Rome pickpockets

[bigwally]

Friend of my dad's just got back from Rome where he was pickpocketed by a group of "eastern Europeans" on a train. They basically bum rushed him, with lot of shoving and pushing. Apparently it almost got to the point where fisticuffs had to ensue.

 

Now how he didn't realize that it was a setup for a pickpocketing is a bit beyond me, but that's probably a tale for another day. Anyway, in the hour it took for him to reach his destination and phone to cancel his various credit cards they'd already been able to do $10k in damage.

 

So I guess I take from this:

 

1) Be on alert for these buggers in the first place.

 

2) Use the proper precautions in securing your stuff.

 

3) If someone gets in your face, you may have to be equally agressive to get out of the situation. But be careful that you don't endanger your well being.

 

4) If something like this does happen, first thing you need to do is check that you still have everything that you should (although by checking for your wallet/valuables you might also be indicating where they can be found for a second try, so a little care is needed).

 

5) Carry the information you need to cancel your cards with you if you can, and a method by which you can communicate the loss without delay.

[DonLou]

... Anyway, in the hour it took for him to reach his destination and phone to cancel his various credit cards they'd already been able to do $10k in damage...

 

It always amazes me how much damage can be done without a proper ID. I have a sneaking suspicion that the merchants in Europe don't care who you are as long as you buy their stuff and have a credit card - anyone's credit card. My wife had a similar experience in Rome. They managed to run up about $1000 in about half an hour.

[cruisemom42]

It always amazes me how much damage can be done without a proper ID. I have a sneaking suspicion that the merchants in Europe don't care who you are as long as you buy their stuff and have a credit card - anyone's credit card. My wife had a similar experience in Rome. They managed to run up about $1000 in about half an hour.

 

 

After having my wallet lifted by a stealth pickpocketer in Barcelona last year, I learned from their police department that often these folks operate in a group endeavor. For instance, of the many $$$ run up on my card before I could notify the banks, 2 of the largest charges were at restaurants (for several thousands each). The police admitted this was probably a fraudulent charge that resulted in cash changing hands. Whether or not the police do anything with this information is another story.....:cool:

[24butterfly]

Hope I never encounter what you have, but isn't it the merchants who suffer? After u report it, aren't u absolved of any charges? The merchant then eats the charges b/c you have denied that u made the purc, and, also it wasn't our signature. THEY and or the bank have to come up with the proofs. Someone correct me if I'm wrong??

[rebeccalouise]

After having my wallet lifted by a stealth pickpocketer in Barcelona last year, I learned from their police department that often these folks operate in a group endeavor. For instance, of the many $$$ run up on my card before I could notify the banks, 2 of the largest charges were at restaurants (for several thousands each). The police admitted this was probably a fraudulent charge that resulted in cash changing hands. Whether or not the police do anything with this information is another story.....:cool:

 

I was robbed by a little kid in Barcelona! I was in a videoarcade. It is amazing who gets recruited to do the theivery.

 

My son and his two friends backpacked last summer all over Europe. My son carried his credit card and Euros in an under the shirt cash holder. This worked. He didn't visit Barcelona though.

 

Women, don't carry anything in your purse that can't be replaced. I strongly recommend only carrying a small amount of cash on you and watching cameras like a hawk!

[DonLou]

Hope I never encounter what you have, but isn't it the merchants who suffer? After u report it, aren't u absolved of any charges? The merchant then eats the charges b/c you have denied that u made the purc, and, also it wasn't our signature. THEY and or the bank have to come up with the proofs. Someone correct me if I'm wrong??

 

Typically, in a "face to face" transaction where you purchase goods directly from the store, it is the card issuer who takes the loss. In most Internet transactions it is the merchant who eats the loss. That's why merchants that do "face to face" transactions in Europe really don't ask about your ID when you make a credit card purchase. They have very little incentive to do so.

 

And you are absolved, most of the time, of any false charges by acknowledging the fraud in an affadavit to the credit card issuer.

[lambs2]

Just returned from a couple weeks in Europe. I had a velcro "pocket" that I could attach inside my shirt and even my bra (sometimes) and DH wore an under the clothing money belt (he tucks in his shirts too). No problems whatsoever for us. We rode the public trains and buses all over Italy, too. In Rome we were on bus 64 (a.k.a. the pickpocket express), and sure enough, a tourist had her wallet lifted on our ride to the Vatican.

[Cruise_Dreamer]

lambs2 - where can I find this "velcro pocket"?

[lambs2]

I made my own velcro pocket with strips of velcro from the $ store and some material scraps!

[mochuck]

It always amazes me how many men still walk around with their wallets in their back pocket. May as well have a neon sign on your arse saying STEAL ME. I include my own husband in this category.

