Rio for a first timer...

[Keith1010]

The last couple of days on our evening news there have been some coverage on Rio. Specifically, about the crime rate and the fact that they are considering hiring as a security consultant for the Olympics the former Mayor of NYC. Over the coming years, Rio will undoubtedly get additional attention with respect to safety, security and crime.

 

The statistics that they showed last night revealed that the murder rates in Rio is significant.

 

Here is my take on all of this.

 

As a tourist, we all sometimes put ourselves in situations where when we travel to areas outside our own hometown, whether in our own country or outside our own country that might not be smart. This is because many times we do stick out as tourists but also because we are not familiar with the area and one turn on the wrong street could be devastating. I say this about cities in my own country as well.

 

There are certain cities around the world both in the United States of American and in various places around the world that I would tell travlers to use a lot of caution particularly if this is your first time there or you are not familar with the surroundings. I have visited Rio several times over the years on business and for pleaure. I include Rio on this list. It has some of the nicest people you will ever meet and lots of beauty but the reality is that crime is indeed high and again as a tourist I believe we are at some risk for the reasons I mentioned.

 

So, when we visit Rio on our upcoming trip we will do what we usually do there which is to go out on organized tours and not go out by ourselves except to a few select locations and we will not go out by ourselves under any circumstances at night.

 

Again, we use this same approach in selected cities around the world.

 

I am reminded that in New York City not too many years ago relatively speaking that violent crime was high. An area back then to avoid at night was actually Times Square which was very unfortunate but true. With a good deal of resources and emphasis this area was essentially cleaned up an is significantly safer today. So, change can occur. I think the Olympics may turn out to be a good opportunity for similar improvements in Rio. Time will tell.

 

Keith

[keltic]

I agree with the cousin!Tudo bem!

 

When will you arrive?

 

Kim

 

I have two alternative boardings. Either on the 29th march in Santos or on the 30th in Rio. As I have a cousin living there I considered coming on the 29th, and overnight in Ipanema or Copacabana. I had safety tips under control, but I have been reading about some events even against tourists buses, being stopped and assaulted in the middle of the Lihna Vermelha. TAxis and private cars seems on a daily basis.

 

Thing is....Is it acceptable the risk?. For the moment I will risk.

[Wendy The Wanderer]

I will probably post at length about Rio when I get home from my cruise, but just wanted to comment that we had *NO* problems feeling unsafe in Rio.

 

Granted, we stayed in Ipanema, which seems quite safe generally, although we did not stray onto the beach after dark. But we did walk around the area after dark and were fine. I admit I hung onto my purse a bit more tightly than usual, but really it was fine.

 

We did have a private guide for 2 days coming and going from Ipanema, and a driver from the airport, and cab to the ship, so we were a bit protected, but really, there were no areas where he took us where it appeared unsafe.

 

I have seen the slums of Mumbai, and the favelas of Rio are palaces by comparison.

 

Rio is a great city, and we hope to come back and see more of Brazil asap!

[keltic]

Thanks Wendy, your comments sound really good.

[freddie]

Keltic –

 

Please let me begin by urging you emphatically to spend as much time in Rio as you can manage to do. It is, as Kim noted, truly “a cidade maravilhosa”, the marvelous city. I have had the good fortune over the last 40 years or so to visit 60 or 70 countries and most of the famous grand cities of the world, some for only a day or so and others for weeks or months. Rio truly ranks amongst the most exciting and beautiful big cities I’ve visited. Its geography and topography are unique, with its many miles of lovely beaches, the mountains against which many neighborhoods sit, and the world’s largest urban forest within the boundaries of the city. We took a 30-minute helicopter ride over the city and were able to get a wonderful sense of the astonishing setting of Rio. There is a delightful Carioca adage something like: “Paris is the most beautiful city designed by men; and Rio is the most beautiful city designed by God.”

 

We spent four days in Rio earlier this month before embarking on our cruise ship. We would have liked to have had much longer in and around the city and absolutely plan to return in the future.

 

As for the safety issue, we did not find Rio to be any more or less safe than most large cities. In the principal tourist areas (Copacabana, Ipanema, and Leblon), the wide sidewalks were filled with people walking their dogs, pushing their baby strollers while happily gossiping, and enjoying the remarkable energy of the city. On the walkways along the beaches, gorgeous men & women jogged, rollerbladed, and socialized as they made their way to the many little bars and bistros set up along the beaches. Did we go out onto the deserted parts of the beaches after dark? – Of course not. Did we carry serious cameras on the sidewalks and beaches during the day? – Of course we did.

