mancunian

Thank you very much for your help. It seems good value. I shall certainly get a week pass. I find that if I go on the beds before going ashore in a morning my walking is better.

We went on the K in April and I did a long review here on the forum. To be honest I do not recognise K from some of the reviews I have read. We had excellent embarkation and disembarkation, good food and excellent service in the MDR. We loved Tamarind. We only went to the Lido at lunchtime always about 12 noon to 12.15 and never had trouble finding a table. We were on open sitting in MDR and apart from on one occasion a two minute wait with bleeper in hand were seated immediately.

Cabin and cabin stewards were excellent - cabin well looked after. Yes they are slightly smaller but quite satisfactory.

Some of the entertainment was not to our taste, but that always happens. We liked the Lincoln Centre and we also had an excellent Beatles tribute in the theatre.

As I said in my review we will not be sailing on K again because no library - massively important to us, no sitting on promenade deck and not even good for walking. We enjoy going to the cinema but do not like it next to the pool on the deck. However, the greatest complaint was distances to walk without any chairs available to rest, I am disabled. If none of those things matter to you go and have a good cruise.

We are new cruisers to Seabourn though we have done a great many cruises - of late mainly with HAL and Oceania. On HAL I have always bought a spa pass as I have bad arthritis of the spine and the heated beds and hydropool help such a lot. On Oceania the heated beds are free but miss the hydropool.

What happens on Seabourn. What does their thermal area offer and what is the approximate charge for this. Can find very little about this on Seabourn site.

Would appreciate help on this. Many thanks

Same here. Our cruise is on Sept 20th and should have been from Istanbul. Just had a call from Seabourn via travel agent to ask if we still want hotel night in Athens or to fly on the day. We have decided we would prefer to stay in Athens for night.

Feel Seabourn has been generous in giving us the onboard credit as I do not think they have to. Our first cruise with them and impressed with their handling of the situationl

We travelled with Riviera on the Lord Byron - at least we did for the last four nights of the trip. We were fortunate that we were put on Tauck cruises Inspire for the first three days.

I think Riviera handled it well and you ask about extras they gave. We were bussed to the Byron on day four which was stuck at a lock north of Strasbourg and in that afternoon they offered a complementary bus trip to Strasbourg. When we got through the lock and arrived at Bingham (not on our itinerary) we were offered a coach trip to Trier, and then we went on to Koblenz and offered a coach trip to Cochem.

The trouble was it was day to day decisions which is unsettling, and when we reached Lord Byron on day four we were much further south than we should have been. There was the worry that if the lock did not open how would we get back.

We are usually ocean cruisers and in our case this is what we will return to. We have only done river cruising twice - the first time the river level was too low which created its own set of problems - missed ports, having to sail very slowly overnight every night etc.

Feel as I said before river cruising is getting more doubtful, probably due to climate change, but we also feel far too many boats on the river and we hated being moored against another boat.

The scenery was lovely - often through rain, but I love the sea so I think we have made our decision.

Just returned from our Rhine/Moselle cruise. Not a particularly good week - lots of rain and we started in Bonn (should have been Cologne on the wrong boat as ours was trapped beyond the locks on southern Rhine. Joined our boat on day 4 where it was trapped, but lock opened that night and we proceeded north.

We went on this cruise particularly as we wanted to cruise the Moselle - had been on Rhine previously. Sadly not to be as ships could not get under bridge. We did have a trip along the Moselle by bus to Cochem.

Really not sure about river cruising for future. Seems to be happening a lot over recent years.

On our recent Koningsdam cruise it seemed that it was not just the passengers who gave up on formal (or gala) night. The ship did not even have a captain's toast and I did wonder if this was the reason so many dressed down. We are open sitting always, but tend to now go earlier and certainly around earlier sittings there were hardly any tuxes at all.

Has the captain's toast been discontinued on any other HAL ships?

It is a bit misleading. The picture with the sunloungers says underneath it is the Westerdam which they have put in to highlight the difference to the other HAL ships

It is indeed good news if it is true. I cannot however, see why they would designate the current small piece of the crow's nest as library and not have enough room for books. Surely you would have empty shelves awaiting the books with a notice to this effect. I agree with topsham the captains corner would be a good place. It was not popular on our cruise and as people seem reluctant to sit there (it is miserable with very low uncomfortable chairs) better use could be made.

