MARIANH

So can you say exactly how many crew positions have been eliminated? Seems to me that if in fact the number is fewer than that in their advertisements then they at least need to revise them as their high crew to passenger ratio has always been one of their strong selling points.

For me the answer is no. All I can say is that staff on Odyssey ( as appears to be the position on Sojourn) are clearly overworked , certainly more so than was apparent two years ago. Also the challenge of the TK experiment was adding to the workload on Odyssey.

Perhaps someone with an inside track can provide definitive stats.

Very busy in the MDR, but staff coping admirably. Is there any one reading this with a direct line to head office? If there is, can you write and tell them that their policy of making a few extra bucks by cutting Crew numbers to the bare minimum is lousy policy. It gives us no pleasure, in fact creates a feeling of discomfort, to see the crew worked so hard, some putting in 12 hour shifts. They are are all stepping up to the plate, no question, but a few extra hands would make all the difference to them - and, more to the point, to us.

Exactly what we found on the Odyssey in November. At times waiting staff were running between tables!

Such a pity as this meant they had no time to stop and talk to pax. And this was one of the delights of earlier cruises on Seabourn

It seems that all crew numbers have been cut and with their long working days and little time off they must be exhausted. Nevertheless, invariably they were friendly, cheerful and doing their very best in what must be very trying conditions.

Good on you crew, shame on you Seabourn.

BTW, much enjoying your despatches. Thankyou.

Sunprince and PaulaJK,

 

Until and unless we know where the alleged construction is/was taking place, what it is/was for, and for how long it is/was making a disruption, we should be questioning this complaint from room 514. This has never been made clear. That was what I asked about and the answers are still pending.

 

In any case, in a few days we will know more when a new set of guests, friends of mine, join the ship and respond. They have no axes to grind.

 

Happy sailing!

When we were on the Odyssey earlier in November, i had the opportunity to congratulate Cap'n Stig on the fine fettle of his ship, given it's age.He replied by saying it was a " constant battle". Perhaps they have brought in some heavy weapons on this cruise. It still is a shame that the OP does not respond to requests for more details rather than focus on compensation.

Incidentally, on our recent cruise we were inconvenienced for a day by a team painting around our balcony. We were given fair warning and I have no complaints. In fact I was rather pleased to see this attention to continuing maintenance. In any case we could not use our balcony for most of the cruise because of inconsiderate near neighbours who smoked incessantly on their balcony. A result of Seabourn's new " enlightened " smoking policy that is having the unintended(?) consequence of driving smokers onto their balcones to the detriment of non smoking pax! Forgive me for straying a bit off topic. And oh yes, I did complain to Customer relations only to be met with a desultory shrug of shoulders. Happy to share more details and an inflammatiry debate on Seabourn smoking policy on another thread.

Glad to read your post Sunprince. I,too, cannot construction plans being halted because I complained at SB Sq.

Please could you kindly resend as this does not seem to make sense- at least to me. BTW, Are you on Odyssey currently?

Thanks.

Greetings Phoenix/Tucson.. happening now..pick up latest flyer for Fry's Supermarket.. currently running a 4 day 30% off wine sale if you mix or match six bottles...(big selection of US, NZ, Aussie, S.American, S. Africa wines, less on the Euros).

 

One example: Oyster Bay (NZ), a Seabourn fine wine offering, at $11.99..six pack price (minus 30%)= $8.40 each..on the neck of each bottle is a manufacturer's coupon,(common in the USA), for $ 3 off per bottle..final price = $5.40. Good probability that Carnival procures mass quantities of this fine wine around the $4 range.

So what?

Surely the point is - is the wine any good as any everyday honest sauv blanc that most Seabourn pax would drink and find acceptable. IMHO ( and from watching said pax on Odyssey very recently) the answer is yes. Futhermore, what would you pay for such wine at a decent USA restaurant when their markup/ profit margin is factored in?

This wine features on many wine lists in UK restaurants and will cost you circa £24 ($ 35.?) or a bit more.