 

He says he would be able to feel it if someone tried to take it, but when you are being jostled on all sides you can't feel it.

 

I've also noticed when making credit card purchases in Europe, nobody checks the signature against the card.

[hcat]

These threads make me nervous--we'll try to be prepared.. Wonder why the local authorities do not try harder make their cities safe...? Seems like it is expected & accepted...

[cberge]

These threads make me nervous--we'll try to be prepared.. Wonder why the local authorities do not try harder make their cities safe...? Seems like it is expected & accepted...

I was going to post a reply,but want to reply to your post first....these threads should not make you nervous.Pickpocketing is a way of life in Europe,and anyone silly enough to keep valuables where they can be taken easliy is just asking for it.There are precautions to be taken,and it's not hard to do.I don't mean to be paranoid about,but keeping just a days worth of cash and 1 CC on one's person in a sfe secure bag or on the body is enough.PPing is an art form over there...nit like ehre in the US where they tend to stick a gun in your back and take whatever you have on you.The police over there could not possibly keep up with all the PPing that goes on as that would be all they do.A few rules..never put any bag you have down any place (like on the back of a chair while eating or in a shop),keep what you carry to a minimum and make sure it has a good zipper or use a neck pouch.Don't look like you are afraid just enjoy yourself,but be aware of surroundings especially in a crowded area.

These post re PP's come up all the time..there was just one for Barcelona and Paris...if people do silly things they will get PP'd.If everyone thinks it won't happen to them and they don't have to be careful they will be a victim.I wish everyone going abroad would read warnings about being careful,but i know that's not going to happen so the posts will continue.

Soory this was so long,but I think needed to be said.

[Hlitner]

I say "here here" to Cberge's post. We have both posted numerous info on this topic over the years, and its a subject that never disappears. The reality is that there are many gypsies in Europe and too many of these gypsies make their living picking the pockets (and purses) of tourists. This is not just a problem in Rome or Barcelona, its throughout all the tourist countries. The good news is that they just want your money and do not want to do you any physical harm. Travelers can usually protect themselves by taking simple precautions, because the theives will normally look for the easiest "mark." A couple of simple ideas are that men should never carry a wallet in their back pocket (I sometimes put a cheap empty wallet in my back pocket as bait). If you must carry a wallet than put a couple of wide rubber bands around the wallet and keep it in a front pocket (even better is to get a pouch that you can wear under your shirt). For women, always carry your purse across your shoulders (not over a shoulder) and follow my wife's idea by using a large diaper pin to secure your outside purse zipper. Beware of any attempt to distract you (a woman handing you a baby, somebody spilling a drink on your pants, etc) and you will be fine. For those that drive in Europe, never leave your car (with luggage) at highway reststops in Italy, Spain or France without somebody staying with the car. In Italy, there are often old "pensioners" who make some extra money by offering to guard your car at reststops for only a few Euros. Its really nothing to get nervous about, but merely a fact of life for which you just have to take a few common sense precautions.

 

Hank

[ger_77]

Our friends spent a month in Portugal and he was picked twice - I guess he didn't learn from the first experience! We have travelled through the Mediterranean twice and have not had any problems. I always sew an extra pocket inside the waistband of DH's travel pants (I take out a pocket from an old pair of pants and simply stitch it to the waistband of his new ones.) and that's where he puts his $ and credit cards. He likely carries a couple of Euros in his front pocket, but that's about it. When we enter countries where we have to carry our passports, his goes into his inside pocket, while mine goes in a pouch around my neck, under my blouse.

 

Smooth Sailing! :) :) :)

[rebeccalouise]

 

I was going to post a reply,but want to reply to your post first....these threads should not make you nervous.Pickpocketing is a way of life in Europe,and anyone silly enough to keep valuables where they can be taken easliy is just asking for it.There are precautions to be taken,and it's not hard to do.I don't mean to be paranoid about,but keeping just a days worth of cash and 1 CC on one's person in a sfe secure bag or on the body is enough.PPing is an art form over there...nit like ehre in the US where they tend to stick a gun in your back and take whatever you have on you.The police over there could not possibly keep up with all the PPing that goes on as that would be all they do.A few rules..never put any bag you have down any place (like on the back of a chair while eating or in a shop),keep what you carry to a minimum and make sure it has a good zipper or use a neck pouch.Don't look like you are afraid just enjoy yourself,but be aware of surroundings especially in a crowded area.

 

These post re PP's come up all the time..there was just one for Barcelona and Paris...if people do silly things they will get PP'd.If everyone thinks it won't happen to them and they don't have to be careful they will be a victim.I wish everyone going abroad would read warnings about being careful,but i know that's not going to happen so the posts will continue.