I had a reply to my post cruise questionnaire. Partly set letter but also referring to some of my criticisms which were mainly the sitting places for elderly/disabled and lack of library both of which were mentioned. It puzzles me why they didn't say there that the library question was temporary and would be sorted out in the near future. Has left me wondering.

Wonder if in fact this is a very last minute thing when they received so many complaints.

Hi everyone, Thank you for your kind comments about my review.

I am just going to do a general reply bringing out the points raised. I have no idea what is going to happen with the library but interesting there are two theories as to where all these books are coming from - Statendam or a book seller in New York. The thing is why prepare a library that does not have room for these books when they arrive? The book part of the library is very, very tiny. There is another thread about the public rooms with a lot of photos, and one of the ones near the beginning show the size of the library and I think I was quite generous saying it was the size of a standard cabin without bathroom or wardrobes. It really does not make sense.

Someone asked about the bathroom. Well I think it was slightly smaller but very much nicer. The only loss I could in fact see was storage. There are just I think three shelves on the wall to the left of the sink and of course the shelf under the sink. The sink is definitely smaller and the worktop, but we found no problem at all with that.

The question about the smaller stateroom was nothing to do with the lack of mirrors but observations. Sitting at the desk you noticed it was shorter in length, likewise when we both sat on the sofa it seemed shorter. At the other end of the cabin there was a door less on the wardrobe. For a 12 day cruise no problem there, and there were some drawers. If I was sitting at the desk with the computer or doing my makeup, DH was trapped on the balcony or on the sofa unable to get past the much smaller coffee table. My other observation was that as you walked up the corridor when the stewards were working in a cabin it seemed possible before to wave and greet the one making the bed. You could not see the bed when the bathroom door was open so the corridor between wardrobes and bathroom are likely a bit narrower. I must say we actually liked the cabin and as caravanners in the past do not mind it being smaller. I would also stress that we were in a cheaper grade of balcony cabin so some may be larger.

We did like the indoor muster very much and glad they have followed other lines. However, I am still a bit nervous of the statement that they can load the boats more quickly. The theory is on all lines that you leave your indoor muster station in a long line with your hand on the person in front and you go to your boat and walk straight on. However, we feel that that is an awful lot of passengers and crew trying to navigate a very small deck area.

Finally Ruth I note you had no reply to your query would someone tell you where all these places you can sit instead of the promenade deck. You have not had a reply because there isn't one. I assume the contributor was thinking you were going to sit inside - which I suppose would answer your question about shade!

Since reading all the replies I have thought long and hard about the question of whether this is HAL trying to attract a younger market. I am sure it is true but like the library does not make a lot of sense. So ........ they have abolished to all intents and purposes the promenade deck, the library, the proper cinema, the captain's toast, the Indonesian tea, the baked Alaska parade, the buffet Dutch high tea, the crew show to name what I am sure is not a full list. They are not in an order of importance and possibly not all are important, but what I ask is have these things persuaded younger cruisers to K. I think not. So ......... what have they now included that will encourage them to come, and when you look at it very little. Any daytime entertainment is exactly the same. They make a big thing about the music walk, but that has really not changed much. We had a music walk before along the promenade deck with music in each lounge. The big music band in the Queens Lounge to me sounds very like Hal Cats - loud and raucous, the B and B pianists - yes there are two of them together who both sing and seemed quite popular but in fact the music seemed similar decades to before. The only real improvement was the Classical quintet who were really good and captured a huge audience, but would they necessarily appeal to younger cruisers. Apart from that you have two new a la carte dining areas. Sel de Mer seemed to attract people though not overly so, and as for the culinary arts centre - I never really got the hang of that and never saw anyone there. The only other new attraction was Blend - a very expensive outlet where you can taste and blend your own bottle of wine.

I suspect HAL have thrown out the baby with the bathwater. Despite what they obviously think, they need their older returners. Attracting younger people needs a Carnival, Royal Caribbean approach. Not that any of us want that!

Oh and one other thing. We questioned our waiter about the crew show. He said they could not do one because they had no props. If, and I say if, the books (without shelves) are coming from Statendam, could the crew props not have come too. He said they really do not know if it would come back.