 

The favelas appear to be generally pretty dreadful; and we had no interest in visiting them. However, I would not be so bold as to comment on whether they are any more dreadful in the total sense than the shantytowns around Bangkok, the townships in South Africa, or the slums of most large cities (including the South Bronx in New York, into which we would certainly not consider venturing). Please bear in mind that a couple of arrondisements of Paris – my favorite big city and one to which I have happily returned a couple of dozen times – are now considered to be quite dangerous for tourists. Does that make Paris a dangerous city? It is true that several policemen were recently murdered in a favela in Rio. It is also true that within the last six weeks, 5 police officers have been murdered in middle class suburbs (not slums) of Seattle, one of the most civilized large cities in North America.

 

Okay, enough ranting about whether Rio is dangerous or not. Here are a few random suggestions, based on no particular order of importance, which might add to your enjoyment of your visit:

 

If you have the time, a helicopter tour over the city is simply incredible. Seeing the Christ the Redeemer statue from the base is quite wonderful – seeing the statue at the level of the head from a hundred yards or so is an experience of a lifetime.

 

Stroll along the lovely walkways along Ipanema or Copacabana and stop for a drink at one of the little bars along the beach to get a sense of the energy of the city.

 

If you are, like me, a serious chocolate addict, seek out the nearest Kopenhagen shop. There are several in Rio and all are quite lovely (at least the two I visited were). My favorite item (after a necessary bit of gustatory research) was the Batatinhas Cobertas (which literally means “little coated potatoes”) – fabulous little balls of marzipan (not as sweet as European marzipan) coated in rich dark chocolate. Truly amongst the best chocolate treats I’ve had anywhere.

 

A bit of disclosure here (as they say on the cable news channels) – we shared a marvelous guide (Cedric Diniz) with Wendy and her husband for two of our days in Rio, as well as having the pleasure of his company for the other two of our days there. Thus, it is not surprising that our positive experience of the city echoes hers.

 

In conclusion, Keltic, please enjoy Rio. It is not the lovely little city in which you live (which we have visited only once and long to visit again); but it is one of the great cities of the world, one which you will not regret visiting and to which you will likely wish to return again and again, as we do.

 

Tchau, Fred

[freddie]

Here I am violating the rule about following a post with one's own post. Oh well, shoot me..

 

As I am catching up on CC boards, having just arrived home after a cruise from Rio to Ft. Lauderdale on the wonderful Regent Seven Seas Voyager, I just found a post concerning an MSNBC/TripAdvisor advisory about the "Top 10 Cities in the World for Falling Victim to a Pickpocket". Hmm, here is the list: Barcelona, Rome, Prague, Madrid, Paris, Florence, Buenos Aires, Amsterdam, Athens, and Hanoi. What is remarkably missing from that list is what?? - Rio. Gee, does that mean that it ain't the most dangerous city in the world?? Maybe so...

 

Again, I am not a blind apologist for the glories of Rio and the safety of that city. My experience there is limited to a few wonderful days, during none of which we felt in the slightest hampered by anything more than sensible caution. I merely urge people to recognize that it is not a dangerous city, if one conducts oneself reasonably.

 

Cheers, Fred

[owl61]

"Top 10 Cities in the World for Falling Victim to a Pickpocket". Hmm, here is the list: Barcelona, Rome, Prague, Madrid, Paris, Florence, Buenos Aires, Amsterdam, Athens, and Hanoi. What is remarkably missing from that list is what?? - Rio. Gee, does that mean that it ain't the most dangerous city in the world?? Maybe so...

 

Again, I am not a blind apologist for the glories of Rio and the safety of that city. My experience there is limited to a few wonderful days, during none of which we felt in the slightest hampered by anything more than sensible caution. I merely urge people to recognize that it is not a dangerous city, if one conducts oneself reasonably.

