this one. They'll have to prove it beyond a shadow of doubt or they be sued big time. Next is the PR problem they'll be facing if they do tell us the vaccine cards are fake. They lose all credibility because the required documentation was not verified but yet demanded. That's a serious problem for RCG.  Because of these two reasons, I seriously doubt that we'll hear anything going forward about them.  

 

Glad that we agree that even if Royal was starting to "question the vaccines", it is not to a significant degree.

 

Your point about how Royal may react to fake vaccine cards is interesting, and I'm inclined to agree that they may very well keep this swept under the rug because not enough "damage" was done to anybody. Although unconfirmed, I heard a rumor that after the captain announced the positives onboard, masking protocols and other restrictions were imposed for the rest of the passengers for the rest of the journey. So, maybe enough "damage" was done to warrant further investigation and a press release.

 

Although I agree that Royal will have to tread carefully if they choose to pursue the issue, I believe it won't be difficult to do so. They can simply hand over the cards to the feds/CDC for inspection (assuming the two positives are American passengers). The feds would be very interested in a possible case of a federal crime being committed. At that point, Royal being sued would be at the bottom of the fakers' worries.

 

I don't believe Royal will face much of a PR problem for demanding cards that they didn't verify. Royal will most certainly issue some form of punishment against the fake cardholders in the form of a lifetime ban. It sends the message that, "yeah, go ahead and fake the cards all you want, but be prepared for the consequences from us and from the feds if anything prompts us to start checking cards". It's easier to check/submit 2 cards than ~600.

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Posted (edited)

Our original CDC vaccination cards will not be leaving our possession. They are with our passports. I don't really know what you are thinking with this "hand over" of the cards. Someone can confirm providers and vaccines with photocopies or photos if they want to. :classic_tongue:

Edited by Coralc
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25 minutes ago, Coralc said:

Our original CDC vaccination cards will not be leaving our possession. They are with our passports. I don't really know what you are thinking with this "hand over" of the cards. Someone can confirm providers and vaccines with photocopies or photos if they want to. :classic_tongue:

 

Of course I don't mean it literally when I say "hand over" 😂 

 

Yes, you are correct that the feds can confirm providers/vaccines with scanned copies or the digital medium of your choice.

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4 hours ago, Coralc said:

Our original CDC vaccination cards will not be leaving our possession. They are with our passports. I don't really know what you are thinking with this "hand over" of the cards. Someone can confirm providers and vaccines with photocopies or photos if they want to. :classic_tongue:

While I understand your sentiment, be careful with blanket statements.  On some cruises, you have to hand over your passport and you get it back at the end. What you want, ad what is necessary are not always inline

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Posted (edited)

The vaccine csards are a hot mess though. My 81 yr old M-I-L left her vaccine card at home for her 2nd pfizer shot. They jabbed her anyway and sent her down the road. She has a date only, No trace of the vial # or anything. The facts will show that human error will be created when you administer millions upon millions of these jabs. Proving a 'fake' vaccine card is going to be very very difficult. I'm not sure any business will wish to attempt to accuse someone for doing so based on this.

Edited by Goodtime Cruizin
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1 minute ago, Goodtime Cruizin said:

The vaccine csards are a hot mess though. My 81 yr old M-I-L left her vaccine card at home for her 2nd pfizer shot. They jabbed her anyway and sent her down the road. She has a date only, No trace of the vial # or anything. The facts will show that human error will be created when you administer millions upon millions of these jabs. Proving a 'fake' vaccine is going to be very very difficult. 

Think of the CDC card as an appointment reminder card that the nurse scribbles the date and time on. The cards were designed only for the patient's infomation and not as a form of vaccine record. But just so you know, the site verifies in their records that they are administering the 2nd shot and should have instructed her to keep the 2nd card with the 1st card. The vaccine site and the state agency that stores the health records, has both shot information in the database.

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5 hours ago, BOOKBOOKBOOK said:

 

Glad that we agree that even if Royal was starting to "question the vaccines", it is not to a significant degree.

 

Your point about how Royal may react to fake vaccine cards is interesting, and I'm inclined to agree that they may very well keep this swept under the rug because not enough "damage" was done to anybody. Although unconfirmed, I heard a rumor that after the captain announced the positives onboard, masking protocols and other restrictions were imposed for the rest of the passengers for the rest of the journey. So, maybe enough "damage" was done to warrant further investigation and a press release.

 

Although I agree that Royal will have to tread carefully if they choose to pursue the issue, I believe it won't be difficult to do so. They can simply hand over the cards to the feds/CDC for inspection (assuming the two positives are American passengers). The feds would be very interested in a possible case of a federal crime being committed. At that point, Royal being sued would be at the bottom of the fakers' worries.

 

I don't believe Royal will face much of a PR problem for demanding cards that they didn't verify. Royal will most certainly issue some form of punishment against the fake cardholders in the form of a lifetime ban. It sends the message that, "yeah, go ahead and fake the cards all you want, but be prepared for the consequences from us and from the feds if anything prompts us to start checking cards". It's easier to check/submit 2 cards than ~600.

