Religious Services on Carnival.

[Drew's Wife]

Actually since you don't drink or gamble, those of us that do are subsidizing the low fare you paid to cruise, since those are Carnival's two highest revenue centers....:rolleyes:

 

 

Hardly Captain. I daresay, you have no idea what we pay for the suite we prefer each time we cruise. As for money spent, well we just prefer to spend it in ways that are more meaningful, something we can keep. I'm sure my photo bill can outdo a lot of your bar bills, and I have lasting memories to bring home!:)

[gtalum]

If they hire someone to do Christian services, they have to hire someone to do Jewish services, Muslim services, Hindu services, etc. I doubt Carnival will do it.

 

If they do, it will be non-denominational clergy doing all services and probably holding other positions on the ship as well. They won't add to the personnel onboard.

[AdmiralJohnson]

Hardly Captain. I daresay' date=' you have no idea what we pay for the suite we prefer each time we cruise. As for money spent, well we just prefer to spend it in ways that are more meaningful, something we can keep. I'm sure my photo bill can outdo a lot of your bar bills, and I have lasting memories to bring home!:)[/quote']

 

Excellent, except please don't confuse me with an idiot of a Captain....

 

Just keep the revenue up!!! I don't have any idea what you pay, nor do I care, but it is a fact that the cost for suites however are quite a bit more for chartered christian cruises where there is no Casino and alcohol provided... so regardless of what you pay, without the Casino and alcohol, they do charge more.

 

But thanks for the spending, as a stockholder I am proud!!! Regardless of your purchases, those ARE the two highest profit producers - not the photos...

[Mikel1733]

So what is your point? We don't drink or gamble' date=' but I'm sure that part of the money that we pay for our cruise goes for salaries for the dealers and the bartenders....doesn't that mean that we in a form subsidizing your cruise in a manner of speaking?[/quote']

 

I guess we could get rid of the casino and bars and turn them into a sanctuary for each faith. Then the cruiselines could get rid of about 1/3 of the employees on each ship. They'd be out of a job and their empty bed could be home to the pastor/ministers for each faith. But since the cruiselines would lose all the profits from drinks and the casino we could then each pay more for our cruise. Makes sense.

[BillnBobbi]

If you want to have your religious services on board, then feel free to do so (in an appropriate place).

 

However, I do not think that Carnival should have a full time minister/priest/rabbi/imam/whatever on board.

 

If a paying passenger wants to lead a service and there are others willing to listen, then that is wonderful; but do not make me pay for it in my cruise fare!

 

A rule of thumb in any professional practice is not to discuss any of the three things because they can be hot button issues: (1) Politics (2) Religion (3) Sex

 

We were on a cruise over the winter holiday in 2005 in which Christmas and Chanukah were about only two days apart. The ship was overstuffed with Christmas decorations, and an accomodation was made in which a menorah was placed in the atrium. There were no services for either religion, but some man took it upon himself to conduct Hanukkah services; and just about every Jew on board bore witness, or participated. I don't know why this was, perhaps there was a feeling of being slighted, by the overwhelming presence of the Christian placed themes.

 

My wife resented the fact that the show that night was Christmas themed and there was nothing done for Chanukah.

 

I also recall an inebriated young man walking into our elevator and screaming "MERRY CHRISTMAS" in my face. So I replied, "Happy Chanukah". In a true moment of ecumenicism, the a.h. said, "You people always have to start up don't you?"

 

Well we wrote a lengthy letter to Carnival, at the end of the cruise outlining why NO religion ought to be represented. There were obviously people from OTHER religions on board ( I noted some Hindus and Muslims) who must have felt entirely left out or foreign.

 

If you are so sincere in your own religion, and the op obviously is. ( I actually waded through that ramble that she placed. ), then by all means pray as much as you like IN YOUR OWN PRIVACY, AND IN YOUR OWN WAY.

 

My family is NOT religious in any way shape or form, and I am not ashamed to say that I am a secular humanist/athiest; whatever you care to call it.

 

However, I RESPECT YOUR RIGHT TO YOUR OWN BELIEFS. DO NOT IMPOSE THEM ON ME. I recall that NCL had a small chapel on board, which it made available for those that require that sort of thing. If you require a formal place to meet and pray, then I suggest you ask for an available room, and do what you like.

 

I would not care to subsidize a "ship's clergyman", unless we infidels may have guest speakers on board to promote secular humanism.

 

Still evolving...

 

BnB

[Sealicker]

Some things I’d like to share with you in addition to what I stated earlier:

Please keep in mind that this is a little long, but I hope considered worth the read.