Cheers, Fred

 

As a resident of Rio for over 7 years, I can confirm Fred's findings. While street crime does exist, the reports of violent crime on Rio streets are exaggerated and sensentionalized by those who are ignorant of the true environment. It is sometimes difficult to combat ignorance in a public chat forum because uninformed people are apt to offer unfounded opinions in the well-intended, but mistaken belief that they are being helpful. Some participants think all opinions are equal. I believe that is a vacuous platitude. The fact of the matter is that some opinions lack credibility for any number of reasons and it is a disservice to users to allow incredible opinions to go unchallenged. Unfortunately, it can be difficult to expose that lack of credibility because some people take offense when their opinions are challenged, albeit reasonably and courteously.

Most violent crime in Rio occurs within the favelas, places where tourists normally never go. In my 7 years here I have been in one favela once and that was accompanied by locals in order to shoot a movie scene. Street crime can be thwarted by using the oft repeated street smarts, e.g. no fancy jewelry real or fake (purse snatchers can't tell the difference), do not walk on deserted streets especially at night, do not stand out as a tourist by dress or by consulting a map on the street corner, don't flash a wad of cash, and be careful with your purse or camera - keep both tightly secured.

The So Am cruise season is now underway and those of you coming to Rio should not be so apprehensive as to curtail your enjoyment of the "marvelous city."

[Wendy The Wanderer]

Having returned from Rio on Thursday, I do not feel that violent crime against tourists is exaggerated. A couple walking off the ship was approached by a local woman and warned to remove their watch as it was certain to be taken. We have been to Rome, Barcelona and other major cities known for pickpocketing, etc. Rio is far worse than any city we have been to. However, if you are with a tour group, you will be left alone.

 

My recommendation would be to not look like a tourist (no baseball caps -- backwards or otherwise -- no jewelry -- no handbags -- no camera's). Walk like you have a purpose and direction (no looking at maps or looking lost). Take tours when you can.

 

Unfortunately, this is one of the most beautiful places on earth with an infrastrature that is falling apart. It is full of slums (in the words of my tour guide -- not me), crime and decay. It will take a miracle for this city to improve their polluted water, crime, impossible roads and traffic before the 2016 Olympics.

 

Jackie, I'm sorry you had a bad afternoon in Rio. I just saw this post and feel I must respond. As you know we were with Freddie for 2 days, and spent 4 days there concurrent with your travelling through.

 

I was told not to wear jewellery and did not, except wedding ring. I wore a cheap watch instead of my modest but nice Seiko. I carried a travel purse with an across-the-shoulder design, lots of little zipper compartments. We left our credit cards in the hotel safe unless we were shopping.

 

We used ATM's inside banks (Citibank has multilingual terminals).

 

We really had NO problems. We strolled around Ipanema in the evenings and during the day when we weren't touring with Cedric, our guide. We were out at midnight and the streets were full of people enjoying the nightlife. At no time on the busy shopping streets did I feel any more insecure than I would have in Barcelona or Athens. After the first day I relaxed my iron-like grip on my purse, although I did keep a hand on it.

 

We sat in outdoor cafes, went to nightclubs, shopped, strolled the beach, felt very comfortable. In fact we can't wait to go back in cooler weather.

 

As I previously posted, the favelas are there, but out of the way, not in your face like in Mumbai. We also saw areas out in Niteroi that looked like favelas but Cedric told us they were just the working poor--in this case fishermen or those doing related work. We went to the main fish market over there, and strolled around with no problems. We saw lovely middle-class neighbourhoods out there as well.

 

Yes, Cedric usually paid a tip to someone to watch his car when he parked. That is part of the culture. And there are tasteful steel gates around all the upscale condos in Ipanema. Nowhere did we feel under seige or singled-out as tourists (and I have experienced this in spades in Mumbai, being practically mobbed by beggars.) We were only with a guide for 2 days, by the way, the rest of the time on our own.

 

I agree they have a huge task to prepare the city for the Olympics. But I feel that that the hugest of these tasks is traffic--if they do not do something about this, the Olympics will be a disaster. Our trip from the airport to Ipanema took an hour and a half (but it was rush hour.) Hopefully the new Ipanema subway stop with help, but really, it's *bad*.

 

And yes, the commercial port where the cruise ship docked was polluted and there was garbage floating around. But in generally I found the places we went pretty clean really. Cf. the beaches of Cozumel, which are a godawful mess.

 

Bottom line, stay in a safe area, and be sensible. No one would come to Toronto and stay in the Jane-Finch corridor (our approximation of a slum.)

