QE2 Transatlantic record

[Jeanne S]

Frank Braynard's 6 Volume masterpiece on the LEVIATHAN should serve as inspiration!!!!

 

 

My grandfather was employed as a baker on the Vaterland when it was seized by the United States government in April 1917 (after first sacking the boilers and engines). He was placed in an internment camp as German Enemy Alien, not released until after the war. So I have a special interest in the ship Vaterland became, the Leviathan.

[Jeanne S]

The first time I saw QE2 was in model form... during Expo '67.

Stephen

 

Thanks for that memory

[dougnewmanatsea]

Nice try!!!!

Well, I had to, didn't I ;) ?

 

I can wait for it... hopefully another ten years at least!

Let's hope so. And let's hope that Carnival are willing to throw some more money at her too. There are many things that can and should be done to improve her... Just a matter of paying for it all.

 

David Hutching also wrote companion books on Queen Elizabeth and Queen Mary. All three are availaable in a single updated version... Published 2004.

Sounds good. I will have to buy this.

 

Do you happen to know who the publisher is?

 

 

At the time I thought she looked fantastic. Sleek and modern. The purists were a bit unkind in their comments, but to me she looked crisp and clean.

It seems to me that the reaction to QE2's original design was dictated by age more than anything else!

 

Most people I know who were young at the time that they encountered her design, seem to have liked it.

 

For my part, I of course was not around to see her in person in her original form, but I think the more they changed, the worse her appearance got. She's still beautiful today, but pales in comparison to the original design.

 

Post Falklands when the funnel was painted red it looked awful.

Yes - I prefer the original, slender funnel but only in white. If it must be red... Then the present funnel is certainly much better.

 

Definitely think someone ought to provide you with a trip on QE2

Well, if you want to take up a collection ;) ...

 

but think it has to be in M class so you can see warts and all!!!

Can we compromise and make it C class?

 

You don't really believe that do you (the bit about a large part of her history yet to be written)?????

At the moment, I think it is up in the air. It may be true... Or it may not be. I hope it is; though I wouldn't bet on it, I do think it is a possibility.

 

Personally, I would like to see her go for a good long time yet. I think if they are willing to put enough money into her, and really fix her up properly, then she has a lot of life in her yet.

 

She just needs some rather expensive wart removal, that's all ;) .

 

PS Doesn't CC provide bursaries for its hosts to do research!!!!!

I wish!

[KenC]

QM2 is now slouch. Check out the speed at the top of the screen.

 

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y184/Navaleye/DSCF0019.jpg

 

:)

 

 

29.4 knots for the past few hours - that's not bad for a 150,000 ton apartment block at sea eh fellas????

 

 

Ken

[Navaleye]

Not bad at all, except that when I took that picture, we were being passed by this:

 

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y184/Navaleye/DSCF0042_edited.jpg

 

In all fairness, even at 29.4 kts QM2 was vibration free thanks to her pods.

[guernseyguy]

In all fairness, even at 29.4 kts QM2 was vibration free thanks to her pods.

 

Nice One! On the QE2 the vibration can be particularly noticeable in the Grand Lounge upper level - all the stuff on shelves in the shops shaking away! Mind you, Golden Princess shudders a bit at 22 knots.....

 

Peter

[KenC]

Not bad at all, except that when I took that picture, we were being passed by this:

 

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y184/Navaleye/DSCF0042_edited.jpg

 

In all fairness, even at 29.4 kts QM2 was vibration free thanks to her pods.

 

I bet the fillings were coming out of their teeth!!!! I know when Commodore Warwick opened up QM2 a couple of times during the maiden voyage and hit 30+ knots you couldn't feel a thing.

 

Ken

[KenC]

...........At the moment, I think it is up in the air. It may be true... Or it may not be. I hope it is; though I wouldn't bet on it, I do think it is a possibility.

 

Personally, I would like to see her go for a good long time yet. I think if they are willing to put enough money into her, and really fix her up properly, then she has a lot of life in her yet.

 

She just needs some rather expensive wart removal, that's all ;) .

 

I guess it really depends on the money, but don't forget the reported metal fatigue in the aluminium superstructure and that she has also been known to spring the odd hull leak. Cost wise, cosmetic improvements (even radical wart removal ones) must pale into insignificance when compared to keeping the structure sound.

 

Ken

[guernseyguy]

Cost wise, cosmetic improvements (even radical wart removal ones) must pale into insignificance when compared to keeping the structure sound. Ken

 

Very true. Before we get carried away believing in the QE2's immortality, food for thought from another board:

 

I was told at Sea Trade the way a classic liner ages:

1] Mechanical, Electrical, Plumbing/HVAC systems break.

It was the first nail in the Canberra coffin. QE2 is suffering that now.

2] Black and gray water tank tops rot. Black and gray water is very corrosive. The engines often have to be removed to get at them Dolphin IV, Universe Explorer and Costa Riviera--she had you know what flood her lower decks, could not get rid of the stench,

suffered that problem.

3] engines

4] hulls are the last to go since the liners have thick plating and strong structure especially with shear, camber, and tumblehome

5] Parts are no longer made and have to be custom fabricated at great expense.

The modern ships with modular construction are easier to make repairs since much of the plumbing is in a straight vertical line and electrical is modular. Modern sewage treatment systems require smaller black water tanks and not underneath the engine room.

 

So 'sound hull' - QE2's great strength (engine room near flooding not withstanding) is the last thing to go....but few end up being killed off for that....other ailings have done for them first....