Interesting comment re library. The travel books are there already - one shelf of them. Cannot quite see where they are going to put more.

Writing this review was not to put people off, it was to make them think. There are many good things on Koningsdam. However for us the things NA does not have that Koningsdam has are not deal breakers to us. However, the things that Koningsdam does not have and NA does are important to us. We feel that NA is a much better ship and are going on her again in November.

It is for everyone to decide from my report and those of others what is important to them, but the warning about lack of seating and exceptionally long walks is very important to the very elderly and people with a walking disability.

Happy cruising everybody.

Hi everyone. We have just earlier in the week returned from Koningsdam. There have by now been quite a few reviews, but I promised I would do one, and feel that as a traditional cruiser may be of use to some people. Just a bit about us – I am early 70’s and we have been on 45 cruises over 25 years on 10 different cruiselines. Our last 17 cruises have been 14 to HAL, 2 to Oceania Riviera, and one on Celebrity Eclipse. You can see from this we love HAL, we actually quite like Oceania though feel it has not got the ambience of HAL, and hated Celebrity.

Our cruise on Koningsdam was from Rome back to Rome. The transfers and embarkation and disembarkation were good, in fact embarkation took 25 minutes from walking into the hall to arriving in cabin. For a ship of this size we thought that excellent. From the point of view of getting on and off during the cruise, again very, very good. Two gangplanks – one for excursion passengers, one for everyone else. We were usually everyone else and never once encountered queues.

Arriving in our cabin we were pleased. Feel cabin is smaller but well thought out. The only problem I encountered was getting from the window side of the cabin to the bathroom at night without waking husband. The end of the wardrobe unit had a corner unit with a glass cupboard at the top, then a shelf with the tray (which overlapped the edge) with the ice bucket and finally a shelf with the fruit basket. That felt quite narrow in the dark. Things we really liked – the bathroom very light and well lit and the shower compartment which was about the equivalent of the old bath in size had a glass door. You could stand in one end of it without getting wet whilst adjusting the water pressure and heat. The cabin had a large flat screen TV positioned on the wall opposite the bed, and the safe was big enough for laptop, cameras, jewellery and paperwork.

Then up to lunch in the Lido. We liked the decor of all the eating places particularly the MDR, Lido and Tamarind. The Lido was quite difficult to get a table at busy times but then it is on the other ships. The food we enjoyed very much. Realise this is subjective but we are not foodies eating out in expensive restaurants, nor (except for the occasional pizza) fast food people and for us everything was good in the MDR where we had breakfast and dinner, and Tamarind which was excellent. We had one pizza at the New York place which we thought was also good. We did not go to Canaletto which we had recently gone off as since the shared dishes less keen on the menu. Strangely this time, for the first time we didn’t go to the Pinnacle.

Whilst we liked the decor of the eating places, we were much less keen on the lounges which were geared to the music walk and seemed dark for sitting in during the day. The crow’s nest which we thought was the only really nice place to sit we found a bit strange as because they had put very well spaced groups of chairs around coffee tables and used actually quite big chairs we felt that there was actually less seating than on the R and S class ships. This of course showed up badly at trivia time and things like the flower arranging demo which is now up there.

The ocean bar was also a nice area with a few large chairs and a grand piano, but strangely with a wall across the middle which meant half the room could not see the pianist. I guess the two storey Queens Room would be nice at night, and they also serve afternoon tea there. There is a large dance floor and they even made what used to be called Dutch High Tea into a tea dance. The word Dutch has been removed and the food choice reduced as just the same as the usual afternoon tea.

The big hit was the classical quintet. Yes, quintet – strange when they have reduced to duo’s on other ships. They were from the Lincoln Centre and were superb garnering crowds of about 70+ - more we felt than other musical offerings on the walk. The downside was no more listening to them in an attractive explorer’s lounge with a big flower arrangement and lamps. The whole area is drab and consists of row up row of club chairs.

The crew was as usual superb. We are of the opinion that HAL has the best crew at sea. As well as the cabin stewards and dining stewards I was particularly impressed with the lovely crew on the gangplank who rushed up or down it to help me every time I ventured ashore.