 

...may I ask a question, did this diatribe have a point:confused:

 

I am bending my voodoo doll now - can you feel it?

 

 

Please keep your religions to yourself, no, I do not want any part of any religious anything subsidized by my cruise fare - thanks and have a great day!!!

[Katz A Prowl]

Popcorn....check

lounge chair.....check

cooler with drinks....check

 

 

 

Okay........now you were saying?

[GoinCruisin]

Hardly Captain. I daresay' date=' you have no idea what we pay for the suite we prefer each time we cruise. As for money spent, well we just prefer to spend it in ways that are more meaningful, something we can keep. I'm sure my photo bill can outdo a lot of your bar bills, and I have lasting memories to bring home!:)[/quote']

 

Actually, the cabin you book really doesn't matter.. the top revenue streams on Carnival are drinks and gambling... don't forget, there are many that get a suite, spend money drinking and gambling, and buy plenty of photos and gifts as well ;) Bottom line, those 2 things are pretty important to Carnival... And what you pay goes to the Carnival Corporation, which in turn pays for things that have NOTHING to do with ANY of our cruises, so it really doesn't matter... Sorry, your post about subsidizing those that drink and gamble really made no sense to me :o As for having full time clergy on the ships, I don't see it happening, simply because as mentioned, they would need to represent so many religions... they could have a multi-demoninational service that would still leave out more than half the religions out there... However, for those that would like to attend services, you can find nearly every religion represented in port if you are in port that day... Church doesn't have to be attended on Sunday, depending on who your God is, he's open 24/7 ;)

[lynyrd]

Popcorn....check

lounge chair.....check

cooler with drinks....check

 

 

 

Okay........now you were saying?

 

Scoot over please. Mind if I join you?

[Brangwen]

Popcorn....check

lounge chair.....check

cooler with drinks....check

 

 

 

Okay........now you were saying?

 

Open up that cooler girlie! :D

[kelz66]

Personally knowing God is everywhere, why would anyone have need for a person to interceed between them and God to communicate or celebrate anything? Isn't a personal relationship with God just that? Personal?

 

Why can't you just have your own personal service with your family where ever you want? Why is there a need for a special person while on vacation? :confused:

[BillnBobbi]

Personally knowing God is everywhere, why would anyone have need for a person to interceed between them and God to communicate or celebrate anything? Isn't a personal relationship with God just that? Personal?

 

Why can't you just have your own personal service with your family where ever you want? Why is there a need for a special person while on vacation? :confused:

 

 

Because sheep need to be led by the nose?

 

BnB

 

"In dark ages people are best guided by religion, as in a pitch-black night a blind man is the best guide; he knows the roads and paths better than a man who can see. When daylight comes, however, it is foolish to use blind old men as guides."

- Heinrich Heine, Gedanken Und Einfalle

[Matlily]

Going to get in trouble now!!! but I dont think religion has a place on board a cruise ship as everyone is so diverse in religion these days, you couldn't accomodate them all. But I do feel you should LEAVE CHRISTMAS ALONE and the nonsense of not allowing a christmas trees etc. The USA was formed apart from the local population of Red Indians by Christians in the mayflower times from England. Let it be (love that beatles song) and this is how religion on cruises and any other vacation spot should be. Just let it be.

 

;)

[cruiselubbers]

...may I ask a question, did this diatribe have a point:confused:

 

I am bending my voodoo doll now - can you feel it?

 

 

Please keep your religions to yourself, no, I do not want any part of any religious anything subsidized by my cruise fare - thanks and have a great day!!!

 

 

Yes it did have a point, meaning we never know when we are going to feel called to express our beliefs so each opportunity is an open opportunity. You have your beliefs....I have mine...if you had read what I said in full you would have noted that, with that in mind please go back and reread my post because I am not going to re-explain myself for you.

 

Furthermore, I did not in any way make any rude remarks concerning anyone elses religion or beliefs, so it would have been respectful for you to have done the same. I could care less what you do or when you do it.

 

BTW just so you know I have a real brother that is an atheist, two adopted online daughters that are lesbians, several friends that are lesbians, cousins that are of mixed race & an adopted online brother who lives in India & is Jain in his beliefs. I also have several friends that are witches. Our religious beliefs do not effect any of us in anyway...not that being a lesbian is....but some would say its not biblically correct.........but without all this in mind we are still great friends, we are still brothers & sisters, mother & daughters as well as friends & I wouldn't have it any other way. We all love each other despite our differences & there are many many other ways that we are connected. We are connected as being humans and have that bond. A bond that says we have hearts, we have feelings, we have spirits & minds....we also each have our own opinions....and it's ok, cause if we were all the same the world we be a pretty boring place!