 

Peter

[KenC]

Very true. Before we get carried away believing in the QE2's immortality, food for thought from another board:

 

I was told at Sea Trade the way a classic liner ages:

1] Mechanical, Electrical, Plumbing/HVAC systems break.

It was the first nail in the Canberra coffin. QE2 is suffering that now.

 

Not done any hot weather cruising but from the 'limp' nature of the A/C I noted then it could be a problem. Is it the original installation - or was it changed with the engines back in 86/87? If it is original then will it last another 10 years? Plumbing seemed sound if a little old fashioned - but I have read stories on this board about foul smells pervading some decks.

 

2] Black and gray water tank tops rot. Black and gray water is very corrosive. The engines often have to be removed to get at them Dolphin IV, Universe Explorer and Costa Riviera--she had you know what flood her lower decks, could not get rid of the stench,

suffered that problem.

 

Black and gray water? Are we talking waste here???

 

3] engines

 

Should imagine the second set of engines is good for another 15+ years?

 

4] hulls are the last to go since the liners have thick plating and strong structure especially with shear, camber, and tumblehome

 

I'm sure most of the hull is extremely strong but surely all those years of vibration at 30 knots must have had some adverse effects - like the engine room flood you mention? Also years of Atlantic storms have taken their toll on all that aluminium superstructure which I have been told has now become very expensive to fix.

 

 

So 'sound hull' - QE2's great strength (engine room near flooding not withstanding) is the last thing to go....but few end up being killed off for that....other ailings have done for them first........Peter

 

Interesting - but maybe not what some people want to hear.

 

Ken

[guernseyguy]

Not done any hot weather cruising but from the 'limp' nature of the A/C I noted then it could be a problem. Is it the original installation - or was it changed with the engines back in 86/87? If it is original then will it last another 10 years? Plumbing seemed sound if a little old fashioned - but I have read stories on this board about foul smells pervading some decks.

 

The a/c has been problematic for some time - until Carnival got on top of maintenance there were frequent plumbing problems - and in a ship of this age all but inescapable.

 

Black and gray water? Are we talking waste here???

 

Grey = showers, washbasins, black = toilets

 

Should imagine the second set of engines is good for another 15+ years?

 

Now 18 years old - half the age of the ship - probably will be the last thing to go....

 

I'm sure most of the hull is extremely strong but surely all those years of vibration at 30 knots must have had some adverse effects - like the engine room flood you mention? Also years of Atlantic storms have taken their toll on all that aluminium superstructure which I have been told has now become very expensive to fix.

 

Report on flood here: http://www.maib.gov.uk/cms_resources/dft_masafety_023304.pdf

 

It makes for interesting, if sobering reading - and the Marine Accident Bureau compliment the engineers on their ingenious solution: 'Most Marine Engineers would hope to match this ingenuity under similar circumstances, it is probable that few would succeed'.

 

Also another accident that year: http://www.maib.gov.uk/publications/investigation_reports/2003/queen_elizabeth_2.cfm

 

which sadly led to a death....there's no getting away from it, but the old girl is getting long in the tooth - she's had an amazing innings - by a huge margin the longest serving luxury express liner (she's recently pipped the Aquitania - which spent her last 8 years as a troop ship/utility ship - and steamed around 3 million miles to the QE2's 5 million) - express liners are old by 20 and withdrawn from their mid-20s - the Queen Mary soldiered on to 31, the Queen Elizabeth got to 28......whatever any of us may wish, her days are numbered.

 

Peter

[jbailey]

Forgive me for not remembering his name, but the naval architect of QM2 was on our crossing of QE2 in May 2002--theme was Great Ocean Liners. He said the hull of QE2 had another "8-9 years on it." (I assume that means ocean-crossing years.) I understood that the reason QE2 would no longer do crossings was to stretch out the hull life.

 

With 30+ years of creaking and shuddering in rough seas, it makes sense that the metal hull's life would be limited.

[dougnewmanatsea]

Forgive me for not remembering his name, but the naval architect of QM2

Stephen Payne - now VP Corporate Shipbuilding for Carnival Corp & plc.

[KenC]

.......Her highest achieved speed was 33.8 knots during trials in the North Sea affter conversion to diesel electric. Of course she would never steam at those sppeds in service.... she needed just about 28 knots to maintain the five night crossing.

....Stephen

 

Hav just read that the maximum trial speed after conversion to diesel was 34.60 knots! Pretty impressive? Reference is 'RMS Queen Elizabeth 2 of 1969' by Miller & Correia, which has some good post Falklands refit photos with that grey hull - which does nothing for the look of the ship at all!!!

 

Ken

[KenC]

....... Any ideas on how many transatlantics she was doing in the 70's, 80's and 90's ????................Ken

 

I can partly answer that now. Between 1969 and 1990 she did 500 transatlantic crossings - an average of 24 per annum.

 

The change to 6 night crossings was made in 1997 which was after the Kvaerner take over but before the sale to Carnival.

 

Looking back at old photos, does anyone else agree that the block of 'prefab' suites dropped on Signal Deck, the magrodome (then Lido cafeteria) enclosure and enlarged funnel have spoiled those classic lines of 1969????

 

Ken

[KenC]

I have just discovered another book that I forgot I had and can answer my own question. QE2 had done 797 transatlantic crossings up to April 2004 (so she must be on 800 now?). Queen Mary did 1,001 and Queen Elizabeth did 908.