elbarney

What I find fascinating about this thread is that people find normal to have fire on a ship.

I feel totally impossible to accept that a fire developing is normal operation, and there is no one to blame. It should be something extremely unlikely, or that was what I expected.

Tha fact that it was correctly and professionally dealt with should not make us forget that it shouldn't have happened in the first place. It's like saying the boat sank, but it was no biggie as everyone got off safely, we just were a bit inconvenienced by the tendering experience :). I understand that even in that situation it could be worse(Concordia, Sewol) but all of you think that that would be right? Sometimes ships sink, we all know that, but they shouldn't.

And by no means am I asking for a compensation, but maybe an "sorry for having a fire" should be proper.

Even with the best possible training and procedures, take a Navy pilot for example, mistakes and accidents can happen. If the pilot bails out and his plane crashes into an apartment complex (which has happened), do you blame bad procedures/bad maintenance?

Yes! Of course I do. I'm sure the navy has a procedure for bailing out on populated areas, and it includes trying their best to avoid it. Bailing out in general and over population in particular. In fact in my country is severely discouraged to have military flighs over cities for the same reason.

But in any case, we are not talking military ships. There is a different risk involved in that case.The most approximate thing would be a commercial jet, and when there is a fire, there is always an apology, as you are not expected to have to endure it. It doesn't matter that the procedures were perfect, and the crew managed perfectly. They will apologize because in the end it was their plane what broke up.

Metal detectors and fixed thermal cameras may be a good idea, but they will require additional personnel to either resort the garbage when metal is detected (not a bad idea) or reset the system everytime there is a false alarm of the thermal camera.

So lets go back to open flame cooking. It's a little bit inconvenient to reduce the risk, so lets ignore it.

As I responded to another poster, where are you going to store the material that is not incinerated, if the ship generates 6-7 cubic meters a day, that is 42-49 cubic meters per cruise. Many ports will not accept ship's garbage, so it might have to be kept around, and storing flammable paper/cardboard can present fire hazards as well.

In the same place than organic residues. You mash it with water and just dump it. It's safe, biodegradable and not a fire risk.

I'm sure there are other solutions.

Not to alarm anyone further, but fires onboard are a fairly common occurrence. It's just that the guests are usually unaware of them. When a fire is reported to the bridge, a "code" announcement will go out to the crew, and the emergency teams will muster and attend to the emergency/fire. There will be an "on scene commander" (generally the Staff Chief Engineer or Chief Officer) who will advise the Captain whether the situation is serious enough to warrant sounding the alarm and mustering the guests. Many fires are dealt with before even all of the fire teams have arrived on scene, and then things return to normal. I'm a bit surprised that an incinerator fire was announced that quickly, but the 30-40 minutes between the alarm and the Captain's announcement would be normal, as the fire teams need time to determine if the seat of the fire has been extinguished, and to check for hot spots to prevent re-flashing of the fire.

Ok with you.

Other than perhaps having the Captain apologize for waking all the guests in the middle of the night (as a courtesy), there is nothing to apologize for. To say that the crew should be "careful not to start fires in the first place" denigrates the company's policies and the crew's training (in fire prevention as well as fire fighting).

 

Trust me when I say that the crew is far, far, more concerned with fire prevention onboard than the guests are, because the crew lives onboard for longer than the week the guests are there, and because the crew are the ones who will be on the business end of the fire hose facing the flames if a fire breaks out.

 

To say that HAL has many fires in crew areas "that are under their control", and this shows that they are somehow negligent is false. The reason there are fewer fires in guest areas is because the lines try to remove as many possible sources of fire as they can, yet they still allow hair care appliances and smoking, which are the two most common sources of fire in guest areas.

I don't remember saying negligent, but at least I think that it shows bad procedures/bad manteinance at the least. I can understand that sometimes you can not control passenger behaviour, but crew should have adequate training and procedures.

Let me explain about incinerator fires. Every day, the ship generates about 6-10 m3 (cubic meters) of paper and cardboard trash. This is shredded and stored in a silo until the ship gets underway, and the incinerator can be started at sea to burn all this trash. The crew is very conscious about trash sorting, and go through everything they take from your cabin wastebaskets (and their own, and all other trash receptacles) to ensure that not only is as much as possible recycled, but that no metal is left in the paper trash. This metal, when sent through the shredder, can spark, and this spark falls on a fine source of flammable material, the shredded paper in the silo. I have seen a silo fire caused by a single AA battery going through the shredder. This spark will ignite some of the paper, but as more paper is shredded and dumped on top of the smolder, it gets buried, and waits. At night, when the incinerator is being run, the smolder will gradually work its way towards the air as the shredded paper is dropped into the incinerator. This is when the smolder bursts into flame, and there is a fire in the silo. This will set off the fire alarm, and there are fire suppression means built into the silo to fight the fire. However, the fire teams will still need to open the silo doors, and using thermal cameras rake through the shredded paper looking for remaining hot spots before the all clear will happen. This can take a while.

If that is the case then there is a clear case of bad procedures! You can install a thermographic cam to monitor the smoldering before it gets critical, you can install metal detectors before shredding, you can store the paper and shred it on land. There are multiple ways to prevent what as per your indication seems a common thing.