 

So please before you go and say anything about me or judge me by my beliefs, know me, know my heart & don't judge me because truly it's not your place. Trust me if I judged all the people above by the way you are trying to judge me I wouldn't have ANY of them except my blood brother & 2 bi-racial cousins in my life! That would be sad because all of those people have bought positive things into my life!

 

Be blessed, be a blessing! :p

[BillnBobbi]

Going to get in trouble now!!! but I dont think religion has a place on board a cruise ship as everyone is so diverse in religion these days, you couldn't accomodate them all. But I do feel you should LEAVE CHRISTMAS ALONE and the nonsense of not allowing a christmas trees etc. The USA was formed apart from the local population of Red Indians by Christians in the mayflower times from England. Let it be (love that beatles song) and this is how religion on cruises and any other vacation spot should be. Just let it be.

 

;)

 

 

Oh, so "religion dosen't have a place on board a cruise ship" UNLESS it is CHRISTIANITY? Why should Christmas be left alone? I don't care who founded the United States, and BTW, the founding fathers were mostly either deists or freethinkers and NOT practicing Christians.

 

By the way, the last time I heard "red indians" was in some 1940s John Wayne movie. I think the nicer term is now "native americans". I never noticed the red skin myself.

 

At any rate, you should have ended your statement after your opening line, which is exactly correct. On a cruise with people from all over, of numerous different faiths, OR NO FAITH AT ALL, to represent ANY religion is asking for trouble.

 

If someone is THAT MUCH OF A CHRISTIAN, and is THAT FAITHFUL, then don't go away on a pleasure cruise during your holiday - stay in church and pray. If you haven't noticed lately, there is plenty of room there. In Europe, the churches are virtually deserted, and are becoming nothing more than museums.

 

Some are being turned into condos. (Really! -

 

Furthermore, Carnival ships are NOT US chartered, they have flags of convenience. Moreover it is a multinational company, and would do best to respect everyone's faith or lack of it, by being COMPLETELY neutral in the matter.

 

BnB

 

"Tantum religio potuit suadere malorum"

 

(To such heights of evil are men driven by religion.)

 

-Lucretius -

[Sealicker]

*****:confused: :confused: :confused:

[lynyrd]

Going to get in trouble now!!! but I dont think religion has a place on board a cruise ship as everyone is so diverse in religion these days, you couldn't accomodate them all. But I do feel you should LEAVE CHRISTMAS ALONE and the nonsense of not allowing a christmas trees etc. The USA was formed apart from the local population of Red Indians by Christians in the mayflower times from England. Let it be (love that beatles song) and this is how religion on cruises and any other vacation spot should be. Just let it be.

 

;)

 

Actually religion really doesn't have a place on this message board. I bet this thread won't make it through the night.

[Sealicker]

Actually religion really doesn't have a place on this message board. I bet this thread won't make it through the night.

 

Hopefully not... the sooner it is deleted, the better.

[Matlily]

Wow - Let it be let it be ooh let it be

 

Sorry the christmas tree is special to me and has no religious symbolism to me just happy times and presents ! yipeeeee

 

I am not religious myself, in fact I wonder sometimes what all the fuss is about, last year I lost my beautiful 42 year old sister and the year before my wonderful 32 girlfriend, so I just Let it be these days............ life is for the living, make the most of it you certainly don't know how long you all have.

[GoinCruisin]

cousins that are of mixed race

 

.....Our religious beliefs do not effect any of us in anyway...not that being a lesbian is....

 

 

I'm confused... how does mixed race have anything to do with religion????? :confused: You threw "mixed race" in with lesbians and atheists...

 

See, this is why you should never discuss religion on a cruise board :p

[Sealicker]

I'm confused... how does mixed race have anything to do with religion????? :confused: You threw "mixed race" in with lesbians and atheists...

 

See, this is why you should never discuss religion on a cruise board :p

 

...don't even ask :rolleyes: , you will get a multi-page response that does not answer any of your questions, but creates more confusion and additional questions. I have a brother that shoots pool, do I qualify for anything:confused:

[cruiselubbers]

Personally knowing God is everywhere, why would anyone have need for a person to interceed between them and God to communicate or celebrate anything? Isn't a personal relationship with God just that? Personal?