[brazilgirl]

Freddie ,

 

Thanks for your wonderful post. So glad you enjoyed Rio . I´ll have to try the Batatinhas Cobertas at Kopenhagen!

 

I´d like to offer a reflection on fear. Of course it pays to be aware of your surroundings and informed of possible dangers. I wouldn´t recommend yachting off the coast of Somalia or going to Afghanistan for a honeymoon at the current moment.

 

However , I think people miss out on a lot of wonderful things in life because of fear. It always amazes me to read that some passengers prefer to stay onboard when docked in places like Rio , Jamaica , Malta...Places with so much to offer. Even if you´ve visited them many times , you wouldn´t even come close to really "knowing " them. I have probably been to Rio 20 times and I there is still so much I want to see and do.

 

Sadly , life can change in an instant . Joan Didion wrote an amazingly eloquent book about this topic in the book "The Year of Magical Thinking". She sits down for dinner and her husband die of a massive heart attack. Soon after , her only daughter dies of a terrible infection.

 

Can you imagine thinking about life´s dangers all the time? Don´t visit San Francisco...the Big One´s coming. Don´t visit the midwest- floods , tornadoes plague the place. Don´t send your kids to school ( in the U.S)...a shooter could appear. Don´t get on a plane or a car or a bike...Don´t take a shower , you could slip and fall and hit your head.

 

My husband is a hematologist. Every day he deals with people who were fine , healthy and poof...Living with him has really changed my perspective on things.

 

The bottom line is , get off the ship , enjoy , embrace the gift of travel you´ve been given. It is rare to have an opportunity to visit another country , culture. Be in awe of all the beautiful differences that exist in the world. Stop worrying so much.

 

I am not telling you to be foolhardy. But have fun and stop looking over your shoulder.

 

Those are my holiday wishes!Carpe Diem!

 

Kim

[keltic]

Thanks Freddie, I suppose media spoils everything when they rate a city. I am quite surprised about the rating of Barcelona and Madrid as unsafe as far as pickpocketing is concerned. I suppose we perceive crime according to our own enviroment experience. Living in a fairly small city of 130.000 inhabitants where crime is not an issue of any kind, and walking in Madrid and Barcelona I had never any feeling of being unsafe.

 

I think, I want to concentrate my attention is the following points. Downtown Rio for La Candelaria, old buildings as the Royal Palace, Opera House...the modern Cathedral, and the Lapa Arches, beaches, and helicopter ride around Corcovado. I am not sure if I want to miss time going up the Pao de Azucar, as it offer views, which could be enjoyed up on the helicopter.

 

As I am getting at 17:40, I suppose sunset will be at 19:00 at late march, so I am sure how I would enjoy the city. Probably a nice dinner (Rodizio), and a show. I have also in mind buying something for my girlfriend and mother at Stern, but I am not sure about the closing time. I have to be in port at 16:30, so they following day will be packed, and I want to get a private tour from 8:00 in the morning. I know it´s a pity staying for such a short time. Chocolate?. I kill for it. I am just making a note of it.

 

I am sure I will be back.

[owl61]

...so I am sure how I would enjoy the city. Probably a nice dinner (Rodizio), and a show. I have also in mind buying something for my girlfriend and mother at Stern, but I am not sure about the closing time.

Email ahead to Stern if you are serious about a (significant) purchase. It would not surprise me if they send a car to meet you at the airport. They will definitely give you (and all other cruisers) a free ride from their Ipanema flagship store to the ship, whenever you want and whether you buy anything or not.

As for a rodizio, try Porcao in Flamengo. Great views of the bay. With respect to catching a show in Rio, check out the music club scene in Lapa, www.lanalapa.com.br, as almost any Lapa club is certifiably more entertaining than the tired, old Plataforma Uno which is located a couple of blocks from my apt.

[keltic]

Fantastic idea. I didn´t know Stern transfer to their potential customers. I know I have to go, but no idea about the cost of gems my mother has noted down for me. I had booked a room at the Othon Palace and as I my cousin lives in Ipanema too, I was considering other options except Fassano which I find a bit overprized.