Soory this was so long,but I think needed to be said.

 

Hey there! I was very vigilant in Barcelona. I read my guide book and the warnings and still my camera and change purses were lifted out of my purse in seconds. I had my straw purse between my feet while I was shooting hoops in a videoarcade.

 

Believe me two weeks of photos and a brand new digital camera stolen- made me cry. And i was 40.

 

I agree that this is common in Europe- so everyone should be really vigilant with their belongings but it still happens even then. So don't make it sound like people are stupid that get pickpocketed.

 

I really love to travel and I like Europe. Most of my experiences there have been good. Except that like anywhere they try to get tourists to spend money.

 

I am going to Barcelona again and this time- no camera. I will leave it in the safe. Just not willing to risk this violation.

 

When I came home to my neighborhood in Baltimore- it was so refreshing to be able to put your purse on top of a table or hang it on a hook under the bar and NEVER have to worry about theft. I am spoiled I guess by living in a nice neighborhood- where people look out for each other.

[cberge]

Hey there! I was very vigilant in Barcelona. I read my guide book and the warnings and still my camera and change purses were lifted out of my purse in seconds. I had my straw purse between my feet while I was shooting hoops in a videoarcade.

 

Believe me two weeks of photos and a brand new digital camera stolen- made me cry. And i was 40.

 

 

 

I am going to Barcelona again and this time- no camera. I will leave it in the safe. Just not willing to risk this violation.

 

One can be vigilant,and one can be vigilant...if your straw bag between your feet had no zipper and or your were distracted by playing a game...all some had to do was sneak up behind you howerver they wanted and in the blink of an eye...gone...whatever they could reach.You could cry even at 40 losing your camera and pics it would ok:( .Don't go to Barcelona w/o a camera...just take some good diposable ones as thet PP's don't want them as thye can get any money for them,and there are some really good ones out there.I won an award with a Fuji disposable!!People have to understand these PP's are raised from the cradle on how to pick anything w/o anyone noting they are even there at times,and as people change where they put things so do the PP's and they WILL practice until they get it right.

[bigwally]

How adept are these pickpockets? Anyone see the video of George Bush's wristwatch getting lifted in Albania.....it was a leather strap, not a metal latch, and it still took the guy only a matter of seconds to undo it with one hand and make it dissapear!

 

I think it's true in principle that these pickpocketing gangs don't mean you any real harm, but they do seem more prepared to get physical with you as a form of distraction and possibly intimidation.

[Love Cruis'n]

This will be my first time to Europe, so can you experienced folks please tell me if I’ve got this covered.

 

I bought a money belt that loops over my belt and then hangs down inside of my pants. In there I’ll keep my passport, photocopy of DW’s passport, one credit card, ships card, Blue Cross health insurance card, driver’s license, and any serious Euros. In my front pants pocket I’ll keep a few Euros for incidental purchases, and I plan to put them in a leather money clip. Will also probably carry a razor cell phone in my front pants pocket, but I also have a belt clip – which might be better? Are cell phones a target?

 

My camera is too large for pocket / purse, so I’ll keep it on a camera strap either around my neck, of over my neck/shoulder at all times. Do I need to worry about it physically being ripped off or someone cutting the strap?

 

DW also has a money belt (around her waist / under her shirt) with the equivalent to what I have in mine, and a purse / day bag that will only contain a shawl for churches, sun hat, cell phone, and a few Euros for incidental purchases (gelato, etc.)

 

Any comments / suggestions (especially re: the camera and the cell phone) are appreciated.

 

Thanks.

[standby 06.30]

I had my credit card cloned in florida in jan this year, you do not have chip and pin cards,3 months later they made a $2000 cash withdrawl at a bank in miami, my bank blocked it, felt like I was being dipped by a very long arm

[cberge]

How adept are these pickpockets? Anyone see the video of George Bush's wristwatch getting lifted in Albania.....it was a leather strap, not a metal latch, and it still took the guy only a matter of seconds to undo it with one hand and make it dissapear!

 

I think it's true in principle that these pickpocketing gangs don't mean you any real harm, but they do seem more prepared to get physical with you as a form of distraction and possibly intimidation.

Sorry...he took off his own watch and put it in his pocket as the rest of the videao shows...it was not stolen in Albania,and this was confirmed by the WH.Not saying it could not happen to someone,but not this time.

[8 Bells]

How adept are these pickpockets? Anyone see the video of George Bush's wristwatch getting lifted in Albania.....it was a leather strap, not a metal latch, and it still took the guy only a matter of seconds to undo it with one hand and make it dissapear!