 

Why can't you just have your own personal service with your family where ever you want? Why is there a need for a special person while on vacation? :confused:

 

 

Personally believe it or not, I agree with you & considering I've done alot of scheduled ministry services in my life maybe that will surprise most, but it doesn't surprise me at all.

 

I believe God my personal choice....or the God of every posters choice....whatever you believe in doesn't need an appointment & He is always there to listen.

 

I do however think it would be nice if there were "prayer partners" on board. I think it would be a great idea if you could tell everyone that prayer time would be held in say the Lounge area at some stated time and everyone that is interested just show up. If everyone would then meet and just someone....from any religion since we all pray would just say, "Let's pray" and at that time just connect hands and have a few minutes of silent prayer with the person that said Let's Pray.....could say End Of Prayer time, I think it would be awesome! We could all connect all pray & then maybe everyone would be happy just knowing that there are other people who actually do pray! I'm sure anyone would be willing to just say those few words & no one would care what religion they were from. It's just the point on Unity! Or if they would just announce to everyone that they'd like to take a moment of silence out just so everyone could pray for safe journey I bet the whole ship would get silenced just for that one moment!

 

These are just a few suggestions & I do not claim that any of them are the correct solution....I only give them as suggestions.

 

We are all never going to agree on a cure-all for this question I just hope all of us will remain united on the boards as Cruise Lovers after the fact!

 

With that in mind......Friends?

 

Be blessed, be a blessing! :D

[cruiselubbers]

I'm confused... how does mixed race have anything to do with religion????? :confused: You threw "mixed race" in with lesbians and atheists...

 

See, this is why you should never discuss religion on a cruise board :p

 

 

This may not make sense to some readers but considering alot of people that read the bible disagree with lesbians, bi-racial people & atheists I used it as a blanket statement. In that particular sense it just becomes a big melting pot of things that are supposed to be no nos biblically speaking. However my belief is too that we are all equals and should all be treated as equals. Believe me if you think I am catching a hard time here for having people like that in my life...you should hear some of the crap I've had to endure in real life over it! Trust me as someone that went to school for ministry & who has also ministered I also get judged by other ministers even though I shouldn't. Believe me there is good & bad in everything. Please don't confuse me as being a judgemental person. Hence the reason why I did state my story above that it was great that if we allow ourselves to open up alittle bit and listen we might find that not every minister thinks the same way, not every atheist thinks the same way as well as anyone else! Trust me I get dug into all the time because I think Eminem has an ispiring story & because I can relate to Marilyn Manson & him feeling upset at the christians for judging him. Ok, that's a whole nother story......but once again some of you will understand exactly what I mean now by I don't judge anyone it's not my job & I do find good in EVERYONE and in EVERY religion.

 

So back off please I'm not out here to offend anyone, just expressing my opinions & being open to everyone elses thoughts without being crude in the process. We can't learn a darn thing unless we're willing to talk to begin with!

 

Be blessed, be a blessing!

[GoinCruisin]

This may not make sense to some readers but considering alot of people that read the bible disagree with lesbians, bi-racial people & atheists I used it as a blanket statement. In that particular sense it just becomes a big melting pot of things that are supposed to be no nos biblically speaking.

 

That is where I am confused... you are comparing 2 people marrying that are different races (not religions, races) to homosexuality and atheism... yet you say you are not here to offend, I find that offensive and borderline racist.

I know some VERY religious people that are high in the church that are of different races...

[cruiselubbers]

That is where I am confused... you are comparing 2 people marrying that are different races (not religions, races) to homosexuality and atheism... yet you say you are not here to offend, I find that offensive and borderline racist.

I know some VERY religious people that are high in the church that are of different races...

 

 

Gotcha now, I think....sorry!

 

What I was meaning....is I don't feel that way a bit! I am in no way racist or trying to offend anyone. What I was meaning.....is that I have friends & family that I accept.....that some of the stuck up think they know it all bible believers will never accept as being part of their community because they are to judgemental to accept these people as being part of "their church" because it's says its biblically in correct to live the way that they do. Personally it offends me that some churches & some ministers especially feel this way, because they are not supposed to be judging someone elses life style. It is of my personal belief once again here being a christian that we should accept everyone and if we have a problem with the way they live, set an example & mind your own business.....leave the door open & if they want to come invite them with full open arms without judging them based on their lifestyles. This is the reason why I have such a diverse group of friends & extended family.....because I looked beyond outside and looked at the heart and they did the same with me.

 

Do you understand what I am saying now???

 

Be blessed, be a blessing!