Those were the generally good things, or things we were fairly happy to live with. Of course there were things we did not like so much.

Firstly I should say here that I am getting steadily more disabled and walk with two sticks finding walking painful. This is the area Koningsdam lets you down badly as compared with Nieuw Amsterdam which had three fixed seats in all the escalator areas, seating here and there along corridors, room usually to find a seat in the main music areas, bench seats at the entrance to the dining room. All of that has gone. In the Thermal Suite area you went in the reception area by the lifts, then went up a long corridor past two gym classrooms to the main gym, turned left along another long corridor past the treatment rooms, left again along another long corridor to get to the thermal suite (at the other side of the escalators.) This completely took away the pleasure of the heated beds on my arthritis. To walk to the dining room because the musical areas were full and the last area was again another very long corridor where they could quite easily put seats was a nightmare. The dining room manager one evening offered us a bleeper and I pointed out there was absolutely nowhere for me to take it where I could sit down.

The promenade deck was a great disappointment. DH likes to walk there every day but after two days gave up because he said it was a miserable experience. We also sit on the promenade deck. We are cruisers who love the sea and like sitting looking at the movement of the water, any seabirds and land when there is any. We have never in all our cruises sat on the pool deck facing the pool, music in the background and noise. Even when we have a balcony we still sit on the prom deck because the land is often on the other side, or it is too windy or sunny on the balcony side. The size of the promenade deck worries us if there is an emergency too.

Our next disappointment was no library. DH usually checks it out immediately after lunch the first day. He was back very quickly. The library bit is the size of a cabin with the bathroom and wardrobes removed. Shelves along one side contain games, a shelf on the other wall contains a few travel books, the third open side has round about 15 coffee table books on open shelving. No books to browse or borrow and no magazines. Definitely no squashy sofas as on the R and S class ships. There is an area next to this with like a breakfast bar by the window with about 3/4 computers and some squashed up tables and chairs to play games or drink coffee. This was devastating and upset a lot of people we met. As people said even if you had a kindle when on a cruise they always borrowed a book or two and I do the same. DH has nothing electronic and loved the browse the books.

These three things are dealbreakers for us and we will not be travelling on Koningsdam again.

The other two things that we did not like but might live with are there is no cinema, just a large screen on the pool deck. If I have showered and got dressed up for dinner there is no way I want to lie on a sunbed under a glass roof, with the pool splashing alongside, people passing through and in quiet bits of film people playing table tennis above. We lasted 15 minutes. It was like being in a sportshall.

Finally although the programme said formal (or rather gala) for dress they have abolished the captain’s toast. Many people said the captain had just become a disembodied voice and they did not know who the officers were. Worse than this I felt was that many passengers just degraded the whole evening and there were many men in shirt sleeves in the dining room, and lots with suits but not ties.

We are going on her on 27th April and I will report back. She is very large for us, but we thought that of the Nieuw Amsterdam and we loved her. I really prefer the smaller ships but now being somewhat disabled we have decided we need a verandah in future and the smaller ships are just too expensive for us.

I have been following Captain Albert's blog with all his photos and the only thing I must admit I am not keen on is the art which is definitely not my cup of tea. Oh, and the other thing is they have abolished the cinema. We are not big on the theatre on ships - too noisy and too many flashing lights but we do enjoy a night at the cinema, and the seats on NA are so comfortable.

I was appalled in a recent post to see that Europe does not care about code red. They most certainly do - all three of 45 cruises we have seen noro were in code red with all the same conditions except for the disinfectant running down the walls and seats. In all cases Orient Lines, P&O and HAL kept us fully informed each day, had people actually manning the purinell machines - much harder for passengers to ignore, and in each case we did not have noro for the whole cruise. In fact without having noro onboard HAL had a code orange on the first two days of every cruise which involved no self service etc, but nothing else. This was to try and prevent people bringing noro onboard, though I think they may have stopped that practice.

We have over many years been on several cruiselines but have now settled to mainly HAL and then Riviera for Europe for the last two years. I hope we may cruise on her again but have just booked our last cruise for this year on HAL. I don't like the term sick ship but there is something very, very wrong here and I don't think it can all be put at the doors of passengers. I was very disturbed by the CDC reports of crewmembers working whilst ill and not reporting till early evening. I wonder if perhaps that is the only time crew can report to the medical centre - if so, Oceania really needs to get this sorted. Can you imagine the damage a stewardess or steward doing your cabin with the disease. Likewise food workers.