It currently sells very well in the UK bastion of middle class values - Waitrose.

It is currently flying off the shelves at a discount price of £7-50 ($12?)

So what's the beef?

At least they're not offering any Ripple Blanc.

 

 

 

if the embed fails:

But they are! It's called Frontera sauvignon blanc.

The majority of the wines listed can be found in certain American states for quite less than listed. Factors affecting prices are state distribution laws, state taxes, local competition, etc. For example in several western states, (near California production), wine prices are very competitive at supermarkets and some of the Seabourn "fine" wine is priced from $6 to $9 per bottle. If you buy a mix of 6 bottles an add'l 10% off, as standard policy. In addition, just about every month there's a sale and the "six-pack" discount is increased to 25% off and on holidays even 30% off, (the Kroger chain, dba as Ralph's, Fry's, and the now merged Albertsons/Safeway chains).

At the volume that Carnival contracts for wine, my guess is that they procure at an average cost somewhere in the $6 range per bottle.

The Nicolas champagne (750ml) is sometimes on sale at $19.95 per bottle with the "six-pack" option.

I did urge in my post "13 that we didn't get into a nugatory debate about bottleshop prices . Sadly, that is what exactly has happened. Surely what is important is does Seabourn offer wines that are acceptable to the majority of its pax.

The facts are that Seabourn is now offering a choice of complimentary wines that range from the cheap and not at all cheerful to very quaffable( IMHO). None can be described as "fine".

Thus the majority of pax should be able to find something to their taste. If not, there is always recourse to the "premium" list on which appear quite desirable wines at sensible markup. At the top end of the complimentary list are wines that would cost say around $60 or perhaps more in a landbased restaurant.

All of this seems to me to be an improvement on two years ago and certainly is better than wines I have experienced on Silversea.

Of course there is an issue around Seabourn hyperbole in describing their complimentary wines as "fine". It's about time they stopped being dishonest.

That was exactly what I thought when I first read the post!

I'm hoping OP comes back too.

Worrying silence from OP. Hope he/ she has not been keelhauled!

Have friends currently on Odyssey but nothing from them about noise.

Our closed MDR [b.L] occurred on a 10 day and a 12 day Med cruise.

 

I am happy with the recent reports of its being open and will wait and see.

On our recent (November ) 12 day Caribbean cruise, the MDR was open every day for breakfast and lunch. They only used one side of the restaurant on these occasions.

Hi, I am new to the Seabourn board - just booked a cruise for 2017 - but definitely interested in wines. Thanks for the list - interesting to compare to what we were just served on our recent Regent cruise.

 

However, I do know what some of these wines cost, so I would suggest you double-check the prices you provided. The Santa Margharita really goes for about $21.99 to 24.99. That 8.95 you saw was a typo. Also the Nicholas Feuillate goes for around $26-27.99. The price you saw was for a 375 ml split I believe. I didn't check any of the other prices - just knew those two were wrong since I am in wine stores pretty regularly!

I agree that some of Sananda's reported prices look rather suspect and too low-,certainly compared with what you might pay in the UK.

All I would say is that my recent experience on Odyssey suggests that Seabourn has upped the quality of their complimentary wines somewhat. If you know enough about wine and cultivate the sommelier you will be able to find a few decent wines that may not be " fine " but are eminently gluggable.

And to buy these in a landside restaurant would probably put their price point around the $50 to $60 region.

Incidentally, the mark up on the premium wine list seems rather modest compared with landside practice and there are some very pleasant offerings at sensible prices.

Hope this is helpful. And please do not let us get into a nugatory debate about bottleshop prices !

Too bad some are not willing to wait for them to work out the kinks.

JFI, Who are these "some" that you refer to?

If you read the comments of the few who have actually experienced the current TK product on Seabourn, then you will find there is acknowledgement that this is work in progress. And for example, I recommended that all pax should try the TK menu at least once. In this way , perhaps Seabourn can have the benefit of customer feedback to inform their future decisions about introducing this alternative dining option.