Yes, fire at sea is a serious business. I've been at sea for 40 years, and seen my share. Yes, fire prevention is the most important aspect of fire fighting, and the crews are probably more aware of fire prevention than anything else in their shipboard life. To those of you who are asking for an apology from the line for the fire happening, would you expect an apology from them if the fire had started in a passenger cabin from a cigarette butt in a trash can?

No, this is clearly impossible to them to prevent! Passengers can and will be careless, so I don't expect them to apologize for that.

1. YOU ARE NOT OWED AN APOLOGY!

2. Too bad your next day was "spoiled" because you were tired. Have you stopped to consider the fact that you may NOT have had a NEXT day? :eek:

3. What do you have to complain about? So you lost some sleep during a tense situation..... deal. :(

Well, I think that is reasonable to ask the tripulation to be careful not to star fires in first place.

It seems to me that HAL happens to have much more fire related incidents that other companies of similar size, and a lot of them in crew areas, which are fully under their control and responsibility. They seem to be very professional and well trained to stop the fire, but when something like that happens there should be apologies, as it was a dangerous situation entirely caused by them.

It's the same as when there is a fault in a motor for example, I understand that they don't broke it just to inconvenience me, but if it impacts the schedule, I think we are owed an apology.

This is my personnal opinion, I think a fire onboard is a serious issue no matter how professionally you deal with it. The problem is not with the response, but with the cause.

Sorry if there are mistakes, english is not my mother tongue.

Want to expand on the fire????

3 AM alarm sounded, fire detected.

Every 5 minutes tha captain was informing on the situation.

About 15-20 minutes later the fire, which was ironically in the incinerator was extinguished.

I was a little bit worried as I didn't have any warm clothes, because we have put them all in our luggage sooner. We didn't have to leave our staterooms.

For me, in the same cruise, the worst was the fire on last night.

I think the delayed baggage is minor in comparison...

Hello, I'll soon be on my first HAl cruise, and I'm thinking about bringing my own wine onboard, as I don't really like what they offer. I undertand that I have to pay a corkage fee, but I'm not really sure if I am expected to tip the wine server or not? As they usually get a gratuity of 15%, but in this case they don't, what is the proper way? What would be a proper amount?

Also, once I pay the corkage, how is the procedure to have our wine in the restaurant? Do I bring it on the same night I want to have it?

Do they store for the next day if there are leftovers?

And what about in case of specialty restaurants?

Thank you very much!

As far as I could tell, there is no way to avoid the monorail ride—no walking paths that I could see. When you arrive to the Maritimma Cruise Center, signs point the way to the NCL warehouse where you will check in.

You can walk from piazzale Roma to the port, just follow the signals that indicate Tronchetto. From piazzale roma you start walking to the mainland(is the only road), and then turn left on the second, it's easy and not so far away, but it's a little climb,

It's the same to get back to the city.

I wanted to send you all a big thank you to all of you!

I have just made a reservation for this summer.

I have another question about the checkin online. It says that it will block 660$ in my credit card for each passenger. Do you now if they make the block now or near the sailing date? I'd rather not have so much money tied up for more than 6 months.

Thanks another time!

Thank you very much to all for your information.

I have another question, how formal is the attire for the formal tea?

I'd like to experience it, but I don't own a tux. I usually pack my bussiness suits and shirts, tie and sport jacket for the formal nights, but I'm worried that HAL will be a little more formal. I'd like to have some real life feedback about what is considered fine by experienced passengers.

Thank you for your information.

Thank you very much for your help, kazu and Krazy Kruizers!

I'm evaluating 3 different mediterranean cruises(11 nights), so I hope I'll have lecturers!

I think that with your responses I have all my questions answered.

I hope I'll try HAL this summer.

Thanks.

Hello to all.

I'm thinking about doing my first HAL cruise, and I have some questions that I can't find a definitive answer, neither in the official page nor in the forum, maybe I'm not using the right search terms.

So I'll ask you, sorry it they are already answered.

-The enrichment program is included in the cruise fare?

-Are there lecturers? Not port or shorex, I'm familiar with Celebrity, and in the cruises I have been on there were 2 different lecturers talking about different themes: art, sports, etc.

-As an american line, I suppose there is free tap water available. Is this right?

-Is there any kind of coffee card? I have looked in the indulgences document, and there is a soda card, but doesn't seem to exist one for budget conscious coffee drinkers :p

-Is there a charge for the room service? I know about the tipping part, but in some companies you have to pay for some of the dishes(Celebrity) or depending the time(Royal).

Thanks for your help!

Those that had 8 (old) points were given 25 additional points so that they could still make elite with 2 more cruises. Those with 9 points were given 16 points. I am not sure about those with 4 points on their way to select.

I'm there, 0 bonus points.

I have a cruise booked, but it won't get me to select as in the old program(10 days interior, so 10 new points short).

The odd thing is that with the old program I'd have a little more interest in booking the next cruise as I would be a higher level, but in this way, I'll keep looking to other options, as classic level is nothing in the end. This looks like they want to keep their loyal patrons(good) but doesn't want to earn the loyalty of new cruisers.

In the end doesn't really matter, as I'll cruise first by destination and second by quality/price, but now they look worse in the second term.

 

A Costa tender making a late run from the Fortuna (Eagle Road in the background)

Thats Costa Voyager!

Thank you for your very nice review.