Whilst Oceania keep blaming the passengers, I do not believe for one minute they really think this and must be very worried. They will never concede that point however. One thing I have found on our two cruises on Oceania and reading the boards they do not communicate with passengers. Usually cruiselines do not charge medical fees for norovirus and I think they should not. Far more people would admit to symptoms if they did. Furthermore they also usually return your port fees for cancelled ports - did Oceania do this?

Actually HAL is the only line we have been on with outside mustering. Celebrity, P&O, Saga, Orient, Oceania to name but a few.

We are very pleased about this as have never thought the outside mustering works well at all. For a start you can often not hear the cabin numbers being called, and the trouble is that the muster start is usually delayed waiting for people to arrive making it a long time to stand out on deck - difficult particularly for older people. I have often thought that by the time they do actually start a lot of people do not listen as they are getting uncomfortable.

In the case of a real emergency generally they want to get you to the public rooms in the first instance, and of course it works much better if assembly in public rooms is in your lifeboat muster stations.

Just our thoughts

I have been looking for this on the plans but have been unable to find. Does anyone know if there is a cinema. I do hope so - we are not really into shows - too loud and flashing lights - but really enjoy two or three trips to the cinema.

I am horrified. Firstly the Volendam was one of my favourite ships along with Rotterdam and now I do not want to go back. Glad our recent cruise in Australia was immediately before refit.

I cannot imagine our comfortable evenings listening to the duo after dinner in there, so I guess I will not be going back.

Sad to say I agree with Sammiedawg. We first went on Prinsendam about four years' ago on one of their standard cruises and we thought it really good.

Last year we went again on the second half of a Grand Voyage and thought things had changed a lot. This is the only HAL cruise on which we complained about the food. This finally came about because on our table five people had boeuf stroganoff and five people only managed about half of it. This brought the head waiter and he in turn brought the chef and we all said the food was disappointing and generally lacked taste. The other side of this coin is that people we went on an excursion with had been on the first half of the cruise and said the food had started to deteriorate since we boarded and they thought the chef may be different. Don't know the answer to that but the food was definitely inferior to the food on Rotterdam three months before and on our recent cruise on Volendam. As for service we thought it was much the same on all three ships - generally excellent.

I agree the costs of running a smaller ship come into it but I think the main advantage of Prinsendam for many people is the size - certainly my DH likes it very much for that though not quite so keen after last year. I personally prefer the R and S class - particularly the R class. The fact that they are all old ships does not come into it for us as they feel more like proper ships.

We had no problem on Volendam in Nov/Dec. We did have excellent room stewards so perhaps that is why. DH does not like liquid soap so we need two bars from the start - one for bath one for washbasin.

Hi Ruth

Yes, I think deep down we both really prefer HAL. To be honest I think I feel the ambience to be the most important thing about the cruise.

Yes I loved the milkshakes too in fact I loved Waves food generally. I also very much liked their non alcoholic pina colada which was free like the other non alcoholic drinks. Sadly on our cruise they ran out so many more must like them too. No - I didn't drink them all. Sadly because of various medications I cannot now drink alcohol - just a half glass of wine occasionally on a good day. Why is it that the most enjoyable things are usually the most fattening!!

I guess I am not really the luxury hotel type - a few days is a novelty then I get bored.

Angela

Sorry to hear your cruise was not great

Just a couple of points the Minerva 2 is less than half the size of the R-ships of Azamara, Oceania & Princess, no comparison

 

Sorry but you are incorrect on this point. Minerva 2 was exactly the same renaissance ship as Azamara and Oceania. In fact it was then passed on to Princess. The current Minerva is as you say a much smaller ship which they had originally before getting the Minerva 2 and a few years later bought back.

We have been on 12 cruises with HAL and thoroughly enjoyed all of them. We love the Indonesian crew and the general ambience. We have found the food to be acceptable to us for what we have paid. Only on one of our two cruises on Prinsendam were we disappointed with the food. There is an occasional blip in MDR but we think not many and service we think is above other lines we have been on. On our cruises I have travelled in good health and now a few times disabled - once on Ryndam being totally in a wheelchair. I think the crew are really superb in these instances.