I have a confession. I'd never tried Pumpkin Pie, had never fancied it. Anyway, Christmas dinner on Sojourn last year I decided it was time to try it.

I loved it :eek:

Just as the old adage says ( well sort of) - "One woman's meat is another man's poisson". No doubt applies also to TK concoctions

We were on the Quest for Thanksgiving as well, and other than having a turkey dinner, it didn't feel as though we were celebrating the holiday. Very limited menu choices.

Same on the Odyssey this year. American friends persuaded me to try the Pumpkin Pyyye ( phonetic). It was truly awful. And no, it was not a TK version!

 

What am I missing that makes my commentary about the service in the Colonnade inaccurate?[/quote

 

Mea Culpa. Like Emperor Norton, I clearly misunderstood that your comments referred only to "family dining " in the Colonnade. Should have gone to Specsavers ( possibly only Brits will understand this.).

 

Apropos "family dining " in the Colonnade, service was frenetic with servers running between tables. Is this de rigueur in TK's land based establishments ?

We got on last Thursday in Fort Lauderdale, and we are staying on deck 5----

They are doing major construction work on deck 4--from 9am to 5 pm it is so noisy you can stay in the rooms

 

We are unable to stay in the room to even have a conversation,

Seabourn says' oh well -too bad for you . The work started Friday and will go for several weeks,

 

If you are coming on next week bring ear plugs,,,,

 

Last trip on this line

 

Gary

We got off the day you got on.

There was no indication of impending work. What on earth are they doing?

Were you warned of possible works?

We sailed on the Odyssey 20 November 2015 after a two year break from this line.

This time, the "freepour" wines were generally superior and at a higher pricepoint. Whereas on our previous cruise it was difficult to extract a listing of the complimentary wines from the Somellier, there was no problem this time.

A new list is prepared for each cruise but you do have to ask for it as it is not well publicised nor volunteered. In addition to the wines listed there are others available but not publicised because they are in short supply and Seabourn does not wish to disappoint if everyone asks for them. It takes a bit of negotiation to unearth these "freepour" wines. But it can be worth the effort!

It seems that Seabourn nominate a couple or so wines to promote each day. Perhaps not surprisingly these are not the best available. I found the tendency for wine servers to "push" these wines somewhat irritating. Particularly as their description of the wines tends to be much more generous than the actualite .

Below is the listing for our cruise -

WHITES

Santa Margharita Pinot Grigio ( Italy)

Gruber Roschitz Dry Reisling (Austria)

Wingspan Sauvignon Blanc( NZ)

Oyster Bay Sauvignon Blanc (NZ)

Frontera Sauvignon Blanc ( Chile)

Stags Leap Chardonnay ( USA)

Pascal Bouchard Petit Chablis ( France)

Chateau Saint Armand Sauternes( France)

RED

Jamieson Ranch Pinot Noir ( California)

Castello Banfi Chianti ( Italy)

Bodegas Lan Rioja ( Spain)

Tall Sage Cabernet Sauvignon (Washington State)

Domaine Sas, Du Plo Corbieres ( France)

Zolo Malbec ( Argentina)

Constentine Zinfandel ( California)

Kendall Jackson Avant Cabernet Sauvignon (Caslifornia)

Penfolds Koonunga Hill Shiraz/Cab ( Australia

Goose Ridge Cabernet ( Washington State

BLUSH/ROSE

Beringer White Zin ( California)

Barton Guestier Cote du Provence ( France)

Centine Banfi Toscano ( Italy)

CHAMPAGNE /SPARKLING

Nicholas Feuillate ( France)

Cantine Maschio Prosecco ( Italy)

Of course personal tastes vary but for me the standout wines were-

WHITE

Stags Leap ( included by mistake?)

The Petit Chablis - classic nicely mineral and rather fine

The Sauterne - an unctous sticky

RED

Banfi Chianti

Domaine Sas - needs to breath for a while!