[freddie]

Keltic - I emphatically agree with Owl's recommendation of Porcao Flamengo for rodizio. Pat & I had a long, late lunch there with our marvelous guide, Cedric, after our magnificent helicopter tour. Cedric snagged the perfect table for us, right at the window overlooking Sugar Loaf. We had a terrific time. One suggestion for Porcao: Even though the buffet of salads and appetizers is both beautifully-presented and loaded with an amazing array of tempting items, use great restraint there, in order to save most of your appetite for the specialty of the place, which is, of course, the parade of excellent grilled meats served from the giant skewers. Bon appetit!!

[40yearcruiser]

I'm re-reading the thread and it's a little sad that there have been more posts about the fear of touring Rio than about what to see and do while there. We have traveled and walked around in many of the "dangerous" cities of the world and have never been a victim of pickpockets or muggers--we are alert and careful, maybe just lucky or too stupid to know we're in danger.

 

To my question: What sights can be reached by using the metro? Our hotel is near a station and we would like to take advantage of it if possible. I haven't yet been successful in finding a good map of the metro system. Are there easy bus connections from the metro to popular attractions, or is it necessary (or advisable) to use a taxi?

 

We may decide to hire a guide, but really like the flexibility of "going it alone". We'll be in Rio 4 days before cruising away.

[Lirio]

Besides Sugar Loaf, Corcovado (Christ) and Samba, Rio de Janeiro has other options. Should you be interested in the braziliam barroque you should visit at least one of the following churches: Sao Bento Monstery, Sao Francisco da Penitencia (440 kg of gold used in the decoration) and Nossa Senhora do Carmo da Antiga Sé where one king and two imperors of Brazil were coronated. They are all in downtown and within two hour you can see them all. Sao Bento has organ concerts on specific dates. Nossa Senhora do Carmo da Antiga Sé has daily presentations.

[Lirio]

One day trips to Petropolis (mountain) and Buzios (beach) can be arranged easely.

 

Should you be interested in fortress, Rio de Janeiro has a good collection starting with those built in the yearly years (1600) up to those built in the begining of XX century. The old ones are located in Niteroi, a city 30 minutes away where you can find 3 of them.

 

In Copacabana you have 2: 1 in each border of the beach. You have a nice cafe at Forte Copacabana near Ipanema open daily and you have the other on the side in a top of a hill which is opened during weekends and national holidays. In this one you have to walk within a Mata Atlantica path. As all fortress in Brazil belongs to the arm, it is very safe inside, including the path.

[Lirio]

Museums:

1- Historico Nacional - Brazilian History, mainly colonial and imperial period.

2 - Republica - Braziliam History - replublic period. Former presidents official residence (before the capital move to Brasilia).

3 - Modern Art

4 - Fine Arts.

 

They are all in downtown area, but you will need at least one day to see them all.

[Lirio]

Boat Ride - an olde boat (1910) that belongs to the navy does a ride throught historical sites in the Baia de Guanabara (Guanabara bay) on the weekends.

 

Mata Atlantica (Atlantica Rain Forrest) - Floresta da Tijuca (Tijuca Forrest): you can visit in a jeep tour. It is wise not to go by yourself. Ask in your hotel concierge for information about jeep tours. There couple of goog TA that offers them. Usuaaly takes all day long.

 

Be safe by using insect repelent and a lot of sun protection while in a jeep tour.

[chrismch]

We are trying to decide what to do for a mere 8hr tour of Rio. We have 2 stops in Rio - one mid cruise and the other as disembarkation. At the end of our cruise we will probably do their ShoreEx & airport transfer which includes the "beaches and sugarloaf mtn."

For the full day this is what an independent tour guide suggested...

you`ll see the Christ statue, Tijuca`s forest, Sambodromo, Lapa and Cinelandia stopping to visit the cathedral and the Colombo tea house (part of this visit is a walking tour in Downtown) Then, return to the ship.

The price I was quoted was $250 for the car for the day. Is that a reasonable price? Is there something else that I should consider as a must see?

[Wendy The Wanderer]

This price must be standard, it's what we paid by day recently (we shared it among 4). It is definitely worth it to have a guide for a short time like this. With one day you have to choose carefully--Corcovado (Christ the Redeemer) is a must for sure, and the walking tour of Centro (some of the historic buildings is also good. Sambadrome--what will be on there? It's just an empty stadium most of the time, so ask what you would be doing there, and if nothing, then skip it. I can't comment on the rest since we didn't make it to them in our 3 days.