However, I think as much as anything to prove that we were not missing something better we went on Riviera last year. Whilst we like midsized ships I do not like the renaissance class of Azamara and Oceania as we have been on Swan Hellenic on Minerva 2.

We had a terrible embarkation at Istanbul. We had Oceania air passage and were surprised on booking to learn that this does not include transportation from airport to ship and the cost of this is astronomic. On this transit we received the impression that the bus driver and guide really wanted to be rid of us and we were dropped at the wrong place, meaning we had a very long walk to the terminal (passing as we did so piles of luggage in the rain). The guide reluctantly sorted a wheelchair for me, having first suggested I walk through the security and book in area (much too far for me, bearing in mind I had had to struggle from the coach a long way up the road to the terminal entrance) and then pick up a wheelchair. We were then taken to the ship through the rain. By this time it was 3.50 pm and at which point the person with us said he did not know if the cabins were ready yet and we were too late for food. I asked was there afternoon tea and he said not today.

Sorry to start off with a moan but your embarkation starts first and a good embarkation gets you in the mood for a good trip. I will just say that disembarkation was better though not as organised as HAL.

We loved Riviera as a ship - what is there not to like. She is beautiful with masses of art. Our cabin (a balcony cabin) was beautifully appointed except for the positioning of the wardrobes and the bathroom was amazing for a ship. If one were to think of saving money by going for an inside or oceanview there are few of these and are booked almost immediately.

We liked the lido and Waves and largely ate there. Food was good and varied. We liked the MDR for breakfast but found it very impersonal at dinner and the service very variable. As it is all open sitting there were often queues to be seated and it was difficult to meet new people - though this was not the case in the speciality restaurants. These were quite good except the French one whose meal the cooking of which we considered below par.

The thing I really enjoyed was the art classes (for which you need to present yourself very early). Also the heated sunbeds were free and not well used so I was able to go twice a day which really helps me. The entertainment was really nothing special and the theatre not nearly as nice as HAL.

People say about HALs excursions being expensive but Oceania's are eye watering so we did not do any. Alcoholic drinks were very expensive too. Possibly most people get drinks packages but these bump your expenses up so much if you don"t really drink much.

So we have decided we like both lines with provisos. We would only go on Riviera/Marina if we were in Europe where we are happy to do our own thing excursion wise, and we would now always do our own air and transfers. We would also feel we would be bored on Riviera for a long trip so have put the cap at 10 days. We think HAL is better itinerary wise everywhere else anyway and we do some of their excursions. We also more often go on HAL for three to five weeks at a time and love the ambience so no cap there.

We have just been on a 22 day cruise on Volendam - Australia to Singapore. This year we are just doing Europe and staying nearer home - once on Nieuw Amsterdam in the Summer and 10 nights on Riviera in October. We have however done our own flights which saved £300 on our cruise fare for which we have booked flights from Manchester to Barcelona return, a night in a hotel on the Ramblas, and which will also run to the necessary taxi transits.

Hope this helps.

I loved the pina colada but certainly on our cruise last year on Riviera there was a charge for non alcoholic beer.

We returned from Volendam in December immediately before she went in for refit. It is our second cruise on her and we like her very much. Like Ruth we thought she was good before the refit and the staff were great.

We have had a lanai cabin once, and we really do not like lower promenade cabins, Hate people walking past all the time. I know they cannot see in in the day time, but if we cannot have a verandah (cost on the R ships) we really prefer the oceanviews on main deck looking straight out at the sea and a bigger cabin.

We too have been on Riviera this year. She is the most beautiful ship we have been on and we enjoyed our cruise. You will probably need to do your own excursions because Oceania's leave HAL's looking not too bad. The other alternative is to do pretty well all ship's excursions because if you do more than 5 (I think it was 5) you get a reduction.

We will probably go on Riviera or Marina again if the price and itinerary is right, but at the end of the day DH and I prefer the ambience on HAL, so for this year we are back with HAL on the NA and just done a long cruise on Volendam. We are also experimenting with Celebrity on a short 5 days cruise in May