Additionally from the unlisted wines , I would highlight a Cune Rioja ( classic Crianza) and a Valpolicella ( forgotten the maker - overtones of a Ripasso)

We found the Champagne too coarse and acidic for our taste ; but it made an acceptable mock Bellini!

At the bottom of the list for me was the Frontera Sauv Blanc ( good paintsripper?) However it was being heavily promoted and consumed with surprising alacrity. In the UK it retails for very little money.

I hope this info is helpful to future cruiosers.

Cheers

PS A Lois Latour Ardeche Chardonnay appeared in quantity part way through the cruise. Nothing special.

We just returned from 20 days on the Quest in South America and I was surprised that very little vegetables were served in the dining room. At one point the ship ran out of lemons and bananas. Hard to believe we could run out of bananas in South America!

On our recent Odyssey cruise they ran out of some fruits ( mango, papaya) and berries before the end of the cruise . This was surprising as this port intensive cruise visited islands where an abundance of splendid looking fruit was available in local markets.

MarianH - I wonder if you might know whether the TK 'posher' food is to be served in the MDR, or perhaps in the Signatures restaurant in future, which I can only assume is restaurant 2 at present in the current ships - don't know where else it could be.

 

Casual eating and staff dressing down a bit in the Colonnade sounds fine to me, assuming the food is tasty.

 

I am sure the new concept is causing a lot of stress and hard work for the galley staff, and to some extent for servers, and it will take some time to get right. At least you 'guinea pigs' did not have to try it if you did not wish to.

I asked a few officers about future intentions and the responses were inconsistent and speculative.

What seems to be agreed is that there will be a dedicated TK restaurant on the new ship.

So far as current ships are concerned, I suspect the final decision will be informed by the results from the current experiment. Some thought the outcome would be turning over R2 fully to TK or perhaps on just a few nights. Others thought TK could be offered as an additional option on a few nights in the MDR.

All agreed that the TK family dining menu would not be appropriate for the MDR and was more fitted for the Colonnade as a theme night (in line with the current arrangements) or the R2.

My advice for what it is worth is that all pax should participate at least once in the current experiment and be prepared to be disappointed ( as we were) or indeed impressed if Seabourn can up their game and deliver an improved product.

It would be beneficial if Thomas K could spend a night or two onboard to judge for himself if Seabourn"s interpretation of his dishes is acceptable. But perhaps it is a little early for that.

I can confirm that certainly galley staff are finding the experiment challenging and stressful. The less so perhaps for servers who seemed to me to be rather bewildered by it all. What would have been helpful on our cruise was a description of the dishes by the servers as currently happens for the tasting menu in R2. But on our cruise the apparent understaffing of servers would not have made this practicable. They were at times having to run between tables!

On one evening when we tried the TK menu in the MDR we were refused the sweet course as "it is not available after 10 pm, Sir". Not impressed as we had started the meal at 8pm and waited an inordinate time for the first two courses to be delivered.Perhaps the galley staff had wilted under the pressure.

BTW, I throughly recommend trying the TK Napa burger. It truly was rather special IMHO.

Hope the above is helpful.

And finally, I just have a worry that Seabourn may be considering offering the TK menu as available for an extra charge. Surely they wouldn"t would they?

But they aren't trying to mimic French Laundry or Per Se or Bouchon. They are trying to mimic Ad Hoc - which is 100% Keller and where the staff dresses in the aforementioned casual[/quote

 

Having just experienced TK on Odyssey, I have to say that you are incorrect.

 

It was only the family dining in the Collonade where servers dressed down.

 

The TK menus in the MDR were "mimicking" TK high end offerings. Servers were dressed in usual smart attire.

 

There seems to be much speculation on this thread from people who have not experienced the TK product on Seabourn ships. Probably best to wait for more feedback from Seabourn pax before jumping to conclusions.

sfvoyage, , no one is forced to eat his food. Plenty of other options.

Of course this is true. But many pax will be seduced by the hype and the prospect of experiencing fancy food from a much lauded Michelin starred chef's repertoire.