 

Once again.... all of above is on the premise that the cards were fake. 

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Just saw that 2 Celebrity passengers tested positive on their “return to the US” test.  That explains why Royal is taking that extra step before embarkation.  Makes sense now. 

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1 minute ago, ArthurUSCG said:

Think of the CDC card as an appointment reminder card that the nurse scribbles the date and time on. The cards were designed only for the patient's infomation and not as a form of vaccine record. But just so you know, the site verifies in their records that they are administering the 2nd shot and should have instructed her to keep the 2nd card with the 1st card. The vaccine site and the state agency that stores the health records, has both shot information in the database.

 

Here's how mine went via CVS pharmacy....

The nurse physically hand wrote my pertinent info including name, SS#, date, and the vial# on a form for her/their records.  She then wrote down my name, date, the vial# on a vaccine record card and issued it to me. So sometime later this info was then transcribed and manually data entered into a data base. My point is that this process lends itself to human error.  Especially if one multiplies this by millions upon millions. TBH, having experienced this first hand and how my M-I-L' s was processed, I personally would have issues accusing anyone of using a falsified vaccine card. But hey... that's me.  

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9 hours ago, Goodtime Cruizin said:

So it appears that RCG doesn't believe the vaccine is working enough. So let's review...

 

Today word from RCL comes out suddenly that all vaccinated passengers to be tested for a future cruise on the Adventure.

Today, word is released that two passengers test positive on a vaccinated cruise from Celebrity.

 

Naw... now way these two things are related.

 

Sure sounds like RCG is starting to question vsaccines.  

 


Given that the 2 individuals are asymptomatic, I'm thinking this is showing exactly why the CDC prefers 95% vaccination rate on cruises. The 2 people were likely infected prior to boarding, and so far, no one else on board has gotten sick. Think about that, those 2 people were dinning, going to shows with, going on shore excursions, for days with the rest of the ship.

Now, we have to wait a full 2 weeks to full know, but likely in the next 4 days we will have a very good idea how well the vaccine works to prevent the spread of covid to other vaccinated individuals. Given that the cruise is on day 6, when the testing happened, it's likely more would have tested positive if the vaccine didn't work as well as it does.

Hopefully, this makes RCG question the non vaccinated cruises going forward.
 

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7 minutes ago, ArthurUSCG said:


Given that the 2 individuals are asymptomatic, I'm thinking this is showing exactly why the CDC prefers 95% vaccination rate on cruises. The 2 people were likely infected prior to boarding, and so far, no one else on board has gotten sick. Think about that, those 2 people were dinning, going to shows with, going on shore excursions, for days with the rest of the ship.

Now, we have to wait a full 2 weeks to full know, but likely in the next 4 days we will have a very good idea how well the vaccine works to prevent the spread of covid to other vaccinated individuals. Given that the cruise is on day 6, when the testing happened, it's likely more would have tested positive if the vaccine didn't work as well as it does.

Hopefully, this makes RCG question the non vaccinated cruises going forward.
 

Also consider, rapid antigen tests have a high false positive rate in the asymptomatic population. 

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18 minutes ago, Goodtime Cruizin said:

 

Here's how mine went via CVS pharmacy....

The nurse physically hand wrote my pertinent info including name, SS#, date, and the vial# on a form for her/their records.  She then wrote down my name, date, the vial# on a vaccine record card and issued it to me. So sometime later this info was then transcribed and manually data entered into a data base. My point is that this process lends itself to human error.  Especially if one multiplies this by millions upon millions. TBH, having experienced this first hand and how my M-I-L' s was processed, I personally would have issues accusing anyone of using a falsified vaccine card. But hey... that's me.  

 

When I went thru, I had to enter all of the info into the registration system, the person verified the info against my ID, they entered or selected the lot# into the system, then put the sticker with the lot# on the card and wrote my info along with the 2nd appt reminder on it.

Given that the lot number is the same for all of the vials in the box, it's likely a retail pharmacy is using the same lot number for most of the day. Unless you were a walk up, the name and SS# written down should be cross checked with the info entered when you made the appointment, so minor errors like spelling are corrected. So, the human error that does happen should be caught by the system and flagged for correction or be obvious when reviewed latter.

But even with the method you wrote, when going later to verify her vaccine status, something should match when queering the database. Usually it only takes 1 piece of info to match, name, address, SS# for those records to come up and then the person will select the best match, this also allows for them to see obvious mistakes like Jimmy vs Jimy vs Jimmie when verifying status.

I work a lot with very large data sets and often from multiple agencies, a good programer or spec writer can fix a lot of human error.

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This is getting beyond dumb.  Either the vax is safe and effective or its not.

 

This what you get trusting the immeasurably incompetent bureaucrats at the NIH/CDC/FDA.

 

I noticed the message didn't say outright that you would be denied boarding, just there will be next steps.

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