 

I think it's true in principle that these pickpocketing gangs don't mean you any real harm, but they do seem more prepared to get physical with you as a form of distraction and possibly intimidation.

 

I watched the video of Bush in Albania, too, but they replayed it later and showed a close-up where Bush removes his watch and puts it in his shirt pocket. BTW, they said it is a $50 Timex watch, so even Bush knows enough not to wear expensive bling in public!

[cberge]

This will be my first time to Europe' date=' so can you experienced folks please tell me if I’ve got this covered.

 

I bought a money belt that loops over my belt and then hangs down inside of my pants. In there I’ll keep my passport, photocopy of DW’s passport, one credit card, ships card, Blue Cross health insurance card, driver’s license, and any serious Euros. In my front pants pocket I’ll keep a few Euros for incidental purchases, and I plan to put them in a leather money clip. Will also probably carry a razor cell phone in my front pants pocket, but I also have a belt clip – which might be better? Are cell phones a target?

 

My camera is too large for pocket / purse, so I’ll keep it on a camera strap either around my neck, of over my neck/shoulder at all times. Do I need to worry about it physically being ripped off or someone cutting the strap?

 

DW also has a money belt (around her waist / under her shirt) with the equivalent to what I have in mine, and a purse / day bag that will only contain a shawl for churches, sun hat, cell phone, and a few Euros for incidental purchases (gelato, etc.)

 

Any comments / suggestions (especially re: the camera and the cell phone) are appreciated.

 

Thanks.[/quote']

First off you do not need to carry your passport with you while off the ship and doing any sightseeing..a copy will be fine.You will not need any insurance cards unless your BC is covered there and again a copy same for DR.Lic.You don' have to carry any money other than what you will use for the day..leave it on ths ship.Carrying all that is just way to much if by any chance something happend.I carry just a regular purse and DH just a regular wallet just as if we were living in the area,and we have never had any problem.Your camera around your neck should be fine.Can't speak for cellphones as never use them there,and who are you going to call anyway??I would keep it in your wife's purse if you hfeel you must carry it.Just don't put anyhting down while eating or shopping..keep camera and ourses,bags etc. wrapped arround chair legs and your legs,and make sure zipped.You will be fine...just be aware of where you are and crowds.Another thing to do and I do tell people this is to carry a bag from a local shop with name on it and put some stuff in it to carry...sometimes puts the lukers off a bit.Enjoy your trip.

[hcat]

Appreciate the tips but if yellow fever or malaria is rampant someplace you might decide not to visit & spend your money there---(not a perfect analogy because you could get meds ahead for that )

I am naive & not very aware of this all when we booked our trip.. (although my dtr's teacher got pickpocked in a Church no less & their school group was swarmed by a gang of pp on a train) ! Barcelona is nicknamed the City of Thieves by some. By accepting the theft, we as traveling consumers just perpetuate it

DH & I will be prepared as best we can but will not be happy til we leave the port.. anyone who comes close to my personal space is not going to get a very welcome response from me.--even if its kids! Sounds like they need someone like Rudy G who cleaned up NY from petty crimes in good order..

Being from the NY area & having lived in DC, I am vigilant but never had to sew velcro pockets into my clothes or buy neck pouches & security belts or leave my new camera home as we are considering....even with a theft proof strap the art of distraction seems too well perfected over there...HOw safe are the hotel offered safes?

We are looking forward to the trip but very uneasy esp abt Barcelona & Rome .Hope the other ports will be better & we are booked on ship's excursions for all the ports.... Zoprry Big Wally abt your dad's friend

[hcat]

Appreciate the tips but if yellow fever or malaria is rampant someplace you might decide not to visit & spend your money there---(not a perfect analogy because you could get meds ahead for that )

I am naive & not very aware of this all when we booked our trip.. (although my dtr's teacher got pickpocked in a Church no less & their school group was swarmed by a gang of pp on a train) ! Barcelona is nicknamed the City of Thieves by some. By accepting the theft, we as traveling consumers just perpetuate it

DH & I will be prepared as best we can but will not be happy til we leave the port.. anyone who comes close to my personal space is not going to get a very welcome response from me.--even if its kids! Sounds like they need someone like Rudy G who cleaned up NY from petty crimes in good order..

Being from the NY area & having lived in DC, I am vigilant but never had to sew velcro pockets into my clothes or buy neck pouches & security belts or leave my new camera home as we are considering....even with a theft proof strap the art of distraction seems too well perfected over there...HOw safe are the hotel offered safes?

We are looking forward to the trip but very uneasy esp abt Barcelona & Rome .Hope the other ports will be better & we are booked on ship's excursions for all the ports.... Sorry Big Wally abt your dad's friend

[bigwally]

Thanks Hcat