My own recent experience on Odyssey suggests that if things don't improve, they will be disappointed. One would have hoped that customer feedback would help inform Seabourn about the TK experience. However, there did not seem to be any mechanism on board for pax to provide such feedback - a pity. Or perhaps they are relying on anecdotal information from serving staff or monitoring the amount of food sent back to the kitchen. In any event it would be helpful for pax TK experience to continue to be shared through Cruise Critic.

As an aside, I was told that pictures of TK dishes are posted in the galley and dishes have to be compared with these to check compliance with TK standards before they are released to anticipating pax.

Although I was disappointed with my own experience of the current TK menus ( except the Napa burger), I would support continuing the experiment in the hope that by my next Seabourn cruise menus will have been refined.

I am also an elderly Brit and have not heard of Keller of course, but having read all about this it is not appealing to me: neither the menu nor the "family serving" idea. That seems like a gimmick to me. However, in September '16 I will be investigating. Who knows. We might like the concept. J

Well don't hold your breath.

We are just off the Odyssey and I have to say the TK food was generally underwhelming except his Napa Burger that was rather splendid.

We had the TK menu twice in the restaurant and once family style in the Colonnade so we can't be accused of not persevering. The menu descriptions were interesting constructs that sadly served only to raise expections that were quickly dashed on tasting the food. Style over substance best describes the experience. We heard lots of complaints and returns of food to the kitchen ( one fatty lamb dish was a prime example ). And as for "family style", what families drink wine out of glass beakers? Ridiculous.

Think again Seabourn.

We on on our seond sea day of this 12 day Caribbean cruise and all is well on the good ship Odyssey.

 

Here is a short report on certain questions posed by the community:

 

If you have any questions please let me know and I will do my best.

 

Happy sailing!

Very interesting, informative and encouraging viz our 21 November cruise.

Just some short points if you have the time.

How's the "included" wine list - any gems?

Is the smoking policy working ok - especially in the Observation lounge?

Will be interested to know if MDR is open on port days.

Looking forward to more dispatches if you have the time and Seabourn snailmail behaves itself.

Enjoy your cruise but please leave some caviar and wine for us!

lincslady

Perhaps our American cousins think we are somewhat odd with our cutlery etiquette.

 

Kind regards,

 

Tony

I think the issue turns more on Pax overloading plates and then leaving food rather than cultural mores. Not good etiquette wherever you hail from.

However, this sidetrack seems to have run it's course. End of?

M

In all honesty, and I don't mean to be disrespectful, but why are you looking at others' peoples plates? And if their behavior bothers you simply look away. No one should be legislating other peoples' behavior. There's way too much of that in the world as it is.

Without wishing in any way to be disrespectful, this comment and its extrapolation seems rather OTT In the context of Linclady's post. She makes a reasonable observational comment and is not suggesting recalcitrants should be keelhauled or otherwise legislated against. All in the context of being able to exercise choice of environment for eating breakfast.

Anyways it looks as though the MDR may be opening for breakfasts and that is good.

(Please don't flame me for infrequent posts - I'm an everyday lurker!)

 

Regarding the plate habit - well, I find these forums to be a good place to swap culture (and other things).

 

It's absolutely common in our neighborhood of the US to put "all the food on one plate." This is neither greed nor laziness (well, usually). It's using one plate only. A second trip would require a second plate. Separating by course would require two or three or six. That is just wasteful. It's not "offputting" at all - it's exactly, in fact, how my mother would put my breakfast plate in front of me while growing up. Old habits die hard!

And I would not be surprised if your mother made sure you ate all your vittals!

What I think Linclady was referring to is "eyes too big for stomach" syndrome aka gluttony.

I don't think this is anything to do with cultural differences. It's more about standatds of behaviour IMHO. To wilfully overfill plates and then leave lots of the food is bad manners in any language.

And Oh, I see the MDR on Odyysey was open most days on a recent cruise - hooray! Looks like I may not have to face overfilled plates in the Collonade next week after all.