 

Presuming that you are flying in the night before, the route may depend on where you are staying, and the weather--Corcovado clouds over frequently and views can be less than ideal.

 

No visit to the beaches? At least a drive-by of Ipanema would be nice, although with traffic definitely being a consideration you might not have time to get that far south.

[chrismch]

This is why I ask questions. I didn't know what the Sambadrome was. Although I might have thought it was some sort of stadium. As I really have no interest in sports (sorry sports fans) I will ask to pass on this. I also think the beaches weren't included because of the distance. Any other suggestions?

[MightyQuinn]

We are trying to decide what to do for a mere 8hr tour of Rio. We have 2 stops in Rio - one mid cruise and the other as disembarkation. At the end of our cruise we will probably do their ShoreEx & airport transfer which includes the "beaches and sugarloaf mtn."

 

For the full day this is what an independent tour guide suggested...

you`ll see the Christ statue, Tijuca`s forest, Sambodromo, Lapa and Cinelandia stopping to visit the cathedral and the Colombo tea house (part of this visit is a walking tour in Downtown) Then, return to the ship.

 

The price I was quoted was $250 for the car for the day. Is that a reasonable price? Is there something else that I should consider as a must see?

Another option would be to ask your private guide to quote on all your Rio excursions on both days, including the airport transfer. I bet you’d come out ahead when you compare the totals including your planned Shorex at the end of the cruise. And you’d have the advantage of being able to mix/match your itinerary with a single provider over the course of both days, as well as being in better control of your airport arrival time.

 

We used a private guide for full-day Rio sightseeing as well as airport pick-up and cruise port drop-off. We got quotes from several guides & all were in the same ballpark. Our cost for all Rio sightseeing & transfers was much less $$$ than any comparable Shorex. And of course, we got to travel as/how we wished.

 

Seeing the sights of Rio depends much on the weather, particularly the biggies of Christ Redeemer & Sugarloaf. We had a general game plan of what we wanted to see but then we did some same-day changes. This was where our guide proved her value – knowing what to do when, how to avoid crowds, how to squeeze in another site. We were fortunate to have good weather to see both Christ Redeemer & Sugarloaf. We also went to Tijuca Forest, Copa/Ipanema Beaches (a must!) Flamenco Park & Sao Bento Monastery. Our guide suggested a stop at Colombo Tea House which we enjoyed immensely. Then we did a walking tour of historic downtown, visited Metropolitan Cathedral & Selaron Stairway. Since we still had available time, we also went to Sambodromo, which was pretty low on our must-see list. It was unremarkable to us but we enjoyed popping into a nearby studio that had displays of Carnival costumes. We got some crazy pics of us wearing those outrageous feathers & hats! Again, we would have passed this up had our guide not suggested it.

 

So I’d recommend that you contact you Rio guide & ask them what they can do for you. I think your price point will go down if you include all your Rio sightseeing & transfers together. Enjoy Rio!

[Wendy The Wanderer]

This is why I ask questions. I didn't know what the Sambadrome was. Although I might have thought it was some sort of stadium. As I really have no interest in sports (sorry sports fans) I will ask to pass on this. I also think the beaches weren't included because of the distance. Any other suggestions?

 

Sambadrome is where Carnival is performed. It's like a stadium, but open at both ends. If there's any kind of performance or carnival-related activity included it might be fun, as the other poster said.

 

I also agree about having the guide quote you on the embarkation day.

 

Where are you staying?

[Lirio]

I wouldnt go to Sambodromo unless there is something related to carnival.

Sao Bento Monastery is listed in my suggestions (some previous posts in this thread), but igreja de São Francisco is the most beaultiful and walking distance from Colombo for tea.

 

I consider the Catedral the uglyest church I have ever seen.

[brazilgirl]

I totally agree that the Sambodromo is not a "must see" unless you are going for carnaval!

Colombo is charming ..and yummy!

 

I concur that Corcovado is a very weather based activity..if you have a cloud cover , your viewing pleasure is totally diminished. Sugarloaf usually has a lot less of a problem.

 

A visit to the Jardim Botanico or Tijuca Forest is a nice way to get a feel for Brazil´s unique fauna and flora. I love the Botanical Gardens!

 

Kim